25
   

Hey, Can A Woman "Ask To Get Raped"?

 
 
hawkeye10
 
  -3  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2010 09:44 pm
@glitterbag,
Quote:
I guess the moral of the story is don't judge a book by it's cover, and don't buy into some blowhards stupid fixation on rape and the innocent perpetrators of said rape. I'm guessing Hawk is not much older than 25 and really men don't become interesting until they are at least 40
48 actually. My experience is as well that people get more interesting as they get older, as they learn to separate the bull **** from reality.
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2010 10:42 pm
@hawkeye10,
I think she was referring to the age you act, not your chronilogical age. I think Glitterbag has you pegged pretty well.
0 Replies
 
glitterbag
 
  3  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2010 11:01 pm
Intreped is on target. I know men and women very young who are very interesting and very engaged, I know men and women 50 thru 80 who are amazing and some who are just a flat waste of space. It is possible at the age of 48 for a man to be feeling a little mid-life crapola...and even more possible if his male role models were all humps. I am no longer interested in coaching folks along, not the lumps at least I encounter here, I still have responsiblity for those who work for me and for the younger members of my family. So much to do, so little time, so why waste time beating my head against a wall. One slight correction, most men become interesting at 40 but way too many do not ever become interesting. But, hey, that ain't my problem, there are a bunch of women with self esteem issues that can look after those males who are not interesting. Think of it as a win win situation.
hawkeye10
 
  -3  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2010 11:22 pm
@glitterbag,
We have had a good share of diversions in this thread, but you have just pulled a whopper. I hope that this makes you feel good about yourself...

If you want to talk about age how about we talk about how disputes about consent overwhelmingly tend to be an affliction of the young?
BillRM
 
  -4  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 09:26 am
@glitterbag,
Quote:
So now that I have had time to think about the wisdom of BillRM's denigration and invalidation of women, I realize I should have been proud to have been singled out for such attention by a man I barely knew. I'm sure Bill would expect his mother, sister or daughter to rightfully allow strange men to feel them up. So what if I was uncomfortable, or was married or was a mother....when someone goes out of their way to say "wow, I think you are hot" or "wow, you just happen to be here and I'm having an urge" I should say thank you, thank you so much for noticing I'm here...it is such an honor.


Highly highly interesting post for the reason that in all of my postings on the subject I had never even hinted at the position our friend is claiming I had taken.

Is she being dishonest in a highly conscience manner?

Is there instead something in her make up that force her to assume such a stand from anyone who would dare to pointed out that some scientific studies had indicated that we have a problem with false rapes reporting in non-stranger relationships?

Or worst of all does not think that when a couple go out drinking together that it is the man responsibility to judge if the woman can or can not grant legal consent for sex but it is instead her responsibility as an adult to control her own drinking?

Neither of those two positions have anything at all to do with a man coping a feel under a table.



0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  -4  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 09:44 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
If you want to talk about age how about we talk about how disputes about consent overwhelmingly tend to be an affliction of the young?

How true in relationship to college age men and women who still are weak in mature judgments and tend to be far more likely to be binge drinkers then people later in life.

Love the women here who wish to turn the young men into heartless predates and the young women into pure victims in any issue concerning consent to sex.

The example of the young woman, already posted here, who on her birthday got drunk then woke up a sleeping young man and being to kisses him and have sex with him is directly to this point,

Only the next day after she had regrets for losing her virginity on her birthday in such a manner did this act turn into rape where the poor guy needing to face a full-scale court-martial.

Given a few more years to mature she would had been far more likely to had placed the blame where it belong on herself not on the young man who gotten awoke that night by her.
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:05 am
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
If you want to talk about age how about we talk about how disputes about consent overwhelmingly tend to be an affliction of the young?


You contradict yourself, since at 48 (hardly young), you try to perpetuate the nonsense that most women actually desire to be raped ("conquered " and "ravished"). Since rape is an act done without consent, you still fail to grasp that essential fact, despite the fact you are pushing the half century mark. It would seem you are a little over-the-hill to be having such "disputes about consent" with most of the women in the world.

