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The Final Debate! No More! This Is IT! Last one!!

 
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Oct, 2008 11:33 pm
All the network polls have Obama as the winner by substantial margins.

Except Fox viewers texting in: 87% McCain win, 13% Obama win.

Stupid people made stupider, and quite happily it seems.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 01:11 am
I finally got to see & hear (as opposed to just hear - on the radio) a live debate (or quite a bit of it) between these two. Via computer in the library at work, at lunch time. I was very impressed with Obama. Very! If/when he wins this election it'll be a such timely & refreshing change for the US ... & for world politics.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 04:52 am
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

All the network polls have Obama as the winner by substantial margins.

Except Fox viewers texting in: 87% McCain win, 13% Obama win.

Stupid people made stupider, and quite happily it seems.

Obama's a good debater, but it's a question of form over substance. What does it matter whether you're cool under fire if the philosophy you express is wrong?
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 05:29 am
Thanks for the info, guys. Just wrote this elsewhere:

Once again, catching up. I watched only a section in the middle... which turned out to be the Ayers section.

McCain was sharper than he'd been and more shameless -- I saw about 20 false assertions in the time I was watching and I wish Obama would have stuffed a few more of 'em. (He got some.)

Plus, Obama seemed to be reading notes during the Ayers response. I'm sure he wanted to nail it but the looking-down didn't help.

Something was weird about McCain's eyes. They were really ROUND. He was very blinky.

Glad to see there were no catastrophes after I turned off the TV.
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 05:39 am
@sozobe,
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:04 am
@Brandon9000,
Quote:
Quote:
blatham wrote:

All the network polls have Obama as the winner by substantial margins.

Except Fox viewers texting in: 87% McCain win, 13% Obama win.

Stupid people made stupider, and quite happily it seems.


Obama's a good debater, but it's a question of form over substance. What does it matter whether you're cool under fire if the philosophy you express is wrong?


Setting aside the irrelevance of that reply...

"Wrong"? You will conceive it as such (along with those Fox viewers noted) for the simple reason that for you, as Krugman observes, a liberal or Democratic government is illegitimate for America. It's the fundamental axiom of movement conservatives. Unfortunately (for you, that is) significant majorities of Americans now reject movement conservatism.
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  -4  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:16 am
@blatham,
O-boy didn't win that debate. You'd have to be braindead to think that.

He makes me sick.
blatham
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:23 am
It looked pretty certain that 1) McCain would say something about Ayers etc and 2) that he'd tie it in with the new Acorn meme the right is trying to build.

I don't doubt that it will be precisely this meme that the various conservative entities who head up the propaganda functions will push to the fore over the next three weeks and beyond. It will provide two essentials elements; a conceptual architecture which facilitates movement conservatives' consistent and historical sense of victimization, and it will provide the underpinning rationale for delegitimizing the election results.

There's a third thing here too...it will provide (Rove et al will hope) a smokescreen for keeping Dem voters away from the polls
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/columns/shoptalk_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003874422
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:24 am
@cjhsa,
Quote:
He makes me sick.


I expect he does.
cjhsa
 
  -4  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:27 am
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Quote:
He makes me sick.


I expect he does.


Seriously, I about puked on my TV. O-boy is Islam's greatest hope. He's obviously an enemy of the United States, and apparently, so is the entire Democratic party.
blatham
 
  3  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:39 am
@cjhsa,
Quote:
Seriously, I about puked on my TV. O-boy is Islam's greatest hope. He's obviously an enemy of the United States, and apparently, so is the entire Democratic party.


Go forth into the dessert. Seek out what moisture and rodentia might be found for sustenance. Commune alone with your god. Mark the cycles of the moon. When a score of years has passed, return to me.
Below viewing threshold (view)
blatham
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:51 am
From the WSJ Washington Wire...

Quote:
October 15, 2008, 10:16 pm
McCain Links Ayers and Acorn
T.W. Farnam reports on the presidential debate.

John McCain’s campaign and the Republican Party have been asking a lot of questions about the voter registration drive being run by the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (Acorn) and Barack Obama’s ties to Bill Ayers, a founder of the 1960s violent protest group Weather Underground.

In tonight’s debate, McCain sought to connect the dots: “While you were on the board of the Woods Foundation, you and Mr. Ayers together, you sent $230,000 to Acorn,” McCain said.

As the debate was going on, the McCain campaign emailed to reporters a number of news articles and other background materials on Obama’s relationship to both Acorn and Ayers, including a list of grants from the Woods Foundation, an education charity, to Acorn, which is best known as a community housing organization. The amounts, from 2000 to 2002, totaled $190,000, according to the campaign, which cited the Illinois Funding Service , a subscription Web site.
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/10/15/mccain-links-ayers-and-acorn/
cjhsa
 
  -3  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:56 am
@blatham,
ACORN is Hiring Convicted Felons as Registration Deputies
By ParaTed2k On 10/2/2008 9:50:39 AM In General Politics 9 Comments
Completely against Wisconsin Election Law, the criminal "grassroots" group ACORN has been hiring convicted felons and deputizing them as registrars for elections.

These "voter registration drives" need to be banned completely. Wisconsin has same day registrations, so there is absolutely no reason for them. Furthermore, criminal groups like ACORN and The New Voters Project should not be able to "deputize" anyone as registrars.

