Obunga: Palestine must be based on 67 borders........

@izzythepush,

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why are you bothering to engage Oralboy, Gunga and Anus in converstaion?

Now, dizzythepushover, you are being bitchy again .

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These people are hate merchants pure and simple

But you like people who hate Jews .

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If they had been living in Nazi Germany they would be queueing up to fire up the ovens.

You miserable piece of **** . You hated Jews as a pro-Nazi and now you hate Jews as a pro-Palestinian . Did you leave the oven on ?

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I'm a bit concerned that you keep referring to me as a woman.

You're a man ?

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I have great admiration for many Jews

People, you scum bag ! I bet you think Jewboys and niggers are so cute the way they walk around on their hind legs just like people .

You dont care what your hatred does to people, so long as your Arab friends have no accountability for their war crimes .

Dizzythepushover, you're a bitch .

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@Ionus,

I'm really not at all bothered with what a sick racist nonce thinks.

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@Ionus,

This kind of post degrades you more than anyone else.

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@izzythepush,

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I'm really not at all bothered with what a sick racist nonce thinks.

So you wont be conversing with your Palestinian friends ?

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@georgeob1,

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This kind of post degrades you more than anyone else.

We've dealt with the facts . The next 200 pages will be trying to convert Himmler and Eichmann to being reasonable . Good luck with that . Your attempts to dignify her racism pure and simple with an intellectual response makes it obvious who you are .

Dizzythepushover watches Al Jazeira, buys only Palestinian Olive Oil and moans about how unsuccessful the Arabs are at killing Israelis . All without any verification of her nationality or religion . What makes you think a Jew-hating muslim Arab cant type English ? What makes you think she can not possibly be a neo-Nazi ?

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In my opinion, from a psychological standpoint, there are Europeans that find it very satisfying to find fault with Israel, since their may exist in Europe a large vestige of guilt for the help many countries gave the Nazis during their Final Solution. By finding fault with the Israelis, the psychological benefit, I believe, is that Jews were therefore likely not angels in pre-WWII Europe, so perhaps, it was just desserts that the Nazis carried out the Final Solution, with the help of many occupied countries? And, Europe can relax any nagging guilt, and continue to believe they are just a great bunch of guys, so to speak.

Regardless, I view American anti-Semitism as a European import, just like in the 18th and 19th century anti-Irish sentiment was a British import.

And, again in my opinion, with the advent of the nuclear age, Europe has decided to pretend to like each other's country; however, that act is already starting to fray, I believe.

But, if I was a religious person I might think that the influx of Moslems into Europe in the last few decades might be a divine sense of humor saying, " If you couldn't learn to like those other Semites (Jews), I'll give you Semites you'll really learn to love."

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@georgeob1,

I'm not going to bother replying to any more of your posts. JTT is right about you. You take every opportunity to insult and denigrate my country whilst refusing to accept your country does any wrong. As far as you're concerned Britain is responsible for everything that's wrong with the world whilst America can do no wrong. You are as big a bigot as the others no matter how much you try to wrap it up in faux intellectualism. I am not going to sink to your level as I know a lot of very decent Americans who would be disgusted to read the sort of rubbish you post. If you had an ounce of intellectual curiosity you would take a far more even handed approach. You just cherry-pick facts to support your own racist ideology, and I'm sick of it.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

I'm not going to bother replying to any more of your posts. JTT is right about you. You take every opportunity to insult and denigrate my country whilst refusing to accept your country does any wrong. As far as you're concerned Britain is responsible for everything that's wrong with the world whilst America can do no wrong. You are as big a bigot as the others no matter how much you try to wrap it up in faux intellectualism. I am not going to sink to your level as I know a lot of very decent Americans who would be disgusted to read the sort of rubbish you post. If you had an ounce of intellectual curiosity you would take a far more even handed approach. You just cherry-pick facts to support your own racist ideology, and I'm sick of it.

