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Hey, Can A Woman "Ask To Get Raped"?

 
 
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Eorl
 
  2  
Reply Fri 16 Jul, 2010 10:53 pm
@Phoenix32890,
Phoenix32890 wrote:

There ARE women who are turned on by rough sex. In a sense, one might say that she was "asking to be raped". But, by definition, rape is non-consensual, so that a person who wants to play act rape IS consenting, therefore it is not rape.

No, a woman can never "ask to be raped".



I thought this was worth repeating.

To put it another way, if someone does actually ask to be raped, then he/she has a problem. A vocabulary problem.
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Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 05:53 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
So, based on this and what you have said before, you do not consider it rape if there is no actual violence or stalking?
If one party says no, or is not allowed to communicate, and the other sticks something in an orifice, a rape has taken place. This should remain a criminal offense, punished roughly like it is now, which is to say rather extremely. I would fudge this slightly in marriage.


I see that you have changed your stance somewhat over the years. You used to have much more liency about rape.

I also see that it has not really changed regarding marriage. Tell us about the fudging in marriage?
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Izzie
 
  3  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 06:30 am
@hawkeye10,
Hawkeye

As you did not address my post (incoherent as it may have been late last night),

so, I'll ask the question again - you clearly state that in your opinion “often abuse is nearly a blessing”

hawkeye10 wrote:

Only the most alive people can do this, and I have found it surprising to me that a lot of these people have suffered deeply at some point in their lives. I catch hell for saying this in the childhood sexual abuse survivor community, but I have come to the conclusion that often abuse is nearly a blessing. The best amongst us have often been forged by abuse, it becomes the fuel that propels us to becoming fully awake, fully aware of our strength, and fully aware of what matters in this life.


http://able2know.org/topic/153679-2#post-4193362

so, in your world being abused can make the victim stronger, it wakens them – being abused is therefore a good thing, a blessing as you put it.

You claim to argue for the rights of victims – you state in the bullying thread

Quote:
the weak are to be improved as best as possible, we need all hands on deck, there is no time to play nurse maid to a bunch of people who don't know how to look after themselves.


along with

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
Victims must be victims". ******* RUBBISH! Victims usually have done nothing to deserve any of the torment they get

I never claimed that they did, the victim is not defined by actions, but rather by how they see themselves which comes out in their personalities. I learned this working with child sexual abuse victims, who as adults would find themselves victimized again and again by different people. The victims always seems clueless, saying something to the effect "I dont understand how I can be so unlucky that all the men I get involved with want to abuse me". These victims attract abusers, who can spot them a mile away, and then can figure out what makes then tick so that they can get what they want.

The good news is that victims can change, stop being victims. The bad news is that they will not so long as they continue to blame their troubles on abusers, or those who fail to protect them from abusers, and dont take a look inside themselves. The outward blaming of others rapidly becomes a defense mechanism, it acts as an excuse to never do the required inward work on themselves.




and here you state

hawkeye10 wrote:

I am content to continue to point out what I see as the truth, and to argue my case, in spite of the fact that most people dont want to hear it. Majorities are sometimes built slowly, as the truth becomes inescapable.

The argument that I am a moral reprobate is not worthy of consideration, reality is not either moral or immoral...I am either right or I am wrong, that is the only context in which judgment of my position is relevant.



Your world to me appears to be a world of actually “creating” victims so that you can then make them stronger for the greater good, therefore weeding out the weak ones to make the stronger race...your collective.

http://able2know.org/topic/143339-5#post-4176286
hawkeye10 wrote:

My kids learned early on not to pick on people who are not strong enough to handle it, but they have certainly at times taunted in the attempt to inspire a better effort.

If I caught my kids picking on a weakling we would at least have words, whether I give an order depends upon what I find out.

(bolded for emphasis)

hawkeye10 wrote:

I believe strongly that our main job as parents is to raise and release quality adults, it is not to protect children from all harm that might come their way. Life is full contact, it serves no ones best interest to only teach them the fantasy of a Care Bear world



With your line of thinking it appears that you perceive sexual assault as a long-term blessing, provided the victim does not act like a victim but believes that being raped/bullied was to make them stronger and the abuser should not be blamed for any of their troubles, and your active encouragement of raising children to taunt and inspire a better effort of the weak, if in your opinion, they are too weak and need to be taught a lesson - your theory of get stronger, quit whining and work on your stronger inward self.



People do not need to be taunted to inspire better efforts, children ought to be encouraged to inspire better efforts. Children/adults do not need to be sexually assaulted to be made to feel alive or find themselves wakened or to realise what matters in life.

There are far more positive ways to live life.

No-one asks to be raped.

Quote:
there are ways for a society to handle agression and power in sex other than to bad mouth it, criminalize it, and put a lot of people in prison. This war on aggressive sex is a futile as is the war on drugs, both are trying to use the criminal justice system to handle "problems" that it can not solve
.

Therefore, from an early age, find the weaklings, mould them through taunting and abuse because the weak need to be improved, after the abuse they will become stronger because you will tell them they are, and therefore they will not be victims any longer and therefore there will be less abusers...


