Another major school shooting today ... Newtown, Conn

@spendius,

spendius wrote:

Quote:
I need oxygen, water, food & sleep; I don 't need THAT.

Oh yes you do!!

I dare you gunners to submit your posts on this thread to a honest, expert and experienced psychiatrist.
I think his verdict would startle you to such an extent that your hair would stand up on end.

The tweeny peeny white boy is only at the superficial end. We all understand that.

The essence of your argument is that
the desire to avoid helplessness in the face of predatory violence,
the wish to dominate any future predatory situation, is sick,
and that we shud prefer the PREDATOR to bring controlling force to bear.

Your wish is implicitly suicidal.
To conform to your wishes,
your psychiatrists 'd have to advocate suicidal intention.

Going around unarmed is irresponsible.

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@H2O MAN,

That's the 6th post you have submiited H2O since you were asked--

Quote:

What justification have you for saying such a thing about another man? From whence does such unrelieved arrogance come from?

Are you expecting that nobody has noticed your failure to reply and draw the appropriate conclusion that you are attracted to soft targets?

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The survival of the liberal democrat is based on two things; other peoples money and other peoples guns.
Without these to things they wouldn't have the money to hire people with guns to protect them.

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@oralloy,

You just wait oralloy until I find the time to discuss your obsession with freedom. Your promotion of an obsession with freedom, which I assume extends to a much wider audience than you find here, does assume an uneducated audience and a general habituation to your feeling that there are no other types of audience.

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@spendius,

spendius wrote:

You just wait oralloy until I find the time to discuss your obsession with freedom. Your promotion of an obsession with freedom, which I assume extends to a much wider audience than you find here, does assume an uneducated audience and a general habituation to your feeling that there are no other types of audience.

FOR THE RECORD:
I join in that obsession.

David

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Quote:

Texas megadonor Steve Mostyn gives $1 million to Gabby Giffords gun-control group

Houston trial lawyers Steve and Amber Mostyn say they’re giving $1 million to a gun-control group formed by former Arizona Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and her husband, astronaut Mark Kelly. Steve Mostyn is a major Democratic campaign contributor, backing candidates in Texas and nationally. He gave $3 million to Priorities USA Action, a super PAC aiding President Obama’s re-election. He’s perhaps best known in Texas for launching a media campaign against Rick Perry two years ago in which he chided the Republican governor for his reluctance to debate in his 2010 reelection race with a full-page newspaper ad depicting Perry and the word ”Coward.”

Mostyn, who describes himself as a gun-owner, says the group hopes to raise $20 million for the 2014 elections – enough to match the National Rifle Association’s political giving. The NRA spent $13 million last year trying to defeat President Obama’s reelection. It also spent money in seven Senate races, losing six and winning one.

In media interviews, Mostyn said Americans for Republican Solutions with support pro-gun-control candidates and conduct a public education campaign with television spots. Giffords launched the new group this week. She was wounded in a 2011 mass shooting in Tucson in which six people were killed. In a USA Today op-ed, Giffords and Kelly wrote: “Achieving reform to reduce gun violence and prevent mass shootings will mean matching gun lobbyists in their reach and resources.” The NRA’s Wayne LaPierre says his organization opposes limits on gun ownership and has proposed placing armed guards at every school in the country as the best way of stopping a repeat of the kind of mass shooting that occurred in Newtown, CT.

Laurene Powell Jobs, the widow of Apple founder Steve Jobs, and Silicon Valley investor Ron Conway are also helping finance the group and will host a fundraiser in San Francisco this week.

http://trailblazersblog.dallasnews.com/2013/01/texas-megadonor-steve-mostyn-gives-1-million-to-gabby-giffords-gun-control-group.html/

1 Reply

@firefly,

Quote:

Texas megadonor Steve Mostyn gives $1 million to Gabby Giffords gun-control group

Can he do anything about the NRA's ability to vote anyone out of office in any rural congressional district?

