The Final Debate! No More! This Is IT! Last one!!

@nimh,

Oh, come on. The cost to renew a driver license was about $17.00, in New Mexico. State issued ID about the same. And if that is a poll tax, it's also an employment tax. To be hired in the US, you are going to have to produce proof of right to work (Social Security, US passport, etc). You will also be required to produce photo ID, usually driver license, state issued ID, or US Passport. You are not going to be able to call this a poll tax. You might as well call it a tax on check cashing ability, as no banks are cashing even small checks without identification.

Now, you can maybe dream up someone in a situation where they don't work, don't cash checks, don't drive, and are still eligible to vote. It will be a stretch.

2 Replies

@okie,

okie wrote:

Bogus accusations? They have been proven to have involved in fraudulant activity before, Diest, and they are currently being investigated for widespread fraud by the FBI. I happen to think fraudulant registration of voters is a big deal, when it is knowing and intentional, and the people should be thrown in the slammer. I happen to think the integrity of the ballot box should be almost sacred. The fact that you don't doesn't earn a very high opinion of your position here in my view.

Yes Bogus.

It's one thing to say that the FBI is involved in an investigation, it's another thing to claim a widespread democrat conspiracy. ACORN has been cooperating with the investigation. If should the acts of the few damn the many? If they discover any individuals who committed fraud, damn straight they should be prosecuted. I've said nothing to the contrary.

I'll repeat: Keep your bogus accusations in the rubber room.

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@Diest TKO,

Yeah sure, Diest, you are so convincing that your are serious.

Keep your bogus defense of criminals to yourself, Diest.

1 Reply

@cjhsa,

cjhsa - You obviously don't like Obama, but to deny he is in the lead clearly only labels you as a fool. As for he rest of your non-sense, it's your's to choke on.

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@nimh,

nimh wrote:

realjohnboy wrote:

To answer your question, Nimh, in many states (like Virginia) it is easy to get a photo ID from the Division of Motor Vehicles. No car required. The DMV just happens to be the agency equipped to do it. Is it free? No. And that I guess is the rub. I have no problem with a voter having to prove who they say they are when they show up at the poll. I do have a problem with them having to pay to prove it.

OK - and yep, I'm with you then. That'd be kind of like a poll tax like they tried to impose in Britain in the eighties.

What an apologist for helplessness, pathetic, nimh. Poor helpless people, its too much to ask us to prove we are legal voters. boo hoo boo hoo boo hoo, cry me some tears for total absolute and pathetic helplessness, nimh. Besides, why do you care? You don't even live here.

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Yeah sure, Diest, you are so convincing that your are serious.

Keep your bogus defense of criminals to yourself, Diest.

Who exactly is it that you THINK I'm defending? All I'm saying is that a one corrupt cop doesn't mean the police force is corrupt and and an investigation on a cop definitely doesn't mean that a police force is corrupt.

You can extrapolate all you like. I'm just saying that your broad accusations have zero merit.

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@FreeDuck,

That implies he hasn't already?

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@Diest TKO,

Its not one corrupt cop situation. It is like a police force infested with corrupt cops, with a police chief that creates rules that encourage corruption while on the beat, that turn a blind eye to it. It is a culture of corruption, there is not much doubt about it for most of us, but you don't want to acknowledge it because it benefits your candidate.

And Obama is apparently lying about his past activities with ACORN, one example was blatant in the last debate. I hate to use the word, lie, but that is what it appears to be. And need I point out that if ACORN is so innocent and benign, why not brag about his work with them, instead of running as fast as possible in the other direction, and trying to erase the record?

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Its not one corrupt cop situation. It is like a police force infested with corrupt cops, with a police chief that creates rules that encourage corruption while on the beat, that turn a blind eye to it. It is a culture of corruption, there is not much doubt about it for most of us, but you don't want to acknowledge it because it benefits your candidate.

Because okie says so. Got it.

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@Diest TKO,

No, because its a fact. And if ACORN is so wonderful, why is Obama trying to disavow everything he did for them? Your entire position is shot full of holes and contradictions, Diest, face it.

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@Diest TKO,

I see that the right here is still drinking the Sean Hannity/Rush Limbaugh Kool-Aid. This is what McFlailin has left for the typical supporters. The fringe.

ACORN has been in operation for years and every election year, the right makes the same asinine claims. One thing wrong with this country is that we have enough problems trying to get people to vote once. There has only been a handful of actual cases of "voter fraud."

The Obama campaign is asking the Justice Department to look into what appears to be the Bush administration and the McCain campaign to suppress the vote by ginning up this phony ACORN smear.

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@Diest TKO,

Diest, you are toast. When Nicole defends your position, thats a very bad sign for the veracity of your opinion.

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@okie,

okie wrote:

No, because its a fact. And if ACORN is so wonderful, why is Obama trying to disavow everything he did for them? Your entire position is shot full of holes and contradictions, Diest, face it.

