9
   

Is the Head of the IMF a Sex Criminal?

 
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 12:54 am
@firefly,
Quote:
I don't think there are any winners in this situation. DSK's and the maid's lives have both been damaged by it
One the one had we have a maid cum con artist, and on the other a skilled banker who was trying to help save the global financial system and potentially the president of France......One had almost nothing to lose and the other a great deal loss, and the rest of us with him as we lost his services. Maids are a dime a dozen, Con artists we can do with out.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 01:32 am
@hawkeye10,
This has got to hurt DSK, coming as it does from the center-left Le Monde

Quote:
May 16, here, below the photo history of IMF Managing Director, his face dark and closed, leaving the police station in Harlem, hands tied behind his back, surrounded by plainclothes police before be thrown in jail, we wrote that, despite the precariousness of the facts alleged against him, Dominique Strauss-Kahn was, "political and media, already held. And punished harshly, without mercy" .

Three months later, the judicial determination of the U.S. component of the case confirms the DSK first to comment, beyond what one could imagine . In ruling for the classification of the record, Monday, August 22, failing to establish with certainty before a jury the credibility of the testimony of the alleged victim, on which only the sexual assault charge, counsel for the State of New York does not totally whitens Strauss-Kahn: It simply recognizes that the inconsistencies revealed during the investigation, in the version of the young woman would not allow him to convince twelve jurors in the good faith of that it beyond a reasonable doubt.

In the absence of witnesses and physical evidence, no one except Mr. Strauss-Kahn and Nafissatou Diallo , will do so if the "sexual rush" held each May 14 in the chamber of the Director of the IMF Sofitel New York, the report said the prosecutor was forced or consented. Finally free to leave the U.S. if the judge follows the recommendation of the prosecutor, Mr. Strauss-Kahn has not been cleared so far.

Such a decision will lead inevitably to France questions about American justice. No doubt we can expect that after this episode, Americans see with new eyes the barbaric practice of "perp walk" , the march of shame for the suspect who was so shocked that the French and even the mayor of New York, Michael Bloomberg, has finally issued doubts. But overall, the American judicial system, which obeys its own logic, that of the adversarial process has worked.

For Strauss-Kahn, the lesson is, as we said, "ruthless" . The case forced him to leave early, and degrading circumstances, his position as Director of the IMF. It definitely has affected his candidacy for the 2012 presidential election. And she lifted the veil on aspects of his personality, his relationships with women and with the money. Like most French politicians, he felt protected by our strong tradition of respect for privacy.

The media frenzy has undoubtedly played a major role in the fall of DSK. On both sides of the Atlantic, the examples of excesses are not lacking, unfortunately. But essentially, in the end, based on Strauss-Kahn himself. Like Bill Clinton , whose presidency was tarnished by the case of Monica Lewinsky , it is primarily a victim of his own imprudence.


http://www.lemonde.fr/idees/article/2011/08/23/malgre-le-non-lieu-une-affaire-impitoyable_1562366_3232.html
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 03:07 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
But essentially, in the end, based on Strauss-Kahn himself. Like Bill Clinton , whose presidency was tarnished by the case of Monica Lewinsky , it is primarily a victim of his own imprudence.

That's pretty much what I said too, Hawkeye. He did himself in with his own recklessness and lack of judgment.

And there will always be questions about whether he did or did not sexually assault Diallo. The charges were not dropped because he was exonerated. Her accusations regarding a sexual assault were not shown to be false.

In that regard, the civil suit might be of benefit to him, as an opportunity to try to clear his name without the threat of prison hanging over his head. The worst he can lose in that one is more of his wife's money in legal fees.

But, at least Le Monde thinks our justice system worked in this case. I do too.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 03:33 am
@firefly,
Firefly unlike Clinton we had a woman here lying her damn head off and wasting one hell of a lot of tax payers dollars beside.

She should be looking for some time behind bars for lying under oath to begin with not getting any rewards from a civil jury.