Furthermore, you laughably cite "scientific evidence" to support your views. Of course, such evidence could be obtained only by interviewing and gathering data from a large cross section of women who have reported they have been raped. Did these women enjoy their rapes? Were the rapes sexually and emotionally satisfying for them? Would they like to be raped again? Are those the sorts of scientific studies you refer to? Please, please post links to them, so we can all be persuaded by such evidence. It would mean that rape is actually a victim-less crime, and it would make BillRM so overjoyed to know that every man ever convicted of rape has been the victim of a false accusation. I mean, if she really wanted it, and really enjoyed it, how could it be a crime? Poor Freud, he could only wonder, "What do women want?", while Hawkeye has known the secret all along--women want to be raped.

You are old enough, or should be, to be able to separate fantasy from reality. That a woman may fantasize about being "ravished" is hardly the same as actually wanting to be raped. That a woman may enjoy reading "bodice ripper" romance novels does not mean she actually wants to be raped. People fantasize about all sorts of things--but their fantasies are under their control, they play out the way they want them to be. And, for most women who have such "ravishment" fantasies, they are generally erotic rather than violent, aggressive, or genuinely unwanted, highly unpleasant, forced assaults.

It is obvious that the time you spend in the BDSM scene exposes you to a group of atypical women in terms of their sexual behaviors. You cannot extrapolate your observations or conclusions from that particular group and then apply them to the entire female population. But, more importantly, those involved in BDSM are role playing fantasies--they enter into these situations willingly, and ostensibly know they can call a halt to them if they wish. So consent is definitely operating, even in the more deviant groups.

You really don't like women. You make that very clear in post after post on more than one thread. You don't even like having to make conversation with women in real life social situations. You insult female posters--often in sexual terms. You obsess about females having too much power (those darn feminists), and you clearly aim to manipulate, control, and dominate women sexually--and then you announce that this is what all women want, as proven by "scientific evidence". You not only deny the crime of rape, or apologize for it, you don't even feel that rapists should be jailed for their crimes, because you feel they are "sick" rather than criminals. What makes them any less criminal than thieves, murderers, or embezzlers? Should we pardon their crimes because 91% of their victims are female, and the welfare of women doesn't count? A man who likes women doesn't want to see rapists get a free pass. A man who likes women does not deny the fact that women do get raped--by strangers, acquaintances, dates, and relatives--and they suffer as a result of these assaults. A man who likes women would not make an absurd assertion that women actually want to get raped, nor would he refer to rape as an "intimate relationship" or an act designed to drive women to the "heights of passion".

You do not like women.

At best, women serve some purpose for you as controllable sex toys or masturbatory devices. They allow you to prop up your fragile and sagging sense of male adequacy or "masculinity" by giving you someone you can "conquer" in your BDSM sex games.

An inadequate 48 year man, who is fearful of and antagonistic toward women, posturing as some sort of stud, dispensing self serving sexual advice to other males, is rather ludicrous.

I'm surprised glitterbag thought you were 25. You sound closer to 17. And not a particularly mature 17 year old.
BillRM
 
  -3  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:06 am
@Arella Mae,
Quote:
In order to stick to his beliefs, he would have to say those men raped in prison were either falsely accusing or they deserved it because you know how sexy those prison uniforms can be. Who can resist a man in uniform, right? What is sad, is that Hawkeye seems completely incapable of any kind of empathy other than that for the criminal. Says a lot about his character, or rather, lack therof, as far as I am concerned.