Can we be candid? The British Empire did not come into existence because the British were the world's Mother Theresa! They spent seven hundred years effecting a holocaust of sorts on the Irish people. Between impressing Irish men into the British navy, and making Irish live as tenant farmers on their own soil, the Irish that were able to come to the U.S.A. in the 1850's were too alienated from the land to enjoy the free land that other immigrant groups came to the U.S.A. to obtain. So, they stayed in the cities and became the backbone of the effort to build many cities. Since the British never allowed the Irish to learn to read and write in Ireland, they had little entrepreneurial background for becoming entrepreneurs in the U.S.A. either in the 19th century.

I am not Irish. I am a secular American Jew and I know bigotry when I see it. He is not a bigot. He just does not pander to those that like a sugar-coated history. The British just cannot accept that they are not a bunch of nice guys throughout history. What is so annoying, I believe, is that the British project any negative traits onto other peoples, as though they are just the hero/heroine of a fairy tale existence.

And, I doubt if there are any on this forum that could have handled the set of responsibilities that the target of your antipathy did handle for many years. Today is our Memorial Day. Please do not muck up the respect we Americans have today, and every day, for our veterans.

For saving Britain two times in the 20th century, you seem to have a lack of gratitude to those that gave their careers to the U.S.A.'s global strength. A simple thank-you might be in order, rather than your diatribe, in my opinion.

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@Foofie,

This British empire was a system of total exploitation under which EVERYBODY in the picture was being exploited somehow or other, from the king to the man on the bottom, which would have been an Irishman.

Interesting reading along such lines are articles about Friedrich List and the so-called Amnerican System of Economics, e.g.

http://american_almanac.tripod.com/listlieb.htm#article

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@Foofie,

Then again for the story of the British system of banking and money and the effect that had on the world, there's always Ellen Brown's "Web of Debt":

http://www.webofdebt.com/

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@izzythepush,

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I'm not going to bother replying to any more of your posts. JTT is right about you. You take every opportunity to insult and denigrate my country whilst refusing to accept your country does any wrong...

You're talking about England I assume... I mean, that's sad, because aside from all the exploitation, England used to be a real country.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_QfVWU-2pVL4/S1NuY0vHetI/AAAAAAAALVY/jnfo7IolIvA/s640/Islam4UK+Spokesman+Anjem+Choudary+(C)+leaves+a+press+conference+in+Millbank+Studios+on+January+12,+2010+in+London,+England..jpg

I mean, picture those fools doing that **** when Churchill was PM??

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@Foofie,

I thought you weren't going to reply to any of my posts. Like most Americans you revert to cheap exploitation of the war. Britain, unlike America declared war on Germany as a matter of principle. During the Battle of Britain when we needed help America used it as an opportunity to make money. America only entered the war after Pearl Harbour. We paid for everything America gave us, only paying things off during Blair's time in office.

You seem to think Israel can do what it wants and have no feelings for the suffering of the Palestinians. British troops liberated Belsen and as a reward were tortured and murdered by the terrorist Irgun. You should be thanking us. If we had taken Hitler's offer of peace in 1940 you would have stood no chance against Hitler when Pearl Harbour happened.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

I'm not going to bother replying to any more of your posts. JTT is right about you. You take every opportunity to insult and denigrate my country whilst refusing to accept your country does any wrong. As far as you're concerned Britain is responsible for everything that's wrong with the world whilst America can do no wrong. You are as big a bigot as the others no matter how much you try to wrap it up in faux intellectualism. I am not going to sink to your level as I know a lot of very decent Americans who would be disgusted to read the sort of rubbish you post. If you had an ounce of intellectual curiosity you would take a far more even handed approach. You just cherry-pick facts to support your own racist ideology, and I'm sick of it.

I have long had JTT on ignore, so I don't see his posts. However once or twice a year I open one just to see if any of his monotone diatribes have changed: haven't seen any variation yet.