I had predicted correctly that his case would never see a criminal trial and now I am predicting that shortly the civil lawsuit will go away.

Those hunger lawyers of her are not going to keep throwing money into a losing hand for years hoping for a Miracle outcome of some kind.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:11 am
@firefly,
Quote:
He doesn't have a case against either NYC or NYS. This wasn't a malicious prosecution. They had legal probable cause to arrest him and to seek an indictment. And, it was their investigation that resulted in revealing credibility problems with the complainant--info they promptly turned over to the defense. Even though they might have handled it better, they played by the book on this case, and they really aren't liable.


He would have a case here I think.

Of course it was a malicious prosecution. See my vulture post. They were salivating ff.

It wasn't their inveswtigation that revealed the credibility problem. It revealed itself. Women were not even allowed to give evidence in courts not all that long ago. That was because women have a credibility problem evolved into them. And the evidence revealing itself had to be turned over to the defence. There is no credit due for revealing that she was a devious manipulative liar, which I knew from the start, nor from handing it over to the defence.

But I must admit ff that you are a pretty good representative of the "monstrous regiment of women" There is no way DSK is getting off the hook with you is there?

Quote:
Vance's dropping of the charges is not a vindication of DSK, it does not mean he did not sexually assault the maid, it simply means they could not rely on her credibility to prove the charges against him beyond a reasonable doubt.


It means he did not sexually assault the maid. Full stop. Sexual assault is a legal category. I hope hawk and Bill will finally see what a fully paid up member of the Monstrous Regiment of Women can do with sophistry while claiming to be a legal expert and cease providing her with opportunities to find DSK guilty by implication in her one woman kangaroo court.

Quote:
Even if he had made a snap decision to have a brief, hurried consensual sexual encounter with a total stranger, don't you see him as having any responsibility for the consequences of that decision on his part--including winding up in a criminal case? Don't you think that split second decisions to have brief sexual contact with total strangers are more than slightly reckless?


That begins with an "even if" and arrives, rather quickly too, at the position that there was no "if" about it. From "even if" to a done deed, and from a real situation to an abstract general point, are a bit much even for the most devious representative of the MRoW.

Quote:
So, whether what happened in that hotel room was consensual or criminal, it involved decisions he made--and, either way, it would indicate poor judgment on his part, for not considering possible consequences to himself as a result of what he chose to do--with a total stranger. So, I have a hard time seeing him as some sort of helpless victim. He contributed to his own downfall by whatever he did in that hotel room.


Maybe the Devil has the best tunes but He would be going some to beat that.






firefly
 
  2  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:12 am
@BillRM,
Quote:
Firefly unlike Clinton we had a woman here lying her damn head off and wasting one hell of a lot of tax payers dollars beside.

But, because his semen was all over her, you can't conclusively say she's lying about being sexually assaulted by DSK. Even liars can get sexually assaulted.

Both Clinton and DSK were responsible for the predicaments they got themselves into.

I'm not that interested in the civil case right now. Maybe, if it eventually comes up for trial, I'll pay attention to it.

This whole case has been bizarre. It makes no sense as a consensual sexual encounter, and even less sense as a non consensual sexual encounter--but, either way, DSK made it happen.

I don't know who is crazier, DSK or Diallo. I don't think either of them is tightly wrapped.
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:14 am
@spendius,
Do you ever touch base with reality? Laughing
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:29 am
@hawkeye10,
Here's a Wiki snapshot of everything you need to know about Emily Bazelon--

Quote:
Much of Bazelon's writing has been strongly critical of the pro-life movement and opponents of legal abortion, including pro-life feminists and proponents of the concept of post-abortion syndrome, while supportive of abortion providers and pro-choice federal judges. She has accused crisis pregnancy centers of being "all about bait-and-switch" and "falsely maligning" the abortion procedure. Bazelon has been described by some commentators as "strongly pro-choice" and a "prominent pro-choicer." She has acknowledged her support for legal abortion on her Double X blog, commenting, "of course there's still an argument that access to legal abortion is also crucial to opportunity for women. Think how much some women's lives would constrict if they really had to carry every pregnancy to term.