Hmm would you like to point out where Hawkeye or anyone else here had condom force or the threat of force in connection to sexual intercourse?
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:10 am
@BillRM,
How many men have lied and said they did not rape a woman when they knowingly had sex with her without her consent?
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:12 am
This is what I call one tough young lady! I am sure somehow, some way Hawkeye will find a way to blame this child for nearly being killed after being brutally raped. After all, it was soooooooooo wrong of her to sleep in her own bed, in her own house, and dare to think she would be safe. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/37232072/

Quote:
Child raped, left to die gets justice 20 years later
After two decades, Jennifer Schuett’s attacker confessed to heinous crime

By Mike Celizic
TODAYshow.com contributor
1056-Bay-KENT

Even in the light of day, the ragged field in Dickinson, Texas, has a sinister look about it. There’s a coarsely mown area with ramshackle soccer goals made of sticks surrounded by scrubby trees and expanses of weeds.

But despite its lack of scenic appeal, Jennifer Schuett visits the field frequently. She doesn’t come to see; she comes to remember.

“This could have been my final resting place. I come here to remind myself how grateful I am to be alive,” Schuett told NBC News’ Jeff Rossen in a story that aired Wednesday on TODAY.

Schuett was just 8 years old when she was raped and left to die in that field, her throat slashed from ear to ear. That was nearly 20 years ago, on Aug. 20, 1990.
Schuett remembers it all. For years, it was because she didn’t want to forget anything that might lead to the arrest of the man who did such a horrible thing to an innocent little girl. During all that time, she made sure investigators never let the case go cold.

Her motivation was simple. It was, she told Rossen, “Thinking of children, adults, anyone that could be getting victimized by him.”

20-year-old clue

Schuett’s determination finally paid off. Last year, new DNA technology allowed samples to be taken from evidence collected at the scene 20 years ago. Back then, DNA traces were too small to produce a result. Today, scientists can get a DNA profile from a single human cell.

Consulting an FBI database, Dickinson Police found a match. The suspect was a 40-year-old welder from North Little Rock, Ark., with a wife and three kids. His DNA was on file because he had been charged in 1996 with kidnapping, sexually assaulting and threatening to kill a woman in Arkansas. He was convicted of the kidnapping charge and spent three years in prison, earning parole in February 2008.

The man’s name was Dennis Earl Bradford. Under questioning, he confessed to kidnapping, raping and trying to kill Jennifer Schuett.

“There is not a day that goes by, not a single day, that I don't see that baby,” Bradford told police in a voice cracking with emotion.

He then summed up his heinous crime in just a few sentences. “I pulled that little girl from her window. She was freaking out. She was crying for her mother. I told her everything was going to be all right. I took that little girl out and I raped her and I cut her throat,” he said on interrogation tapes aired for the first time on TODAY.

Left to die

It is the same story Schuett had been telling for 19 years. As an 8-year-old, she was afraid of the dark and preferred to sleep with her mother. But on the night of the crime, she told her mother, “Just because I love you, Mom, I'm going to sleep in my own bed tonight.”

She fell asleep with the light on, making the interior of her room visible from the street. Soon, her peaceful sleep would be shattered.

TODAY

In a dramatic confession, Dennis Earl Bradford admitted attacking Jennifer Schuett when she was 8 years olf.

“I woke up to a man running with me down the sidewalk of our apartments. He had come through the window and kidnapped me,” she told Rossen. “Of course, I tried to scream. He immediately covered my nose and mouth, put me in his vehicle, and we drove off. I remember him holding a knife to my throat in the front seat of the car and asking me if I was scared, His exact words were, ‘Are you scared little girl? Am I scaring you?’ ”

Schuett doesn’t know what happened next, but picks up her narrative in the field.
“The next thing I remember after that is him dragging me through this field by my ankles,” Schuett said. “Apparently, he had choked me unconscious or strangled me unconscious. Raped me. And then he slit my throat from ear to ear and left me in this field to die.”

She was naked and lying on her back on top of a fire-ant nest. Some 14 hours later, she woke up, covered in fire ants, but when she tried to move she couldn’t, her strength drained away with her blood. She tried to scream, but no sound came out; her voice box had been slashed.

Rossen asked if she thought she was going to die.

“I knew I was going to die,” Schuett replied.

But the little girl was tougher than anyone could imagine. Kids who came to play in the field found her. She was rushed to a hospital in critical condition. A scar low on her neck marks the place where a breathing tube was inserted to keep her alive.

