44
   

Florida's Stand your Ground law

 
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 02:17 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:
So..
The shooter would be safer
"Safer" than WHAT????
Safer than if he were home, watching TV??



parados wrote:
if he carries a gun as evidenced by his killing the other person
I 'm not so sure about the evidence.
We don 't know what happened.



parados wrote:
The person shot would be safer if he carried a gun
in which case he could have killed the original shooter rather than being killed himself.
That is 1 of the possibilities.
When I was shot at, the shooter fled (very swiftly) as soon as he saw
that his victim pulled out a shiny revolver for self defense.
Thay did not give me time to line up a shot.
( I heard a scream b4 thay left. It sounded like "gun" was mentioned
but the sound was blurred, so I can 't be sure. )
If the decedent had been armed, he 'd have had a better chance
to control the situation. That might have saved his life.
That is what emergency equipment is for.
Sometimes, the mere sight of defensive firepower
has been enuf to scare off predators. It has even worked with animals,
but u might need to touch off a round in front of him.





parados wrote:
Your hypocrisy is in arguing that someone carrying a gun is safer
when this case would only lead to one of the other probably being killed. [non-sequitur; identity counts.]
U r distorting the definition of hypocrisy; shame on u!
Hypocrisy means pretending to believe something
that u do not actually believe. I have remained innocent of that.





parados wrote:
If neither had a gun, no one would have been killed which directly contradicts your argument.
O, yeah, right, because no one ever got killed b4 guns were invented
and EVERYONE always obays anti-gun laws because thay are MUCH more eager
to please the government than thay are to remain alive!!!





David
parados
 
  4  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 03:05 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
I 'm not so sure about the evidence.
We don 't know what happened.

So, you are not arguing that someone with a gun is safer? Are you giving up that position?
parados
 
  4  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 03:07 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
Sometimes, the mere sight of defensive firepower
has been enuf to scare off predators

I see. So now you are arguing that the Zimmerman was a predator?
parados
 
  2  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 03:09 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:





parados wrote:
If neither had a gun, no one would have been killed which directly contradicts your argument.
O, yeah, right, because no one ever got killed b4 guns were invented
and EVERYONE always obays anti-gun laws because thay are MUCH more eager
to please the government than thay are to remain alive!!!





David


I didn't realize that Skittles were a deadly weapon. Thanks for clarifying that for us David. If Zimmerman hadn't had a gun he would have been taken down by a bag of Skittles obviously.
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 03:52 pm
@parados,
DAVID wrote:
I 'm not so sure about the evidence.
We don 't know what happened.
parados wrote:
So, you are not arguing that someone with a gun is safer?
Are you giving up that position?
Most of the time,
in most circumstances, carrying competent safety equipment
like guns makes u safer, but not from everything.
If u r floating on a boat, it will not make safer from sinking,
nor will guns protect u from an IRS audit, nor from diabetes.
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 03:57 pm
@parados,

DAVID wrote:
Sometimes, the mere sight of defensive firepower
has been enuf to scare off predators
parados wrote:
I see. So now you are arguing that the Zimmerman was a predator?
I don 't know the operative facts well enuf to offer any argument,
but I can conceive of the possibility that he was.





David
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  7  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 04:01 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
We know a man with a gun approached a 17 year old after being told not to by 911 operators and then shot the kid dead. There really isn't much else to know. We also know the kid wasn't armed or doing anything wrong. He certainly wasn't trying to rob the man with the gun.

If someone is following your David, do you have the right to shoot him dead if you think he is going to attack you?
Since Zimmerman was following someone don't you think it would have been logical for you to shoot him if you felt threatened?
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 04:02 pm
@parados,
OmSigDAVID wrote:





parados wrote:
If neither had a gun, no one would have been killed which directly contradicts your argument.
O, yeah, right, because no one ever got killed b4 guns were invented
and EVERYONE always obays anti-gun laws because thay are MUCH more eager
to please the government than thay are to remain alive!!!





