The new Puritans: Food Bullies . . .

And I have a question about the Happy Meal/Toy issue - was it that they were removing the toys so kids wouldn't have a reason to want the Happy Meal? If so...

why not just change the Happy Meal to something healthy? I mean, if you're into mandating! lol

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@Mame,

The toys were seen as a sneaky bribe to make the kids nag their parents for the meal. I've seen kids dump the toy with the (abundant) packaging after eating the food, so I don't think the toys were not big a lure.

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@Mame,

I think that goes too far.

When I talk about doing something about school lunches I mean the ones that kids buy at school. I think they might have more options in later grades but in the lower grades there is just one thing per day and most of those things are truly atrocious, nutrition-wise. Something called Bosco sticks really annoyed me, they are basically cheese dipped in dough and then deep-fried, served with a dipping sauce. That's the entree. Blech. (Sozlet happens to be standing here and just shuddered at the memory.)

I pack her lunches (specifically because the ones served are so icky), but that's the kind of thing that I think can/ should be improved. The lunches use a lot of cheese (for example) because it's cheap, due to surplus/ subsidies. That whole thing should be rejiggered IMO.

Edit: here's a bosco stick.

http://www.foodservicedirect.com/productimages/OTF497532S.jpg

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@sozobe,

I'm sorry, I don't remember reading what you're referring to! Sorry. Sorry.

I absolutely think that if the school is providing lunches, they can provide whatever they want, as long as it's healthy. In my day, we had hot dog day once a week (how healthy is a hot dog?? not!! but back then, nobody cared) and tiny cartons of milk every day. But not all schools offer lunches. I would never advocate a school providing pop machines, chip and junk machines or garbage (like hot dogs! or Bosco). That is so not right. But the school may be getting some extra funding from these companies... more than likely.

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We are addicted to the easy/cheap/fast fix....got a mind or body "problem" then take a pill....got issues with how other people are acting then pass a law. And we do increasingly have issues with the choices that others make for themselves and their families, despite the lies we tell to our kids about how bullying is wrong and mean we are bullies much more than we used to be. We dont see it, because according to our rose colored glasses power in personal relationship is wrong, and us being angels do not practice it. Delusion/ mental illness runs deep in modern society..

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@Mame,

Mame wrote:

And I have a question about the Happy Meal/Toy issue - was it that they were removing the toys so kids wouldn't have a reason to want the Happy Meal? If so...

why not just change the Happy Meal to something healthy? I mean, if you're into mandating! lol

In fact, that's exactly what the mandate in SF was - a ban on advertising or selling meals for kids using free toys, that are extremely unhealthy for them.

Cycloptichorn

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@Mame,

You can click on the "Mame" at the top of my post to go back to the post of yours that I was responding to -- sorry it was confusing.

I was agreeing that mandating what parents send in (as long as its not an allergy thing) goes too far. And clarifying that when I mentioned mandates re: school lunches, it was about making the ones that are sold (or given, in the case of kids who come from low-income families) healthier than they tend to be now.

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@sozobe,

God, we had horrible lunches at school when I was a kid. Truly bad.

I don't understand why schools can't serve -

1 meat entree, this can be pretty cheap to make
2 roasted veg - easy to make and nutritious
1 starch - rice, bread, pasta.

Every day. Throw in a soup once a week or something and maybe a salad. The food cost can't be that high....

Cycloptichorn

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@Cycloptichorn,

It's not hard and it can be cheap. Soup kitchens do it all the time. Seriously. I'm a cook and trust me, it's cheaper to make good, wholesome food for a large number than opening a bunch of cans or packages. It really is. Why they don't do it? Maybe they're lazy, I don't know. But I cook in mining camps and the only prepared things cooks that I know use are condiments, pasta, and breads. The rest we make ourselves. No reason why a cafeteria can't.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

God, we had horrible lunches at school when I was a kid. Truly bad

I once took the effort to call the school board about the quality of the food being served, I was told point blank that the service was contracted, it met the federal dietary guidelines, and that the school board had no further interest in the matter. I used to watch most of them be thrown away, as mostly only the kids on the free lunch program took it, but even they would routinely refuse to eat it.

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@Cycloptichorn,

I'm part of a group working to make school lunches better and you'd be amazed how much pushback there is.

We ARE making progress but the subsidies are a big part of the problem. If they get loads of cheese for basically free, they want to use loads of cheese. And the volume is so high in general that a difference of 25 cents/ lunch, say, really adds up.

