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The Communist Origin of the Modern Conservative Movement VI

 
 
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Mon 30 Sep, 2019 08:46 pm
@edgarblythe,
I was unaware that Cadillac had a governor in the 60s. Actually, that was a good idea, most drivers don’t need to drive over 65 MPH Heavy equipment used mechanical governors at the time but when electronic ignition came along in the 70s it made electronic governors cheap and easily installed. It was much better for car manufacturers, not to mention the owner, if the governor keeps the driver from over revving the engine and blowing it up. On my 370Z you can actually set a warning light to come on before you reach the rev limit. I set the light for a few hundred RPMs before the governor kicks in. I have not seen the warning light yet. If you have a $35,000 racing engine and miss a shift and over rev it you have lost a motor. Governors are worth their weight in gold in racing.

Years ago, my wife decided to try her hand in powder puff race. As soon a I climbed out of the car, after finishing the feature, she got in the car for hot laps. When she got the car on the race track, the fastest half mile in the country at the time, she never took it out of first gear. The car was screaming at that speed. She blew the motor. When I tore it down three of rod bearings were completely gone. I asked her why she never shifted gears, she learned to drive on a standard, she said it felt like it was going to stall. She had a very short racing career. A governor would have saved that motor.
0 Replies
 
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Tue 1 Oct, 2019 09:55 pm
@oralloy,
If you put two corvette side by side one with a manual transmission and one with a standard transmission you could tell a real difference driving the two but they would both still be the most dangerous cars on the road, more people are killed in corvettes per 100,000 miles than any other car. Assault weapons are the same way automatic or semi-automatic they are both designed to kill large numbers of people rapidly.
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The manufacturers sell the semi-automatics assault weapons.as assault weapons. There are several motor driven vehicles, cars, trucks, riding lawn mowers, tractors. When new motor driven vehicles, they are designed to one of those groups. When a gun manufacturer designs a gun, he designs to be a pistol, rifle, or assault weapon. The automatic and semi-automatic assault weapons were designed for the same purpose the wholesale slaughter of men. Colt saw the writing on the wall and stopped selling assault weapons.
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The 1994 assault weapons ban would have failed if eight republican senators had not voted to ban assault weapons. It passed by 56 to 43. Eight votes going from yea column to the nay column would have made the vote 48 tea and 51 nays. So, the Republicans were responsible for the 1994 assault weapon ban they cast the deciding votes.
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There is reality and then there is personal reality and there is a big difference in the two. There is an exact correlation between the two both have an automatic and standard version.
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The two assault weapons are identical except for one small difference.
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In your personal reality you can continue to beat a dead horse but it won’t change reality.
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Neither does a semi-automatic assault weapon magically become a completely different type of gun because it is a standard fire version.
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Trying to convince people that two identical assault weapons are two completely different type of guns is the same thing.
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The assault weapons are the same, just one has option that is easily adapted to the other.
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When you are killing people at 130 round a minute rate, aiming is utterly impossible.
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The fact is aiming takes time and you can not aim a gun in a second. If a mass murderer took time to aim every victim would be dead and none would be wounded but the number of wounded in Las Vegas was almost ten times high as those killed.
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If you are standing in a large crowd like the Columbine mass murderers you would have to aim to keep from hitting someone.
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We know what happened in practice it is a matter of record you can see the El Paso mass murderer entering Wal Mart with the gun waste high.
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The stills are there as well as security camera footage. You can spend literally hours watching security camera footage. That what the next generation of mass murderers do so they learn from the mistakes of others.
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Whether it is held when firing we know they are dropped and people die. Can’t be a very secure grip in fact it is awkward. Ever hear of someone being killed when an assault weapon was dropped?
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Colt sold them and they can tell you that America is absolutely saturated with weapons of war.
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The evidence is there you just don’t want to look at it.
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In the few minutes I spent it showed the Columbine footage shows one of the mass murderers firing to set off one of their propane bombs.

0 Replies
 
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Wed 2 Oct, 2019 09:45 pm
@Baldimo,
You will never be able to make the case that two identical assault weapons with one slightly modified are not both assault weapons. The reason mass murderers use assault weapons is the speed that the chamber ammunition and there is no difference in speed between the semi-automatic and the automatic models. After all a 130 round rate is great for mass murdering.
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The point about being shipped to local gun store is that it lets the mass murderers order assault weapons from all over the world.
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“Like many pseudocommando mass shooters, Lanza grew fascinated with guns and military history.”

From the book: “Mass Killers”

If you are a mechanic you need to master a mechanic’s tools, If you are a carpenter needs to master carpenter tools, but a mass murderer must master assault weapons.
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We are not worried about standing armies, they are not the problem. We are worried about mass murderers armed with assault weapons.
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There is no box on a police report where you mark whether someone was an NRA member. If the only one holding the information that someone is an NRA member is NRA, and if they are determined to keep it secret there is no way to know. However, what we do know is that mass murderers are gun nuts and fascinated with all things gun the very type most likely to be NRA members. You have no idea what has been found. Mass murderers go out of their way to destroy stuff, both Adam Lanza and the Las Vegas shooter even destroyed their computers.
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I had that right to start with otherwise I would not have used the word “rate.” I would have just said it fires 900 rounds a minute. There is a difference between firing 900 rounds a minute and firing at the rate of 900 rounds a minute.
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No, you are the one that claimed that it would take 2 seconds to aim a gun. The Akron shooter fired 30 rounds in 30 seconds. Do math it would take 60 seconds if he aimed using your estimate. It was not possible to aim according to your estimate.
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I gave you the specific search that takes you to the Columbine security camera footage. You can see one of the mass murderers firing at a propane bomb to set it off.
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I bough a book on Windows 10 a few months ago to learn how to do links but I hate to read technical manuals.
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You can keep insisting that a rose is not a rose but it will not change anything. If 99% 0f the parts are the same they are both assault weapons. No matter how hard you try you can’t change reality.
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The Las Vegas shooter fired a thousand rounds and had plenty left over.
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Aiming in the general direction of a crowd is quite different than actually aiming a gun at a target. When people are standing five or six deep in a night club or a school cafeteria it is impossible to miss.
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I have never claimed Las Vegas was common but it is still a mass murder. After all the Las Vegas shooter is the current record holder, the one that all the perspective mass murderers want to beat.
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Texas is hardly a gun free zone and probably has the highest concentration of guns in America, yet that did not stop the El Paso shooter.
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Most mass murderers are not marksmen, they need to be within a few feet of their victims so they won’t have to aim. Plus, they want to be close up and personal to watch their victims die.
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Making the assault weapons easily available is like putting gasoline and matches in every class room in America and telling the children not to set fires. Society strives to create carbon copies and those that are different pay a price and that leads to retaliation in rare cases.

Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Oct, 2019 09:24 am
@Zardoz,
Quote:
You will never be able to make the case that two identical assault weapons with one slightly modified are not both assault weapons. The reason mass murderers use assault weapons is the speed that the chamber ammunition and there is no difference in speed between the semi-automatic and the automatic models. After all a 130 round rate is great for mass murdering.

You are wrong beyond belief. If it doesn't have the main compenent, a selective fire switch, it isn't an assault anything. You are basically saying there is no difference between an automatic and semi-automatic rifle. That is crazy talk and shows exactly how uneducated you are on the subject of guns. You should stop while you are ahead because you are sounding foolish. Repeat your claims all you want, it doesn't make them true.

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The point about being shipped to local gun store is that it lets the mass murderers order assault weapons from all over the world.

You are wrong, you can't import assault rifles, they have a selective fire switch, and civilians can't own rifles with selective fire switches.

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We are not worried about standing armies, they are not the problem. We are worried about mass murderers armed with assault weapons.

Did you see the latest FBI crime report? There were more murders with knifes in the US in 2018 then there was murdered by rifles. You are over hyping mass shootings so you can get rid of the 2nd Amendment. A vast majority of mass shootings don't take place with rifles, just the ones the media and gun grabbers want to take away. You ignore all the mass shootings that didn't take place with rifles.

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There is no box on a police report where you mark whether someone was an NRA member.

Just stop the BS. The media would find out a shooter was part of the NRA, since none of them have found any mass shooters who were NRA members, and they would be looking, they have an agenda and they need the propaganda. We know for a fact that none of the mass shooters were NRA members. You fail to prove it every time so you have to make things up.

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Mass murderers go out of their way to destroy stuff, both Adam Lanza and the Las Vegas shooter even destroyed their computers.

Do you have any proof of such claims? I don't remember any news stories about them destroying "evidence". Prove it or it never happened, just like a majority of the crap you post.

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We are not worried about standing armies, they are not the problem. We are worried about mass murderers armed with assault weapons.

Who's we? The weak minded who lie about guns?

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I had that right to start with otherwise I would not have used the word “rate.” I would have just said it fires 900 rounds a minute. There is a difference between firing 900 rounds a minute and firing at the rate of 900 rounds a minute.

You are still wrong, the 900 rpm is only achievable with a fully automatic rifle with an unlimited supply of ammo, no reloads required. That's how they figure that rate of fire, it doesn't apply to semi-auto rifles that can't be fired that fast without a cheat mechanism like the bump stock. It is physically impossible to pull the trigger on a semi-auto and get a 900 rpm cyclic rate. You seem to always forget the term cyclic. The best you could hope to achieve would be around 60 rpm.

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No, you are the one that claimed that it would take 2 seconds to aim a gun.

I did claim that it takes just seconds to aim a rifle, you seem to think it take much much longer. You would be wrong and continue to show your lack of education and understanding of guns.

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The Akron shooter fired 30 rounds in 30 seconds. Do math it would take 60 seconds if he aimed using your estimate. It was not possible to aim according to your estimate.

You can't do that math with any reliability, you aren't accounting for fatigue, which would kick in much sooner than you think.

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I gave you the specific search that takes you to the Columbine security camera footage. You can see one of the mass murderers firing at a propane bomb to set it off.

Did he actually hit the bomb, did it go off? No he didn't, goes to show you still don't understand what you are talking about.

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I bough a book on Windows 10 a few months ago to learn how to do links but I hate to read technical manuals.

That won't help you do links on this site. I've already posted the link from this site that says how to do links and quotes, you are just too lazy to do it right.

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You can keep insisting that a rose is not a rose but it will not change anything. If 99% 0f the parts are the same they are both assault weapons. No matter how hard you try you can’t change reality.

That is your opinion and your opinion is wrong. Repeating wrongness doesn't make it right. Assault anything would have a selective fire switch, and guns sold in the US don't have such a switch.

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The Las Vegas shooter fired a thousand rounds and had plenty left over.

He fired 1000 rounds in 10 minutes, which totally blows away your claim of a 900 round per minute fire rate.

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Aiming in the general direction of a crowd is quite different than actually aiming a gun at a target. When people are standing five or six deep in a night club or a school cafeteria it is impossible to miss.

Hence the reason the fire rate of the gun makes no difference. It's like shooting fish in a barrel, you don't really have to aim, you just point it in the general direction, which the Pulse shooter did from the shoulder. You have still failed to prove your "shooting from the hip" crap. What are you going to move the goal polls too next?

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I have never claimed Las Vegas was common but it is still a mass murder. After all the Las Vegas shooter is the current record holder, the one that all the perspective mass murderers want to beat.

