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MOTIVES For the Colorado Theater Murders ?

 
 
Rickoshay75
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 04:38 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:


Any ideas of the motives behind these murders ?
Was this his way of protesting unemployment ?

Please note that we already have another thread
for discussion of the right to self defense
and of the best means to do it; accordingly,
please keep discussion of that to a MINIMUM,
devoting your comments to psychology, if u don't mind.

OK. WHATAYATHINK about the killer's motives ??





David


Or he could have been brainwashed by some kind of psychotic weirdo There are far too many unusual behavior killings and suicides to ignore the possibility -- Heavens Gate, Jim Jones, Columbine, and the Waco whackoes
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 04:41 pm
@Rickoshay75,
Rickoshay75 wrote:
Or he could have been brainwashed by some kind of psychotic weirdo There are far too many unusual behavior killings and suicides to ignore the possibility -- Heavens Gate, Jim Jones, Columbine, and the Waco whackoes


I was wondering when the brainwashing theorists were going to show up...
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 04:44 pm
@Rickoshay75,
Who do you think "brainwashed" the two Columbine killers?

He could also be an Al Qaeda sympathizer, or maybe he was demonstrating the harmful influence of violence in movies and video games by acting it out, or maybe he wanted to do this to push for tighter gun control laws by showing how easy it is to get and use these weapons to commit mass murder.

Anything is possible...
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 04:53 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:

Who do you think "brainwashed" the two Columbine killers?


Here is the thing that is silly about the brainwashing arugments. What is the point? I mean if you have the ability to brainwash someone, why not go to the source if there is something you want to accomplish?

For example if this brain washing incident was to get gun legislation passed why not use your brainwashing skills on those who will actually make the laws. Because there is no saying that if you set up an event with mass killings, you are not garenteed gun legislation. But you are more likely to be successful brainwashing politicians to get the laws you want enacted.

Seems like a hit or miss going this indirect route. Unless I am not thinking broadly enough, what would be the motivation to make some average person kill a bunch of average people?
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 05:02 pm
@Krumple,
Quote:
. Unless I am not thinking broadly enough, what would be the motivation to make some average person kill a bunch of average people?

Why do suicide bombers/terrorists do this sort of thing? What's their motivation?

This shooting in the theater was an act of terrorism. And the booby-trapped apartment was planned to be an act of terrorism.

Is it really less crazy if acts of terrorism are done out of religious or political beliefs rather than for an individual's personal, idiosyncratic reasons?
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 05:06 pm
@firefly,
firefly wrote:

Quote:
. Unless I am not thinking broadly enough, what would be the motivation to make some average person kill a bunch of average people?

Why do suicide bombers/terrorists do this sort of thing? What's their motivation?


I honestly don't know. I could make a bunch of assumptions but I really don't know what compels someone to strap on bombs and blow themselves up to injure or kill others. I can't think of any reason why this would be good or useful.
Rickoshay75
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 06:13 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple wrote:

firefly wrote:

Quote:
. Unless I am not thinking broadly enough, what would be the motivation to make some average person kill a bunch of average people?

Why do suicide bombers/terrorists do this sort of thing? What's their motivation?


I honestly don't know. I could make a bunch of assumptions but I really don't know what compels someone to strap on bombs and blow themselves up to injure or kill others. I can't think of any reason why this would be good or useful.

The Hamas do it for the money, $20,000, to make sure their families are taken care of.
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 06:22 pm
@Rickoshay75,
Rickoshay75 wrote:

The Hamas do it for the money, $20,000, to make sure their families are taken care of.


Really? $20k and I don't even get to spend it and I have to die? That price is not high enough for me. I don't even think I would do it for 20 million espeically when I don't even get to spend it. I guess I am just selfish in that way. I'm too selfish to blow myself up and others for 20 million dollars.
littlek
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 06:25 pm
So.... I haven't been listening particularly closely to this story and I haven't heard any news about it yet this evening. But, I know there is a distinct lack of commentary from the shooter's family. Are we interested in what mom and dad have to say? Is there a mom and a dad?
Krumple
 
  2  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 06:27 pm
@littlek,
littlek wrote:

So.... I haven't been listening particularly closely to this story and I haven't heard any news about it yet this evening. But, I know there is a distinct lack of commentary from the shooter's family. Are we interested in what mom and dad have to say? Is there a mom and a dad?


Good question. I know there is a mother. She got ambushed by a reporter before she even knew her son was involved in anything.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 06:30 pm
@littlek,
littlek wrote:

So.... I haven't been listening particularly closely to this story and I haven't heard any news about it yet this evening. But, I know there is a distinct lack of commentary from the shooter's family. Are we interested in what mom and dad have to say? Is there a mom and a dad?


Expand that to anyone who has had extensive contact with him in the last year. I am betting that there were lots of signs that this member of the collective was in trouble which were ignored. For legal and shame reasons lips are sealed.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 06:44 pm
Quote:
As well as mental illness, there have been other suggestions at a motive, including reports Holmes had recently split from a girlfriend and the fact he had been struggling in school before dropping out.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2178304/James-Holmes-Gunman-used-police-evidence-bags-hand-puppets-mother-admits-feared-disturbed-years.html#ixzz21afvofMC


I have no idea what the basis is for this reported alleging that this is fact, but I would like to know.
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 07:10 pm
@Krumple,
Oh, you crafty K! I shall ponder this nutty sideline and return.
0 Replies
 
boomerang
 
  2  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 07:46 pm
Quote:
Yes he did rig a bomb/bombs but remember, he actually told officers it was there. Now if he had intent to cause harm with the bombs, why tell the officers?


I think the bombs were supposed to go off before the shooting started -- that's why he turned on the music and left the door ajar.

