19
   

How would you fix the U.S Government?

 
 
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Mon 16 May, 2011 08:55 am
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:

I shut doors behind me and open them for the ladies, have you tried that?
I close toilet lids for the ladies, and flush after; and before too if I happen to be in Detroit... It must be the custom there to show everyone who may follow you your own great prize...

Why bother; is what I say... When your whole life is ****, why do you need mine to look at??? As Groucho said: Why should I do anything for posterity??? What has posterity ever done for me???
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 16 May, 2011 09:06 am
@Fido,
Fido wrote:

H2O MAN wrote:

I shut doors behind me and open them for the ladies, have you tried that?
I close toilet lids for the ladies, and flush after; and before too if I happen to be in Detroit... It must be the custom there to show everyone who may follow you your own great prize...


LOL!

The practice of leaving a bowl scraper for the next customer to deal with has spread
across the land... how they do this without using toilet paper is even more concerning.
0 Replies
 
Tifinden
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 May, 2011 03:42 pm
@Food For Thought,
Personally, I would begin by completely abandoning the Constitution and its doctrine- it is NOT WORKING! at all by any means. to begin with, government is a pretentious veneer by which a political body attempts to sustain itself by avoiding popular revolt and political failure. all governments which are founded on documents such as the Constitution are compromised first and foremost of language and written word, and therefore immediately subject to the consummate deluge of skepticism, critique, and identification of flagrance in its words. such a document will not endure for centuries through eons of evolution and political variation. thereafter, the populace will cease to apply meaning to our structural government and will begin to induce rampant riots, enraged by the fault and weakness they locate in the document. a democracy is merely a form of government which seemingly endows all with inalienable rights and liberties, yet it infests the populace with extensive ability to influence their political body, which leads to tumult, disruption, and ultimately, anarchy. because of democracy, there are far too many citizens who believe that their actions, no matter how completely erratic, are thereby by the government condoned, and they fail to realize the contrary to their sorrowful psychopathic mania, and are subjected legal penalty and chastisement. democracy allows us to write the democracy is failing, and it allows us to persuade millions of our believes- this is threatening to a political entity. we may be the perfidious founders of massive revolution.
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 16 May, 2011 04:10 pm
Mob Rule 'Democracy' is not part of our Constitution and it has no place in American government.
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Tue 17 May, 2011 04:50 am
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:

Mob Rule 'Democracy' is not part of our Constitution and it has no place in American government.
Really!!! Why should the majority be served by their government???...

Better to have the minority rule as was intended by the constitution; but then, at least the people had a check on corruption and minority control... Now we have nothing but our furstration and the outrage of injustice without recourse.
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Tue 17 May, 2011 05:43 am
@Fido,
Give one example were a mod rule type of government has worked.


You need to understand that mob rule ignores the rule of law.
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Tue 17 May, 2011 06:37 am
@Fido,
Ask Lara Logan what she thinks of mob rule.
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Tue 17 May, 2011 09:00 am
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:

Give one example were a mod rule type of government has worked.


You need to understand that mob rule ignores the rule of law.
Your question implies that you misunderstand the basic relationship between people and the law... You act as though law were some abstraction apart from the reality of people, their needs, and their survival... As a form in the hands of people who do not understand it, that is what law becomes: An abstraction, and people begin to think of law as a thing, and a goal in itself...

Let me explain the true relationship between law and people... The people are the law, and what they need is the law, and not as an abstraction, but as a means of giving them justice... As Abalard correctly noted: Ius (Justice) is the Genus, and Lex (Law) is a species of it... If law does not deliver justice, and is not just, then it is not law, and no good will follow from it, and eventually the people must abolish it... Law is just a form, and a formality; but if you were gifted with sight you would see beyond law to the people law is meant to serve...

You can see in the wide spread lawlessness of people, their willingness to use law when it suits them and to ignore it when it does not, to cheat on their taxes because the rich evade them legally, to speed because everyone speeds, and no cop means no speed limit that the respect people should have for law that springs from their need and to their defense is missing... You can see in the contempt of the right for the left, and in the willingness of the right to arm itself and invite violence that law is a dead letter to them, and that to them, might makes right is the only law...What they advocate internationally, the going and breaking of other people's homes and property and the stealing of their national resources is as good as done to them, and justified for them by their willingness to support international injustice... Those who most advocate for the law, meaning Western Law are a class of criminals who care nothing for justice, and sneer at cries for justice as weakness, and they write in stone their own indictments...

