The Communist Origin of the Modern Conservative Movement VI

@Zardoz,

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Do you actually know anything about communism? Or do you just like to call people names like Coldjoint? There can’t be a football game or a basketball gave without rules and referees. Many people will resent both the rules and the referees, but alternative is far worse.

You show all the hall marks of a Marxist, right down to your hate of religion.

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The Republicans have done everything to destroy public education by financially strangling it state by state to give more money to the ungodly greedy in tax cuts.

Public education has done everything on it's own. Since the Teachers Unions took control and pushed out parents and limited local control, they set the path for the dismal education system we have today.
We actually fund out schools at a much higher amount then do most of our fellow 1st world nations. The problem isn't a lack of money, it's how the schools choose to spend the money. How many administrators do you really need to run a school?

This article is from 2013, it's been 5 years and I know education spending has increased since then:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-education-spending-tops-global-list-study-shows/

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The Republicans have school funding so far that the average teacher must pat for an average of $500 per teacher for school supplies for their class room.

I doubt that is an actual average across the country, maybe in certain school districts, but not nation wide.

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The teacher’s unions are now making a stand that the Republicans actually fund the schools and stop cutting taxes on the ungodly greedy.

Screw the teachers unions, they don't care about the kids, they only care about the teachers and then only based on what they give the union. If they cared about teachers and the kids, they would allow for pay raises based on performance, just like every other job in the US.

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Without the teacher’s unions teachers would be paid less than workers at McDonalds and be expected to buy the text books.

That's a lie. Teachers would be better paid without the unions. Unions protect poor teachers and don't let good teachers earn the money they deserve. You can't have one teacher get a raise and not give one to another, even though one teacher will out perform the other, the union insists they get paid the same.

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The teachers in WV had been taking pay cuts for years when there was a tiny wage increase their health insurance would be raised twice as much as their tiny raise. After years of that and having to work three jobs to pay their bills their backs were against the wall. Sooner or later they have no choice but to fight back.

If they worked more than 9 months out of the year, they wouldn't have those problems. When you look at actual hours worked vs their pay, teachers come out better than most. Hard to pay the bills when you take 3 months off. My ex-wife works for the biggest school district in CO, I know their hours.

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Non-union teachers are under paid and have far fewer benefits.

Right out of the Teachers Union play book. Nice try.

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When they say right to work to work state you know it is the right to work for less.

Again, right out of the Union play book. I don't belong to a union and I make over $80k a year. If I belonged to a tech support union, would I make more? I don't care about private businesses and unions, I don't want unions when it comes the govt workers and their dept's.

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School Boards still control the school’s agenda, but unions represent the employees and negotiate wages and benefits. When you have no representation, you get only a beggar’s share when you are organized you are more likely to get a fair share.

School boards are flooded with teacher union friendly people, they have to lie to be elected, and the massive amounts of outside money used in these local elections should anger even someone like you. Since it's union money being used to by the election, you more than likely don't care.

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The actual fact is that tax payers got a $4,050 personal exemption for every person in the family plus the standard deduction. If you had family of eight you had ten personal exemptions amounting to $40,500 last year the Trump tax scam eliminated those personal deductions and you will have to pay taxes on additional $40,500. That is a hell of a lot more taxes you are going to have to pay. That is not a math game it is simply basic taxes 101.

Stop with the BS examples that no one meets.

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In the other countries in world where the communists that founded the modern conservative movement did not make unions public enemy number one the standard of living of the middle class continued to improve only in United States did the middle-class standard of living plunge.

Stop with the BS. Communism has nothing to do with Conservativism. In fact they are the exact opposite in beliefs and practice.

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When I use the word communist unlike you I am referring to card carrying communist of the American Communist Party. The communist party even assigned them a wives whose job it was to watch them to make sure they were not disloyal to the Communist Party.

Sounds like something leftists would do.

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Charter schools are a racket. In FL the charter schools get the money for a student but then can send them back to public school and keep the $8,000 in tax money. Most private schools are run by cults and you might as well have sent your children to Jim Jones or David Koresh.

Links, facts? Your bigoted opinion means little.

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It is as plain as the nose on your face that the Republican tax scam takes from poorest to give to richest. You can’t deny that.

It's very easy to deny. Tax cuts let people keep more of their own money. What you want is to take money away from the people who earned it and give it to people who didn't. Communism.

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Who did not get a tax cut and on top of that lost their $4,050 per person personal exemptions? The loss of Trump’s $12,150 personal exemption for three people on his multi-million income is meaningless but it will be tragedy to large poor working families.

I guess we will have to wait until everyone does their 2018 taxes to see who is right and who is wrong.

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Trump Republican Tax Scam is taking the food out of babies’ mouths to give to ungodly greedy.

No one takes from the poor and gives to the rich, the rich get to keep more of the money they made, which is what everyone gets to do. The only people paying more in taxes will be the middle class who live in high tax states like NY, IL and CA. The rest of us no longer have to give those people tax brakes because their states like to rape their pocket books.