These groups pay people per registration. If a voter registration comes from a deputy registrar, the precincts aren't required to verify the information unless a discrepancy is found.

ACORN and New Voters Project claim that they are helping, but what they are doing is helping perpetuate the voter fraud that they rely on to get Democrats elected in Wisconsin.

Of course, they aren't just in Wisconsin. Obama himself was a big wig in ACORN Illinois. He is neck deep in the stink of these criminal groups.
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 06:58 am
@cjhsa,
I knew you were gay.
McGentrix
 
  0  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 07:05 am
@Bi-Polar Bear,
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:

I knew you were gay.


This is not a pick up website. I am sure you can find what you need elsewhere.
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 07:05 am
@cjhsa,
In an op-ed posted Tues. Oct. 14th, titled "Obama and Acorn," the Wall Street Journal's editorial board attempted to link Barack Obama to the activist group ACORN, and by association to recent false allegations that ACORN engaged in deliberate voter fraud.

Of course the WSJ editors offered only the slimmest evidence to link Obama to the group beyond the word "like." ACORN is "like Barack Obama" stated the Wall Street Journal editors in what appears to be the biggest stretch of intelligence and logic since the paper's editors opined that the deregulation of banking was a splendid idea.

The WSJ editorial board refused to remind its readers of John McCain's own links to ACORN. In 2006, McCain spoke at an immigrants' rights rally co-sponsored by ACORN in which he stated that groups like ACORN "make America special."

Of course, if McCain has to explain why he spoke at an ACORN-sponsored event, he is forced into the unenviable position of explaining to his right-wing base why he attended an immigrants' rights rally. At that point, he would be mired in the sticky situation of needing to address again why he co-authored a 2006 bill with Sen. Ted Kennedy (D-Mass.) that provided comprehensive immigration reform, but now, just two years later, wouldn't vote for a bill he helped write. (See the video here)

To help McCain rethink his new-found dislike for ACORN, in a press statement released Oct. 13th, the group's chief organizer, Bertha Lewis, responded to McCain campaign criticisms of her group, saying, "It has deeply saddened us to see Senator McCain abandon his historic support for ACORN and our efforts to support the goals of low-income Americans."

So it's best that the Wall Street Journal just not bring all that up.

Using what appears to be a McCain campaign memo verbatim, the WSJ editorial instead proceeded to run down the now-conventional list of past accusations lobbed at ACORN, most of which appear to be the work of a few individuals, not the organization itself. But the editorial then went on to emphasize the latest allegations. For example, the editorial cited claims made by Michigan Secretary of State Terri Lynn Land that the organization turned in fraudulent voter registration forms earlier this year.

What the Wall Street Journal op-ed failed to tell its readers is that Terri Lynn Land is a partisan Republican who co-chaired the Bush-Cheney campaign in 2004. Further, WSJ editors ignored the fact that her recent accusations just so happened to have coincided with news accounts quoting Michigan Republican Party officials saying they would use a foreclosure list obtained from a McCain campaign donor to challenge minority voters in Democratic precincts on election day.

The Wall Street Journal also ignored the fact that Terri Lynn Land's partisan interference in the election has gone so far as to liberally interpret a Michigan state law, giving Republican Party operatives and lawyers increased power to arbitrarily challenge voters at the polls on election day.

The Wall Street Journal's editors refused to report that the ACLU just won a lawsuit against Terri Lynn Land forcing her to stop a massive voter purge of tens of thousands of voters in violation of federal voting rights laws. After the federal judge's decision ordering Land to stop the voter purges was handed down this week, ACLU staff counsel Meredith Bell-Platts told reporters, "As a result of the judge’s decision, fewer Michigan voters will be illegally purged and wrongly disfranchised " and that’s good for everyone."

Terri Lynn Land's status as a non-partisan enforcer of voting rights is as highly suspect as the WSJ editorial board's pretense at a non-biased view of this whole affair.

On a related matter, the ACLU also happened to include Terri Lynn Land's voter purge actions as an example of serious problems in the national voting process in a recent report demanding that the Department of Justice (DOJ) abide by its civil rights mandate to protect voters' rights.

Deborah Vagins, an ACLU spokesperson, expressed the civil liberties group's strong concerns about the DOJ's refusal to take this mandate seriously. "Unfortunately, recent revelations of partisan bias in the decision-making in [the voting section of DOJ] have seriously undermined voting rights enforcement and have bred a lack of confidence and trust," Vagins said.

While the Wall Street Journal editorial board's high-minded call for DOJ investigations seems worthy, it is simply a demand that the Bush administration expand its already excessive partisan interference to try to help McCain win the election by creating a scandal where none exists and by forcing voters who are legitimately registered off of the rolls.

See McCain speaking at a 2006 ACORN event on immigration here:
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  0  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 07:07 am
@McGentrix,
If it were a pick up website...and i were gay.... I wouldn't be giving a glance to a couple of LL Bean backwoods motherfuckers who smell like deer piss...
0 Replies
 
Eorl
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 07:13 am
@cjhsa,
cjhsa wrote:

O-boy didn't win that debate. You'd have to be braindead to think that.



That's right. The vast majority of people are so wrong to that he did.

cjhsa
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 16 Oct, 2008 07:17 am
@Eorl,
We have a majority of brain dead chimps.
 

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