Aren't pregnancies the result of consensual copulation? Why would a woman engage in consensual copulation if she had no intention of carrying any resultant pregnancy to its natural conclusion.

And votes for women was achieved by women who did carry such pregnancies to their natural outcome if they were irresponsibly enough to get themselves into that state. Emily wants the judges to act as back-stop for women's irresponsibility.

And what has she to say about the "hole-in-the-corner" methods of the abortion industry? Why has no abortion operation ever been shown in a medical programme in a society which believes in free expression. We have seen births, hearts pumping in chests and brains exposed to view. Why the reticence about abortion?
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:32 am
@firefly,
New York (CNN) -- Lawyers for former International Monetary Fund chief Dominique Strauss-Kahn said they are not worried about a pending civil suit from his accuser after a New York judge dropped criminal charges against him.

"She doesn't have much, if any, chance in a civil case," William Taylor told CNN's Piers Morgan Tuesday night, the same day that a New York judge dismissed sexual assault charges against Strauss-Kahn. "The same difficulties, the same lies will come back to haunt her in a civil case."

BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:37 am
@firefly,
Quote:
But, because his semen was all over her, you can't conclusively say she's lying about being sexually assaulted by DSK. Even liars can get sexually assaulted


She had admitted that she had lied under oath about aspects of her testimony before the grand jury and that is a felony and she had lied to investigators and that is in a large numbers of states is at least a misdemeanor.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:41 am
@firefly,
Quote:
Do you ever touch base with reality?


Too real for you ff. Hence the glib response which means nothing. Pity A2K provides no door to slam and no corridor for indignant footsteps to fade out along.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:44 am
@firefly,
Quote:
This whole case has been bizarre. It makes no sense as a consensual sexual encounter, and even less sense as a non consensual sexual encounter--but, either way, DSK made it happen
.

So if I had a consensus sexual encounter with a woman paid for or not and the woman later pressed false charges it is my fault for having the sex with her in the first place?

Now if a woman get drunk with a man she does not know and he then have sex with her in a drunken state it is not her fault.

Your double standard is amazing to say the least.

spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:47 am
@BillRM,
Piers Morgan eh? They say he's frightened of returning to England in case he's arrested due to allegations about hacking the phones of the families of murdered girls and soldiers killed in Afghanistan.

The allegations are far more substantive than any made in the DSK case. He was the editor at the time the hacking was going on and printed stories derived from the illegal phone taps.

0 Replies
 
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 04:49 am
here's my solution to this debacle, Dershowitz, DSK and the maid should all be placed in steel cage, the cage should be picked up by helicopter and dumped in the middle of the ocean
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 12:28 pm
@djjd62,
I don't think helicopters have the range to get to the middle of the ocean dj.

You theorists eh?? You never think of the practical difficulties.
firefly
 
  3  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 12:39 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
. So if I had a consensus sexual encounter with a woman paid for or not and the woman later pressed false charges it is my fault for having the sex with her in the first place?

You can manufacture hypothetical situations from now to doomsday, but they will illuminate nothing about this case.

No matter what went on that hotel suite, whatever happened happened very quickly after she entered what she believed was an empty suite to clean it--and she did not remain in the suite very long. Given that situation, DSK would have had to be the one who initiated whatever transpired.

So, either one believes that the former head of the IMF took one look at this maid who had entered his room and suddenly decided to attack her, giving the matter no thought at all, or one believes he took one look at her, made her an immediate monetary offer, that she rapidly agreed to, and, without any thought about it, she gave him oral sex, and he attempted unprotected vaginal sex. In either of these scenarios, you have an ostensibly intelligent man making a snap, really split-second, decision, to suddenly engage in sexual contact with a strange woman who had just entered his suite to clean it--a man who knew full well that there might be people who would want to set him up for a sex scandal, and who had absolutely no reason, at all, to trust this woman he didn't know from a hole in the wall and that he had just laid eyes on.