6 Replies

@Baldimo,

Baldimo

I lost a night due to a thunderstorm taking down the phone/internet.
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Everyone is paying taxes even the homeless beggars pay taxes. When a homeless beggar begs a few dollars for sandwich he pays sales tax on it and he pays it 365 days a year. When they build a stadium for professional ball players they generally raise the sales tax to pay for it. The ungodly greedy pretend the only tax in the United States is income tax when there are actually 100s of different types of taxes. T00here are taxes you have no idea you are even paying but only one tax was levied on "excess wealth" and only the ungodly greedy should be paying it. There are taxes on phone bill, on electric bill, there are sales taxes on everything you buy. Nobody escapes paying taxes they may not pay the tax on "excess wealth" but everyone in America that eats or sleeps pays taxes. The poor pay the same percentage in taxes as the rich when all taxes are takin into account. In Huntington if you have a job you must pay a $5 a week fee for working inside city limits even if you only make $5 that week.
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The poor pay the same percentage of their income in taxes that the rich pay only the middle class pays a higher percentage.
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The income tax was a tax placed on "excess wealth" and only "excess wealth" anyone that has no "excess wealth" should not pay a penny of income tax. You can never escape the intent of the original law no matter how many times the ungodly greedy pervert the intent of the law with their money.
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I can see there is something else you have no clue about it. As Union President health insurance was a major concern. I can remember when there was actually was health insurance. When you had a claim, it was paid. There is no longer any health insurance in America you now have a health copay policy that will pay part of the bill if and only you if have met your $2000 deductible. A family policy that pays 80% with a $2,000 deductible cost over $25,000 a year and now the employee must pay a good percentage of the cost of the policy. Very few Americans can afford health insurance unless it is offered by their employer. While you are younger you seldom have big medical bills and when you’re are older and have paid for thirty years for health insurance and suddenly become ill the first thing you lose is your job and health insurance. The Crooked health insurance companies are in business for one reason and one reason only to make bigger and bigger profits. Insurance CEOs make million a dollar a year off the suffering of sick children.
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The choice for many Americans is Obama Care or nothing. It is easy say they should have nothing if you have health insurance. There was one of the ungodly greedy, from WV that went to all of the conservative gatherings and pushed them to stop Obamacare because. Wait for it. The taxes on the ungodly greedy had been raised to fund it and because it was an excise tax the ungodly greedy had to pay it. That is why they wanted to kill Obamacare to cut the taxes on the ungodly greedy. Many hospitals now turn away people without health insurance. St Elsewhere is a real hospital and it got the name because other hospitals would tell the ambulance drivers to take them elsewhere. Many hospitals have now closed across the country because people cannot afford to pay. Our whole healthcare system is in danger collapsing.

Healthcare system is like any other business if Wal Mart has a million dollars of merchandize stolen they raise the prices to cover their loses. When someone goes to hospital without health insurance their bill is passed on to other patients. This causes health insurance to go up to cover the hospitals loses. This causes the health insurance to up and when it goes up fewer people can afford insurance. This causes insurance to go up more and the vicious cycle continues. When I started going to political rallies over Health Insurance before Bill Clinton was first elected. Even General Motors was behind the push because the most costly part of making cars was not steel or aluminum it was the cost of health insurance. General Motors estimated they paid for healthcare for four uninsured people when they paid for an employee’s healthcare. America lost a big Toyota plant even though we offered them millions to build here. Toyota turned us down and went to Canada with explanation that health insurance was far to costly in America.

Is Obamacare perfect? No, but it is a hell of a lot better than nothing. This dispute is about who is going to pay, the ungodly greedy or the middle class in runaway health insurance costs. The democrats had every intention of creating a National Healthcare System like every other modern country the Republicans killed that and eventually that is where this will end. Anyone who does not see the injustice of a for profit healthcare system that you pay into for thirty years without a single claim and find yourself dumped when you become seriously ill is blind in more ways than one.
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I don’t think you ever filled out your own taxes. Flat tax is by far the worst of all tax system. The ungodly greedy would pay .0000007% and the middle class would pay at minimum 40%.
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Ryan makes his point clearly that he thinks a $1.50 a payday tax cut was a tremendous tax cut for the middle class.

The woman works for a school system she is solid middle-class woman who works every day and she clearly demonstrate the lies put out by the Republican Tax Scam.

1 Reply

@Zardoz,

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Everyone is paying taxes even the homeless beggars pay taxes. When a homeless beggar begs a few dollars for sandwich he pays sales tax on it and he pays it 365 days a year.

Everyone should be paying income tax if they make money. Don't be daft and push the conversation into a realm we were not talking about. It's a weak debate tactic.

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When they build a stadium for professional ball players they generally raise the sales tax to pay for it.

They generally don't raise the sales tax and even if they do, it's only in the city where the stadium is going to be. Most cities use bonds or some other scam to pay for the stadiums.

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The ungodly greedy pretend the only tax in the United States is income tax when there are actually 100s of different types of taxes.

The only tax the Federal govt really concerns themselves with is the income tax. You usually don't pay any sort of Federal Sales tax, as far as I know there is no such thing. We were talking about income taxes and how you think only the "ungodly greedy" should pay an income tax on their "excess wealth." Don't start moving the goal posts because you can't win the debate.

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T00here are taxes you have no idea you are even paying but only one tax was levied on "excess wealth" and only the ungodly greedy should be paying it.

See the duck and dodge. Income taxes were the subject and if you earn an income, you should be paying that income tax. Your 1913 Tax bill no longer counts, give it a rest. You support a tax plan from 100 years ago, but not a Right that was put down in the Constitution over 200 years ago...

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There are taxes on phone bill, on electric bill, there are sales taxes on everything you buy. Nobody escapes paying taxes they may not pay the tax on "excess wealth" but everyone in America that eats or sleeps pays taxes.

We have far to many taxes because we have greedy politicians.

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The poor pay the same percentage in taxes as the rich when all taxes are takin into account. In Huntington if you have a job you must pay a $5 a week fee for working inside city limits even if you only make $5 that week.

Those head taxes are a a perfect example of the greedy politicians taxing everyone to death. Besides, the employee does not pay that tax, that is paid by the business. Socialist Seattle just proposed the same type of tax.

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The poor pay the same percentage of their income in taxes that the rich pay only the middle class pays a higher percentage.

LIE!

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The income tax was a tax placed on "excess wealth" and only "excess wealth" anyone that has no "excess wealth" should not pay a penny of income tax. You can never escape the intent of the original law no matter how many times the ungodly greedy pervert the intent of the law with their money.

You don't have a clue as to what you are talking about. That original law expired a few years after it was passed. It wasn't on "excess wealth", that working was never in the law. You really need to stop with your Communist manifesto talk, it is starting to make you look silly.

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I can see there is something else you have no clue about it. As Union President health insurance was a major concern.

Union President of what? The building inspectors scam union?

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There is no longer any health insurance in America you now have a health copay policy that will pay part of the bill if and only you if have met your $2000 deductible.

You do know that this is the very example of insurance. Car insurance works the same exact way. You want to confuse a medical coverage plan with an insurance plan. It's the same stupid game you played with income tax.

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A family policy that pays 80% with a $2,000 deductible cost over $25,000 a year and now the employee must pay a good percentage of the cost of the policy.

These plans were cheaper prior to the ACA. I had Family insurance that would have been considered a "Cadalliac Plan" by the Obama admin and it costs have tripled since the ACA went into effect. I now have to carry "insurance" on things that have no bearing on my health. My wife and I are 45, we no longer require any sort of baby coverage or maternity coverage, yet I'm forced to carry and pay for something I will never use. That isn't insurance, that is forced medical coverage.