Doctors told her she would never talk again. Three days later, she was speaking.

TODAY

“You chose the wrong 8-year-old girl to try and murder,” Jennifer Schuett wrote to her attacker in her victim’s impact statment.

“The doctor said that I would never speak again. And that couldn't be further from the truth because these days it’s hard to get me to be quiet,” she said with a laugh.

She grew up and went on with her life, but she kept coming back to the realization that her attacker was still free. She even went on “America’s Most Wanted” in an effort to bring him to justice.

As soon as she was able after the attack, she had given police artists a detailed description of Bradford. The picture that they drew turned out to be remarkably accurate. But no one ever found Bradford until the DNA match was made.
People who knew Bradford told reporters that they couldn’t believe he was the same person who could commit such an unspeakable crime. His employer told reporters that Bradford had worked at the same company for 10 years and had “changed his life.”

Schuett can’t understand how he could live so long with such a secret.

“It just makes me wonder how he couldn't have confessed sooner,” she said. “And why would you want to live with a secret like that. I would think it would drive someone crazy.”

Message to her attacker

Although Bradford was in custody and had confessed, one last loose end remained. Schuett’s ability to have children naturally was destroyed when she was raped. Her life had been changed forever. She desperately wanted to face him in court at his sentencing and unburden herself.

She had even written her victim’s impact statement.

“You chose the wrong little, 45-pound, 8-year-old girl to try and murder,” she wrote. “Because for 19 years, I've thought of you ever single day, and helped search for you. And every year that's passed has given me more strength and drive for when I finally would be face to face with you, as I am today.”

Rossen asked what she hoped to accomplish.

“To show him that he didn't win, and that I'm a strong survivor, and that his intentions of killing me weren't followed through with,” Schuett replied, fighting back tears. “And to show him how strong I am and to show other victims that no matter what obstacles you come across or how long you have to wait, that as long as you're strong and determined you can get the justice that you want.”
In the last violent act of his life, Bradford hanged himself in his cell last week before she had a chance to tell him how he’d failed to extinguish either her life or her spirit.

© 2010 MSNBC Interactive. Reprints
BillRM
 
  -4  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:13 am
@firefly,
Quote:
It is obvious that the time you spend in the BDSM scene exposes you to a group of atypical women in terms of their sexual behaviors


Firefly are you claiming to be typical when it come to women and sex?

Somehow I do not think you are anywhere near typical.
BillRM
 
  -4  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:18 am
@firefly,
Quote:
How many men have lied and said they did not rape a woman when they knowingly had sex with her without her consent?


From the studies anywhere from 75 to 50 percents and you point being what?

Oh this is not dealing with the cases where there is no question there was consent just whether it is "legal" consent or not.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:24 am
@BillRM,
Quote:

Hmm would you like to point out where Hawkeye or anyone else here had condom force or the threat of force in connection to sexual intercourse?


Hawkeye talks about "conquest" and "ravishment" all the time--as the most important elements in "good sex" for him.

Quote:
Noun: ravishment ra-vish-munt

The crime of forcing a woman to submit to sexual intercourse against her will
- rape, violation, assault


Rape is unwanted sex, sex without consent. If she says, "NO" and he has sex with her anyway, he is raping her.

If she is drunk, she cannot legally give consent, and sex in such situations is rape.

The responsibility is on the male to be sure he has consent, because he is the one who will be charged with rape. If he is at all unsure about whether he has clear, conscious consent from the woman, he should refrain from having sex.

You and Hawkeye have repeatedly denied the crime of rape, and you, in particular, have focused on blaming the victim.

Only the rapist is responsible for a rape.
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:25 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:


Hmm would you like to point out where Hawkeye or anyone else here had condom force or the threat of force in connection to sexual intercourse?


emphasis by me.

You are truly confused and out of touch. Laughing Laughing
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:27 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Quote:
It is obvious that the time you spend in the BDSM scene exposes you to a group of atypical women in terms of their sexual behaviors


Firefly are you claiming to be typical when it come to women and sex?