I think that he expected a neighbor to come to the door, set the bombs off, and create a diversion that would send all the cops and ambulances to his house so that when the shooting started there wouldn't be anyone available.

According to his downstairs neighbor it almost worked.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 08:01 pm
@hawkeye10,
There is no reliable basis for the statement--the University has confirmed nothing to that effect.

You're looking for cause and effect to make your own particular case--that because he couldn't cope with school he was forced to drop out and he then saw no future for himself, blah, blah, blah, and that led to his committing these horrendous acts and booby-trapping his apartment.

Except this guy was stockpiling weapons and ammo, and probably the materials to booby-trap the apartment, for at least 3 months before he dropped out of his Ph.D. program.

What's more likely is that this man began slowly decompensating even before that time, either due to the gradual onset of a major psychiatric disorder, like bi-polar or schizophrenia, which often first appear at around his age, or due to some sort of drug use which affected his mental state, and he began to get more and more caught up in the fantasies of committing the crimes he's now in jail for. And, as he got caught up in the plans, and preparation, and purchasing, and planning explosive devices, he had less and less interest and mental energy for school. And, by the time he withdrew from the program, he knew he'd definitely be committing mass murders and wouldn't be coming back to school because either he'd be dead or in jail.

So I don't believe that anything that happened toward the end of the school semester,like prelims or oral exams, precipitated any of this. And I don't think that people at the University might necessarily notice anything unusual in his behavior--all the the things he was planning and acquiring, and probably obsessing about, were going on in another part of his life, and they were going on in relative secret, they really didn't involve anyone else. His outward behavior might not have altered that much until he got closer to the time he'd put his plan into effect.

Why he hatched on this particular plan of mass shootings, and a major explosion at his apartment, is anyone's guess. It might not be related to rage or anger at all. It might simply be a desire to exercise power, violent destructive power, for it's own sake, just as The Joker might do. Except this guy took it one step further than The Joker, whose exploits were confined to the movie screen, this man actually made it real in the movie theater.

He actually might have been influenced more by the violence of movies, like Batman, and characters like The Joker, than people would like to think, and the influence of either a major psychiatric disorder and/or drugs, helped him to get caught up with an obsession to live out the sort of fantasies of violence he saw on a movie screen.

Other than proving he could do it, and get infamous for doing it, there may have been no other motive, and no specific precipitating event.


Lash
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 08:30 pm
@firefly,
what she said...
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 08:31 pm
@littlek,
Quote:
Are we interested in what mom and dad have to say? Is there a mom and a dad?

Yes, there is a mom and dad. I'd be interested, but they aren't going to say anything. And I'm sure their son's lawyer has advised them not to say anything. They have said they are standing by their son.

No one should jeopardize the investigation or the legal case by blabbing to the media, particularly his parents. And no responsible knowledgeable parties are leaking information. And this man left no footprint on the internet that the media or public can turn to--he had no Facebook page, no Tweets, etc. That's what's driving the media crazy--they have no reliable info to feed the public's curiosity, so they print or report any tidbit of info, most of it very dated, or of very questionable validity, or it's just sheer speculation on someone's part. I'm not buying any of it.

Maybe the things they removed from his apartment, like his computer, or possible writings, or things he read, might hold some clues, but that info won't likely be released to the public for quite some time. I think we're going to be in the dark on the issue of motive, and even in gaining an accurate picture of what this man is like, for quite some time.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 08:31 pm
@firefly,
I have seen no report that dates the start of his buying, and it is highly likely that if he was unprepared to do well at orals that he knew this well in advance. I don't understand why you completely dismiss the posibility that the rigours of this program were not suited to his skills and he thus went from highly promising genious to wash out in one year flat.
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 09:20 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
Re: firefly (Post 5055167)
I have seen no report that dates the start of his buying,

The Aurora Police Chief said the weapons, and ammo, and gear, and explosives were purchased over at least a 4 month period. And his thinking about, and planning, this massacre and massive explosion, had to start before he began making purchases.
Quote:
I don't understand why you completely dismiss the posibility that the rigours of this program were not suited to his skills and he thus went from highly promising genious to wash out in one year flat

Because, based on reliable reports about his undergraduate academic performance, he is very bright, and a very good student. Simply based on intellect, and academic ability, he shouldn't have washed out in a year, he should have been able to understand and handle the work--and they would have helped him if he was having problems. Even if he found that particular program not to his liking or interest, he could just apply to another grad program, in a different field--he had options, he wasn't at any sort of dead end or "washed up".

But, if he had spent months of that first year in the program fantasizing about, and then planning, and then shopping, for all the things he needed for his grand scheme, how the hell could he have sustained interest in his Ph.D. program? Something. like a mental disorder or drugs, likely sent this man off the rails, and then his academic work might have taken a back seat in his priorities or suffered.

Unlike other mass shootings, where someone just shows up with a gun and starts shooting, this man constructed an elaborate, well thought-out attack, complete with smoke cannisters, and protective gear, and lots of weapons and ammo, plus an apartment rigged to blow up most of a building--this was at least months and months in the conception and planning, and it took a lot of effort on his part, particularly rigging his apartment.

This guy is sort of in a class by himself, Hawkeye. Or in a class with The Joker.

hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Jul, 2012 11:51 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
Unlike other mass shootings, where someone just shows up with a gun and starts shooting, this man constructed an elaborate, well thought-out attack, complete with smoke cannisters, and protective gear, and lots of weapons and ammo, plus an apartment rigged to blow up most of a building--this was at least months and months in the conception and planning, and it took a lot of effort on his part, particularly rigging his apartment


I this guy is as bright as claimed and if whatever might of been wrong with him did not greatly impact his functioning level then the prep for this was no big deal. Average Bob he is not.
0 Replies
 
 

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