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Very few Americans can afford health insurance unless it is offered by their employer.

Not entirely true, prices were cheaper when people could actually choose the type of coverage they wanted to carry. When you are forced to carry and pay for something you will never use, it stops being insurance.

60% of Americans had insurance that worked for the majority, Obama didn't like that and decided to screw the middle class. The ACA was a scam from the start.

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While you are younger you seldom have big medical bills and when you’re are older and have paid for thirty years for health insurance and suddenly become ill the first thing you lose is your job and health insurance. The Crooked health insurance companies are in business for one reason and one reason only to make bigger and bigger profits. Insurance CEOs make million a dollar a year off the suffering of sick children.

The only purpose for any company is to make money. Why do you hate capitalism so much?

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The choice for many Americans is Obama Care or nothing.

Now that Obama has destroyed the individual insurance market, he has left the poor at the mercy of the federal govt. We had a good system for the vast majority of the US population and he turned it on it's head to help a couple of million people. The youth didn't do as they were told and get insurance so that they could prop up the rest of the market on the back healthy and young...

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That is why they wanted to kill Obamacare to cut the taxes on the ungodly greedy.

No, they wanted to stop the ACA because it did more harm than good to the General public, it had nothing to do with the any one else but the greed of the politicians.

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Many hospitals now turn away people without health insurance.

That is a flat out lie. There are laws about turning away people, it can't be done! Please please please stop with the lies!

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Many hospitals have now closed across the country because people cannot afford to pay. Our whole healthcare system is in danger collapsing.

We didn't have those problems prior to the ACA. This is all thanks to the govt trying to run a portion of the economy. Leftist can't do it, the realities never meet the fantasy hype.

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Even General Motors was behind the push because the most costly part of making cars was not steel or aluminum it was the cost of health insurance.

You mean the greedy unions were forcing the car companies to cover things the employee's with their nice union pay could have been paying for? We see what the unions did to the US auto industry.

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America lost a big Toyota plant even though we offered them millions to build here. Toyota turned us down and went to Canada with explanation that health insurance was far to costly in America.

You must not be paying attention to the news. We actually have a lot of foreign auto makers here in the US. None of them are union shops and they pay their people well.

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Anyone who does not see the injustice of a for profit healthcare system that you pay into for thirty years without a single claim and find yourself dumped when you become seriously ill is blind in more ways than one.

If you pay for your car insurance for 30 years, should it be free as well?

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I don’t think you ever filled out your own taxes.

Oh, I did when I was single. When I got married and had kids and bought a house, I started paying someone to do them. Far to complicated to get wrong, the IRS will take everything.

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Flat tax is by far the worst of all tax system. The ungodly greedy would pay .0000007% and the middle class would pay at minimum 40%.

You have just proven you don't understand what a flat tax is. Everyone pays the same. If we moved to a flat tax, I would agree that people under say 15K a year pay no takes, everyone else pays the same rate. The most common % used is 15%.
Make 30k, you pay $4,500 a year in Federal Income tax
$100,000k a year? you pay $15k
1,00,000 you pay $135k a year in income taxes.

The intent is to fund the govt for it's actual liabilities, not the wish list for all the leftist in the US to give away free stuff.

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Ryan makes his point clearly that he thinks a $1.50 a payday tax cut was a tremendous tax cut for the middle class.

Keep telling yourself that. I should be getting a couple thousand off of my tax bill this next year. I'm middle class and I don't think you actually care anything for us, you are only concerned with what you can take from someone else and give to the poor. The middle class is a tool of war for your ilk.

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The woman works for a school system she is solid middle-class woman who works every day and she clearly demonstrate the lies put out by the Republican Tax Scam.

She doesn't work everyday, if she works for a school district, she works a 1/3 of the hours I work in a year. When there is no school there is no job, so summers off, several weeks off during the school year due to Thanksgiving, Xmas, Spring Break and of course every teachers favorite perk, summers off. Must be nice.

10 Replies

@Baldimo,

Every modern-day president has released his tax returns and that information is considered when voters decide to vote. Trump as usual lied he said he would release his tax returns and later decided he would not saying the voters are not interested. It is a pattern with him he says he will do something and lies and hope the public forgets about it. As Hitler said the great masses' power for forgetting enormous” and Trump is a student of Hitler. His grandfather was German and at one point in Trump’s life his friends routinely gave him the traditional Hitler salute, heil Hitler. According Trump’s ex-wife he kept a copy of Hitler’s speeches on his bed side table.

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It has nothing to do with jealously and everything to do with history. Greed is a vice it is not a virtue. The United States was a once great country with a strong middle class but after 40 years of the conservative worship of greed as the golden idol the United States was set in a long slow decline into obscurity. History teaches us the only way to stop the decline is to get greed under control it is not a virtue and it is one of human being worst traits. The way to do that is to put a stop to worship of the ungodly greedy and see them for what they really are. If you watch ID you know that greed is behind many murders where children kill their parents for money, where husbands kill wives for life insurance. Even where a dentist fed his children poison Halloween candy to collect their life insurance. That is the real face of greed not what is portrayed on “Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous.” Whenever you chose to worship the golden idol you are sure to reap the whirlwind.
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I am not jealous I have done well in life I am not rich, but I am not poor. I have more property than I can keep up with and no doubt will inherit more property that I plan to just pass on. I have no need for more and no intention to keep the property. “Whenever a man can take exactly the right measure of himself…...” For someone who is greedy it is impossible for him to imagine someone who isn’t. ___________________________________________________________________________________
I quoted the source when that was posted. The source of 50% figure was a poll from a leading university. Most people are keenly aware that when Republicans cut taxes they always cut them for the ungodly greedy and give beads like those given to Indians for New York to the middle class.
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The tax calculators are worthless the only thing that matters is the actual tax form. You won’t pay taxes based on any tax calculator. When you sit down to pay your 2018 taxes you will pay based on that tax form and only that tax form. The Republicans will put all kinds of crap out there to fool the idiots. But when you are called in for audit what your tax calculator said will be worthless. The standard deduction tax form is extremely simple you don’t need a tax calculator. I have done taxes for years and beat the IRS auditors at their own game on their own turf and I did not need a tax calculator then and I don’t need one now. They are no doubt worthless.

