The Communist Origin of the Modern Conservative Movement VI

@Zardoz,

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I have been married 45 years and owned rental property and used the short form most years. The EZ may be for singles but the short form is only a page.

And? You say you were a rental property owner, how would that work out for you if your dream of socialism came to the us? One of the first things socialist do is take land away from people...

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If you claim the standard deduction the only information necessary on the short form is the income personal information, married number of dependents, birth dates, social security numbers and the amount of tax paid. It is an extremely simple calculation from there. According to Republicans the purpose of tax reform was to make it simple and after all they did away with the personal deductions which will make many pay more taxes this year.

You keep confusing the types of deductions. You can't take the standard and personal deductions, you have to choose between the 2 and pick 1. You need to stop spreading false information and how that works.
https://blog.taxact.com/difference-itemized-standard-deductions/

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Thank god for republicans they took a $10,000 tax deduction away from many working people with several children. But the ungodly greedy got millions in tax cuts funded by raising taxes on working people.

You can't even be honest about this bit. Who on average has a $10k state tax write off on their federal taxes? The wealthy, this only effects those who live in high tax states, mostly liberal, who want to pass the burdon of their high state taxes onto the federal system. I wold have thought you would like the wealthy to pay more.

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So, who do you believe funded the Pew Research Center? Peter Rabbit. The think tanks were started and funded by the ungodly greedy to write white papers for the congressmen they own to use justify their voting for whatever the ungodly greedy wanted. These were chartered as non-profit organizations so ungodly greedy could donate to them and deduct them from their taxes. But then you still believe peter rabbit started them.

I don't care who started it, they have been releasing good work that is pro and con for both sides of the political aisle. Just because they don't back socialism, you don't like them.

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How can you say with a straight face that the income tax didn’t tax excess wealth when it only taxed income over a $100,000 in today’s dollars? That means the tax law recognized the difference between income and excess wealth. At the time the ordinary income exemption was $4,000 (a $100,000 in today’s dollars). This recognize the fact that no one would pay income tax on income below that level because congress understood that money was needed to support their families and only when someone had excess wealth would it be taxed. There is no other way to look at the figures are clear and don’t lie.

I've grown board of this portion of the debate. You get to pay income tax just like everyone else in the US. Stop whining, if paying tax is good for one group, it's good for all groups. It gives them skin in the game instead of just being freeloaders.

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Working people as a group are pretty honest and pay their taxes but the rich will cheat every chance they get and the richer they are the more likely they are to cheat.

I think that goes for the majority of Americans, regardless of their wealth. It's to bad you have such a pathological distrust of the wealthy. It's a form of bigotry if you were being honest with yourself.

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See a pattern there the more dishonest you are the more likely you are to get rich. I always enjoyed catching them in their tax scams, but you could never do more than make them pay what they owed.

That's a lie, there is always fines and fee's and don't forget jail time.

I'm pretty sure you used your power to target those you didn't like. BTW, I thought you were a building inspector who worked in the police dept? Now you are a tax authority?

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@Zardoz,

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You will never get rid of the Welfare for the rich programs because the rich own the government. America’s infrastructure is falling apart, and the Republicans are to blame for not funding infrastructure replacement.

Which welfare for the rich are you talking about? Keeping more of the money they earn is not welfare. From the sounds of your last post, the GOP Gov of WV is doing just that.

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You are talking about what the Republicans call “entitlements” like social security, Medicare unemployment, and welfare.

I"m not sure what I actually said, I don't see any claims like this in that post. Social Security while a ponzi scheme, is actually something we all pay into for future use. The rest of the "entitlements" on your list are paid for by a majority of people who haven't and won't need them.

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The Republicans want to use the law to force all sorts of people who can’t support themselves to have babies even they know they can’t support.

You want to use the force of law to make the general public pay for people's lack of personal responsibility, that's right, you want to make people who do make good decisions in life pay for people who make poor decisions.

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Every effort to stop abortion makes the welfare problem worse.

Maybe people should stop making poor choices in either their sexual partners and choose not to have sex if they don't have birth control. Condoms are cheap and so are other forms of non-Rx protection. Welfare problem only gets worse when people don't care about how many children they have because they know bleeding hearts like you will just make others pay for it, and make them feel no shame for it either.

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The Republicans always want to stop abortion, but it is alright to starve the babies to death after they get here.

No babies starve in the US, we have over 170 social welfare programs between all levels of US govt. To say this is just as stupid as CEO's steal money from their companies.

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That explains a whole lot. You have no clue how to do your own taxes. I on the other hand have never paid to have my taxes done. I had to learn the tax laws to do my own taxes.

I used to do my own taxes until just a few years ago when I went through a couple of life changes that changed my tax filing status on many different levels, so no, with all the changes that took place, my taxes are a tad more difficult than they were prior to 2013. I could handle the easy stuff, dual income w/children, owning a home and basic deductions for some simple charities we donated to, now it is more complicated and I would rather have a professional do them for me.

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In New Jersey only 60% will get a tax cut under the Republican tax scam.

