Any idea what kind of social disorder this could be? (a little creepy short story)

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Hey psychologists. I would love some insight on this by the experts.

I live in a highrise, and because so many people live here, everyone resides here quite anonymously. There are certain residents you will run into repeatedly, and one of them who I keep encountering is an older lady. I have encountered her several times in the elevator, and every time it would be a quite unpleasant elevator ride.

She stands surprisingly upright for her age, almost too straight. I guess that's nice; but her face is always empty and she shows no emotion or awareness for me having entered or standing beside her. She just doesn't move, as if paralyzed. She doesn't acknowledge me or ever turn her face towards me. Only one thing moves - her eyes. They will creepily shift to my direction, while the expression on her face remains serious and also a bit bitter; very tight pursed lips all the time. She looks straight ahead to the elevator doors. It was very scary for me in the beginning because she would look so dead serious and also bitter somehow, I guess it reminds me of some psycho-thriller type of thing where she might suddenly go "BOO!" and attack me.
I can sense that she knows I am there, and that she is avoiding eye contact very actively.

But that isn't all. When the elevator gets down to the lobby, I have so far, out of courtesy always waited for her to exit first. In my culture you will do that out of respect. And I know that concept isn't foreign in America. However, she will stand still as stone and won't move unless I exit first. It creeps me out so much because of her general energy but I'm assuming this may be her own fear; perhaps she is distrustful and doesn't want anyone walking behind her?
Anyways, I will then usually wait a few seconds and see but she always stands still and and tense, and then I walk out through our double doors - we have two of them, and she will always ALWAYS avoid walking through the same door if I hold the door open. She will just ignore the gesture.

I am seriously curious what her deal is. I wondered too if it was racism because of my tan skin; I often get mistaken for Indian, Latino or Italian, even though my ethnic background is Persian. Oh, and I'm a female if that makes any difference.

Any ideas? I wondered if it's social phobia but there are many different kinds, so I thought I'd ask here. I guess the whole refusal to let me exit first is what is interesting to me and made me wonder if that is a pattern found in a specific disorder.

Thank you for your time.

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@goldamber,

I'd call it grumpy old lady - have you tried talking to her?

Next time smile and say good morning! Beautiful day we having, aren't we? Please, please after you (upon exiting) - try to be overally sweet.

And if that doesn't work say f* - you - you old bag!

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@Linkat,

hahahaha

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@Linkat,

and yes I initially did that, would say "Hi" and wait for some eye contact so I can smile at her but she would do the same thing, just look straight ahead and ignore.

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She is perhaps so insular in her little world she does not want human contact, except for possible connections to family or life-long friends. It may have nothing at all to do with you.

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Quote:

I wondered too if it was racism because of my tan skin; I often get mistaken for Indian, Latino or Italian, even though my ethnic background is Persian.

That would be my guess. Sad, really, but she's probably going to take a long time to warm up to you.

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@edgarblythe,

I totally agree. She could be very shy, scared, or perhaps she's OCD. Who knows. She doesn't sound dangerous, to anyone but herself. Sad..

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@Ceili,

I know one who is incredibly shy. After three months of eating and reading in the same restaurant, she would finally respond to a friendly nod. I like to think that has become an important part of her life.

The restaurant closed about a month ago. I hope she's okay.

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@goldamber,

Anything you do she'll probably think you are harrassing her. Leave the poor oldie alone. Aren't you just making fun of her? What's wrong with the way she is? After all, she could be a haughty queen-of-somewhere.

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@goldamber,

I do think that elevator behavior really varies by culture.

I grew up in the Midwest and you make eye contact, smile, be friendly, make small talk, etc. That's normal, not doing it is creepy.

I got the worst feedback for being "normal" in Los Angeles. People stared straight ahead and that was that. If they sensed you trying to make eye contact there would be renewed "leave me alone" vibes, if not outright scorn.

I asked L.A. people about that, the ones who'd moved from elsewhere knew what I meant, the natives were confused about why anyone would want to make eye contact in an elevator. "That's weird." I asked what they would think if I (as a stranger) tried to, and they said they'd think I was hitting on them (even same-sex!) or I wanted to sell something.

So, maybe she's from L.A. or an L.A.-like culture.

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@Pemerson,

I'm not making fun of her, there is nothing funny to me about this situation except for my own silly fear of her.

I always want the best for any person, and I think the reason I am interested in her behavior is because I want to know what things can cause a person to act this way. I'm interested in her life and background (obviously I will never find out) but I'm just interested in human behavior generally. Especially older people, it makes me wonder what type of life they led or what things happened to them. They have so many stories that we can't see and will never hear, and this is true for all of us. We are all a story, essentially, and some will have the privilege of hearing our story while others will merely wonder and see you as the cover of a book, and they make up their own ideas about what this book could be about.

And isn't this what a psychology forum should be about? Psychology is about understanding human behavior, not saying "who cares, leave her alone."