To get the facts, get last years tax form and plug in the figures with this year’s changes. Plug in a few children and the results will horrify most people while the ungodly greedy got huge tax cuts. Even the Republicans admit some people are going to pay higher taxes and most of those people are middle class couples with children. Gimmicks like tax calculators are just that.

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@Baldimo,

Baldimo

My major in college was mechanical engineering but I only finished four years of the program before I hung my slide rule up and got married and went racing. I enjoyed the hands on of building race cars more than all the math in engineering.
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That is the funny thing about constitutions the cannot rewrite them on a whim. Constitutions have to be amended to change them and that is very difficult for a reason. Constitutions provide the framework and the Supreme Court exists to make sure that laws don’t violate the Constitution. You can’t complain that you don’t like majority rule but don’t believe that the constitution can’t be overruled by majority vote. You can’t have the secondment and complain the majority can’t vote it away.
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If the Feds decide to really crack the whip they can make the sanctuary cities fall in line. Federal funds can be withheld if they don’t cooperate. Just because there is a law doesn’t mean it will be enforced. In James Comey’s new book, he makes a point to say the Justice Department’s job is to decide which laws will be enforced. Right now, enforcing the laws tightly in sanctuary cities is not popular in those cities.
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The supreme court is not above politics and politics influences their judgement. If there is a bad ruling another case can be bought in front of the court after many of the previous members have left.
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The gun was being transported through WV before it was taken into Ohio. Checking with WV authorities solved at least half of the problem.
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The democratic party of 1863 was far different than that of 1963. Senator Byrd of WV was a KKK member when he was first elected. The KKK was instrumental in getting politicians elected at one time. When a death threats were made against Senator Byrd a couple of FBI agents were posted at his home. One of the agents 0was a black woman when she asked to use bathroom at Byrd’s house he instructed to use the bathroom at a gas station down the road. Here is someone stationed there to take a bullet to defend him. Sometimes people change and so do political parties. Reagan made racism a platform of the modern conservative movement.
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I don’t use google for everything. I spent several years in college and I still remember part of it.

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@coldjoint,

Coldjoint

I see you are into "fake news" and "alternative facts."

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@Baldimo,

Baldimo

I was unable to post yesterday because I was out of town for a half marathon it is the 28th straight year doing that race.
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I think we can agree that we have free speech in America. Do you think that slander and liable should be protected speech or shall we put a limit on free speech?
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We have a government, of the people, and for the people who better to put the appropriate limits on rights? The problem with you is that you see government as separate from yourself when in fact you are part of the government and can vote out the people you don’t like. We had the same problem with union members who believed that the union was a hired gun to take care of them. When they would complain that the union didn’t do this or didn’t do that I would ask them what is a union? It is the union of the workmen. If it doesn’t suit you maybe you need to take a more active role. All anyone needs to know about guns is assault weapons make mass murder easy. That is the only fact anyone needs to know.
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There was a reason that Chambers defected he believed the communists were going to kill him and that was why he defected. There is no doubt that Chambers should have been executed for being a communist spy. The reason he wasn’t executed is that statue of limitation had run out before he ran to government to protect him from his fellow communists. There is no smear everything I have stated is in his autobiography. You use communists as a strawman to attack but, yet you defend a communist spy who was responsible for the deaths of thousands in our military caused by the secrets he stole and relayed to the communists but according to you he was just disillusioned.

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Have you missed something? It is an absolute fact that all of these communist not only touched the Republican party all of these communists joined the Republican Party they became founding fathers of the Modern Conservative movement. You can say it ain’t so, but it won’t change the facts.

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Throughout history greed has been far more destructive than an atomic bomb. If the communists and the little Russian princes, Ayn Rand and set out to destroy America they could not have chosen a more effective method.

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The conservatives who believe the government should be the same as it was 1776 should have no problems with guns being the same as they were in 1791. ____________________________________________________________________________________
Is English your first language because words have clear and concise meanings and “casting doubt” is not or will it every be overturned. If the decision was overturned it would be marked as overturned. When Oliver Wendel Homes gives you an example of prohibited speech you can take that to the bank. If I gave you a bomb and said this is an example of a bomb it would of course be a bomb this is what Justice Homes did.

1 Reply

@coldjoint,

Copldjoint

Without the active participation of Russia in the election Trump would have lost Wisconsin along with many other states he "won." The KBG might as well of appointed Trump president and saved us the trouble of a crooked election.

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@Baldimo,

Baldimo

I will give you the point that the Schenck was not about yelling fire in crowded theater. Oliver Wendel Homes did use that as example to show the freedom of speech does have limits.

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It is often necessary to cite an extreme example to show that there are limits on all rights. A serial killer might argue that he has a right to happiness and since killing people makes him happy should he be able to kill people? Why do rights have to have limits? When they violate the rights of others. Assault weapons violate the most basic right of others, the right to life. You would argue that there should be no limits on rights whatsoever.
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There is no such thing as an ex-communist. Philosophies grow the brain. The neuro pathways in the brain are similar to muscles in the body. The muscles that are used become stronger but the muscles that are not used atrophy. When you are a communist, communism shapes your brain, the pathways for alternative ideas and philosophies are atrophied. Our brains are wired by what we think, and it is far more difficult than you think to rewire your brain. This is why child molesters that are released from prison typically reoffend they have wired their brain that way.
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You actually read Atlas Shrugged? All 1146 pages? Have you read her biography “Ayn Rand and the World She Made?” Or how about “The Virtues of Selfishness” that should have been the title for “Atlas Shrugged.” Ayn Rand was such a bright and shining moral example when she bought her lover home and told her husband that she was taking a lover and he should just get use to it and she conducted an affair under her husband nose for years. I have not read the Fountainhead. Rand preached against social security all her life but in the end broke and alone she had no choice but to take the collectivist’s money. In the end her philosophy failed her.
Make no mistake Rand’s philosophy was designed to destroy America and it is working even though she is long in the grave. Rand could never escape her childhood and the philosophy that wired her brain. For a Russian to come over here and believe she could improve our political system by putting the wealth of a country in the hands of a very few she was no doubt a narcissist. If Russia decided to take over America in a conventional way they would send an invading army in. They would not try to set up a communist government first that would come later. You don’t have to invade a country with an army you can invade it with ideas and once you destroy what their you can install any government you wish. Rand objective was never to set up a communist government but to destroy the government that is here now. America did not get to be a great country by “The Virtues of Selfishness.” America had a tradition of barn raisings and working together to accomplish goals the collectiveness that Rand so hates was what made America great.