Which is a vast majority of taxpayers. The majority of those who don't, pay more than 10k a year in taxes to the state, read property owners, and can no longer deduct those state taxes from their federal taxes. Be honest about what it really happening. Rhetoric with no substance.

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I still don’t think that you understand that you get to choose the standard deduction or the to itemize deductions and you got personal exemption until the Republicans eliminated under the guise of cutting taxes.

I've posted the info for you to disprove but you keep repeating the same stuff with no facts. Do you need to website again? Maybe you should post some proof of what you say instead of just endlessly repeating the same thing over and over.
https://blog.taxact.com/difference-itemized-standard-deductions/

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Both my father and mother came from large families neither were ever on welfare.

My grandparents were the same, 11 on one side and 12 on the other. They weren't on welfare either, the kids who could work left the farm and went to work on other people's farms. My grandpa was 13 years old and driving 6 team of Clydesdale's, working fields. They were to proud to accept handouts, unlike people of today who think it's a right to take such things. Pride no longer exists and the social welfare state took that from people.

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Just because you have a large family does not mean you are on welfare.

This is why it's important to post what I actually said... your such a dishonest person, here is what was actually posted:

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Who has 10 kids? If you have 10 kids and have to live on welfare, you have bigger issues than taxes.

Now compare that to the BS you implied I said. This is the real reason you don't bother to quote me, it's easier to bullshit people if you don't quote me.

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@Baldimo,

According to Trump most Mexicans are either rapists or gang members. Lordy, Lordy that is why he is so desperate to build a wall. Trump believes that South Americans will bring in MS-13 gang but MS-13 began in Los Angles. Trumps wants more immigrants from countries where the people are white like him. Trump has no issue with immigration he has an issue with race. When the white supremist and the Nazis were rioting in Virginia Trump told the nation that the Nazis and the white supremist were “fine people.”

You live in an alternate reality created out of “alternative facts” commonly known as lies created by the ungodly greedy. When FDR was president racism was the rule not the exception. When the Black Panthers killed people, Obama did not tell the country what “fine people” they were.
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During the Cold War no body trusted the Russians. In fact, we were convinced that a nuclear attack was immanent that there were designated bomb shelters in many big buildings. City Hall was a fall out shelter and the windows were blocked up in the bottom story and only a few of the windows have been restored. In school we had drills to shelter under the desk when the Russian bombs hit. Several generations lived in mortal fear of what the Russians would do. Nothing has changed the Russians are still the Russians oh there is one thing that changed, Trump has been promised a large chunk of a Russian oil company if he sells the United States out according to dossier compiled by the top expert on Russia today. Trump openly admires dictators because he wants to be one.

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Where do you live? Do they mine coal there? The first thing Trump did was eliminate the rule that you could not dump coal so close to a water way that prevented the chemicals used to treat it from being washed into the drinking water. We just had a major water way polluted with chemicals and people could not drink the water for weeks. Trump changing the rules, so the coal fired plants that are a major source pollution will continue to put hundreds of thousands of tons of pollution into the air each year. One small town in Ohio was so polluted the power company had to buy the town. Thousands of people die in America each year from the air pollution generated by coal fired plants but that does not matter to Trump. The Russians can’t wait for Trump to destroy NATO they have already invaded one country and taken over when NATO is gone there will be no obstacle to taking over other small countries. Trump is like the little cartoon dog jumping around the big bull dog. He absolutely can’t wait to do the Russian’s bidding.

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The public schools have been drained by the Republicans to give bigger and better tax cuts to the ungodly greedy. You get what you pay for. The Republicans cut the funding to local schools so far, they can no longer afford to hire substitutes when teachers are sick. The kids are just told they can stay in study hall or go home for the day and this happens several times a year. But big oil and big coal companies were given tremendous tax cuts by the Republicans.

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@Zardoz,

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According to Trump most Mexicans are either rapists or gang members.

I'm not going to spend lots of time "defending" Trump, I didn't vote for him and he had a poor choice of words in that initial outing. The reverse implication from the left is that there are no bad people who come across the border, but logic says that it is a mix of good and bad people.

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Lordy, Lordy that is why he is so desperate to build a wall. Trump believes that South Americans will bring in MS-13 gang but MS-13 began in Los Angles.

The wall has nothing to do with racism and everything to do with limiting illegal immigration across the southern border.
As for MS-13, they may have started in LA, but they were and are primarily made up of South American immigrants, mostly illegal, and specifically those from El Salvador. MS-13 is one of the most violent gangs in the US.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS-13

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Trumps wants more immigrants from countries where the people are white like him. Trump has no issue with immigration he has an issue with race.

Pfft, race has nothing to do with it. If we are going to grant legal immigration status to people, why not make it people who are most likely to a net add to the economy instead of subtracting from the economy? We have enough people in the US to do the low skilled labor jobs, we don't need to "import" them. As for the higher skilled trades, allow immigration as long as there are no US persons to do the jobs. Computer engineering is a perfect example of not having enough skilled workers in a field, so the tech industry "imports" workers from nations like Pakistan and India. I have worked for small start up companies in the tech industry for the last 10 years, at several companies at least 25% of the programming engineers have been from those 2 countries, with a few people from the UK and Ireland, but most of the green card workers were brown people from none white countries.