You started the fault-finding exclusively about Israel and U.S. support for it, without acknowledgment of any contribution to the persistent problems by the Palestinians or the Arab states in the region, or even any reference whatever to the origin of the whole mess at the hands of the European colonial powers (chiefly Britain, France and, to a lesser extent Italy), and in particular your country's dismemberment of the Ottoman state; occupation of its several parts; unkept promises to European Zionists and Arab Hashemites with respect to Palestine (if they would only help you overthrow the Ottomans in the case of the Arabs, or provide lots of money in the case of the European Zionists); and shameful abandonment of the resulting mess when things got hard in 1948. (I also suggested some similarities here to the British acceptance of bribes from the tyrant Ghadaffi for the release of the Lockerbie bomber.)

Very early in the dialoge I noted our fairly complete agreement about what should be the short-term objectives in Israel and the foolish irresponsibility of Israeli attempts to expropriate the land of the West Bank without also assimilating its people. We also largely asgreed on the factors that attended the resolution of the somewhat analogous situation in Northern Ireland, and the applicability of these factors to the situation in Palestine. In terms of the current situation we differed only in my expressed belief that restricting Israeli exports of beauty and processed food products made in the West Bank would not be a serious or meaningful action in the real world.

We also discussed our common descent from Ireland and the different viewpoints often taken by those who emigrated to America and those who stayed or went to the UK, as well as the presence in America (but not Europe) of well organized, politically active Jews who are understandably concerned about the fate of their fortmerly European breadhren who fled to Palestine after largely being rejected in their former European homelands after WWII.

The "faux intillectualism" to which you refer was merely a recitation of the key historical facts surrounding the creation and evolution of the intractable situation in Palestine during the last hundred years or so, and some references of their similarity to an analogous UK-created situation in Northern Ireland that spawned a similar conflict that lasted three hundred years (since the Ulster Plantation). I did not assert that Britain is responsible for everything that is wrong with the world - instead only some of it, and, along with the other states of Europe, the situation in the Middle East and Northern Africa.

There's nothing racist in my ideology, and I do not lack intellectual curiosity. I believe your outrage, on these two points in particular, may involve a little projection of your own failings in these areas on me.

I believe the real explanation for your rather girlish pique is that you ran out of excuses and evasions, and found yourself unable to deal with the obvious truth of a matter which you had falsely and probably deceitfully described.

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@georgeob1,

Gob ran so fast to ignore precisely because he was unable to deal with the obvious truths. How a guy so prone to mendacious behavior can write stuff like this that so accurately describes him is truly astounding.

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@JTT,

He has only just said he never read your posts. As a lot of what you wrote contradicts a lot of what he said I can see why. I really don't want to play his game, and turn this whole thread into one big UK vs USA rant. Anyway it's pointless arguing against someone who is purely motivated by anti-UK sentiment. He's going to hate me and my kind no matter what I say.

On a brighter note I welcome the opening of the crossing into Gaza. It's not perfect by any means, but it's one of the first signs of the positive affects of the Arab Spring. The ordinary Egyptians won't sit back and see Gaza turned into the World's biggest prison in the same way Mubarak would. The power dynamic is shifting in the Middle East, and that's a good thing.

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@izzythepush,

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As a lot of what you wrote contradicts a lot of what he said I can see why.

Is that why you have me on ignore ?

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The ordinary Egyptians won't sit back and see Gaza turned into the World's biggest prison in the same way Mubarak would.

Are there many big prisons in your world where the guards live in fear of their children being mortared ?

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@JTT,

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How a guy so prone to mendacious behavior can write stuff like this that so accurately describes him is truly astounding.

Stunningly hypocritical .

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

I thought you weren't going to reply to any of my posts. Like most Americans you revert to cheap exploitation of the war. Britain, unlike America declared war on Germany as a matter of principle. During the Battle of Britain when we needed help America used it as an opportunity to make money. America only entered the war after Pearl Harbour. We paid for everything America gave us, only paying things off during Blair's time in office.