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

Baldimo

The reality is that the founders of the Modern Conservative Movement were card carrying communists and extremely proud of it. Nothing you say or do will change history. The focus of their entire life was to destroy the government of the United States and then you seem to believe one day they just said “never mind” and burned their communist membership cards and said I want to be a republican.

Where you have a website, I have several books from the time period in question. There were public trials of the communists in Whitaker Chambers’ cell. The books were written by the communists themselves. The books will provide with far more reality than a website. I found that the Internet is extremely inadequate in history of the last 100 years and especially when it comes to dealing with American communists and is no doubt an overreaction to Joseph McCarthy accused just about everyone of being a communist. The context of the time period was that the ungodly greedy had just about destroyed America and the tax on excess wealth was used right the ship of state. In 1932 the top tax rate on the ungodly greedy was raised from 25% to 63% and this provided the funding for the WPA projects that still stand today.
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An American Communist Party is going to be just that an American Communist Party. The great Regan lie was that Regan was responsible for Russia going bankrupt, but Regan had no more to with it then you had to do with your neighbor going bankrupt because you bought a new car. No one in this country could do anything about Russia going bankrupt. However, Reagan placed America on a path to bankruptcy by tripling the national debt. You view the world as black and white there is only make the ungodly greedy richer and every other economic theory in the world is communism. “There are far more things on heaven and earth than you imagine.” _________________________________________________________________________________
You only want to count mass shootings that take place at schools and ignore all others that don’t happen in schools. All the mass shootings must be counted just as all cars would have to be counted.
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The shooting in homes are seldom mass murders someone only needs an assault weapon to kill large numbers of people. It is no problem to kill 4 people with a handgun. Only when your objective is to kill 30 or more people do you need an assault weapon.
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I am sorry, but it is very difficult to remember which book that study was in. I tried to locate the study on the Internet, but it is inadequate in some areas, but it did mention a reference that I read but I still need to locate that particular book in a library of over 2,000 volumes.
____________________________________________________
It doesn’t confuse anything a mass shooter is just a mass murder that is a bad shot.
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Weapons of war should have never been allowed on the streets in the first place.
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You believe the NRA that is working with communists to other throw our government would tell the truth? That is like how the Catholic church told the truth about child molesting priests. They tried their level best to bury the scandal. Who is most likely to kill people? People who own guns. Who is most likely to belong to the NRA. Gun owners. So those most likely to kill are also most likely to belong to the NRA. Some gun manufacturers throw in free NRA membership with the purchase of a gun. It is beyond belief that NRA members are not frequently involved in murders of all kinds.
Using searches of news stories would not tell you anything as the press does not have access to the NRA membership rolls. If a mass murderer was a member of a country club it would not be reported either.

____________________________________________________

TBC

0 Replies

@Baldimo,

Baldimo

The NRA is a private club and as such its records are private. That means the public does not have access to those records and it would require subpoena for law enforcement to access them. It might be a good idea for law enforcement to subpoena those records and see how many NRA members are routinely involved in shootings. The people that own the guns are the ones involved in shootings and the ones who are likely to belong to NRA.

____________________________________________________
At one time most of the people in WV hunted to put meat on the table and some still do today. Most of the population in WV lives in the country while most other states live in big cities. I finally figured how to configure a search to find the state by state percentage of gun ownership. WV is number 4 in the nation with 54.2% or the residents owning guns. Alaska is number one with 61.7% owning guns. However only 5.8% of Rhode Island residents own a gun and that is the future of gun ownership in America.

0 Replies

@Baldimo,

Baldimo

You might do well to remember that only 5.8% of Rhode Islanders own guns. How do you think an anti-assault weapon platform would do in that state?

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Will you stop clinging to the fairy tale that guns protect people. The reality is that people that owns guns and their families are the ones most likely to be shot and killed. If your silly fairy tale were true Rhode Island would be overrun by crime because 94% of the population doesn’t own a gun. Guess what Rhode Island has few guns and one of the lowest crime rates in the country at 43rd. This proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the gun manufacturers propaganda is a lie. Alaska with the highest rate of gun ownership has the highest rate of crime in America. The crime rate in Alaska is over 3 times as high. More guns, more violent crime. The more difficult we make it for people to own guns the more we reduce crime.

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The fantasy of every mass murderer is acquiring a full automatic assault weapon to commit mass murder with. The only thing that stopped them is they are very difficult to obtain. Only the Las Vegas shooter managed to make his assault weapons fully automatic. Guns have been stolen from the army before and in fact my uncle bought his Thompson home from the army.

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You have a real problem with facts when they don’t confirm to your fantasy.
“The background check works for the majority of people.” It isn’t the majority of people we are worried about it is the tiny minority that commit the mass murders. A fence built with holes in it is worthless.
____________________________________________________

TBC

1 Reply

@Zardoz,

Quote:

I was unable to post yesterday because I was out of town for a half marathon it is the 28th straight year doing that race.

Quote:

I was unable to post yesterday because I was out of town for a half marathon it is the 28th straight year doing that race.

No problem, I've been on vacation for the last week. Cool

25th High school reunion, drinks were had and stories were told.

Quote:

I think we can agree that we have free speech in America.

If you pay attention to what takes place at our public Universities, you would think only some people have free speech.

Quote:

Do you think that slander and liable should be protected speech or shall we put a limit on free speech?

They are free speech as far as the govt is concerned, the govt can't arrest you or put you in jail for either of those things. Liable and slander are going to be charged against a person by another person, there is no State vs Slanderer court cases. As we have learned, people can be fired for saying things on the job, Rosanne is the perfect example.

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We have a government, of the people, and for the people who better to put the appropriate limits on rights?

You misunderstand what Rights are if you think this way. The Founding Fathers were smarter than you, they knew of the fallibility of people, that's why we have the Bill of Rights, it's the reason for the drafting and signing of the Declaration of Independence, it wasn't to limit Rights, you disagree with, we have Rights, plain and simple. The 2nd Amendment is the only Amendment which says, "shall not be infringed", they knew that some day people like you would come along and limit Rights.