So, what does that have to do with the average gun owner? If the average gun owner was as nutty as you claim, there would be a lot more gun deaths in the US.

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Texas is hardly a gun free zone and probably has the highest concentration of guns in America, yet that did not stop the El Paso shooter.

What's you point? It sounds like not enough people are armed in that part of Texas. Did you also know that gun sales spiked in El Paso after the shooting? Getting your carry conceal permit is one of the best things you can do to protect yourself and others. Permit requests also spiked since the shooting, people want to protect themselves, you want to disarm the public and leave them victims.

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Most mass murderers are not marksmen, they need to be within a few feet of their victims so they won’t have to aim. Plus, they want to be close up and personal to watch their victims die.

This usually comes from shooters picking places that they know no one will be armed, they are cowards at heart. Gun free zones lead to people dying, you like people dying, it's why you want to see US civilians disarmed and left to the killers.

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Making the assault weapons easily available is like putting gasoline and matches in every class room in America and telling the children not to set fires. Society strives to create carbon copies and those that are different pay a price and that leads to retaliation in rare cases.

They are not easily available, they require background checks to purchase and they aren't sold on every corner. Did you see the article a few weeks ago about the lady who tried to buy a gun from Walmart and it was harder than she thought it was.





Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Thu 3 Oct, 2019 09:05 pm
@oralloy,
You make the same argument by claiming identical assault weapons are not assault weapon if one is semi-automatic. If that is the case then a corvette with a manual transmission could never be a corvette because the transmission is manually operated.
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The manually operated assault weapon was designed first and the automatic version was a later option. Just because an automatic option was added later it does not suddenly negate the first design.
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You can’t say a manually operated corvette is not a corvette and you cannot say a manually operated assault weapon is not an assault weapon especially when 3 small parts can be changed and you have a full-automatic. If these were completely different weapons that would not happen.
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If the automatic is capable of firing at a 900 round per minute rate then the manually fired assault weapon has that same potential, a fast and practiced trigger finger is one way to take advantage of the capability, a bump stock is another or other ways to achieve the same result.
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The math is impossible, 2 seconds to aim those 30 shots would have taken 60 seconds instead of the 30 seconds it actually took.
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In the still of the El Paso mass murderer going into Wal Mart the ak47 is not at his shoulder and you know he is going in shooting.
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Water will wear down a rock and being hit in the shoulder enough times will eventually do damage no matter how light the recoil is. If the rounds are so weak why is the damage from them so catastrophic?
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If assault weapons had been tightly regulated for 85 years there would be very few high body mass murders but that is not the case.
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Assault weapons were only banned between 1994 and 2004.
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0 Replies
 
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Fri 4 Oct, 2019 09:41 pm
@oralloy,
The assault weapons are identical except for three small parts. If you take the full-automatic and change those parts it magically becomes rifle instead of an assault weapon. Do you know how utterly absurd that sounds? To try and tell the public that those three small parts are all that makes an assault weapon.
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The law is correct and it targets the cause of these high body count mass murders.
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Assault weapons were banned once and it is going to happen again except this time it will not only ban the sale of but the possession of assault weapons.
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Since the parts are interchangeable it makes no difference at all. Assault weapons were designed to kill large number of people quickly and the semi-automatic has out preformed the full-automatic in mass murderers.
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Assault weapons are readily available, to every mass murderer, racist and revolutionary maniac in America.
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Assault weapons were designed for only one type of hunting, hunting human beings.
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Do you really think mass murder should become a normal way of life in America? Where you kiss your wife goodbye in the morning and tell your wife I hope I make it home before some gun nut kills me. The mass murders are getting worse and far more frequent. The three highest body count mass murder happened in the last couple of years.
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Even the gun manufactures don’t lie about it, they sell assault weapons as assault weapons.
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The very people that manufacture the assault weapons tell you they are assault weapons.
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The fact is he killed 49 people and held the record for a few months. Have you ever been in a crowded night club? You can just reach out and touch people. Shooting into that type of crowd you could not miss.
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Over 93% of Americans are now in favor of changing the gun laws. Never in the history of America have so many people agreed that something has to be done. Do you not understand “a right to bear arms” is just that and no more? If you have an arm to bear your rights have been met in full.
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Assault weapons are designed for mass murder not hunting.
The left understands the words of the second amendment and if you have an arm to bear your constitutional rights have been met.
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Gun manufactures market their assault weapons all the time to mass murderers.
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If a soldier killed that 49 enemy soldiers in that short of time, he would get the medal of honor.
Maybe they should be using the semi-automatic version of the assault weapons.
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You can continue to insist that black is white but it will never make it so.
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You have a real problem understanding how dense a crowd is in a bar people are standing five to six people deep.
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The definition of assault weapons is set by law and when they are confiscated that is the definition that will be used.