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When the white supremist and the Nazis were rioting in Virginia Trump told the nation that the Nazis and the white supremist were “fine people.”

There was no rioting by those dispicable people, the rioting was started and caused by Antifa. Why is it you types always forget to mention the violent fascist group Antifa and the violence they have unleashed? You only talk about the one person killed when they were ran over by a car, but not the violent confrontations started by Antifa?

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You live in an alternate reality created out of “alternative facts” commonly known as lies created by the ungodly greedy. When FDR was president racism was the rule not the exception.

The above response proves who is living in a world of "alt facts". You can't even get the facts of those events correct. I don't agree with anything those groups say, but they have a right to say it as long as they remain non-violent. Antifa who claims to be anti-fascist, yet acts and behaves very much like fascists, attack those they don't agree with and try to silence those who's speech they don't like, just like Hitlers Brownshirt's used to do to Hitlers opponents.

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When the Black Panthers killed people, Obama did not tell the country what “fine people” they were.

Do you mean the BLM, Black Lives Matter, movement? If you do, then Obama did everything he could to prevent any sort of relation between the cop killers and the BLM movement, he had plenty of help from the MSM as well.

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During the Cold War no body trusted the Russians.

I disagree with that statement, the American left has always had a soft spot for the Communists and have supported them in South America and anywhere else the USSR was trying to expand their sphere of influence. Your own continued push to enact socialism/communism in the US is proof enough of that.

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In fact, we were convinced that a nuclear attack was immanent that there were designated bomb shelters in many big buildings. City Hall was a fall out shelter and the windows were blocked up in the bottom story and only a few of the windows have been restored. In school we had drills to shelter under the desk when the Russian bombs hit. Several generations lived in mortal fear of what the Russians would do.

I have a lot of those same memories from my early school days in the late 1970's and into the 80's.

As a side note, I don't think everyone was scared of the USSR, there were lots of communist sympathizers through the generations, to include a current sitting US Senator who got married and then had his honeymoon right in the USSR capital. Bernie and his ilk have always been fans of the USSR and only now don't like Russia because they are no longer communists.

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Nothing has changed the Russians are still the Russians oh there is one thing that changed, Trump has been promised a large chunk of a Russian oil company if he sells the United States out according to dossier compiled by the top expert on Russia today. Trump openly admires dictators because he wants to be one.

Don't you recall Obama telling the out going Russian leader to tell Putin "not to worry, I'll have more flexibility after the election"... Clearly prior to 2014, Obama was willing to deal with Putin and assured him of his co-operation. Can you imagine if Trump had been caught saying the same exact thing? In fact Obama didn't even consider Russia a world threat and mocked Romney for his "80's foreign policy" for calling Russia out as a geo-political threat. Obama said ISIS and global warming were bigger threats than Russia.

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Where do you live? Do they mine coal there?

I live in CO, they used to mine coal here, now we are an oil state, in fact I live in one of the oil richest parts of CO, lots of oil drilling going on out here. I love it!

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The first thing Trump did was eliminate the rule that you could not dump coal so close to a water way that prevented the chemicals used to treat it from being washed into the drinking water.

Considering it was a "rule" that was written and went into effect in Dec of 2016, less than a month before Trump took office, I can see why it was revoked. Obama liked to use the EPA to target industries he didn't like and didn't support his campaign. How many EPA "regulations" did Federal Courts overturn while Obama was in office.

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We just had a major water way polluted with chemicals and people could not drink the water for weeks.

Just? As in the last few weeks? Nope, I looked and it was in Jan of 2014...

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Trump changing the rules, so the coal fired plants that are a major source pollution will continue to put hundreds of thousands of tons of pollution into the air each year.

Obama put rules in place to shutdown the coal industry, those were some of the rules that were overturned by Federal Courts. Clean Coal is an actual real technology that emits almost no pollution, and it is certainly more cost effective than wind or solar.

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Thousands of people die in America each year from the air pollution generated by coal fired plants but that does not matter to Trump.

I think that is bullshit and you can't prove it.

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The Russians can’t wait for Trump to destroy NATO they have already invaded one country and taken over when NATO is gone there will be no obstacle to taking over other small countries. Trump is like the little cartoon dog jumping around the big bull dog. He absolutely can’t wait to do the Russian’s bidding.

Who was running the US and promised "more flexibility after the election"? That's right, Obama who refused to name Russia as a geo-political foe and 2 years later they invaded another country... You want to talk about Trump?
NATO needs to pay their fair share, they have been living safely thanks to the hard working American taxpayer. If they don't pay their promised amounts, the failure of NATO will be in their hands, not Trumps. The US has contributed enough to the security of EU nations, we have footed the bill for the last 30 years.

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The public schools have been drained by the Republicans to give bigger and better tax cuts to the ungodly greedy.