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@spendius,

spendius wrote:

You just wait oralloy until I find the time to discuss your obsession with freedom. Your promotion of an obsession with freedom, which I assume extends to a much wider audience than you find here, does assume an uneducated audience and a general habituation to your feeling that there are no other types of audience.

It might be more productive for you to just accept the fact that America is going to remain free.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

It might be more productive for you to just accept the fact that America is going to remain free.

I think you mean that America is going to remain saturated in gun violence if the NRA and the gun-lobby have their way. We'll be free all right--free to continue to shoot and kill each other.

http://rackjite.com/wp-content/uploads/gungaurds.jpg

Soon just carrying guns, and having guards everywhere, won't be enough protection, everyone, including children, will also have to walk around wearing body armor.

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@firefly,

firefly wrote:

everyone, including children, will also have to walk around wearing body armor.

Remember to use thick steel plates. Centerfire rifle rounds glide right through Kevlar like it isn't even there.

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@oralloy,

Nice selective statistics that barely make your case. If we simply update the statistics from a few of the countries things get much different

South Africa - The stats used are from the worst murder years.
The current murder stats are 1/3 of what is used in your numbers
http://www.southafrica.info/news/crime-200912a.htm#.UPDHCW_AffI
If we make that adjustment then guns make up 52% of the murders on that list.

If we go to the numbers here which are much more recent....
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/jul/22/gun-homicides-ownership-world-list
Of the countries listed 51% of the murders are committed with guns.

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Having experienced the sound and fury of liberal pundits and the liberal media demanding, for weeks, some sort of legislative action, I have come to the conclusion that all it is all being bellowed within an echo chamber.

That the Administration responded to the furor by establish something of a task force was to be expected, that Joe Biden was named to lead it tells me there is no real muscle behind it.

Support of private gun ownership is one of the few bi-partisan issues in Washington. Democrat politicians who, unlike their party's leader, are up for re-election in 2014 are not going to risk their chances following Dana Milbank and Jon Stewart down the rabbit hole.

The liberal press made much of Joe Manchin's seeming endorsement of ammo restrictions, but he's since backed way off, and all Harry Reid can manage to promise is that the issue will get a fair debate.

The sort of gun control legislature that liberals favor will never get through the House, let alone be considered by the Senate.

My bet is that some tepid legislation gets passed so everyone in DC can say they care about the kids who were murdered in Connecticut, but that about the size of it.

Obama will be A-OK with this since I can't imagine he will try and demand his Democrat subordinates commit political seppeku, and he will get to blame each and every victim of a gun wielding mass murders over the next four years on recalcitrant Republicans.

Number One Obama Objective: Transform America
Number Two Obama Objective: Destroy the Republican Party

But, I may have misjudged him and it's possible that in knowing nothing material will come from Congress he will impose his will by fiat and issue an Executive Order severely restricting gun ownership. I doubt this will happen because I doubt he really cares all that much about this issue, but it will be very very interesting to see how such a Constitutional Crisis plays out if he does.

And so Anti-Gun Nuts, Sandy Hook is the not the carnage for which you have been longing, the slaughter house that will break the back of the NRA.

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@parados,

Damn I wish the Guardian would give a time period for the data - nice that you can download it though - I'd like to see it as a five year rolling average. For example it says that Norway had two gun homicides - so not including Anders Brevik's bastard act.

I came up with the Hinge Factor: Gun Homicides per gun per 100,000 people as some way of comparing countries.

It's kind of interesting. Southern and Central America feature heavily in the deaths per gun per person tally. Then some African, Asian and European nations . Surprisingly Singapore was above the US (because they've had one gun homicide but they don't have many civilian guns).

England's Hinge factor is about a third of the USA's and Australia's about a quarter. Can only calculate the Hinge Factor for about half the table because key data is missing for some countries.

Not sure what it really says except an Australian gun is less likely to kill you than an American one even allowing for the differences in population of both people and guns.