0 Replies
 
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Sat 5 Oct, 2019 10:17 pm
@oralloy,
You are not going to convince people that their eyes are lying that two identical assault weapons are not assault weapons.
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The 1994 law banned the sale of assault weapons
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Just keep trying to convince people their eyes are lying. They know an assault weapon when they see it.
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The law was written specifically to address the assault weapon problem.
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The semi-automatic version of the assault weapon should have never been allowed on the streets in the first place after the trouble caused by the Thompson submachine gun.
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The only thing that the second amendment grants is the right to bear arms and as long as you have an arm to bear that is fulfilled. The conservatives are always complaining about activist judges but some have stretched their interpretation of the second amendment far more than any activist judge in history. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
When a semi-automatic can fire a 130 rounds a minute why buy an automatic?
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The history of mass murder says otherwise, assault weapons are designed for function, it is not like chrome bumpers.
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A weapon that was designed to fire at 130 round a minute rate are designed for one reason to slaughter large numbers of people rapidly.
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You will never convince people their eyes are lying or will you convince the government that a gun that can fires at a 130 round a minute rate is not an assault weapon.
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The assault weapons are the same and the semi-automatic can be modified to fire automatically.
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It is the same gun and it can be modified to fire automatically.
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Some people were only wounded not everyone died. Forty-nine died and fifty-three were wounded that accounts for most of the rounds in the Pulse Nightclub mass murder.
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If you consider aiming pointing the gun in the general direction of the crowd. Or watching to see where the rounds are striking.
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The assault weapon ban was written by 100s of peoples who were experts in their field and the Republicans cast the deciding votes.
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So, a semi-automatic assault weapon is not an assault weapon but as soon as you change three small parts it is suddenly an assault weapon. Even you don’t believe what you are saying.
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Your concept of aiming, putting the assault weapon to your shoulder and looking through the site and finding a target doesn’t happen in mass murderers. Putting the barrel to the head of the victim and blowing their brains out does. If that is your idea of aiming you might be correct.
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The capability of an assault weapon to fire at a 130 round a minute rate makes mass murder easy. History demonstrates that the high body count mass murders are not being done with any other type of guns. If the pistol grip did not make mass murder easier the high body count mass murders would be done with other types of guns.
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When you have baseball size exit wounds people bled out before help can arrive.
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Colts’ official statement said that and that was their stated reason for deciding to no longer sell weapons of war to the public.
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They are not mislabeled and only three small parts need to be changed to make them full automatics. If they were not the same weapons this would be impossible.
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Assaulted weapons were first regulated in 1994 and the Republicans let the ban lapse in 2004 after the gun manufactures stuffed their stockings with blood money. Why bother to register a weapon of war?
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The experts who wrote the assault weapon ban disagree.
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It is not an ordinary hunting rifle it was designed from day one to slaughter large numbers of humans rapidly. It was designed for one type of hunting, hunting people.
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A mass murder firing 30 rounds in 30 seconds can’t not aim. It is beyond human limits.
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Mass murderers just fire in the general direction and let God sort them out.
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The law sets the actual definition and your free to make up anything you wish but that is the actual definition.
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If manufacture says a semi-automatic is an assault weapon they should know.
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Mass murderers prefer semi-automatic assault weapons. It is the mass murderer’s friend.
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A pistol grip is specifically designed for the human hand for grip.
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It is a common type of death here there will be one or two deaths each hunting season.
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If solider dropped his assault weapon and it went off instead of killing one person it might kill several and that is why it has a pistol grip.
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You do realize the pistol grip gives you another firing position that a traditional rifle doesn’t have.
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Pistol grips are what makes it such an effective mass murder weapon.
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Actual facts show that you are wrong mass murderers manage to kill large numbers of people rapidly. Mass murderers have been as young as 11 years old but with an assault weapon you are in business.
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I think you would get the hang of it after the first mass murder or so.
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You are surrounded by assault weapons.
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That has happened fighting in a tight confined space like a night club is far different than fighting on a battlefield.
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You don’t believe that and neither do I.
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Bump stock or pulling the trigger at a 130 round per minute rate there is not much difference.
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You believe that we should just accept the ever increasing rate of mass murder and do nothing about it, that the death 20 elementary school children ever few years is an acceptable price for having a country full of assault weapons and you think calling an assault weapon a regular rifle will keep them putting more and more weapons of war on the streets.

0 Replies
 
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Sun 6 Oct, 2019 10:39 pm
@Baldimo,
All you have to do is read the newspaper, the suicides, children shooting children, spouses murdering each other the incidents can also be found just from watching the evening news. I have known several people that committed suicide including a Police Captain I worked with for 20 years. The city changed the retiree’s insurance and he ate his gun because he did not want to be a burden on his children. There was a recent program about the suicide rate for cops in one city nine cops had ate their guns in a years-time. The suicide rate for cops is now approaching the suicide rate for ex-military. There are daily stories of shootings, it is constant. People that are at an increased risk for suicide should not own guns. It is not possible that the most likely gun nuts, NRA members, are not involved in gun crimes. The NRA is a secret organization just like the KKK they kept their membership secret also.
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The mentally ill do not have the organized mental capacity to carry out long range plans for mass murders and not one mass murderer has been found innocent by reason of insanity. People think that the common definition of mental illness is someone who did something that you would not do. By that definition every murder is mentally ill.
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I don’t know why you can’t get your mind around the idea that there are people who just want to kill people. It is what their guns were made for and they want to see them work. Ted Bundy wasn’t insane he just really enjoyed killing people much like you enjoy firing your guns. It is a choice plain and simple. If you know what you did was wrong and made a choice to do it anyway you are not mentally ill. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Watch and see if the Akron shooter is found innocent by reason of insanity. The prosecutor will have several expert witnesses that will testify to his sound mental health.
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Mass murderers are gun nuts and most have several guns, they may not be with them but when their houses are searched, they find the other guns.
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Wars tend to last longer than ten minutes.
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Holmes had 6,000 rounds of ammunition whether he took it all with him or not he still had it.
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Just one of the many mass murderer threats that are sweeping the country.
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The specs were written by Colt the Pulse Night Club mass murderer was recorded at 130 rounds per rate and someone who practiced could far exceed that rate because the assault weapon is designed to far exceed that rate.
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However, the mass murderers speak for themselves.
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The assault weapon ban was only on the sale of assault weapons the country was still full of assault weapons.
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If you have a better hold on something it will be harder to take away.
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Chicago is a big city with a huge population if it were broken down into normal city size it would compare favorably to other cities the same size.
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Gang activity is a problem in most big cities and there will always be collateral damage, at least according to the military.
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Not all gang members are black. How would you stop all these people from killing each other? Confiscate all guns? If they had to kill each other with knives their accuracy would improve.
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The gun I owned was a shot gun.
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The El Paso shooter picked a gun rich zone, there were laws in some Texas down that required you to own a gun whether you wanted to or not. Mass murderers plan to die for their cause anyway.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You think bars or gun free zones? One guy was just killed at the same place that he had been shot twice in a gun fight inside a bar two years ago. One of the bars had so many killings inside the bar that they were closed down. They tried everyway they could to keep the guns out but they always managed to get them in. When you really want to kill someone, you can always get a gun in. Have you ever been in a bar before, especially a crowed bar like the Pulse? The Fire Marshall sets limits but most bars ignore them.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