That's another lie. We spend more per student than any of our "1st world" allies. The problem with school funding is all the extra BS that schools think they should be teaching. Students can't read or write properly anymore, but they can tell you how many made up genders there are. Kids are dumber today than they were 30 years ago, and it has everything to do with what and how they are teaching. Teachers unions are also a huge drain on school funds and resources, they should all be disbanded.

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You get what you pay for. The Republicans cut the funding to local schools so far, they can no longer afford to hire substitutes when teachers are sick.

Don't you mean when the selfish teachers go on strike? Depending on where you live and who controls the school districts purse strings, depends on how schools are doing. The US education system was one of the best in the world prior to the creation of the Education Dept. They have done more to destroy our US school system than any other force in the US.

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The kids are just told they can stay in study hall or go home for the day and this happens several times a year. But big oil and big coal companies were given tremendous tax cuts by the Republicans.

Stop with the BS. A majority of school funds come from local sources and not the Federal govt. In fact one of the reasons I think recreational pot passed in the US was due to the first $40 million in taxes collected would go to the school construction fund, the greedy politicians have now dipped into that new revenue source and are starting to spend the money on all sorts of pet projects, like they do.
Have you ever heard of TABOR, Taxpayers Bill of Rights? You would hate it, it forces the politicians to go to the people if they want to increase any taxes in the state. You were talking about the power of the people, that's the best power the people can have, limit the greedy politicians and force them to work with a budget, just like a majority of the Citizens they are suppose to represent.

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@Zardoz,

I am going to take a break from replying to Baldimo tonight.

We now have a president who is a chronic liar, and this has never happened before. We all know people who are chronic liars some just tell outrageous lie for no apparent reason other are patholigocial liars and lie. But there are seven types of liars according to the website “Seven Types of Liars and How to Recognize and Deal With Them.”

1) White Liars: generally harmless lies like, does this dress make my but look big? No not at all.
2) Careless liars: They lie all the time and don’t particularly care about the ethics or sense of their lives.
3) Occasional Liars: Only lie occasionally they are not in a habit of lying.
4) Compulsive liars: Lying is their default way to respond to a question.
5) Sociopathic Liars: The worst type of liars they lie to get their way.

I only found 5 types on the site but that pretty much covers it. Is there any doubt that Trump is a sociopathic liar?

But the liar is not the problem the problem comes in when people believe the liar. Right now, in America many people believe Trump’s lies or at least see nothing wrong with him lying. Why do so many people believe Trump’s lies? It is far easier to believe the lies than deal with the truth. We live in an age of designer lies. Lies that are designed for specific philosophies. Like puzzle pieces they are designed to fit together. However, the truth is the truth and may not fit so easily into your philosophy. It is easier to believe the lie.

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@Baldimo,

The right-wing motto is the truth is a lie and the lie is the truth. Bill Kristol is a regular guest on Meet the Press daily and he is red neck right royalty. Bill Kristol father, Irving Kristol, was one of the founding fathers of the modern conservative movement. A true card carrying communist and the party selected his wife. Meet the Press is one of the longest running programs on television meaning they were subject to the Fairness Doctrine where both sides of a political question had to be given equal time. Fox News could never exist under the Fairness Doctrine and could only start broadcasting their propaganda after Reagan eliminated the Fairness Doctrine. Fox News was created by right wing political operatives who made a living spreading propaganda.

What comes around goes around. The Republicans blocked Obama from filling a vacancy on the supreme court that occurred during his term in office in effect the Republican stole that vacancy pay back will be hell. Your reference was only a report of a conversation of an incident on Meet the Press and had nothing at all to do with Meet the Press veracity.

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Links are far inferior to searches that provide both sides of an issue but then you don’t want exposed to both sides of an issue.

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The Russians alone gave far more to the NRA than is listed in that pack of lies and the Justice Department is investigating the Russian firm that The NRA was laundering the money for. Links are worthless as any Russian with a computer can come up with a professional looking website and the Russians did during the last election. The Gun Manufacturers are selling death do you think that they would be bothered by lying? The facts show that the NRA spending approached a half a billion in the 2016 election. Do a search instead of believing links when you depend on links you are a sitting duck for Russian propaganda. ____________________________________________________________________________________

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

I don't accept your claim of expertise on university curricula. I have had more than a decade of your bullshit peddling here, and this is just another glaring example. This is particularly glaring in your lame attempt to describe the course of history in recent decades. Stalinist and Maoist versions of "communism" certainly failed, and they have been replaced by a plutocratic kleptocracy in Russia and a modified communist-capitalist command economy in China. Socialism has been successful in Sweden and France under that name, and in modified form in Germany and Italy. Right wing troglodytes have been squealing about "socialized" medicine in the UK and Canada for decades and only stopped when it became common in almost all liberal democracies. They still piss and moan about it, but they don't want to give up the insurance coverage provided by the ACA.

I certainly never suggested that you feel guilty about anything. Given the vicious, racist remarks you made here shortly after you arrived at this site, and the lame bullshit you came up with the attempt to claim that you are not white, I have no doubt that you don't feel guilty about anything.