Bizarre!





Strangely perhaps, I do completely agree that victims should not be victims - I do believe that one must be strong and not be a victim, one must empower themselves, grow stronger during and throughout any of life's curve balls and that comes from the inner self, confidence, it can take a lot of hard work and energy to feel better about oneself but it can be done if one doesn't view onself as a victim...

however, I just don't see it in the same way that you do or would go about it in the same way that you do.

From your words, you seem to create the victim then blame the victim for their weaknesses, so that your collective can then improve it.




0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 07:21 am
@hawkeye10,
Do you still maintain what you said on September 7, 2008?

Quote:
My position is that as minors approach adulthood should increasingly gain individual rights. I agree that parental consent should not be required for abortion and am conflicted about parental notification. as i have said before I am in favor of moving the age of consent backwards again, to 15 or maybe 14. I am conflicted about the laws that take into consideration the age of the sex partner. I think that teens have the right to be told the truth, thus sexual indoctrination programs such as "just say no" are an abomination.
Anyone got anything to say about teenage rights in general, or how it relates to sexual and/or abortion rights in particular??


bolding mine for emphasis
CalamityJane
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 09:54 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

there are ways for a society to handle agression and power in sex other than to bad mouth it, criminalize it, and put a lot of people in prison.


Really? How would society handle aggression and power in sex i.e. victimizing a person, other than criminalizing it?
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 10:04 am
@CalamityJane,
You will probably get an answer from Hawkeye that has legalize in there.
JustBrooke
 
  5  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 10:15 am
@Intrepid,
hawkeye10 wrote:

I catch hell for saying this in the childhood sexual abuse survivor community, but I have come to the conclusion that often abuse is nearly a blessing.


You are such a reprobate. If I were married to you, I'd kill you - for fear you would give our children a "blessing."

B-A-N-G

Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 10:17 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
there are ways for a society to handle agression and power in sex other than to bad mouth it, criminalize it, and put a lot of people in prison.


As far as I am concerned, a rape is another form of assault. If a person assaults someone, and there is grievous harm, he will be put in prison. Rape causes not only grievous physical harm, but serious psychological harm as well to the victim.

Hawkeye- If you had your "druthers" what would YOU do with rapists?
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Arella Mae
 
  2  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 03:17 pm
@firefly,
I do not believe a woman ever asks to be raped. However, I don't believe women should be out there displaying as much skin as some do BUT even if the woman is dressed in a not very modest fashion, it is STILL THE MAN'S responsibility to keep a check on HIS OWN BEHAVIOR.

Intrepid, that very comment crossed my mind too. LOL
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Arella Mae
 
  2  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 03:19 pm
@William,
William wrote:

Hello Issie, please read what I offered again. “Any woman who.......”! Any woman who does not, would rather die first and fight; oh my god can she ever! No man could ever fight off such an attack. And yes there are extenuating circumstances too.

Now please think about it. How many women have ever known that have beyond a doubt been forcibly raped? Not what you see on the television that is so dramatized, but in real life?

Please understand I am staying on topic here as to what the Op is suggesting and what I personally know and personally experienced.

One very close to me said she was raped once. I will expound a little later after you peruse the following site so you know how complicated it is to understand exactly what rape means, now.http://www.answers.com/topic/rape

Perhaps my comment was a bit more profound than many can understand and I can’t apologize for that because I know there are some, perhaps only a few, that do.

I’ll be here when you calm down a little and not so het up.

William


Rape means when a woman says no but the MAN HEARS YES!
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Arella Mae
 
  2  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 03:24 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

The clear goal of these ads is to convince people to report rape. I dont think that this will work with victims, because I think that most victims who dont report make this choice out of self interest. I assume that the designers of this campaign know this, thus the real goal is to get people other than the victim to turn in rapists. It is yet another assault on the right of the victim to determine their own course of action, their own destiny. It is a new push to depower victims, done under the cover of promoting the victim.


I am not one usually given to saying things like this but in my opinion, YOU ARE SO SICK AND TWISTED! ACTUALLY, I THINK YOU ARE FLAT OUT EVIL. You prefer to let the criminal free. Says so much about your character. I make you this promise - I will never respond to a post of yours again. I tried to be civil with you and tried to understand you but you are just flat out SICK!
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 03:35 pm
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

I think I'm going to save myself some time, and just put you on ignore now.


How do you do that? I can find My Users Ignored but how do you add someone?
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Mame
 
  2  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 03:51 pm
Click on their avatar, it will take you to their page. On the right hand side, you click "Ignore User". Voila.
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 03:53 pm
@Mame,
Mame wrote:

Click on their avatar, it will take you to their page. On the right hand side, you click "Ignore User". Voila.
Thank you so much! Clicking away!
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 04:19 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
Hawkeye- If you had your "druthers" what would YOU do with rapists?
My main interest is in preventing rape, in helping those in need before they do harm.


Why don't you answer the question that Phoenix asked you?
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