The man doesn't think, BillRM, he doesn't consider consequences before he acts, he's reckless, and, consequently, very self destructive. Of course, he's responsible for his behavior, and for the repercussions of his behavior, and what he's just done to himself, his career, and his family, because of that behavior. He's got some serious personal problems, and he just brought about his own downfall because of those problems.

And I don't doubt that the maid who got caught up in this mess has a load of problems of her own. Not only was she inconsistent in the narrative she gave to prosecutors, she fabricated for no logical reason. Making up the gang rape story for them makes no logical sense--it was unrelated to the situation with DSK, and she didn't need that story to make them believe her about DSK--they had already arrested him. Her changing versions of what she did immediately after the alleged attack make little sense either--except maybe she really was attacked, and she was emotionally rattled afterward, and didn't clearly recall what she did, or unless she really didn't trust the prosecutors and her changing versions were foolish attempts to protect herself from them--but just deliberately lying about it to prosecutors, for no reason at all, doesn't make sense. And she really had no clear motive to make a false accusation about DSK--immigrant women generally are not fast to go to authorities with sexual assault complaints, immigrants tend to be leary of getting involved with law enforcement, and the thought she would make a fast decision to willingly get herself involved in a criminal matter just so she could eventually lodge a civil suit to get money from him, is really quite a stretch.

Diallo may well have been telling the truth about an actual sexual assault, and she seems to have been consistent on the details of the assault, but she was so inconsistent about some other things, and at times so emotionally and behaviorally inappropriate with prosecutors (they described her as rolling on the floor of their conference room when she became upset at one point), that they must have been going out of their minds with her. And the more agitated and upset the prosecutors got with her, the worse her behavior with them probably got, and, that's probably why, after Thompson got involved in the case, he kept her away from them for a while just to defuse things. And she might have trusted Thompson more because he is also black, which is why she was apparently more honest with him than she was with the prosecutors. So, even though she might have been sexually assaulted, from a prosecutor's point of view this woman would be a loose canon on the witness stand, they couldn't be sure of what she'd say, which would be a main reason they couldn't go to trial. And the fabricated gang-rape story, apparently convincingly told, was just bizarre--there was no need for that story. I really suspect that prosecutors concluded the woman was slightly crazy and they wanted no part of this, despite any pressure on them to go to trial, and that's what their battle with Thompson was about.

This is not a scheming, sophisticated, con woman. This is not a woman with a lot of savvy or smarts. You've given this woman far too much credit for attributes she doesn't seem to have.This is not a woman who even understands she has to play it straight with law enforcement, otherwise she needlessly, very needlessly, digs herself into a mess. By the time Thompson got involved I think she had already irretrivably damaged her relationship with the D.A.'s office (she had already told them the gang rape story) and his attempts at damage control made matters worse. I tend to believe Thompson's characterization of Diallo as "a simple woman"--she is uneducated, illiterate, and worked hard at a decently paying, but menial, job, and really had no idea what she was in for when she reported her sexual assault, particularly because she probably could not have imagined that her complaint would make headlines all over the world.

To think that this woman even had the cunning to deliberately go after DSK with a false accusation, that would have to have been suddenly conceived after a brief, hurried, and totally unanticipated, consensual encounter went wrong, does not at all ring true for me. If money crossed her mind, it was the next day, after she really found out who he was, and that he had deep pockets.

To say that DSK made reckless moves, consensual or otherwise, on the "wrong woman" is an understatement. And, what happened to him, as a result of those moves, was his own damn fault and he should be grateful that the consequences to himself weren't even worse in terms of years in prison. Most of all, he should be grateful that this woman has so many screws loose that she even spared him the ordeal of a trial because the prosecutors couldn't use her to make their case.