0 Replies
 
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Mon 7 Oct, 2019 10:29 pm
@Baldimo,
You are learning bad habits from Trump you think if you can repeat a lie enough it will become true.

Assault weapons come down the same assemble line, they are the same design, there is one option offered and that is automatic fire. The assault weapon ban, that the Republicans cast the deciding votes for, was to ban semi-automatic assault weapons. Semi-automatic assault weapons are what is making these mega mass murders possible. There is a difference between the trigger mechanism but it does not make it a different gun. Cars come with all sorts of options, there was a book full of options for my 370Z but no matter how many options or how few options the car came with it was still a 370Z. You can buy a gun with a laser sight or a conventional sight it is still the basic construction of the gun that determines what it is. The law backs my position up and it would have been upheld by courts.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The assault weapon used in El Paso was imported from Romania and the law has my back on the definition and the courts will back it up.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There were no mass murders killing 58 people with knives and there never will be but the mass murders with assault weapons continue to get more frequent with higher body counts. Knives are used by acquaintances while assault weapons are used to slaughter huge numbers of innocent strangers. Most killings with knives only involve one fatality while the sky is the limit with assault weapons. It is just the mass murders that kill huge numbers of people that are the real problem.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Being a member of the NRA is of no significance, it is not against the law, there is no reason to find that out, no more than checking for a membership in the local garden club.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Read the book “Mass Murderers” and you will find many of the answers you are looking for. News stories can not go in to the details that a 200+ page book can.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
About 93% of Americans are worried about mass murderers enough to want stiffer gun regulations.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The 900 rpm is the rate the assault weapons were designed to fire. We know for a fact that the Pulse mass murderer fired at a speed 130 rpm. You can bet someone can break that record.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It takes time to aim a gun and when you only have seconds time is a luxury you don’t have.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I am 69 and last month I did a Triathlon, 4.2 miles run, 4.2 miles in the kayak, topped off with a 17-mile bike race. That took 2hr and 50 minutes tell me about fatigue of my trigger finger. All you have to do is get conditioned.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
He was aiming and fired but that bomb did not go off. Goes to show you that aiming does not keep you from missing.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There are things you just don’t want to know.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The law backs me up on that definition as do the manufactures of the assault weapons.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The Las Vega mass murderer had to switch guns and reload. It was a rate, remember.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The only picture of a mass murderer firing at shoulder height that I have seen was the one from Columbine and he was aiming at a propane bomb not a crowd.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It is not the average gun owner that is the problem it is the average assault weapon that is the problem. Gun deaths are still climbing.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
One of books that I am reading shows how retarded the idea is that if guns are killing people the solution is even more guns. A pimp walks into a bar and starts propositions a woman at the bar a male patron takes offence and takes the pimp down and holds him until the police arrive. When the police arrive, they shoot the do-gooder four times in the back killing him. Let the police enforce the law. A do-gooder with a gun in his hand at a mass murder scene will be shot by the police or by other do-gooders with guns looking for any idiot holding a gun. The gun spike will make for even more killings.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There have been mass murderers go into police station they are not afraid to die in fact they want to die. There is a reason school-shooters chose schools and it has nothing to do with a gun free zone. School shootings tend to be done by students. The Policeman who worked at a school said it best, “If they let guns in school, I will run screaming from the building.” ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It should be harder to buy a gun, anyone wanting to purchase a gun should have to undergo go psychological testing and be cleared by a panel of at least three psychiatrists and undergo yearly follow ups.
Zardoz
 
  3  
Reply Tue 8 Oct, 2019 09:09 pm
The recent developments in Washington have confirmed one thing for certain, that Trump plan for winning elections include soliciting help from foreign governments. We know for a fact, from the transcript of the call to Ukraine President, that Trump was trying to solicit help in the next election. If Trump would ask for help in the next election from the Ukraine, he would have no problem asking the Russians for help in the last election. We know how he thinks and what he would do. They say this may be the first witch hunt in history where the witch drowned himself. Trump continued to ask Red China for help in the next election just as he asked Russia to find Hillary’s missing e-mails. After Trump does one of these outrageous things the Republicans excuse it as a joke but Trump is no comedian. Trump stopped the $341 million in military to the Ukraine days before his call to ask for a “favor.”

Trump watches the wild conspiracy theories on Fox News and then tries to strong arm a foreign governments into proving the wild conspiracy theories. It seems that Fox News believes it was not the Russians who helped Trump it was the Ukraine posting all the pro-Trump lies were from the Ukraine in an effort to use reverse psychology to help Hillary. Trump also believes the DNC server is buried somewhere in the Ukraine. This would make a good treasure hunt show where they never seem to find the treasure but won’t give up either.

0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 09:41 am
@Zardoz,
Quote:
You are learning bad habits from Trump you think if you can repeat a lie enough it will become true.

Sorry to tell you, but that you be you and your propaganda on guns. You continue to prove you know nothing about them and yet think your an expert.