Quote:

The problem with you is that you see government as separate from yourself when in fact you are part of the government and can vote out the people you don’t like.

This comment makes no sense. What does "being part of the govt" have to do with voting?

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We had the same problem with union members who believed that the union was a hired gun to take care of them. When they would complain that the union didn’t do this or didn’t do that I would ask them what is a union? It is the union of the workmen. If it doesn’t suit you maybe you need to take a more active role.

We should have no unions at the govt level, keep the unions for private sector. Govt employees work for the People and work against their interests, aka management, to properly do their jobs. Unions outlived their purpose in modern day society over 40 years ago.

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All anyone needs to know about guns is assault weapons make mass murder easy. That is the only fact anyone needs to know.

This is a throw away statement with no meaning.

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There was a reason that Chambers defected he believed the communists were going to kill him and that was why he defected.

He realized the lies they were telling the world, the USSR was already purging the "useful idiots" from the ranks. He realized the idea of Communism was wrong and turned against them.

Quote:

Chambers carried on his espionage activities from 1932 until 1937 or 1938 even while his faith in Communism was waning. He became increasingly disturbed by Joseph Stalin's Great Purge, which began in 1936. He was also fearful for his own life, having noted the murder in Switzerland of Ignace Reiss, a high-ranking Soviet spy who had broken with Stalin, and the disappearance of Chambers' friend and fellow spy Juliet Stuart Poyntz in the United States. Poyntz had vanished in 1937, shortly after she had visited Moscow and returned disillusioned with the Communist cause due to the Stalinist Purges.[13]

Chambers ignored several orders that he travel to Moscow, worried that he might be "purged." He also started concealing some of the documents he collected from his sources. He planned to use these, along with several rolls of microfilm photographs of documents, as a "life preserver" to prevent the Soviets from killing him and his family.[1]

In 1938, Chambers broke with Communism and took his family into hiding, storing the "life preserver" at the home of his nephew and his parents. Initially he had no plans to give information on his espionage activities to the U.S. government. His espionage contacts were his friends, and he had no desire to inform on them.[1]

In his examination of Chambers' conversion from the political left to the right, author Daniel Oppenheimer noted that Chambers substituted his passion for communism for a passion for God. Chambers saw the world in black and white terms both before his defection and after. In his autobiography, he presented his devotion to communism as a reason for living, but after defecting saw his actions as being part of an "absolute evil." [3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whittaker_Chambers

Quote:

There is no doubt that Chambers should have been executed for being a communist spy. The reason he wasn’t executed is that statue of limitation had run out before he ran to government to protect him from his fellow communists.

I don't think you have the correct information, he was actually an informent against US spies, that would mean he was given a free pass for good info. You know, a Rat... Rat's don't get the death penalty. I can understand your anger at the guy, he turned against your cause.

Quote:

The country quickly became divided over the Hiss–Chambers issue. President Harry S Truman, not pleased with the allegation that the man who had presided over the United Nations Charter Conference was a Communist, dismissed the case as a "red herring".[31] In the atmosphere of increasing anti-communism that would later be termed McCarthyism, many conservatives viewed the Hiss case as emblematic of what they saw as Democrats' laxity towards the danger of communist infiltration and influence in the State Department. Many liberals, in turn, saw the Hiss case as part of the desperation of the Republican party to regain the office of president, having been out of power for 16 years. Truman also issued Executive Order 9835, which initiated a program of loyalty reviews for federal employees in 1947.[32]

Quote:

You use communists as a strawman to attack but, yet you defend a communist spy who was responsible for the deaths of thousands in our military caused by the secrets he stole and relayed to the communists but according to you he was just disillusioned.

I don't think I have defended any of his actions when he was a communist, I've just corrected your twist on his reason for being in the GOP. Communism and Conservatism are on opposite ends of the political spectrum.

Quote:

Have you missed something? It is an absolute fact that all of these communist not only touched the Republican party all of these communists joined the Republican Party they became founding fathers of the Modern Conservative movement. You can say it ain’t so, but it won’t change the facts.

I'll say it again, Conservatism and Communism are on opposite ends of the political spectrum. One group believes in limited govt and Liberty , the other believes in no Liberty and total govt control.

Quote:

Throughout history greed has been far more destructive than an atomic bomb.

Tell me all about it Marx.

Quote:

If the communists and the little Russian princes, Ayn Rand and set out to destroy America they could not have chosen a more effective method.

They were out to save America from the lie that is Collectivism and all the evils that come with it. Save your breath, you are no better than those of the Scientology Cult who bad talk those who have turned against their Faith. It's a defamation propaganda designed to destroy what they stood for later in life.

Quote:

The conservatives who believe the government should be the same as it was 1776 should have no problems with guns being the same as they were in 1791.

You might have some kooks who think that, but a majority of those who are right leaning, just want less govt regulation and to pay less in taxes. The 9 scariest words to hear from someone "In from the govt and I'm here to help".

Quote:

Is English your first language because words have clear and concise meanings and “casting doubt” is not or will it every be overturned. If the decision was overturned it would be marked as overturned. When Oliver Wendel Homes gives you an example of prohibited speech you can take that to the bank. If I gave you a bomb and said this is an example of a bomb it would of course be a bomb this is what Justice Homes did.

Holmes is an over rated leftist. Granting the govt the ability to limit the rights of free speech is not a notion of Liberty, it tyranny.

7 Replies

@Zardoz,

Quote:

I will give you the point that the Schenck was not about yelling fire in crowded theater. Oliver Wendel Homes did use that as example to show the freedom of speech does have limits.

When it came to the 1st Amendment, Holmes was a tyrant. Screw him.

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It is often necessary to cite an extreme example to show that there are limits on all rights.

Only those with the idea of limiting Rights in the Constitution would stoop to such lows.

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A serial killer might argue that he has a right to happiness and since killing people makes him happy should he be able to kill people?

Only a fool would entertain such a notion... It seems you are a fan of the slippery slope way "granting" rights...

Quote:

Why do rights have to have limits? When they violate the rights of others.

You can't limit the rights of citizens because it might infringe on other rights. Murder is not a right and is already illegal, as other shootings have proven and the fact that a majority of murders are committed by handguns, you have no good reason to ban the AR platform. You don't like it, and it's a starting point to ban all guns you don't like. Rights don't work that way.