The only fact is there is an investigation. Your conclusions are not a part of it, so bugger off.

And other users are free to comment/agree/disagree as they please. It means nothing to me. I'm sure you would not have much fun defending the likes of cjhsa. I defend my words alone.

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1 Reply

@roger,

Quote:

Oh, come on. The cost to renew a driver license was about $17.00, in New Mexico. State issued ID about the same. And if that is a poll tax, it's also an employment tax. To be hired in the US, you are going to have to produce proof of right to work (Social Security, US passport, etc). You will also be required to produce photo ID, usually driver license, state issued ID, or US Passport. You are not going to be able to call this a poll tax. You might as well call it a tax on check cashing ability, as no banks are cashing even small checks without identification.

Now, you can maybe dream up someone in a situation where they don't work, don't cash checks, don't drive, and are still eligible to vote. It will be a stretch.

I volunteer to work with the homeless and I see thousands of people who don't have IDs. In fact, this is one of the services we provide. Do the homeless and destitute, and the unemployed not have a right to vote?

In the minds of the Republican pieces of **** who have been winning elections by suppressing the vote for years, they don't have the right to vote because 90% of these people vote for Democrats!

I guess Roger has never heard of check-cashing stores either and how they operate and, yes, it is possible to cash checks without an ID. Hundreds of people have what is known as payees.

Roger, you don't have a clue what you are talking about.

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@Diest TKO,

okie wrote:

]No, because its a fact. And if ACORN is so wonderful, why is Obama trying to disavow everything he did for them? Your entire position is shot full of holes and contradictions, Diest, face it.

Obama is not disavowing his role with ACORN, he explained what his role was. Start listening and stop drinking the kool-aid.

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@DrewDad,

DrewDad wrote:

A picture ID is not required in Texas.

We are required to have registered by a deadline.

Not only are we not required to have a photo ID, we don't have to pre-register either, and if I vouch for you; you don't need anything at all.

Nimh:Roger's right about ID. $28 bucks, once every 8 years and you can't really do dick without one. No bank, no work, no air travel, no nothing. There has to be virtually no one who doesn't have one already. A Poll-Tax it is not (regardless of what Roxanne's latest bogus persona is babbling about.)

Blatham; I am a reasonable guy... but I only made it through your first article completely. I can easily accept that Republicans would like to disrupt poor people, immigrants and minorities... for the exact same reason the democrats don't wish to trouble them with any hoops whatsoever (they tend to vote democratic.)
A. They're going to do that anyway.
B. I don't care if that does net more voluntary disenfranchisement. Concerns over people choosing not to vote for any reason are trumped by concerns over ineligible voting.
C. Few convictions Not Equal

few offenses. Example: John asks his neighbor Joe, "you voting?" Joe says "F*ck that. It don't help." An hour later John vouches for his neighbor Joe (who's really Jack, from another district.) Who will ever be the wiser?
D. Concerned about the cost of the occasional eligible homeless dude with no ID? Include in the bill that indigents can have ID for free (to be charged against their next State Tax Return.) (Probably not a bad idea as a stand alone bill anyway, really.)

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@roger,

roger wrote:

Oh, come on. The cost to renew a driver license was about $17.00, in New Mexico. State issued ID about the same.

Right. Requiring people to spend $17 on something before they can vote sounds like a poll tax (or in this case, a poll charge) to me.

roger wrote:

Now, you can maybe dream up someone in a situation where they don't work, don't cash checks, don't drive, and are still eligible to vote. It will be a stretch.

Well I could Google it again, but I read often enough that a large number of Americans dont have a photo ID. So it doesnt seem to be as outlandish or rare a scenario as you make it out to be.

1 Reply

@okie,

Wow, some of you people are really losing it now. I hope you regain some of your dignity once these elections are over. This is ridiculous.

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@okie,

okie wrote:

No, because its a fact. And if ACORN is so wonderful

And if ACORN was plagued by a culture of corruption, as you assert in the face of a lack of any kind of number of criminal cases that would warrant the assertion, why was John McCain keynoting for them and praising their work just a few years ago?

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@OCCOM BILL,

OCCOM BILL wrote:

C. Few convictions few offenses. Example: John asks his neighbor Joe, "you voting?" Joe says "F*ck that. It don't help." An hour later John vouches for his neighbor Joe (who's really Jack, from another district.) Who will ever be the wiser?

Well its true that few convictions isnt foolproof evidence that there were few offenses in the first place - sure, it's possible that hundreds or thousands of cases were perpetrated by people who were just each and every one smart enough to escape detection. That's as irrefutable as it is unprovable.

But, yeah - without any actual cases that were brought to light, brought to court, to show that such voter fraud is indeed as endemic in the state as you say it is, what are you going on exactly? Do you know anyone who did it? Historical reputation? Lore? Hearsay? "Everybody knows it's true"?

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