FINAL COUNTDOWN FOR USA ELECTION 2008

Foxfyre wrote:

Yesterday or the day before he was kibitzing about the criticisms of his "spread the wealth' plan equating it with him being criticized because he shared his toys with a friend or his lunch at school with somebody who forgot his. The thing he (and apparently his worshipers) continue to miss is that his illustrations are of voluntary charity. That is much different than the school or school board demanding that he give up his toys and/or his lunch just because they thought somebody else needed them more.

If you're so against sharing, why did you take my tax dollars for your new furnace, Foxfyre? I want my money back!!!!

Who are ALL these worthless people whom you claim that Obama is going to give YOUR toys to? Is it the veteran from the war in Iraq who lost both his legs in an explosion? Is it the baby who was abandoned at the local hospital emergency room? Is it the old man who doesn't know who he is anymore because of Alzheimers Disease? Who are the worthless bums who are taking your tax dollars? Identify them or quit your whining.

Meanwhile the guy still producing out there is less and less inclined to produce what he can't keep.

Debra Law wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:

Yesterday or the day before he was kibitzing about the criticisms of his "spread the wealth' plan equating it with him being criticized because he shared his toys with a friend or his lunch at school with somebody who forgot his. The thing he (and apparently his worshipers) continue to miss is that his illustrations are of voluntary charity. That is much different than the school or school board demanding that he give up his toys and/or his lunch just because they thought somebody else needed them more.

If you're so against sharing, why did you take my tax dollars for your new furnace, Foxfyre? I want my money back!!!!

Who are ALL these worthless people whom you claim that Obama is going to give YOUR toys to? Is it the veteran from the war in Iraq who lost both his legs in an explosion? Is it the baby who was abandoned at the local hospital emergency room? Is it the old man who doesn't know who he is anymore because of Alzheimers Disease? Who are the worthless bums who are taking your tax dollars? Identify them or quit your whining.

I took the tax rebate for my new furnace because it was there. I would have bought the new furnace if it hadn't been there--it wasn't enough to make or break the deal--but it was nice to be able to deduct that little bit from my taxes. I would have preferred that the government just not have collected those taxes in the first place and I could have made a little on interest or capital gains on it, but no big deal for that little amount. My rebate included the taxes I had contributed as much as it included taxes you contributed.

But you see, you could also have claimed the rebate if you bought a new furnace and so could that really struggling family just starting and so could Warren Buffett or any of the rest of the folks out there. The rebate was nondiscriminatory and uniform across the board. Go energy efficient and you get a rebate no matter how much or how little you make. That isn't socialism. That's government meddling but we'll call it incentive.

That is very much different from the government taking your tax dollars and giving them to me because I'm 'needier' and you are entitled to nothing.

I didn't use the word 'worthless' to describe anybody. Is that how you view people? Worthless? Why would you use such a word to describe people you don't even know?

It doesn't matter WHO gets the money, though. It is the principle. Whomever gets the money will be quite happy to have it and will probably praise the benefactor(s) who will be the goverment official who gave it. But there will be little or no praise for the guy or gal who actually went to work and by their labor, risk, investment, ingenuity, etc. earned/produced it.

And that's how the system begins to become corrupt. Elected leaders learn very quickly how to use taxpayer money to buy the votes of the people. The people hardly notice how they then begin to become more and more subservient to the government until they believe they can no longer survive without it. And at that point, they have lost their freedom. Meanwhile the guy still producing out there is less and less inclined to produce what he can't keep.

The results of that are obvious to the educated. And will keep for an additional scenario another time.

That is most likely because you live in a Conservative area of a hick state, Okie. You have no real objectivity, just an extremely partisan lens from which everything is tinted. Not cool.

Cycloptichorn

Cycloptichorn wrote:

That is most likely because you live in a Conservative area of a hick state, Okie. You have no real objectivity, just an extremely partisan lens from which everything is tinted. Not cool.

Cycloptichorn

I will take an honest hick anyday over a polished liar.

Let me sort of describe my overall policy.

What I've said is that we would put a cap and trade system in place that is as aggressive, if not more aggressive, than anybody else's out there.

I was the first to call for a 100% auction on the cap and trade system, which means that every unit of carbon or greenhouse gases emitted would be charged to the polluter. That will create a market in which whatever technologies are out there that are being presented, whatever power plants that are being built, that they would have to meet the rigors of that market and the ratcheted down caps that are being placed, imposed every year.

So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can; it's just that it will bankrupt them because they're going to be charged a huge sum for all that greenhouse gas that's being emitted.

That will also generate billions of dollars that we can invest in solar, wind, biodiesel and other alternative energy approaches.

The only thing I've said with respect to coal, I haven't been some coal booster. What I have said is that for us to take coal off the table as a (sic) ideological matter as opposed to saying if technology allows us to use coal in a clean way, we should pursue it.

So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can.

It's just that it will bankrupt them.

Coal official calls Obama comments 'unbelievable'
11/2/2008 4:37 PM
By Chris Dickerson -Statehouse Bureau

CHARLESTON - At least one state coal industry leader said he was shocked by comments Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama made earlier this year concerning his plan to aggressively charge polluters for carbon and greenhouse gas emissions.

(more. . . .)
http://www.wvrecord.com/news/215679-coal-official-calls-obama-comments-unbelievable

Just accept idiocy, is that it, cyclops?

Foxfyre, interesting, and I imagine he would like his new national security force to learn a new anthem. The national security force that he wants to fund every bit as much as the military!

Heres a quote:
"We cannot continue to rely on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set. We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded."

Can you imagine a bunch of "brown shirts" or whatever he will call them, of his friends and admirers to knock on your door, Foxfyre?

okie wrote:

Foxfyre, interesting, and I imagine he would like his new national security force to learn a new anthem. The national security force that he wants to fund every bit as much as the military!

Heres a quote:
"We cannot continue to rely on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set. We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded."

Can you imagine a bunch of "brown shirts" or whatever he will call them, of his friends and admirers to knock on your door, Foxfyre?

I hadn't actually thought of it in that respect, but yeah, I can imagine it. Not a pleasant prospect is it?

okie wrote:

Just accept idiocy, is that it, cyclops?

We tolerate you, don't we?

I don't want to hear a word about 'idiocy' from the party that ran the country horribly for the last 8 years, Okie. Your party had their chance and blew it. It's the other team's turn now. Get used to it or you are going to be mighty unhappy for the next 4 to 8 years.

Cycloptichorn