This whole incident has been a mess, and DSK caused the mess. He's no way the victim in this saga, except as the victim of his own self destructive tendencies, but he's sure left a lot of damage to other people in the wake of his reckless actions in that hotel suite.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 01:05 pm
@firefly,
Editorial in today's Guardian.


Quote:
The sexual assault prosecution of Dominique Strauss-Kahn had not even been dropped before the French Socialist party celebrations began. Martine Aubry, who may be the party's candidate against Nicolas Sarkozy in nine months' time, described the New York court's decision as an "immense relief" and declared that "we were all waiting for this, for him to finally be able to get out of this nightmare". François Hollande, Mme Aubry's main rival, agreed that "a man with the abilities of Dominique Strauss-Kahn can be useful". And Harlem Désir, the party's interim general secretary, expressed satisfaction at a "happy outcome".

What kind of world do these leaders of the Socialist party live in? No one who reads the original prosecution complaint against Mr Strauss-Kahn and the New York prosecutors' 25-page request for the case to be dismissed could possibly make such reckless remarks. Yesterday's dismissal did not find that no sexual encounter occurred between the ex-head of the IMF and the hotel maid Nafissatou Diallo. There was reliable forensic evidence of a real and rapid encounter, and Ms Diallo quickly reported the incident. The case ended because it had become a "he-said-she-said" dispute and because Ms Diallo's reliability as a witness had collapsed. As the prosecutors put it: "The nature and number of the complainant's falsehoods leave us unable to credit her version of events beyond a reasonable doubt, whatever the truth may be about the encounter between the complainant and the defendant." The outcome, as so often in rape cases, should cause not "immense relief" but immense unease.

To drop the case against Mr Strauss-Kahn was nevertheless the right legal decision. But it does not justify the wholly inappropriate tone of vindication expressed by so many French Socialists and it does not justify the tendency of so much of the French governing class to debate the DSK affair as a purely political event devoid of moral content. Mr Strauss-Kahn is entitled to the presumption of innocence, but he has not been exonerated, as a commentator on French television falsely claimed last night. He has been freed on a technicality, albeit a vital one.

Mr Strauss-Kahn's modernising roles in the often difficult debates in the post-Mitterrand Socialist party and, more recently, his work as an innovative head of the IMF in crucial times deserve real credit. But his public career is over. It should not be resuscitated. He cannot again command the respect required by a senior minister, let alone a head of state. One Berlusconi is enough. A rehabilitation of Mr Strauss-Kahn would dishonour the French left. The Socialist party has enough problems without humiliating itself in such a disturbing manner.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 02:38 pm
@izzythepush,
Quote:
He cannot again command the respect required by a senior minister, let alone a head of state. One Berlusconi is enough.
Logic fail: if Berlusconi can do it DSK should be able to do it, the French are as forgiving a people as are the Italians. The puritan Brits can shove off....
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 02:43 pm
@spendius,
doesn't have to be the middle of the ocean, i'd be happy with water about a foot above their heads
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Aug, 2011 03:35 pm
@firefly,
Come on Firefly all we know for sure is that she does not tell the truth so there is zero reason to buy into any statement of her such as she did not know who he was or that she was under the impression that the room was empty.

She had proven that she is a constant liar and yet you still are trying to grant her statements weight.
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

T'Pring is Dead - Discussion by Brandon9000
Another Calif. shooting spree: 4 dead - Discussion by Lustig Andrei
Before you criticize the media - Discussion by Robert Gentel
Fatal Baloon Accident - Discussion by 33export
The Day Ferguson Cops Were Caught in a Bloody Lie - Discussion by bobsal u1553115
Robin Williams is dead - Discussion by Butrflynet
Amanda Knox - Discussion by JTT
 
Copyright © 2025 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.1 seconds on 04/29/2025 at 04:32:39