Once again, I'm not buying your bullshit about history. Finding some extremist academic self-described historians is neither difficult nor conclusive. It's like reading Howard Zinn and then condemning all contemporary historians on that basis. Even contemporary academic historians didn't and still don't buy Zinn's bullshit, but you seem to be using crap like that to condemn the practice of teaching history and the practice of writing history by the tens of thousands of practicing historians, academic and otherwise. This is what one academic historian had to say about Zinn:

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Stanford professor Sam Wineburg is also critical of Zinn's research. Reviewing a critique by Wineburg, reviewer David Plotnikoff credits Wineburg for showing that "[A People's History] perpetrates the same errors of historical practice as the tomes it aimed to correct," for "Zinn's desire to cast a light on what he saw as historic injustice was a crusade built on secondary sources of questionable provenance, omission of exculpatory evidence, leading questions and shaky connections between evidence and conclusions," for which he provides many examples.

In effect, you're a typical ignorant man, whose opinionated pronouncements derive their strength from an inverse relationship to your knowledge. Here, I'll simplify that so that even you can understand it. Because you know so damn little, your ranting opinions are the much louder and odious.

You've shown yourself to be ignorant and hateful since you first showed up here. Apparently, nothing has changed in all these years.

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@Zardoz,

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The right-wing motto is the truth is a lie and the lie is the truth.

As you push for a socialist nation, keep this in mind, socialist's can't be honest about their aims, which is to destroy liberty and freedom.

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Bill Kristol is a regular guest on Meet the Press daily and he is red neck right royalty.

Bill Kristol is from New York... nothing red neck about that.

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Bill Kristol father, Irving Kristol, was one of the founding fathers of the modern conservative movement. A true card carrying communist and the party selected his wife.

You are still going on about all these "communists" who started the modern conservative movement? How is it "communists" would found a political group that was 180 degree's of their "political beliefs"?
You continue to strike me as someone who is used as an attack dog against those who turn against the faith. Scientology is a prime example of this, they run a propaganda campaign against the person who leaves their "faith" and becomes critical of it.

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Meet the Press is one of the longest running programs on television meaning they were subject to the Fairness Doctrine where both sides of a political question had to be given equal time.

Nothing like forced govt speech codes. It's on NPR, a left-wing channel supported with taxpayer money.

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Fox News could never exist under the Fairness Doctrine and could only start broadcasting their propaganda after Reagan eliminated the Fairness Doctrine.

Who are you kidding, none of the modern news agencies, CNN and MSNBC included, could be on the air if the Fairness Doctrine was in play.
Do you support a new version of the Fairness Doctrine?

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What comes around goes around. The Republicans blocked Obama from filling a vacancy on the supreme court that occurred during his term in office in effect the Republican stole that vacancy pay back will be hell.

You mean the GOP was following the Biden rule? The DNC is going to throw a fit but it won't do any good, they will vote and this guy will go onto to be the next Judge in SCOTUS.

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Your reference was only a report of a conversation of an incident on Meet the Press and had nothing at all to do with Meet the Press veracity.

They lost their trust worthiness when they hired Chuck Todd, he did an extreme left turn and went right on by neutral coverage.

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Links are far inferior to searches that provide both sides of an issue but then you don’t want exposed to both sides of an issue.

Why would I provide both sides of an issue, in a debate that's suppose to be your job. I provide links that backup and prove what I'm saying. It's funny you talk about both sides of an issue, when you clearly take only one side and debate from one side, do you provide anything that comes from both sides? No, you are just as partisan as the rest of us.

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The Russians alone gave far more to the NRA than is listed in that pack of lies and the Justice Department is investigating the Russian firm that The NRA was laundering the money for.

I provide a link and it's packed full of lies because it doesn't match what your propagandist thinking says? You have zero facts to back any of your claims and yet you declare my links as "lies"? You have some real issues dude.

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Links are worthless as any Russian with a computer can come up with a professional looking website and the Russians did during the last election.

Give it a rest. Opensecrets has been a website for over 10 years, tracking campaign contributions in elections. I've noticed a trend, when websites don't track with your thinking, they can't be trusted... why is that?

Zardoz, the floating head that was suppose to lead others to knowledge, what a joke.

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The Gun Manufacturers are selling death do you think that they would be bothered by lying?

Nothing like good old rhetoric to try and make a point...

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The facts show that the NRA spending approached a half a billion in the 2016 election.

The facts show no such thing, and you can't provide any proof that they did. You know why, because it didn't happen, this website tells you everything that was spent by the NRA on the 2016 election, as disclosed by Federal Election Law regulations. So either come up with some facts or drop the lies.
https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/summary.php?id=D000000082&cycle=2016

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Do a search instead of believing links when you depend on links you are a sitting duck for Russian propaganda.

It isn't my job to provide the proof of what you claim, that is your obligation. If you can't provide said proof, then you have no facts to back your argument. If you can't back your argument, why should I bother continuing with this farce?

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@Setanta,

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I don't accept your claim of expertise on university curricula.

I didn't claim any expertise, I only provided examples of where the information is coming from on the current state of University education and the socialist games being played by the Professors.