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@sozobe,

Interesting, thank you for your input. I live in Chicago ... so we are in the Midwest. But you're right, who knows what type of environment she grew up in.

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@goldamber,

Maybe she's deaf.
Maybe she doesn't speak English.
Maybe she moves kind of slow and she doesn't want to hold up others getting off the elevator.
Maybe she's crazy.
Maybe she's afraid of germs.

I'd totally follow her and she where she goes.

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@boomerang,

beautiful response.

but she walks very fast! soon as I exit she runs out, in the opposite direction. it's really fascinating how physically fit she is, and how that clashes with her image otherwise

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@goldamber,

Maybe she is just scared,frightened. Chicago - it's certainly not out of the question that she could have had past incidents that have made her leery, really leery.

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@sozobe,

Eek, well, Soz, we have different experiences. I had eye contact with people in LA all the time. Lived there 46 years. Different areas, I'll guess. I'm often an eye catcher, though I can be as circumspect as anyone else. I won't wing it if people seem otherwise engaged.

When I moved north, I heard a lot of 'don't like that place' stuff in two ways -
humboldt county people who really really really didn't like southern california (but that is usual, once in a while for good reason, from people from northern california) and learned more about oregon folk not liking california as a whole, on and on.

So, the first time I returned to LA for a visit, I was sort of looking for all the zero faces. Nah, I was relieved. Same old, same old.

I will admit that when I got to albuquerque, I early on said to Diane after a grocery store visit that someone smiled at me (grinned). Is there spinach on my nose? Maybe I'm just older and deserve a good smile.
Kidding.
Over five years now, with a return visit to CA, I think the day to day level of eye catching and smiling is not all that different. Maybe more in store smiles.
Hard to tell, as my own behavior is sort of friendly, at least some of the time, in both places.

It might be a matter of really big cities versus smaller places, and where in the big cities, which do have neighborhoods.

On the woman in the elevator, I think she may not like others, or "foreigners", seems like a lot of fear for whatever are her reasons.
That must be disconcerting to deal with for the feared person.

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@ossobuco,

Remembering, last time Diane and I were in a store here, we were at a small place that has what I would call discounted interesting goods. I was the one that pushed to go there, but she was the one who first acquainted me with it. For me, it was time for an new bar of very nice soap. Very nice soap is pricey, so less than pricey is attractive, and not that far from grocery store stuff.

We got into the store, a pleasant nirvana of possibilities racked on aisles, and as Diane and I parted for our individual explorations, said, "I'm only going to buy soap, that's it!" not all that loudly. But a nearby woman heard me, met me in an aisle and stopped me to say she heard me about 'only the soap' and completely understood, and how this place (some name like Tuesday Morning) was wonderful.

My point - that kind of thing happened in LA for me too.

Still, re the woman in the elevator, that kind of scene would not happen. There is likely some troubled history there.
I guess I'd try to reassure her but not in any strong way. Maybe something quiet and well wishing, while leaving.

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@ossobuco,

There are definitely different cultural pockets within L.A. My "why the hell are you looking at me?" experiences were mostly in Pasadena and the Valley. Plus downtown L.A. proper.

I have the impression that where you lived was more warm/ friendly though.

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@ossobuco,

Another beautiful post. Because others have also mentioned the likelihood of racism, I just want to say this.
Being born and raised in Germany, I am very much used to racism, so it's not really new to me. When I first moved to Chicago, I was surprised at how warm and friendly most people are to different nationalities, how much diversity is in the city and how most enjoy that, how it's perfectly normal to encounter a person from a different country every other day. And I guess I have been getting used to the friendly Chicago attitude, which makes me forget that more overt racism is still present. In Germany, I wasn't even aware that I was growing up around racist people until I came here and thought "wow, black people work at the bank here? you have black news reporters? awesome!" it was amazing and awakening for me, to see what type of environment I had been living in all along. Of course that doesn't mean racism doesn't exist in cities like Chicago but generally it tends to be more undercover, not as overt and direct.
Humanity has had a long history of racism, which I personally think is unfortunate ... but the emergence of cosmopolitan cities and life is breaking the ice a bit, and at the very least, right now we are at the stage of confrontation ... we are confronted with the conflicts of dealing with a person who you believe to be inferior to you, because of cultural or ethnic backgrounds.
I don't see myself connected to a nationality or ethnicity, I just feel human. I was born in the country I am not ethnically from and was always considered a foreigner there; I have never been to the country of my ethnicity so I cannot completely identify with the people there either. I feel that I am who I live to be, I am the culture that I assemble throughout my life from family, friends and the different societies I lived in.

I know this drifted off topic a lot but I could keep writing about my thoughts on humanity for days.

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@ossobuco,

to get back to the question, the lady in the elevator may be dealing with progressive dementia. My mother had that, and in her elder years pre clear dementia was actually paranoid, now a known symptom of alzheimers.

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Any idea what kind of social disorder this could be? (a little creepy short story)

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