Quote:

There is no such thing as an ex-communist. Philosophies grow the brain.

Oh please. A political philosphy has nothing to do with one's bio make-up, give the suedo science a rest.

Quote:

This is why child molesters that are released from prison typically reoffend they have wired their brain that way.

So it's a comparison between one's sexual predilections and their political beliefs? You are sounding more and morel like a nut case. If anything, communism is a temporary mental disorder that can be cured in some patients. Those you seem to speak out against the most are cured.

Quote:

You actually read Atlas Shrugged? All 1146 pages?

Yes, can you actually believe it? I've read Fountain Head as well. I've actually read a lot of long books, although most of them were fun reading, not serious reading.

Quote:

Ayn Rand was such a bright and shining moral example when she bought her lover home and told her husband that she was taking a lover and he should just get use to it and she conducted an affair under her husband nose for years.

Only people of your ilk stoop to such lows when it comes to those you don't like. You should be ashamed, I thought one's personal life was personal? BJ's in the oval office anyone?

Quote:

Make no mistake Rand’s philosophy was designed to destroy America and it is working even though she is long in the grave.

It was meant to destroy the socialist and communist forces that were starting to rise in the US. We fought facism in Germany and Italy, the USSR was a threat and the Unions were the path way to the socialism the far leftists were working through. Atlas Shrugged cast the unions in doubt, The Socialist Workers Party... ring a bell? They are unAmerican to their core!

Quote:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist_Workers_Party_(United_States)

3 Replies

@Baldimo,

Baldimo

Most mass murderers do not have criminal backgrounds. Their mass murders are often the first and last crime they will ever commit. They buy AR-15s because they are easy to come by. If we legalize automatics every school shooter would be armed with one. To say that every criminal who wants a gun will find one is wrong. The harder it is to buy a gun the fewer guns there will be on the streets. People follow the path of least resistance.

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Why create new laws? To take the weapons of war off the streets and return them to the battlefield where they belong. Remember Rhode Island? Lowest gun ownership and one of the lowest crime rates. Citizens dead at the hands of crooks is for the most part in your paranoid imagination. If you were correct Rhode Island would have the highest crime rate because 94% of the people don’t own guns in Rhode Island but that is not what happened.
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Any wantabee mass murder can simply go to the corner gun store and buy his AR-15 why purchase one illegally when some shady dealer will no doubt rip them off. It is so easy to buy a weapon of war legally and go to war on school children.

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The gun manufacturer made a law to make sure CDC could not conduct a study of gun violence that could be used to promote gun control.
“But getting this data has long been a challenge, for nakedly political reasons: a 1996 amendment to a spending bill—lobbied for by the NRA—that forbade the Center for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) from using government funds for research that “may be used to advocate or promote gun control.””

Source and Internet Article: “The Ultimate Guide to American Gun Control Laws”

____________________________________________________

TBC

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

Baldimo

The fact remains that there is absolutely no reason to put weapons of war on the streets. We don’t need to know whether they were legal or not because it does not matter to the dead any longer. Your child is just as dead shot with a legal AR-15 or an illegal AR-15. Make them all illegal and put anyone caught with one in prison for 20 years.
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I worked in the police department and worked with them for another 40 years. I spent years in city, state and federal courts. I am pretty familiar with both policemen and police procedures. Your dad may have been a policeman, but it is not the same as working with the police department. Have you ever been on a drug raid? I have been on several.

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All mass murders are mass shootings but not all mass shootings are mass murders. Both statistics are relevant to the discussion.

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How old are you? You seem to be having memory problems. That is exactly what the article you posted stated that the mass murder began taking off in the 1960. I didn’t post that you did. Just as the AR-15 is hitting the streets mass murders begin to rapidly increase. I wonder if the two are connected. No doubt about it assault weapons make mass murder easy. Mental issues? Not one mass murderer has ever been found innocent by reason of insanity. So, insanity has no dogs in this fight. The insane have trouble finding lunch let alone planning a complex military style attack.
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The number of people murdered in mass murders has increased radically in the last two years and the language has not kept up. New terms will need to be coined.

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There is a big difference between four people being killed and fifty-nine people being killed. If only three people are killed it is not a mass murder but there is a far greater difference between four and fifty-nine than between one and four. We could rate mass murders by color, but we would run out of colors.
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I have provided several references for the facts in this discussion but obviously you don’t even read to the end the links you posted.
____________________________________________________________________________________

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

Baldimo

I am no more biased against organized cults than I am against racism they are both a problem. Are you one of those people that is going to send your money so that televangelist can by a new $64 million jet? That conman will take the last penny from poor people hoping to buy their way into an imaginary heaven.
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You are the one that bought up abortion in an effort to justify mass murder as an ordinary event that should just be tolerated.
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You introduced abortion into the argument. The typical idiot’s argument if abortions happen then there no reason to stop mass murder.

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Again, you are the one who introduced abortion into the argument and you can never talk about abortion without talking about religion. God is omnificent, he created “everything” including all fetuses, those that made it and those that didn’t.

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Abortion is a complicated argument because it involves religion which is a subset of philosophy. The gun debate does not involve religion it is simply a question of how many deaths are we willing to tolerate to have assault weapons on the streets?
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The religious are not satisfied to keep religion in church they constantly push their beliefs on others and society as a whole. You need only pass by a Catholic church to see thousands of little white crosses on their lawn. Just like the KKK they love putting white crosses on lawns. Men have control over their bodily functions without the inference of religious cults women do not. Religious cults want to take control of women’s normal bodily functions.

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

Abortion is already illegal in the third-trimester and many states have tried to make getting abortions as difficult as possible. So, in fact some abortions are already illegal. In the end the majority will determine the fate of abortion in America. They will continue to replace supreme court judges until they make abortion completely illegal. And in the end the same fate will befall the gun debate.
___________________________________________________
Language especially when it comes to legal matters has to be very precise and the legal definition of words prevails in a court of law. Language in common use is lose by nature but courts of law require a higher standard.
What went into the constitution was decided by majority rule. The constitution was written with provisions that allow it to be changed by the majority.