Anyway, the superintendent is responsive and there are more and more companies that are trying to make cheap + healthy school meals (as in, alternate contractors, though there's all kinds of complicated stuff about unions etc.), so I am somewhat hopeful that this can be resolved eventually. But definitely complicated, with a lot of moving parts.

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@hawkeye10,

Right, federal dietary guidelines for example is one of the things I'd like to see changed. Some really crappy stuff meets the guidelines.

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@sozobe,

Good luck Sozobe! There was a tv programme on here last year about Jamie Oliver trying to change school lunches in one American town. What was being fed to the kids every day was pretty shocking - basically junk food. Our school canteens (in Australia) could be improved enormously but a lot of kids bring lunch from home and even if they buy something at the canteen I don't think they're getting the huge portions or quite as much fat as these kids were getting in the US. Not that we don't have a child obesity problem here as well....

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@sozobe,

sozobe wrote:

I'm part of a group working to make school lunches better and you'd be amazed how much pushback there is.

We ARE making progress but the subsidies are a big part of the problem. If they get loads of cheese for basically free, they want to use loads of cheese. And the volume is so high in general that a difference of 25 cents/ lunch, say, really adds up.

Anyway, the superintendent is responsive and there are more and more companies that are trying to make cheap + healthy school meals (as in, alternate contractors, though there's all kinds of complicated stuff about unions etc.), so I am somewhat hopeful that this can be resolved eventually. But definitely complicated, with a lot of moving parts.

Yeah, I'm sure money is what it comes down to in the end. But hell, it's unhealthy!

The fact that you can get unhealthy **** for cheap shouldn't be a reason to get unhealthy ****!

The whole thing is mind-boggling really. Glad that you guys are looking into it....

Cycloptichorn

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@sozobe,

Quote:

Right, federal dietary guidelines for example is one of the things I'd like to see changed. Some really crappy stuff meets the guidelines

for us it has not been the food that was started with that was the problem, it has always been the complete lack of care that was taken in preparing the meals. It was done on the cheap, and even the lunch ladies know that they are at best only one step above prison cooks, and that those who deviate from the programed swill will be harshly dealt with.

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This all reminds me fondly of my catholic grammar school, where the 'auditorium' and cafeteria were in the basement. I don't remember the exact food, but there was a line of older (well, hey, I was nine) ladies scooping out stew - possibly Dinty Moore's, but still - or homemade soups with veggies, perhaps clam chowder, spaghetti and meatballs, and fruit. Hah, tuna and noodle casserole on fridays. Perhaps not the healthiest meals on earth, but I remember thinking they were delicious. Milk, white or chocolate, ooh la la.

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@Setanta,

Just the other day, I started thinking about making my own pasta, doesn't look that hard. I'm lucky enough to live where I can get my beef straight out of the pasture. Beef tips and home made noodles , ok now I'm on a mission.
Think fm could send me some sperigus ?

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My friend's wife owns a bread machine, knows how to use it.
He weighs about 300lbs, rides a harley davidson, prominent member of the patriot guard. Very effective at blocking Phred's view at those funerals.

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@sozobe,

sozobe wrote:

Who are the food bullies, though?

I thought of this because of a BS ad i heard on the radio, and not long after, i came downstairs to use the computer, and saw an anti-gluten ad at FB. It's the great amorphous "they," and one of the big problems i have with Puritanism in its modern form is that we rarely see who "they" are. Saab points out we need a balanced diet, and that's good sense. Cyclo points out that people need to get good exercise, and that those who do can benefit from carbs, and that's good sense. That some people are lactose intolerant or gluten intolerant does not make it good sense to crowd other products out of the market.

In one sense, "they" are marketers and retailers eager to jump on the latests bandwagon--but it's not them entirely. Every cuisine on the planet uses carbs in one form or another--wheat, rice, potatoes--and as a part of a balanced diet, they're not necessarily bad. Europeans lived on bread and little else for centuries--the inability to assure the bread supply has toppled nations, France and Russia coming to mind immediately. So, i guess we should be gluten-free to avoid the revolution?

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@sozobe,

sozobe wrote:

Right, federal dietary guidelines for example is one of the things I'd like to see changed. Some really crappy stuff meets the guidelines.

I recall when Reagan's FDA decided that ketchup is a vegetable and that serving it with whatever was the weekly deep-fried entrée constituted compliance with nutrition guidelines.

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The new Puritans: Food Bullies . . .

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