During sex she fell asleep, I continued, is that wrong?

I could really do with knowing less about your sexual life, not more.

And besides--it's hard work trying to be better than everyone else and there's no end in sight. It's a job.

Imagine the Dow Jones Index as an enormous weight and holding it up are millions of straining and sweating citizens. In the H. Bosch style.

I don't have it in me to feel this way and never will. Abuse is painful and devastating for some people and I could never see any good in it. People take their lives every single day because of of abuse (even just verbal abuse) because after dealing with being cut down daily, they eventually feel worthless, taking their own lives.
I'm far from timid and have a big ass voice which I'm not afraid to use, but you're right in saying that this is no place for the timid.
I can handle what's being dished out my way, the thing is that I just don't have any desire too. I choose not to deal with it even though I can.
I get angry and all bent out of shape when I see people abusing others and it simply has a negative effect on my life. Once I'm angry, I can't just get out of here and forget about it. I just keep on brewing and I'm just not willing to live that way anymore.
I see enough abuse in my every day world just going to work. Either I see employees abusing other employees or it's the employers who are the abusers and I jump in to make noise about that as well, which is all right close and face to face, so timid I'm far from.
On that note, even though I'm hardly timid and very much able to defend myself, along with others, I hate being in the position to have to do so and I choose to avoid being in those situations just so I can have some enjoyment in this life.
Like many of us, I've had a very hard life having to fight so very many battles that shouldn't have begun in the first place and it took up such a large part of my life where I could have been happy if not for the abusers.
I could never find anything good coming out of abuse because there is nothing good about it.
People can disagree without trying to break each other down. Some of the cruel things I see some people say to others literally makes me feel sick to my stomach, which is when I jump in to help defend this person so they won't go down a bottle of pills or jump of a bridge, then I get under attack and end up mad as hell. So here I end up sick to my stomach and rage running through my veins.
This is just not the way I choose to live anymore. If I was ever going to get any peace in my life, I had to make a difficult choice and that choice did indeed bring me more peace. It didn't come without a cost, however, because I left a lot of fabulous people behind

I just laugh when people throw food at me Osso, so you're gonna have to do better than that hun Ice cream is my favorite

Thank you (((Osso)))

That's how my ex use to wake me up sometimes, lol!

I'm far from timid, just can't stop myself from getting involved when I see someone being attacked and then I get all kinds of bent out of shape. It's just the way I'm made and I can't change it, so I had to my a tough choice.

You were on that post mentioning something about the marketing, but assuming someone is doing this without knowing for sure is not something people should do. There was no way of anyone knowing if this person was legit or not, yet comments are made making fun of them. You didn't do that as you were just explaining the marketing thing, but others did.
It's just stuff that bugs me to no end, turns my stomach and I can't stop myself from feeling the way I do.

Wish I felt the same, but it for me it burns my ass that the abusers have this toy to play with...

I just noticed my response about being timid was suppose to go to Hawkeye... Ooops...

As far as the topic of this thread goes, I want to add that I was almost raped once. It came close enough to where I felt like I was raped and still does, which is why this hardly classifies as rape.
This guy was already beating the hell out of himself for what he did and has enough people on his end beating him up, I'd hate to see him commit suicide or see his life be destroyed over something I don't think is that big a deal.
When people are backed in a corner and surrounded by abuse, some will end their lives to escape it, I know because I've been there and contemplated it many times. Abuse, even verbal should be taken seriously and I take it very seriously.

But Montana you must realise that you might be confusing abuse with robust debate. I have had a great deal of abuse on the evolution threads. Probably more than anyone else on A2K has ever had. I hope so.

But we might be back to the difficulty of a mixed social group. Men are used to robust argument and I think women are much less so and thus less tolerant of it.

So your strictures have the tendency to be calling for a feminisation of A2K and by extension the feminisation of society and of men. Which is serious abuse from my position.

If some people reach for the pills I think they have other and more deep-seated problems and they are certainly not entitled to hold such a threat over our heads.