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I have had more than a decade of your bullshit peddling here, and this is just another glaring example.

When you can't refute the evidence, attack the speaker. Typical leftist MO, and the very same kind of MO being used on University campus's today.

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This is particularly glaring in your lame attempt to describe the course of history in recent decades.

Is this going to be another "Well it just hasn't been done right" defense of socialism?

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Stalinist and Maoist versions of "communism" certainly failed, and they have been replaced by a plutocratic kleptocracy in Russia and a modified communist-capitalist command economy in China. Socialism has been successful in Sweden and France under that name, and in modified form in Germany and Italy. Right wing troglodytes have been squealing about "socialized" medicine in the UK and Canada for decades and only stopped when it became common in almost all liberal democracies. They still piss and moan about it, but they don't want to give up the insurance coverage provided by the ACA.

The Leader of Sweden has come out and said they are not a socialist govt, this was in response to Bernie claiming they were. You seem to forget the other countries where socialism has failed, not just in Russia and China. The most current example was Venezuela and lets not forget about the every successful Cuba and their first world level of living... Give it a rest, socialism isn't coming to the US, we value our liberty on property way to much to see some powerful wannabe's vote to take away my property and land.

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I certainly never suggested that you feel guilty about anything.

Sure you did, it was implied in your wording.

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Given the vicious, racist remarks you made here shortly after you arrived at this site, and the lame bullshit you came up with the attempt to claim that you are not white, I have no doubt that you don't feel guilty about anything

When you can't debate the topic, you have to resort to some bullshit that was said 15 years ago? Do you mean my explaining that I was of Italian/Sicilian decent and that Italians were just as hated by white supremacists as Blacks and Hispanics were/are? Those are historical facts.
If you want an update, I did some DNA testing and I'm whiter than I thought, I'm only 8.7% Italian but I'm 20% French/German and 17% Norwegian. So what do you know, I was a white guy married to a black woman, I wonder how many racists do this? As for feeling any guilt, I hold no guilt for things that took place a hundred years before I was born and no dealings with.

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Once again, I'm not buying your bullshit about history.

It isn't my bullshit, it's the bullshit currently going on in modern day academia. Political, economic and diplomatic history are no longer taught, kids are taught about social history through a lens of modern day ideals. Modern day universities are filled with Marxists. UW Madison had at least 4x the students graduating with degree's in Social Work, than they had kids graduation with engineering degrees. That speaks volumes about the type of education "top" schools are handing out.

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It's like reading Howard Zinn and then condemning all contemporary historians on that basis. Even contemporary academic historians didn't and still don't buy Zinn's bullshit

Yet, Zinn's book has been read in thousands and thousands of high schools and college class rooms... It seems the academics love the book and push it on their students.

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In effect, you're a typical ignorant man, whose opinionated pronouncements derive their strength from an inverse relationship to your knowledge. Here, I'll simplify that so that even you can understand it. Because you know so damn little, your ranting opinions are the much louder and odious.

All of that, and it boils down to a personal attack, I think I might have struck a nerve.

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You've shown yourself to be ignorant and hateful since you first showed up here. Apparently, nothing has changed in all these years.

Once again, I'll point out that you are the one doing the personal attack and avoided a majority of what I actually brought up. You didn't come to debate, you came to attack, just like those Antifa punks.

I guess ignorant and hateful are terms used to describe those who don't agree with your world views.

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@Setanta,

You should watch this video of Jordan Peterson interviewing a couple of Professors from Wilfred Laurier University on that schools mainline push for the type of education I was talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWVmDSMl30s

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@Baldimo,

You provided no evidence, just some anecdotal narrative. So I provided the same, and refuted it. As for attacking you personally, that's just gravy on the meat and potatoes I've already provided.

1 Reply

You should bite me.

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@Baldimo,

There is almost always a significant home town advantage for a politician the fact that Trump was beat so badly in his hometown reflects the fact that he was considered a clown in his home town. Nelson Rockefeller was a Republican who was popular in New York.

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The first thing a religious cult tries to do is isolate it members from the influence of the world around them. The primary purpose of home schooling is to do the same thing most home schoolers belong to religious cults. In the world of ideas magical thinking is having a harder time competing these days so increasing isolation is necessary.

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The major religions are all interrelated Book 1 is the Jews, Book 2 is Christianity and Book 3 is Muslims. Certain sects of the Mormon practice plural marriage. The magical thinking cults can justify anything with the bible.

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All organized religions fall under the definition of a cult.

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

Quote:

Typical leftist MO, and the very same kind of MO being used on University campus's today.

No, it bears no resemblance, at all, to the "free speech" controversies on college campuses today. The criticism of you is the result of long-running disputes on a message board for christ's sake, it has nothing to do with trying to prevent you from speaking. Sorry, but your libertarian talking points aren't very convincing.

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The Leader of Sweden has come out and said they are not a socialist govt, this was in response to Bernie claiming they were. You seem to forget the other countries where socialism has failed, not just in Russia and China. The most current example was Venezuela and lets not forget about the every successful Cuba and their first world level of living... Give it a rest, socialism isn't coming to the US, we value our liberty on property way to much to see some powerful wannabe's vote to take away my property and land.