David

parados wrote:
I didn't realize that Skittles were a deadly weapon. Thanks for clarifying that for us David.
If Zimmerman hadn't had a gun he would have been taken down by a bag of Skittles obviously.
I did not limit the facts, as u have done.
A rock, a piece of wood, metal, or incidental debris around,
or a stout kick to a sensitive area might have been among the other possibilities.
parados
 
  5  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 04:05 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
I did not limit the facts, as u have done.
A rock, a piece of wood, metal, or incidental debris around,
In a gated community? By a kid carrying a drink and a bag of Skittles?
I see, you prefer to just make up facts as opposed to limiting them to what is known.


Quote:
or a stout kick to a sensitive area might have been among the other possibilities.
Which greatly reduces the likelihood of anyone being killed.
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 04:09 pm
@parados,

DAVID wrote:
I did not limit the facts, as u have done.
A rock, a piece of wood, metal, or incidental debris around,
parados wrote:
In a gated community?
Yes; there can be rocks in there.


parados wrote:
By a kid carrying a drink and a bag of Skittles?
I see, you prefer to just make up facts as opposed to limiting them to what is known.



Quote:
or a stout kick to a sensitive area might have been among the other possibilities.
Which greatly reduces the likelihood of anyone being killed.[/quote]When someone is slown down,
he is vulnerable.
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  4  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 04:19 pm
The police chief, Bill Lee, has resigned. This can only be good news, even if it's only 'temporary'. (It's probably not as temporary as he thinks).

Link
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 05:12 pm
I was looking for other news about this case and came across this article:

http://www.examiner.com/charleston-conservative-in-charleston-sc/zimmerman-was-on-the-ground-being-punched-when-he-shot-trayvon-martin

I'm wondering how much of the information is true. Was this kid really 6'2"? Did a witness see Trayvon on top of Zimmerman punching him? Was there grass stains on Zimmermans back?
RABEL222
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 05:18 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
John Wayne.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  2  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 05:19 pm
@Baldimo,
Ill bet the only way this guy goes before a judge is if the FBI gets involved.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 06:43 pm

Another point of vu
(for those who lack the energy
to click Mr. Baldimo's link):

" March 21, 2012
Zimmerman was on the ground being punched when he shot Trayvon Martin

By Kyle Rogers
Charleston Conservative Examiner



Last weekend in the city of Chicago alone, gangbangers slaughtered ten people and wounded another forty. The youngest fatality is only six years old. The youngest person wounded is only one-year-old. Many of the victim were pedestrians sprayed with bullets in drive by shootings. The national news has said nothing about this.

So why does one shooting in Florida warrant weeks of national news? Why has there been thousands of articles a day, for the last four days, about one single shooting?

Almost all of the news items about George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin contains a combination of false statements, opinions presented as facts, transparent distortions, and a complete absence of some of the most relevant details. Almost all news items are written soley from the point of view of the grieving family. The media also fills their articles with outdated baby-faced pictures of Trayvon. Very few include that he was a towering 6'2” football player. Is the media really reporting the news, or is this classic agitation/propaganda to advance a political agenda?

Literally thousands of articles contain at least one false statement in the first couple of lines. They usually read "George ZImmerman, a white man," or "shoot by a white man." Zimmerman is described by family as a multiracial Hispanic. His appearance is clearly that of a Latino/Mestizo individual. However, the media wants him to be white because that better fits the political narrative they are trying to artificially create. Many news articles have also claimed the neighborhood is "mostly white." This is also a lie. The neighborhood is only 49% white. It is over half non-white.

All the way back on February 27th, the local Orlando Fox station interviewed the witness who dialed 911. Almost none of the thousands of articles since have mentioned any of the details described by the witness. Some, however, have attributed false statements to this witness. On March 16th, the Sanford police department released new details to the Orlando Sentinel. Once again, these details have been ignored or changed by the media.

