For The First Time In My Adult Life I'm Not Voting

this isn't a party slick, and any smidgen of pity I might feel would be for my fellow citizens and what's to come for them.....but I don't believe in pity ...either receiving or giving.

on this we are in perfect agreement.

fa shizzle =for sure

ma nizzle = my negro. (PC version)

Why would you need to "like and trust" him? Likeable persons dont go into politics, or at least, dont make it very far. Not generally. That's kind of a given.

But so what? I dont vote for a politician because he's a swell guy. I vote for him because I agree more with him than with the other guy. {shrugs}

If you think McCain/Palin will be a disaster and Obama/Biden will just be kinda bleh, then there's a big difference there, isnt there? One's still better than the other.

I mean, Bear. You liked Hillary for her health care plan. Well, Obama's a lot more like hers than McCain's. You dont like the way Bush pushed all of you into the war. Well, McCain was there for it all the way; Obama wasnt. You didnt like the way Bush gave massive tax cuts to the richest 1%, while the regular American lost purchasing power. Well, McCain wants tax cuts that are directed even more just at the very wealthiest, while Obama's tax cuts are all for those on regular or lower income. Like Hillary, Obama wants to protect women's right to choose; McCain/Palin are the most rightwing couple on abortion in modern history.

Whether you like Obama or not, he agrees with Hillary on 90% of the issues. McCain agrees with maybe 10%. You already indicate yourself that there is a difference between the two tickets. It's the difference between Democrats and Republicans. You spend lots of time here on a bloody internet forum opposing the Republicans; why wouldnt you pop down to the voting station in November to do the same?

Voting for someone doesnt need to express one's undying devotion to him. It just means you agree more with his positions than with the other guy's. Thats all that's needed.

Finally, I think it was Engineer who made a good point: the elections arent only about the President. There's all kinds of people on the ballot. Local people too, local issues in your community. You've got lots of opinions here on the board - why not express them on the ballot too?

PS the "what are you gonna do, harden my water" line had me LOL..

I'll give you that it's not necessary to like him.... I do need to trust him. I don't. I think his intentions are good....but he's in over his head....which I've said all along. I believe I'm right. He won the nomination through the efforts of many who wanted to attach themselves to the flavor of the week. Now Palin is the flavor of the week. That's the problem with the entire flavor of the week program....unless you're selling ice cream and TOP 40. Just my opinion.

Your not voting works for me.

good. subject closed.

I have a theory, Bear. I think you have lost faith that he can win and you don't want to vote for a loser again (did you vote for Kerry?). To that I would say, just wait and see. He has shown that he has good judgment, maybe most strikingly in his choice for VP.

Who is the He you speak of?

I voted for Kerry, with no faith he'd win. Your theory is incorrect. Much love for ya though.

Well, thought I'd give it a try.

I don't mean to push you, I just remember a time when I thought there was truly no difference between the parties and their candidates. I gave my vote to Harry Brown. Bush became president. It took me two years to figure out that there was indeed a difference. I know we don't see these candidates the same way, but just keep in mind what is at stake.

I don't think Obama's choice of VP is that striking--solid, maybe, but not all that spectacular. Reality is, at this point, Obama is in a corner. He was so intent on beating Hillary Clinton that he summarily dimissed her, for the sake of the victory in the primary. I think this shows his general greeness. Sure, he's focused and disciplined, but he hasn't done much to build on his initial "wowness."

OK, but do you think he'll make less of a mess than John McCain and Sarah Palin?

I mean, if I get what you're saying right, you have

- on the one hand a guy who has good intentions to do things you agree with, but wont be competent enough to achieve 'em;
- on the other hand a couple that will actively work to achieve things you think are wrong.

Still sounds like a pretty big difference... worth going out to vote for that one day.

I mean, compare the time you have spent arguing with conservatives here on a2k - that involved much more time, and really achieves zilch. Consider voting for the Dems just the equivalent of telling H2O Man, Cjhsa, Finn, alla those people - "here, I dont agree with you, and just did my bit to stop you from getting your way".

I disagree. I think if he just wanted to win, picking Hillary would have made it a sure thing. That ticket would have been unbeatable by sheer numbers. But I think he was interested in governing, and there are some fundamental incompatibilities between his operation and hers. Biden was a great choice in terms of governing and it showed that he has good judgment, IMO, and that he was trying to do more than win.

re Hillary he allowed his ego to get in the way IMO.

Tell me you wouldn't tap it... hell bear... you'd tap the boat exhaust in the background...

I think Obama may be interested in governing as you've said, but there's way more to it than that:

My hesitation about Obama is he's been in the Senate for 3?, 4? years and half of that time he's been running for president.

Who does he think he is? president? I mean, the guy gave a speech in Germany (he wanted it at the Berlin Wall and they nixed it)with a fake presidential seal on the podium. There, he gave a semi-shallow speech at the Brandenberg Gates, which was supposed to sound soaring and lofty in the tradition of Kennedy and R. Reagan.

Then, he holds his acceptance speech in a football stadium and opts for fireworks-- holy cow. All the while he's claiming the election isn't "about me, it's about you."

McCain has latched onto this with venom and can outdo him on the loyalty and service issue-- especially now since he made his pentacostal pick for VP. I hope I'm wrong, but in my opinion, the Democrats are screwed.

she doesn't do it for me.....at all..... on any level.....

I bet you're more into the Cindy Sheehan type.

Cindy Sheehan is palin with 10 more years on her....