Somehow I do not think you are anywhere near typical.


Firefly did not claim to be anything. Your reading comprehension is as badly in need of work as your writing skills.
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:33 am
Here is a bit of the Andrew Luster story. Notice the bolded phrase? This is how twisted a rapist's mind can be. He actually believes this woman is just laying there waiting for him! Fortunately, Andrew Luster wasn't a real smart rapist. He videotaped most of his horrific crimes, which left absolutely no doubt as to what a deviant he truly is. He received 124 years in prison.

You can read the entire story at the link below.


http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/criminal_mind/sexual_assault/andrew_luster/3.html

Quote:
Andrew Luster
By David Krajicek

'What I Like'

After thinking over the evening's events and talking with friends, Carey went to police a couple of days later, on July 17, to file a criminal complaint alleging drug-induced rape. Tests found no GHB in her system, but the drug is notoriously fleeting.

With police listening in, she telephoned Luster to draw out incriminating comments. During the call, Luster admitted that he gave her "Liquid X."

The next day, police arrested Luster for using a narcotic to rape Carey. Police searched his home but found no GHB. They did find circumstantial evidence: a cache of photographs and home videos that showed Luster having sex with unconscious women.

One of them was an ex-girlfriend, Tonja, who had later married a Mussel Shoals neighbor.

Contacted by police, Tonja said she met Luster in October 1996 at a club on State Street in Santa Barbara, just like Carey.

Tonja, 22, was visiting from Arizona. She said they had a three-month fling before an acrimonious split. Luster sued her to recover a $4,000 loan he made to Tonja so she could have her teeth fixed.

Tonja determined that the sex video was made at Luster's home on the night they met.

The video showed Luster positioning Tonja—limp as a rag doll—in various sexual positions. He is seen inserting objects in her vagina, including a smoking marijuana cigarette, a candle and a plastic saber. The woman winces in apparent pain as he sodomizes her.

Tonja said she had been unaware of the sex and the taping, and authorities heaped additional charges on Luster.

A third young woman then stepped forward to say she was the victim in a Luster video labeled "Shauna GHBing."

Shauna said she met Luster on the beach when she was 16. She said the two had "made out" but she had never knowingly had intercourse with Luster.

The Shauna video shows Luster having sex with the unconscious—and audibly snoring—young woman, who by then was 17. As the camera panned Shauna's naked body, Luster adds this commentary: "I dream about this: a strawberry blonde passed out on my bed, waiting for me to do with her what I will."

Ventura County authorities said about 10 other women stepped forward to accuse Luster, but they limited the prosecution to the allegations against Carey, Tonja and Shauna. When the investigation was complete, authorities charged Luster with 88 criminal counts in those three cases—more than enough to send him away to prison for life if convicted.

Prosecutors argued that Luster's wealth made him a high risk to flee, and a judge set bail at $10 million.



Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:35 am
@Intrepid,
What on earth is condom force????? I see it in bill's quote but I seriously don't want to hear his explanation. OOPS ! Didn't mean to bold that.
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:36 am
@Arella Mae,
Arella Mae,
Just a suggestion, but it might be better to just paste part of the editorial to save time and space since you have the link included so we can read the whole thing there. That is the purpose for including the link. Wishing you a fantastic day.
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:37 am
@Intrepid,
Intrepid wrote:

Arella Mae,
Just a suggestion, but it might be better to just paste part of the editorial to save time and space since you have the link included so we can read the whole thing there. That is the purpose for including the link. Wishing you a fantastic day.
LOL! I finally figured that out when I posted the Andrew Luster article! Thanx Intrepid!
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Tue 7 Sep, 2010 10:38 am
@Arella Mae,
Arella Mae wrote:

What on earth is condom force????? I see it in bill's quote but I seriously don't want to hear his explanation.


I think the rest of us would have probably used the word condoned. It is, however, hard to fathom what Bill ever really means. May the force be with him.
 

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