1.The witness reports that George Zimmerman was on the ground and Trayvon is on top of him punching him.
2.The witness says that George Zimmerman was screaming and yelling for help.
3.Police arrive and find Zimmerman bleeding on his face and the back of his head. He also has had grass stains on his back.
All this confirms the story told by Zimmerman and the witness.
4.Police play the 911 tape for Trayvon Martin's father, who tells police that the voice screaming is not the voice of his son
.

The neighborhood this took place in has seen a lot of crime. Would you be surprised to learn that there were eight burglaries, nine thefts, and a shooting just in the past year? In fact, the local homeowners' association reports that George Zimmerman actually caught one thief and aided in the apprehension of other criminals. The Miami Herald wrote about this on March 17th. None of the thousands of articles and cable news segments that came after, thought this was important.

In fact the Miami Herald goes on to interview neighbor, Ibrahim Rashada, who is black. Rashada ​confirms that there has been a lot of crime in the neighborhood and indicates to the reporter that the perpetrators are usually black.

The media also characterizes Trayvon as a "model student." In fact, he under a five day suspension when the shooting took place. That is why he was staying at a house so far from his school on a school night. A laywer [sic] for Trayvon's family has blocked access to his school records. However, you have to do something pretty bad to get suspended for five days.

Now that you know the suppressed facts of the case, you can for form a better more balanced opinion. Maybe you still think Zimmerman was wrong to pull the trigger. However, I think you will come to the conclusion that the "mainstream" clearly is pushing an agenda. Even when they have to grossly alter and adjust a story to fit that agenda."


[All emfasis has been added by David.]
OmSigDAVID
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 06:47 pm
@Irishk,
Irishk wrote:
The police chief, Bill Lee, has resigned. This can only be good news, even if it's only 'temporary'. (It's probably not as temporary as he thinks).

Link
He sounds like a good man; admirable,
from whom people who defend themselves are safe.
The decent people need more like him.





David
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 06:51 pm
@Baldimo,
Quote:
What do ignorant Americans have to do with the Federal govt getting involved in a shooting?


A lot when it's you, B.

Quote:
There were no federal laws broken. Murder is local issue not a federal issue.


You don't know that at this point in time because you are both ignorant of the facts and, pretty obviously ignorant of how the federal government can be involved, has been for roughly half a century.
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  4  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 06:54 pm
Described as 6' 2", 140 pounds. He was a beanpole. Have you any idea how thin you are if you're that tall and weigh that little. Zimmerman is pescribed as 200 pounds, that's half again as much as Trayvon. Older than Trayvon, considerably burlier than Trayvon, and with a gun. Trayvon had a bag of Skittles and a cellphone, on which he was talking to his girlfriend. He was where he had every right to be, and no one has said he was doing anything he shouldn't be doing, no one has come up with any suggestion there was anything needing immediate intervention, which Zimmerman had no training, authorization, or right for anyway. If he had sat in his car, as the cops told him to do, there would have been no murder. If there had been no guns at hand, there would have been no murder. Just get rid of ALL the goddamned guns.
Cycloptichorn
 
  4  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 06:56 pm
@Baldimo,
Baldimo wrote:

What do ignorant Americans have to do with the Federal govt getting involved in a shooting? There were no federal laws broken. Murder is local issue not a federal issue.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_%28United_States_law%29#Federal

I would suggest educating yourself before posting. The Feds most certainly can try someone for murder.

Cycloptichorn
jcboy
 
  19  
Reply Thu 22 Mar, 2012 07:02 pm
I never experienced racism until I moved to Florida. We have a neighborhood association and a neighborhood watch. I use to get the monthly newsletters emailed. I was tired of hearing everyone talk because they saw a suspicious African American person in the neighborhood, describing him and asking others to watch out for him and call the police.

I finally did a reply all to everyone on the mailing list and told them if they see a shaved headed Puerto Rican around my house not to call the police and report him, he’s just my husband.

They took me off their email list after that.
 

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