Quote:
Assault weapons come down the same assemble line, they are the same design, there is one option offered and that is automatic fire.

There is no such thing as an automatic Ar-15. The AR stands for Armalite, not assault rifle.

Quote:
The assault weapon ban, that the Republicans cast the deciding votes for, was to ban semi-automatic assault weapons.

There is no such thing as a semi-auto "assault weapon". Stop using made up definitions by politicians who knew nothing about guns. It wasn't expanded because it failed to work. Columbine happened right in the middle of the ban, proving it was pointless. They included BB guns in the act because they look scary.

Quote:
The law backs my position up and it would have been upheld by courts.

Your appeal to authority is weak and totalitarian in nature.

Quote:
The assault weapon used in El Paso was imported from Romania and the law has my back on the definition and the courts will back it up.

What difference does it make where it came from, the law was followed when he purchased it. You have no point.

Quote:
There were no mass murders killing 58 people with knives and there never will be but the mass murders with assault weapons continue to get more frequent with higher body counts.

I guess mass murder only started with guns... history would prove you wrong. No, there are no higher body counts, but there will continue to if you remove the ability of the people to protect themselves. Gun free zones make mass murder possible.

Quote:
Most killings with knives only involve one fatality while the sky is the limit with assault weapons. It is just the mass murders that kill huge numbers of people that are the real problem.

The latest FBI report shows that more people were killed with knifes then rifles, the stats don't back your propaganda.

Quote:
Being a member of the NRA is of no significance, it is not against the law, there is no reason to find that out, no more than checking for a membership in the local garden club.

You would be wrong. People like you think the NRA is where these people come from, not a single member of the NRA has committed a mass murder, more propaganda.

Quote:
Read the book “Mass Murderers” and you will find many of the answers you are looking for. News stories can not go in to the details that a 200+ page book can.

Does this book provide proof of your claim that mass shooters are NRA members? No it doesn't, or you would have posted this months ago when you made the first BS claim.

Quote:
About 93% of Americans are worried about mass murderers enough to want stiffer gun regulations.

The gun regulations will have no effect, all your going to do is violate the 2nd Amendment and people's Constitutional rights. The only Amendment that says "Shall not be infringed".

Quote:
The 900 rpm is the rate the assault weapons were designed to fire. We know for a fact that the Pulse mass murderer fired at a speed 130 rpm. You can bet someone can break that record.

See you keep repeating lies as truth. No semi-auto rifle can fire that many rounds, it takes unlimited ammo, no reloads and an automatic rifle to get that fire rate.

Quote:
It takes time to aim a gun and when you only have seconds time is a luxury you don’t have.

You are wrong, it doesn't take much time to aim, you continue to prove you don't know **** about guns.

Quote:
I am 69 and last month I did a Triathlon, 4.2 miles run, 4.2 miles in the kayak, topped off with a 17-mile bike race. That took 2hr and 50 minutes tell me about fatigue of my trigger finger. All you have to do is get conditioned.

Stop the BS, you have no point.

Quote:
He was aiming and fired but that bomb did not go off. Goes to show you that aiming does not keep you from missing.

You are going to have to provide some proof of this claim.

Quote:
There are things you just don’t want to know.

I know about a 1000 times more about guns than you do, you don't know **** about guns.

Quote:
The law backs me up on that definition as do the manufactures of the assault weapons.

You are confusing military weapons with civilian weapons, that's easy for a propagandist to do.

Quote:
The Las Vega mass murderer had to switch guns and reload. It was a rate, remember.

What other excuse are you going to make for him shooting 1100 rounds in 10 minutes? He didn't reload anything, he only switched guns, which should have let him fire faster, but he didn't. This shooting alone disproves everything you say about the fire rate of guns, he was using bump stocks, which are now illegal.

Quote:
The only picture of a mass murderer firing at shoulder height that I have seen was the one from Columbine and he was aiming at a propane bomb not a crowd.

Lies, lies and more lies.

Quote:
It is not the average gun owner that is the problem it is the average assault weapon that is the problem. Gun deaths are still climbing.

Guns don't fire themselves and the average gun owner is not a killer or mass shooter. Gun deaths are not climbing, more people were killed with knifes than rifles, you continue to prove you are nothing but a propaganda machine.

Quote:
One of books that I am reading shows how retarded the idea is that if guns are killing people the solution is even more guns.

As noted by the 2013 CDC report, 500,000 to 2.5 million people use guns to defend themselves a year. You don't have a point, you want more people dead, not less.

Quote:
It should be harder to buy a gun, anyone wanting to purchase a gun should have to undergo go psychological testing and be cleared by a panel of at least three psychiatrists and undergo yearly follow ups.

What other Constitutional rights will have this type of limit?



hightor
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 11:31 am
@Baldimo,
Quote:
You continue to prove you know nothing about them and yet think your an expert.

One needn't be an "expert" to speak meaningfully about firearms and their effect on society.
Quote:
There is no such thing as an automatic Ar-15.

Because the design of the AR15 is basically the same as the military assault version it can be quickly converted to automatic.
Quote:
Stop using made up definitions by politicians who knew nothing about guns.

There's no reason that people can't develop new terminology to describe items which factor heavily in the news.
Quote:
Your appeal to authority is weak and totalitarian in nature.

Citing the law is not a logical fallacy, nor is it "totalitarian".
Quote:
What difference does it make where it came from, the law was followed when he purchased it.

The fact that people can import these modified weapons of war should prompt legislation to prevent this from happening.
Quote:
No, there are no higher body counts, but there will continue to if you remove the ability of the people to protect themselves.

Civilized society doesn't need to revert to the law of the jungle. Increasing the supply of weapons leads to more suicides and accidental deaths along with more criminal use.
Quote:
The latest FBI report shows that more people were killed with knifes then rifles, the stats don't back your propaganda.