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The most basic right of all is the right to control your own body. If you take that freedom you have no freedom. If you can take that right you can take any right.
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I had no position on abortion for many years It never concerned me. I never had to pay for one and I was sure I would never need one but since it became a political football that was helping the radical right destroy America I had to take a stand. Rights are limited and so are abortions.
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The world is not perfect, and neither are posts

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Whenever you talk about rights you can’t leave out abortion rights.
The abortion debate hinges on it is alive and sperm is alive. If something is alive it should be entitled to the same treatment.

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The directions for the use of quotes is on the site. I write my posts on word and paste them on the reply site. The reason if the power goes down or the computer restarts you loss 2-3 hour’s worth of work. If the computer restarts the post is automatically saved on Word.
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Abortions are not all medical procedures. Abortion is a routine medical procedure with little risk. There are plenty of quacks in the medical field who would perform the most outrageous and dangerous medical procedures. Until the right of control of your own body is resolved it would be impossible to resolve the gun rights debate.

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

In the end we are a majority rule country. When the supreme court ruled that abortion was legal the effort to replace the supreme court justices with anti-abortion justices started. If the truth be known the anti-abortionists were responsible for Trump getting elected. It is obvious to everyone that Trump is crazier than a sh**house rat but as long as he will stack the supreme court with antiabortionist that all that is important. The founding fathers gave the majority of Americans the ability to modify the constitution with amendments.
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You can bet the subject is much broader than abortion because it goes to the heart of whether Americans have rights. You have to remember this is not a majority trying to impose its will on the minority this is a minority actively using the government to impose its will on the majority.

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Abortion is probably the most important issue in America today not because of abortion but because it is driving our politics in a downward spiral. All that is needed to get elected in America in many cases is say you are against abortion.

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I have no trouble following the argument by putting the posts side by side.
You have a hard time refuting actual facts it is easier to complain and run.
I did not introduce the tangent of abortion in this discussion but once it is on the table…

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I know that you think you know what you posted but in many cases you don’t
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Why do you believe that the supreme court ruled that abortions should be legal? The women that wanted an abortion were always able to find someone that would preform the abortion. The trouble was that since it was illegal the doctors doing the back-alley abortions were mostly quacks and drunks and the death rate for those getting abortions were high. Wikipedia will give you the history of abortion in America.

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Desperate women actually used coat hangers prior to abortion becoming legal.

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Current religion proports to take the bible literally. It has all the hall marks of a 2,000-year-old cult. Its foundation is in the age of ignorance and its objective is to impose ignorance on America.

____________________________________________________
Female teachers “molesting” teenagers have become a media sensation for the same reason a dog biting a man is not a story but a man biting a dog is a story. Because it is so rare female teachers molesting teenage boys gets the maximum amount of press. Preachers molesting children is so common it is like a dog biting a man it is a non-story everybody already knows that is common.

1 Reply

@Zardoz,

Quote:

Most mass murderers do not have criminal backgrounds.

Which are we talking about mass murders or school shootings? You like to interchange mass murderers with mass shootings and school shootings, pick one and stick to it, stop the language shift based on emotional agruments. You provide no stats for anything you post, you are on the internet, use the damn thing. Google is your friend...

Quote:

Their mass murders are often the first and last crime they will ever commit.

That seems to be the case for some of the school shooters, although the school shooters are usually mentally deficient in one way or another.

Quote:

They buy AR-15s because they are easy to come by. If we legalize automatics every school shooter would be armed with one.

A majority of the school shooters have not purchased their own guns, they have taken them from a family member. The Parkland shooter was one of the only schools shooters to actually purchase their own gun. Sandyhook, the latest Tx school shooter, most of them are underage students.

Quote:

To say that every criminal who wants a gun will find one is wrong.

Sorry to inform you, but a majority of the gun crimes in the US are committed by gang members, and people who can't purchase guns legally. The TX church shooter is a good example, not allowed to purchase any weapons but the Air Force failed to report him to the background check system.

Quote:

The harder it is to buy a gun the fewer guns there will be on the streets. People follow the path of least resistance.

So ban the sale of guns and our gun violence problem will go away?

Quote:

Why create new laws? To take the weapons of war off the streets and return them to the battlefield where they belong.

The AR-15 is not a weapon of war, it operates no different then a standard semi-auto rife, as I have already proven in previous posts. It looks scary and you don't like scary looking things.

Quote:

Remember Rhode Island? Lowest gun ownership and one of the lowest crime rates.

Compare that to WY, which has the highest gun ownership rates and is ranked 10th for crime vs your RI example, which is 8th. What do these 2 states have in common? No major urban centers.

Quote:

Citizens dead at the hands of crooks is for the most part in your paranoid imagination.

The average citizen dead at the hands of gang bangers isn't the issue, it's killing people in their own area's is the problem. The state of IL has a low crime rate but Chicago is one of the worst cities for violent crime. This past Memorial Day weekend is a good example: 7 dead 32 wounded. Sound like a mass shooting.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-met-memorial-day-crime-chicago-20180528-story.html

Quote:

If you were correct Rhode Island would have the highest crime rate because 94% of the people don’t own guns in Rhode Island but that is not what happened.

The links below show that WY is a safer place to live than RI. You analogy is based on anything but easy #'s to find. The facts are actually quite different.
Cheyenne WY crime rates:
https://www.bestplaces.net/crime/city/wyoming/cheyenne
Providence RI crime rates:
https://www.bestplaces.net/crime/city/rhode_island/providence

Quote:

Any wantabee mass murder can simply go to the corner gun store and buy his AR-15 why purchase one illegally when some shady dealer will no doubt rip them off. It is so easy to buy a weapon of war legally and go to war on school children.

Your narration doesn't fit the facts, the majority of the 11k murders per year are not committed by mass shooters and school shootings are indeed rare.

Quote:

The gun manufacturer made a law to make sure CDC could not conduct a study of gun violence that could be used to promote gun control.
“But getting this data has long been a challenge, for nakedly political reasons: a 1996 amendment to a spending bill—lobbied for by the NRA—that forbade the Center for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) from using government funds for research that “may be used to advocate or promote gun control.””

Source and Internet Article: “The Ultimate Guide to American Gun Control Laws”

And? Would you back any study who's only aim was to restrict a Right? You would, it would be the Rights you don't think we should have.

6 Replies

The Communist Origin of the Modern Conservative Movement VI

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