Justice must come out of law... That people who are just, are also civil and civilized, pacific, understanding and kind... There is no excuse for our miserable treatment of our fellow citizens and human beings other than that it is legal... There is no defense for our destruction of our environment except that it is legal.. The law is an ass... The law we have is the butt hole of the rich and the religious from which all people are supposed to take their sustenance... If we had government of the people, for the people, and by the people we would need only laws over the lawless, that group who normally know no law but of supply and demand, and profit... People are normally moral, and so just, and lawful... The perversion of law to support private interests teaches injustice and lawlessness and violence on a scale too great to police... Look at the cost we pay to know only insecurity... We pay for the failure of law to deliver justice...
0 Replies
 
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Tue 17 May, 2011 09:09 am
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:

Ask Lara Logan what she thinks of mob rule.
I don't talk much to Lara Logan, but I do know that all those news people who want to be among the gods of news must make their offerings to the gods of war... What is the pain of populations, their fears, their maimings and deaths??? One man's misery is another person's entertainment even if called news...

What else is news??? Is there in any amount of news the key to ending that violence and death??? The essential understanding of the situation is lacking, and as a result, all that is left is the entertainment factor... I hope you enjoy it... I hope she enjoyed it because she helped to creat it... Too bad she did not spend more time shining a light on the profit factor; but then she would have ended up dead... If you took the profit out of war there would be no war... No one is doing it for free, and the more criminal is the act the more money plays a part in it... If it were truely worth doing, it would be worth doing for free... Why didn't she catch that small detail???
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 06:02 am
@Fido,
Fido wrote:

H2O MAN wrote:

Ask Lara Logan what she thinks of mob rule.
I don't talk much to Lara Logan, but I do know that all those news people who want to be among the gods of news must make their offerings to the gods of war... What is the pain of populations, their fears, their maimings and deaths??? One man's misery is another person's entertainment even if called news...

What else is news??? Is there in any amount of news the key to ending that violence and death??? The essential understanding of the situation is lacking, and as a result, all that is left is the entertainment factor... I hope you enjoy it... I hope she enjoyed it because she helped to creat it... Too bad she did not spend more time shining a light on the profit factor; but then she would have ended up dead... If you took the profit out of war there would be no war... No one is doing it for free, and the more criminal is the act the more money plays a part in it... If it were truely worth doing, it would be worth doing for free... Why didn't she catch that small detail???

wow, thats harsh.
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 06:16 am
@hamilton,
Yep, Fido has no compassion or loyalty to anyone but him or herself.
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 08:29 am
@H2O MAN,
wow, thats harsh.
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 08:34 am
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:

Yep, Fido has no compassion or loyalty to anyone but him or herself.
I have no compassion for anyone making their dime off the suffering of others... News isn't truth, but just another version of reality, and one easily bent to serve the powerful... That is why we have freedom of the press, and freedom of religion... It is because those two groups have shown themselves so corruptable... If you want to fix a problem, fix it...

To turn war, injustice and misery into a form of entertainment for profit is not fixing the problem... If reporting the news is a thing worth doing it is worth doing for free, just like the making of war... Take the profit out of it, and only the insane will continue with news or war...This country is going broke making war, but individuals are making billions... There is a connection between their war profiteering, with the natural resources we intend to steal, and the vote of congress that fund our wars that the public neither profits by nor enjoys... It is as one man said of the money we loan for international construction projects: that 90% never leaves the country... The greatest share of money spent on war does not leave this country no matter how many lives we lose or bombs we drop... A reporter in war takes a chance... Telling the truth in this land if it were possible at all would certainly result in death...And no one would pay anyone for it since all the money is on the other side of the question...
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 08:36 am
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

wow, thats harsh.


Fido is irrational.
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 08:37 am
@Fido,
Fido wrote:

H2O MAN wrote:

Yep, Fido has no compassion or loyalty to anyone but him or herself.
To turn war, injustice and misery into a form of entertainment for profit is not fixing the problem... If reporting the news is a thing worth doing it is worth doing for free, just like the making of war... Take the profit out of it, and only the insane will continue with news or war...

actually, i think its the cause.
0 Replies
 
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Wed 18 May, 2011 08:55 am
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:

hamilton wrote:

wow, thats harsh.


Fido is irrational.
What does reason have to recommend it??? If you ask a criminal why they did their crime they are never without reason... They can justify any injustice, and this is very common with even the worst of scum... Forget your rationality... The Nazis were rational enough, but it was the want of emotional connectedness that made them criminal... I have seen pictures on the news I will never get out of my memory... Shall I believe those who saw and smelled what I only witnessed second hand were better than myself because they could see what they saw with detached rationality???...