The knife killings don't happen in one incident — where and when has a knife-wielding criminal killed 58 people?
Quote:
People like you think the NRA is where these people come from, not a single member of the NRA has committed a mass murder, more propaganda.

NRA lobbying has prevented effective gun laws and is responsible for gun deaths and injuries even if its members are relatively law-abiding. You haven't said anything.
Quote:
Does this book provide proof of your claim that mass shooters are NRA members?

Not an issue.
Quote:
The only Amendment that says "Shall not be infringed".

Subject to re-interpretation by future courts.
Quote:
No semi-auto rifle can fire that many rounds, it takes unlimited ammo, no reloads and an automatic rifle to get that fire rate.

Big deal.
Quote:
You are wrong, it doesn't take much time to aim, you continue to prove you don't know **** about guns.

No, you're wrong. You don't know how much time anyone will take to aim in any particular shooting incident. You're not omniscient.
Quote:
Stop the BS, you have no point.

His point was obvious to me.
Quote:
You are going to have to provide some proof of this claim.

You don't think a person can aim and miss his target?
Quote:
I know about a 1000 times more about guns than you do, you don't know **** about guns.

You're getting to sound like oralloy!
Quote:
You are confusing military weapons with civilian weapons, that's easy for a propagandist to do.

And you're confusing a post on a message board with propaganda.
Quote:
This shooting alone disproves everything you say about the fire rate of guns...

False.
Quote:
Lies, lies and more lies.

More pronouncements from the omniscient one, eh? You don't know what Zardoz has seen and what he hasn't seen.
Quote:
Guns don't fire themselves and the average gun owner is not a killer or mass shooter.

And your point is? People are getting shot all the time. Someone is responsible. Some gun owner.
Quote:
As noted by the 2013 CDC report, 500,000 to 2.5 million people use guns to defend themselves a year.

Great methodology used in that study — the estimates differ by a factor of five.
Quote:

What other Constitutional rights will have this type of limit?

What other Constitutional rights address civilian use of lethal weapons?
Baldimo
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 12:14 pm
@hightor,
Quote:
One needn't be an "expert" to speak meaningfully about firearms and their effect on society.

The lies he tells are not helping his cause. If he was honest, he might have a point.

Quote:
Because the design of the AR15 is basically the same as the military assault version it can be quickly converted to automatic.

No it can't be quickly converted, that is another lie. If that was so easy, we would see AR's converted to automatic for these mass shootings, it's never happened. Don't spread his lies.

"Basically the same", except for all semiauto guns are of the same basic concept, does that mean they want all semiauto guns off the streets and taken from legal owners? Don't spread the propaganda, would you have gone into a war zone with an AR15, or an M16? Be honest, don't lie.

Quote:
There's no reason that people can't develop new terminology to describe items which factor heavily in the news.

You mean make **** up so they can be banned? That's not how the Constitution works. 2nd Amendment is the only amendment that says "Shall not be infringed". Not even the 1st Amendment says that.

Quote:
Citing the law is not a logical fallacy, nor is it "totalitarian".

Yes, it is exactly totalitarian when you look to take things from law biding citizens. You leftists want more rights for illegal immigrants than you do citizens.

Quote:
The fact that people can import these modified weapons of war should prompt legislation to prevent this from happening.

It isn't modified, it's a regular semiauto rifle. Stop the lies and propaganda.

Quote:
Civilized society doesn't need to revert to the law of the jungle.

Tell that to your communist Antifa buddies. We also shouldn't be taking rights away from citizens because you don't like something.

Quote:
Increasing the supply of weapons leads to more suicides and accidental deaths along with more criminal use.

Got any proof of that? The US isn't even in the top 10 for suicides and yet those that are, have strict gun laws. Japan?

Quote:
The knife killings don't happen in one incident — where and when has a knife-wielding criminal killed 58 people?

That's the best you got? Keep moving along, you have no point.

Quote:
NRA lobbying has prevented effective gun laws and is responsible for gun deaths and injuries even if its members are relatively law-abiding. You haven't said anything.

You haven't said anything. The point Zardoz the Lame was trying to prove is that the NRA is filled with mass killers. He has failed to even defend his point.

Quote:
Not an issue.

According to Zardoz it is. He and Izzy have both made this claim, why are you defending a lie?

Quote:
Subject to re-interpretation by future courts.

Where is that written in the Constitution? That's the problem with leftists, they want to "reinterpret" all the things they don't like. They want to trash the Constitution because they don't like it.

Quote:
No, you're wrong. You don't know how much time anyone will take to aim in any particular shooting incident. You're not omniscient.

If you slow and old it would be slow. The main point behind his claim is that mass shooters are not aiming and are shooting from the hip, which he claims a pistol grip was made to do.

If you are going to defend his claims, at least get his claims correct and don't change them for him.

Quote:
Big deal.

Another one of his lies about guns.

Quote:
You don't think a person can aim and miss his target?

Sure I do, but he is making a claim he can't prove. I live in CO, this was major here in my state. There has never been any indication that they were trying to set the bombs off by shooting them, all indications say they had flares taped to the bombs, they weren't shooting at them.

Quote:
You're getting to sound like oralloy!

You mean educated and know what they are talking about when it comes to guns? He might be a little off his rocker, but he isn't wrong.

Quote:
And you're confusing a post on a message board with propaganda.

His posts on guns are propaganda. He doesn't provide any actuate facts, he lies.

Quote:
False.

True. If those guns shoot 900 rounds per minute, why did the Vegas shooter only shoot 1100 rounds in 10 minutes?

Quote:
More pronouncements from the omniscient one, eh? You don't know what Zardoz has seen and what he hasn't seen.