Blah blah blah ... you have a very misguided view of what "socialism" even is. You keep talking as if it were some single political system which functions identically everywhere it has been "imposed". It isn't, anymore than "capitalism" is.

1 Reply

@Setanta,

Quote:

You provided no evidence, just some anecdotal narrative.

No evidence? The amount of young people who have come out in the last few years in favor of socialism isn't any evidence of the education they have been receiving in school? I provided enough evidence to prove what I was saying to be fact, this new view on US history as a way to teach intersectionality as history where everyone is a victim of the white man, this is the current driving force behind the extreme left and their shifting of American society.

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So I provided the same, and refuted it.

You hardly did that. Zim's book has over 2 million copies sold and while it isn't used much in schools, his theory of history has surly spread across academia and the higher level schools, universities, are filled with his minions. The very fact that the SJW movement started in the universities where they no longer believe in diversity of thought.

Quote:

As for attacking you personally, that's just gravy on the meat and potatoes I've already provided.

It just shows the weakness in your character.

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@Zardoz,

Quote:

There is almost always a significant home town advantage for a politician the fact that Trump was beat so badly in his hometown reflects the fact that he was considered a clown in his home town. Nelson Rockefeller was a Republican who was popular in New York.

Clinton and Trump both claimed New York, Hillary was a Senator from that state, plus NY is way to the left in their politics. When was the last time someone from the GOP won NY? Reagan in 1984 was the last GOP President to win electoral votes from NY. So Trump not winning NY is not surprising.

A better comparison to what you are actually saying would be Al Gore, who lost Tennessee in the 2004 election. He was a Senator and a Rep for the state prior to being Vice President and still couldn't secure the win, in fact his father was also US Rep for Tennessee, that had to be embarrassing.

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Nelson Rockefeller was a Republican who was popular in New York.

He wouldn't stand a chance in modern day NY though, they are far to liberal.

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The first thing a religious cult tries to do is isolate it members from the influence of the world around them.

That is indeed what cults do, unfortunately you are trying to label all religions as cults, which isn't the case.

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The primary purpose of home schooling is to do the same thing most home schoolers belong to religious cults. In the world of ideas magical thinking is having a harder time competing these days so increasing isolation is necessary.

The premise of your argument is built on a faulty narrative, you again assume that all religions are cults and the very notion of believing in a higher power as "magical thinking". Since you can't even speak on this subject with anything approaching logic, I'm going to move on to the next paragraph.

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The major religions are all interrelated Book 1 is the Jews, Book 2 is Christianity and Book 3 is Muslims. Certain sects of the Mormon practice plural marriage. The magical thinking cults can justify anything with the bible.

Yeah, your bias against religion is pretty clear, I'm not even a Christian and even I would call your line of thinking bigoted. Where does Hinduism and Buddhism come in and play a part? I know why people like you do not like religion, you see it as competition against the state that has to be squashed.

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All organized religions fall under the definition of a cult.

No they don't, or cult would have no meaning, it typically refers to those who fall outside the "normal" beliefs of the major religions, subgroups who form their own beliefs outside of the normal "Christian" teachings and go off to form their own "churches". Christianity isn't a cult, but Christians who handle snakes and think they talk to them, that would be a cult. Islam is not a cult, but thinking their Imam is the reincarnation of Muhammad and following him because of it, that would be a cult. Judaism isn't a cult, but the early followers of Jesus were a cult to the Jews of the time.

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@hightor,

Quote:

No, it bears no resemblance, at all, to the "free speech" controversies on college campuses today. The criticism of you is the result of long-running disputes on a message board for christ's sake, it has nothing to do with trying to prevent you from speaking. Sorry, but your libertarian talking points aren't very convincing.

I'm going to have to throw the BS flag on this one. The left typically goes with a discredit tactic as part of their "response" to people disagreeing with my views. This topic isn't about me, although Set tried to make it that way. It is also another tactic used by the left. Get the person defending themselves so the actual topic doesn't get any response. Don't play these stupid games, you should be responding to my post to you, not Set's, he's a big boy and can handle himself.

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Blah blah blah ... you have a very misguided view of what "socialism" even is.

No, I think I have a pretty good understanding of what socialism is and what the people pushing it will have to do to make it work. Throwing "democratic" in front of it doesn't change the goal, it fly's in the face of what our Constitution stands for, individual liberty.

Quote:

You keep talking as if it were some single political system which functions identically everywhere it has been "imposed". It isn't, anymore than "capitalism" is.

What other aim does socialism have other than to remove the rights of the individual and replace those with rights of the collective?
Can you tell me where capitalism has been "imposed" and where it has failed?