I cannot bear it... I cannot bear this insane inhumanity and I will not pretend otherwise... I do not need to see it to know it goes on... I do not need an investigation to tell me avarice was behind it all....I do not need reason to tell me that domestic injustice is behind every instance of international injustice... Injustice is the most easily exported commodity, and is paid for before it is ever loaded on a ship or plane... But not a bit of it would happen without profit being in it and an intimate part of it at every level...

So forget reason... Learn to feel, because being dead to your own emotions, how you are yourself made dead to reality by degrees is the first sign of their victory over you, how in taking profit out of you they have stolen your meaning and your soul... Every zombie like you, the living dead marching through the days of life uncarring is their victory... They know you will support their wars... Misery love company...
hamilton
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 May, 2011 06:03 am
@Fido,
i really think this is a bit off topic. i agree, but it is. i think that to fix a government screwed up like ours, we start over with something completely new. not the form, but with a clean slate.
Fido
 
  0  
Reply Thu 19 May, 2011 06:24 am
@hamilton,
hamilton wrote:

i really think this is a bit off topic. i agree, but it is. i think that to fix a government screwed up like ours, we start over with something completely new. not the form, but with a clean slate.
Impossible... Society has grown up in the shadow of government, and the population too... The organization provided by government can not be done away with, and the good goals of our government, though long ignored must be accepted by any government that would long endure... The form of government is the same as form whether one is talking of family or simple self control of behavior... While I agree that our government as it stands cannot ever be fixed, even a new form of government will in some respects resemble the last form... Try to understand, that every form is a form of relationship, and it is to preserve relationships that old forms are trashed and new ones are instituted...

Old forms, controlled by old money, and old power care nothing for the relationship of the people that tends to make a nation of us... They will trash the relationship if doing so gives them the form... So soon as they turn the form to their sole benefit they have taken our excuse to remain in it... If a form no longer serves the relationship it will have no meaning the people can share...Those who control our form divide the people so the people can be ruled... In this fashion it has made itself obnoxious and an impediment to our success, our unity, our survival, and our progress... We must revolt, and we must design a form that serves our needs...
Pukka Sahib
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 May, 2011 07:27 am
@Fido,
I think it demands a reexamination of our values; and, more fundamentally, what we stand for as Americans. Do we stand for freedom and equality? Freedom and equality are ideals; but, absent a perfect world, no one can live in society and be entirely free or completely equal. For every freedom there is a corresponding obligation to others, and equality is limited to the extent that such obligations are mutual, and others do not demand rights without responsibility for their exercise. In this, the promise of America is not freedom and equality, but rather liberty and equal opportunity and justice under law. However, such promise cannot be kept when government instituted by men favors the few in derogation of the many, or serves the special interests at the expense of the public interest, and when the rich and powerful can have more justice than the poor and oppressed.

America is a nation of laws and not men. But the law can be both used and abused by men; and so it is the duty and responsibility of every citizen to oversee those who make and enforce the laws and administer justice lest our democratic institutions be turned into a tyranny over us.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 May, 2011 08:20 am
@Pukka Sahib,
Pukka Sahib wrote:

I think it demands a reexamination of our values; and, more fundamentally, what we stand for as Americans. Do we stand for freedom and equality? Freedom and equality are ideals; but, absent a perfect world, no one can live in society and be entirely free or completely equal. For every freedom there is a corresponding obligation to others, and equality is limited to the extent that such obligations are mutual, and others do not demand rights without responsibility for their exercise. In this, the promise of America is not freedom and equality, but rather liberty and equal opportunity and justice under law. However, such promise cannot be kept when government instituted by men favors the few in derogation of the many, or serves the special interests at the expense of the public interest, and when the rich and powerful can have more justice than the poor and oppressed.

America is a nation of laws and not men. But the law can be both used and abused by men; and so it is the duty and responsibility of every citizen to oversee those who make and enforce the laws and administer justice lest our democratic institutions be turned into a tyranny over us.
To be exact: Freedom and equality are moral forms, but the reason those moral forms have existed from prehistoric times is that humanity finds them necessary for their survival... Consider that they are older than the wheel, and perhaps older than rope, and in all places and time were once universal... Humanity as it was, on the move, migratory, hunters and gatherers only occasionally agricultural did not have the means to carry any ideas with them that did not carry them as well...

The notion that the Greeks invented democracy is often heard, but impossible to prove... In fact, all primitve people were democratic as far as I know, and I have looked, and it was because people had little but their lives and no form of government is so suited to defense as democracy... What it protects for all it protects for each...Liberty, equality, justice stand central to the experience of human kind because they were essential as ideas to his survival, and so they have always survived with mankind...
 

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