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VIDEO ~ NRA: Biden meetings are just for 'show'

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Quote:

sound and fury of liberal pundits

Odd that you didn't mention the sound and fury of those opposed to the liberal pundits sound and fury.

Your analysis may well be right.

You have such a nice line is casual putdowns - of course if you're anti gun you're a nut. And Liberals have been hoping for a slaughter.

Just can't help yourself can you?

Quote:

Number Two Obama Objective: Destroy the Republican Party

And that would make the Dems different to the republicans how?

Ah well you're always good for a little light relief with the odd insight, just hard to tell which is which sometimes.

1 Reply

@parados,

parados wrote:

Nice selective statistics that barely make your case.

Hardly selective, and they make the case quite well.

parados wrote:

If we simply update the statistics from a few of the countries things get much different

Probably. Things tend to change as time passes.

That chart is a relic of the battles of the 1990s, when gun control was an actual threat to our freedom. These days, there is no real threat, despite Obama's wishing that he could violate our rights. As such, there isn't a lot of need to keep it updated with the latest possible numbers.

In a way, the gun control movement today is reminiscent of Chavez spewing his nonsense from Venezuela. Once upon a time we would have had to take him seriously and maybe had the CIA assassinate him. But today Communism is a defeated ideology, so no matter how much noise Chavez made from south of the Caribbean, there was no real need to waste our energy dealing with him.

I wouldn't be surprised if the numbers in the charts were never updated from their 1990s-era numbers. There is really no real need to update them anymore.

I remember that I once looked up Taiwan on my own, just because I was curious, and their numbers had also dropped a bit, although they were still quite high.

parados wrote:

If we go to the numbers here which are much more recent....
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/jul/22/gun-homicides-ownership-world-list
Of the countries listed 51% of the murders are committed with guns.

They'd be just as dead if they were murdered with knives.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Finn dAbuzz wrote:

But, I may have misjudged him and it's possible that in knowing nothing material will come from Congress he will impose his will by fiat and issue an Executive Order severely restricting gun ownership. I doubt this will happen because I doubt he really cares all that much about this issue, but it will be very very interesting to see how such a Constitutional Crisis plays out if he does.

The Freedom Haters have badly misunderstood what Obama was proposing to do via executive order, so all the recent celebrations about "him banning assault weapons via decree" that have erupted on various extreme left websites are a bunch of nonsense.

What Obama wants to do via executive order is ban imports of assault weapons, much like Bush (senior) once did.

Obama also wants to expand the definition of "dangerously insane" to include people with a learning disability, so that such people will fail a background check.

Clearly that last move isn't going to pass muster with the courts if he tries it. But it isn't really going to be a Constitutional crisis. The courts will simply strike it down.

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@firefly,

firefly wrote:

Quote:
It might be more productive for you to just accept the fact that America is going to remain free.

I think you mean that America is going to remain saturated in gun violence if the NRA and the gun-lobby have their way. We'll be free all right--free to continue to shoot and kill each other.

That has always been and is the natural human condition.
Did gun control save Julius Caesar ??

Disarming future victims only protects violent predators.
U shud KNOW that; obvious.

David

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@oralloy,

oralloy wrote:

parados wrote:
If we go to the numbers here which are much more recent....
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/jul/22/gun-homicides-ownership-world-list
Of the countries listed 51% of the murders are committed with guns.

They'd be just as dead if they were murdered with knives.

Have u noticed that the left
does not seem to care much if folks get KILLED,
as long as no guns were involved.

David

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The New York Times this morning reports a huge spike in guns sales, country-wide.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/12/us/as-us-weighs-new-rules-sales-of-guns-and-ammunition-surge.html?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_th_20130112

Oh dear. oh dear.

Historically, when a country gets over-armed and belligerent, it often attacks its neighbours.
Maybe the same thing applies to people. People asserting their "rights" behind a gun-sight. Maybe there's a civil war brewing.

1 Reply

Another major school shooting today ... Newtown, Conn

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