As I said earlier, robust discussion is essential for progress and the border line between that and abuse is hard to draw. I only engage in abuse when I am abused and even then I have my tongue in my cheek. But I'll defend robust debate all day long.

shewolfnm--to add a little fancy footwork to my previous post I will quote S.T. Coleridge who when contemplating writing a novel entitled "Men and Women", the themes of which were to be the ingratitude and lack of sympathy between the sexes, wrote in his notebook--

I think this is so, but is there any proof? You can add this male trait of devotion to getting at the truth over being devoted to being nice to our single mindedness and willingness to take chances in the list of reasons why men are better leaders and better organizers of the affairs of civilization than women are. Sadly we have lost a lot of these beneficial qualities over my lifetime as men have been feminized.

Look at our OP, real men and real friends would punch him in the arm for feeling bad about enjoying his woman while she was asleep, but I guarantee that some men have joined the women whispering that he is a dangerous user of women.

And there is a sociological reason for it hawk which shewolf alluded to and which I developed a little.

One might say advertising on TV. Women make the shopping choices hence TV becomes slanted to the female interest. And women do the shopping because men are too lazy or feel it is beneath their dignity. So TV makes programmes which attract women and slowly comes to represent the female interest. It evolves. The "environment" being the ratings.

The medium is the message.

If it is an error we become extinct. A rather messy business in which women suffer the most. Each single feminist is actually only concerned with the ceiling she is busting.

The financial crisis is due to expectations, translated into demands at the ballot box, outdistancing productivity. And we know that TV has a lot to answer for in that regard.

In Phoenix Nights there's a scene where the blokes go into where the TV is to see the big race and the cleaning women are all sat around avidly watching a shopping channel selling bracelets and necklaces and such like. It has some funny scenes if you haven't seen it and have a mordant sense of humour.

Wouldn't your argument be more sound if you widened the picture?? If you took the position that since women make something like 80% of the purchase choices those who want to sell their wares (the corporate class) have purposefully worked to slant society towards the feminine so as to make them more comfortable and more willing to spend? TV is the propaganda machine that makes this happen but problem is much deeper....if you could somehow fix TV you still would not have solved the problem. You for instance will have done nothing to change the fact that the feminists have taken over sex law and used it to oppress men, with the full complicity of the government and the corporate class which runs government.

Not chase me away exactly... but it is just less likely that i want to throw my 2 cents into something .

The bully mentality is huge, so is the pile on effect.. so much so that people will not even let you finish your thought, or make your point because they are blinded with their own opinions. Its a very ' me me me and me only' thought process.

makes even a good debate not worth it.
I take a lot of ideas i see here to facebook where discussion is fun and quite interesting. there is no 'holier than thou' bullshit there that has so littered this forum.

I accept it that that has been done. It is a fact. I am engaged in the dynamics of the process by which it was done. That's all. My opinions are neither here nor there on whether it should have been done or whether the drift continues. They are suspect of being subjective. And I'm not sure they are correct anyway. A grand smash-up might be needed. The survivors might get their sanity back.

What chance have I against the feminists, the government and the corporate class?

The New A2K programming has certainly made A2K more masculine, something that I noticed well over a year ago, but I am not sure I want to call this a flaw.....there are very few masculine places either in real life or virtual, the rarity makes places that have it valuable. It is not in Roberts interest to own a masculine site though, because such places cut out half the potential audience, are a pain to manage, and at some point the debate suffers through the absence of the feminine view point and the absence of women (not always the same thing). The facebook model is problematic as well though, as it is so regulated and authoritarian that debate suffers, and free thinkers are not likely to come to a place so heavily policed as Facebook is.

The truth is supposed to win the day, that is what science is all about....have you lost your faith in that as well as your manhood?

But shewolf FB is vast and you can choose where to interact more easily than on the much smaller A2K. There's been a court case here resting on some suicides alleged to be due to abuse on FB. The abuser was convicted and given jail-time.

It's probably easy to avoid the abuse on here I should think. But if people want to engage in contentious matters with the emotions involved there is bound to be enough friction to generate sparks.

I play a lot on Trivia and there's no abuse there. There are cooking threads and pet threads and stuff where I don't think there will be any abuse.

Anybody playing on a thread like this can expect some heat to be forthcoming. Objecting to it is tantamount to objecting to the views of others being forcefully put.

Listen hawk, I've been fighting this battle since the late 70s.