I can tell by the way he talks about guns, he doesn't have that much experience with them. He's never fired any type of AR weapon and yet he talks like an expert.

Quote:
And your point is? People are getting shot all the time. Someone is responsible. Some gun owner.

Depends on where you live. Yeah, people in the south and west sides of chicago are getting shot all the time. My town hasn't seen a single shooting in a several years.

Quote:
Great methodology used in that study — the estimates differ by a factor of five.

Even if you took the lower number, it's still higher than the total # of gun deaths per year. More people are saved using a gun than are killed by them.

Quote:
What other Constitutional rights address civilian use of lethal weapons?

You have no point here. The intention of the 2nd Amendment was for the population to have access to the same weapons the military would have. It's main point it to prevent someone like an extreme leftist from taking over the country and ruling like a king. If you don't understand this, then I can't help you.

People think Trump is Hitler and yet they want to get rid of guns. It goes to show they don't believe their own propaganda.
McGentrix
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 12:40 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:

Quote:
There is no such thing as an automatic Ar-15.

Because the design of the AR15 is basically the same as the military assault version it can be quickly converted to automatic.


Did you actually watch that video? I don't think you did.

You cannot just take an AR-15, add a paperclip and make it automatic. That's not how it works. That's like saying you can take a Volkswagen Beetle, add a paperclip and make it a Porsche 911.

Here is the actual difference between a semi automatic AR-15 and an automatic M-16
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 01:47 pm
@McGentrix,
Okay...I fell for that one! Touche!

But, it can be done. I couldn't do it with any of my firearms.
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 01:51 pm
@Baldimo,
Quote:
The intention of the 2nd Amendment was for the population to have access to the same weapons the military would have.

The Constitution doesn't say anything like that.
Quote:
It's main point it to prevent someone like an extreme leftist from taking over the country and ruling like a king.

Nope. It's to enhance the security of the country by providing for a well regulated militia. In other words, it's an anachronism.
Baldimo
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 02:15 pm
@hightor,
Quote:
The Constitution doesn't say anything like that.

Sure it does, read the 2nd Amendment. It doesn't place any limits on the citizens, but does place a limit on the govt, "Shall not Infringe". The founders were pretty clear on their intentions.

Quote:
Nope. It's to enhance the security of the country by providing for a well regulated militia. In other words, it's an anachronism.

You haven't read the Federalist or anti-Federalist papers have you? You can always tell who pulls things out of their asses vs people who have actually studied this subject. It's to prevent tyranny. They had just finished fighting a war against a tyrannically govt, the Brits, and kicked their asses. Why would they limit the weapons choice for the people when they just fought a war?

Which other Amendments do you consider "anachronism", are they the ones who give more power to the govt and take power from the people? The entire Constitution was written to limit the power of the US govt, can you be any more anti-freedom?
oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 02:44 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:
The Constitution doesn't say anything like that.

That is incorrect. The Second Amendment protects access to any kind of weapon that the militia needs to fight effectively.

Guess what? Militias need modern military weapons in order to fight effectively.


hightor wrote:
Nope. It's to enhance the security of the country by providing for a well regulated militia.

Well-regulated militias enhance the security of the country by refusing to carry out the orders of leftist tyrants.


hightor wrote:
In other words, it's an anachronism.

The fact that the left regards civil liberties as an anachronism is why it is important to keep voting for Trump and the Republicans so that we can be protected from these leftists.
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 03:27 pm
@Baldimo,
Quote:
It's to prevent tyranny.

No, it really doesn't say that. It mentions the "security of a free state". An armed citizenry is hardly a guarantee against tyranny, since people could freely elect a tyrant if they wished. And hand-held weapons are hardly an effective defense against a foreign power intent on tyrannical rule — that's why we have professional armed forces.

You try to make it sound as if there's only one possible interpretation; in truth, it's ambiguous.
Quote:
Having been oppressed by a professional army, the founding fathers of the United States had no use for establishing one of their own. Instead, they decided that an armed citizenry makes the best army of all. General George Washington created regulation for the aforementioned "well-regulated militia," which would consist of every able-bodied man in the country.

source
Quote:
Why would they limit the weapons choice for the people when they just fought a war?

Okay, and why can't I buy a machine gun?
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Wed 9 Oct, 2019 03:45 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:
No, it really doesn't say that.

The Framers disagreed. They said that having a militia would prevent tyranny.


hightor wrote:
It mentions the "security of a free state". An armed citizenry is hardly a guarantee against tyranny, since people could freely elect a tyrant if they wished.

An armed citizenry would hardly enforce a tyrannical directive against themselves.


hightor wrote:
And hand-held weapons are hardly an effective defense against a foreign power intent on tyrannical rule --

Why do we equip soldiers with such weapons then?


hightor wrote:
that's why we have professional armed forces.

The Framers did not agree with you. They felt that such a defense should be carried out with a militia if at all possible.


hightor wrote:
You try to make it sound as if there's only one possible interpretation;

He is right to do so. There is in fact only one correct interpretation.


hightor wrote:
in truth, it's ambiguous.

No it isn't. You just pretend not to understand because you don't like what it says.


Quote:
Having been oppressed by a professional army, the founding fathers of the United States had no use for establishing one of their own. Instead, they decided that an armed citizenry makes the best army of all. General George Washington created regulation for the aforementioned "well-regulated militia," which would consist of every able-bodied man in the country.

So in other words, military weapons.


hightor wrote:
Okay, and why can't I buy a machine gun?

Setting aside for a minute the definition of "machine gun" and whether such a weapon is covered by the Second Amendment, the reason why people are not able to buy the sorts of military weapons that they have the right to have is because progressives like you keep violating their civil liberties.
0 Replies
 
 

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