You seem to think Israel can do what it wants and have no feelings for the suffering of the Palestinians. British troops liberated Belsen and as a reward were tortured and murdered by the terrorist Irgun. You should be thanking us. If we had taken Hitler's offer of peace in 1940 you would have stood no chance against Hitler when Pearl Harbour happened.

Let us understand that the Nazis wanted to literally annex Britain. The U.S.A. lost 500,000 men in WWII, so do not try to put a price tag on your getting the Americans to protect your island nation.

The reason I think Israel can do what it wants is because it is a sovereign nation. I cannot tell it what to do; others would like to tell it what to do, since, in my opinion, the thought of Jews being autonomous, and not beholden to the non-Jewish world is too much cognitive dissonance for some with the Eurocentric mind.

And please do not say woulda, coulda, shoulda, regarding the hypothetical result of Britain taking any Nazi peace offering. You do not seem to understand the strength of the U.S.A. in the 20th century. We are an amalgam of many nations, and I believe you seem to underestimate how much Britain needs the friendship of the U.S.A., regardless of all the Commonwealth nations being good sycophants to Britain.

We (U.S.A. and Britain) share a language, but I do not think we share much else. Oh yes, we do share the interests of some American Anglophiles that, like Francophiles, think Britain is the main source of western civilization. Well, like Christianity being something quite different than the early Essene Jews, the U.S.A. made something else of the British culture. A more noble culture I believe.

Enjoy your heterogenous society in the coming centuries. I do not think Britain can assimilate them equally to the way the U.S. culture assimilates the world. That is because, I believe, like Europe, Britain is "exclusive," while the U.S. (society) is "inclusive."

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@Foofie,

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The U.S.A. lost 500,000 men in WWII,

Because they could see the riches for themselves coming out of that war. The US didn't give a **** about the Jews. Very few Jewish survivors got to come to the US. Instead, the US picked ex-Nazi war criminals that could help it continue its hegemony.

The US used the Holocaust for propaganda purposes.

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The reason I think Israel can do what it wants is because it is a sovereign nation.

What a crock of ****, Foofie! You're just one big crock of ****! Iraq and Afghanistan are both sovereign nations but look what happened to them. As soon as the world's top rogue/terrorist nation starts screaming "bogeyman", way way too many of your fellow idiots support war crime after war crime.

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We (U.S.A. and Britain) share a language, but I do not think we share much else.

Sure you do. The US has taken over being the top imperialist, the top raper and pillager of the poor countries of the world.

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The U.S.A. lost 500,000 men in WWII,

It's always about you, isn't it? Other countries lost way more than that. Try focusing on the millions that the US has killed just to steal others wealth.

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@JTT,

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Because they could see the riches for themselves coming out of that war.

So they have ESP like you ? What about those who didnt want to go to war ?

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Very few Jewish survivors got to come to the US. Instead, the US picked ex-Nazi war criminals that could help it continue its hegemony.

Varian Fry might have argued .

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Very few Jewish survivors got to come to the US.

Perhaps if you had of been in charge you could have forced them to...ever here of the State of Israel ? Any idea when it came about ?

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The US used the Holocaust for propaganda purposes.

And what would those be ?

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What a crock of ****, Foofie! You're just one big crock of ****!

Yes, the great satan gets you all riled up doesnt it ?

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Try focusing on the millions that the US has killed just to steal others wealth.

Never heard of the Soviet Union ? Perhaps you think we would be better off red, comrade ? How many did the Soviets kill ?

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Iraq and Afghanistan are both sovereign nations

More lies . Afghanistan was recognised by three nations only and not by the UN . Disagreeing facts dont slow you down at all do they ?

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The US has taken over being......the top raper

Put your name down on the list . I know you have a thing for rape .

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Obunga: Palestine must be based on 67 borders........

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