2 Replies

@Baldimo,

I will suspend the order of things today do to the new developments in the Russian investigation. The Trump administration has issued a press release saying that none of its members “knowingly” participated in fixing of the last election with the Russians. This was followed with film of Trump calling on the Russians for help in finding Hillary Clinton’s missing e-mails. What the new indictments show is the very next day the Russian military went to work the very next day hacking e-mail accounts in America. Who “knew” if a Presidential candidate called on help from the Russian military they would send it? I knew when I first saw that Trump had called on the Russians for help that his request at a public campaign appearance would be the smoking gun in the Russian investigation.

Who knew if you said candy man three times the Russians would appear or was it Russians three times? Trump needs to resign immediately if he refuses steps need to be taken to remove him from office now that the white house has acknowledge that they participated in fixing the election whether it was knowingly or not. You cannot publicly call for the Russian’s help and claim that it was unknowingly.

The Republican theater of the absurd in Congress yesterday shows the lengths the Republicans will go to take up for the Russian military attack on our democracy. Ever since the OJ trial it has been a get out of jail free card to put the investigators on trial instead of the defendant. If you can show that the investigators made one mistake out of thousands the defendant is the one who has been wronged and the only way to atone is to let them go free. In any election there will be people who will be biased in fact almost everyone is biased during any election. To expect FBI agents to be any different is a fairy tale. No matter how bad I wanted to convict some low life I could not do a thing until I could prove he committed a crime. The FBI agent, even though he bragged to his girl-friend, could not do a thing to Trump if Trump did not break a law. Bringing false charges is useless and Trump has publicly convicted himself. He left no doubt read his lips.

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@Baldimo,

Quote:

It is also another tactic used by the left. [and the right, if you haven't noticed] Get the person defending themselves so the actual topic doesn't get any response. Don't play these stupid games...

Blah-blah-blah. The point is that you defensively tried to compare a personal argument with someone on a message board with the current "free speech" controversies on college campuses. There is no comparison and I suggest you read the link I provided to help clarify the difference.

Quote:

Can you tell me where capitalism has been "imposed" and where it has failed?

This statement reveals that you have the same fundamental misunderstanding of "capitalism" as you have of "socialism". Capitalism developed in response to changing economic traditions over the centuries. It's not a cut-and-dried, ready-to-go ideology which is simply imposed on a society by political economists. There are many forms of capitalism, many of which have adopted components of socialism.

As to where capitalism has failed, again, it's not a simple system which might "fail" in one instance. It's a complicated set of economic relationships woven deep into society. Businesses fail all the time, workers are underpaid, vast numbers of people are chronically unemployed. The "business cycle" illustrates the failures of capitalism, recessions and depressions illustrate the failures of capitalism, and currently the rapacious pursuit of profits which has endangered the intricate natural web of inter-relationships which support life as we know it is a failure of capitalism. The depletion of the ozone layer is the result of capitalists seeking to make higher profits. The steadily increasing amount of CO2 in our atmosphere results from shows just how dangerous unregulated capitalism can be. Polluted air and water, the expansion of invasive and destructive species, and the wholesale destruction of natural eco-systems by factory farming are all indictments against capitalism. The many failures of capitalism are exactly what has made socialism endure. And by "socialism" I mean a political philosophy where cooperation for the public good takes precedence over the mindless pursuit of economic growth, propelled by greed, at the expense of everything else.

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

Schools were one of the first things established in every community. Even children who lived far out in the country had access to one room school houses. My mom was a farm girl who lived far out in the country but she still attended school. It is hard for the blind to lead the blind, but it is far harder for the uneducated to teach. Teaching is a skill that most lack. I encountered college professors who were extremely knowledgeable but were unable to teach.

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You need to read a little about cults, so you will understand what a cult is. A good basic book to give you a basic understanding of what a cult is: “Cults in Our Midst: The Continuing Fight Against Their Hidden Menace” by Margret Thaler Singer. If you know much about organized religion, you know that they began as small religious cults.

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The terms are pretty close a mass murder is someone who murders four or more people while a mass shooter is someone who shoots four or more people. The only real difference is that mass shooters are lousy shots. It is clear their intention was to kill. They just lacked the skill, or their guns was not big enough.

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You suffer under the fantasy that everyone is honest, and no government is necessary. If you left corporations to their own devises they would pollute the air until 10s of thousands died each year. You need only to look at pictures of large cities in the 60s. We had a number of plants and the smog was so bad that people died in car accidents in the fog frequently. Once the plants closed the smog is more fog than smog. The fatal accidents in the fog seldom happen now. I went fishing one morning and had to open the car door and look for the edge of the road. There are any number of types of government that control the country.

The ungodly greedy have taken over our government with their money. Big corporations can now deprive you of your right to sue them. When Wells Fargo fraudulently opened several fraudulent accounts in people’s names when the people went to sue Wells Fargo asserted that they could not be sued because the legal accounts only allowed arbitration to settle disputes. So, Wells Fargo and large corporations cannot be sued because you sign an arbitration agreement any time you apply for a credit card, job or any other type of business with a company. This is just one way the ungodly greedy get richer the CEO of Wells Fargo got 100s of million on this one scam. Then you believe it is wrong to tax this criminal stolen money. It was “other people’s” money.

1 Reply

The Communist Origin of the Modern Conservative Movement VI

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