The UN, US and Iraq IV

The War of 1812 came to us -- seems they burned down the Capitol building.

The Spanish American war is turning out to be a sham as the Maine was unlikely sunk by an enemy torpedo.

The Mexican/American war -- not particularly honorable, in fact nearly as silly a war as one could imagine.

I believe mamajuana set caution to the wind in the statement but 9/11 still remains what it is -- a horrendous breakdown of our intelligence and security due to a very foolish self-assurance that "they would never do that" which even goes over the line into an incomprehensible denial.

In order to be sucker punched, you have to be a sucker.

The administration seems to be following the Soviet model, which relied on continuous revolution across the planet to justify erosion and eventual removal of civil rights at home. Enough people in the US can be counted on to cheer when they see things explode on their TV sets,and who will equate foreign war with action films that this administration seems to feel little to no fear at running roughshod over the principles of democracy. If one reads records from late 1930s and early 1940s Germany, one finds similar declarations of national pride in military victories that one hears from the American populace today.

Sofia, War didn't come to us; terrorism came to us, but it's not the first nor the last. Many terrorist acts were executed by Americans against Americans. That's not 'war,' it's terrorism. .

That's it, Hobit.

CI -- You're right. We responded to terrorism with war -- not an intelligent move (to put it mildly!).

Blaming everyone in sight for the work of a few Saudi religious fanatics is rather stretching it. Why didn't we go after all the domestic organizations that spawned a Timony McVeigh? What is the real difference? Got to be careful -- we don't want to let the rest of the world know it's really revenge. Osama has made more videos than Sting -- what's up with a "War on Terrorism" that looses sight of who the enemy is?

Because it isn't a war on terrorism, y'old Wizard (but you know that?)!!

We did prosecute a 'war' on the KKK, it's funding and operations, and McVeigh burned.

911 was a declaration of war to me, and to most Americans. Terrorism is an act of assymetrical war.

Sofia, In prosecuting the war with the KKK, we didn't kill over 3000 innocent people to get at the enemy. Same case with McVeigh. You go after the perpetrators of the terrorism, not kill whole villages of innocent men, women, and children.

There is a certain mindset, and the US is not the sole owner, that sees military might as the only solution to society's problems,and will always applaud military action, regardless. The administration has played into this mindset.

so it seems, so it seems - sadly. Just as long as it's not their family and friends, they're the 'enemy.'

c.i. said--

We didn't have to.

The Taliban made their decision to cloak al-Quaida. They had a choice.

I'm not signing on to every bomb that has dropped--but its more complicated and shaded than some of the pronouncements made here, IMO.

True. But, there are also many that hate war, look at the long-term and all options, and see that war--as horrible as it is--is a lesser evil than the undeterred situation.

It's more complicated and "shaded" than ole Rumsfeld can figure out. He's been remarkably quiet lately. It doesn't take a political genius to figure out that they are in trouble in Iraq and that the end may not justify the means. Attempt to rationalize it in as many different ways as you care -- that is called "spin" -- you're going to come out the other end with all the same unanswered questions. The war in Iraq was not a war on terrorism by the administrations's strategy of how such a war should be conducted. They haven't found any Al Quida terrorists being harbored in Iraq. Perhaps they thought that some of Timothy McVeigh's terrorist friends were being harbored there?

(They are still looking for more conspirators in the McVeigh tragedy).

Sofia's quote: "We didn't have to." Are you saying "we had to in Iraq?"

If you read the PNAC documents the choice to go into Iraq had been made at least as early as 1998.

gels, It won't be long before the 9.1 million people in this country out of jobs will begin to feel like that Iraqi. I wonder when the firestorm is going to begin? Job losses are increasing every month. 93,000 in August.

c.i.--
Didn't mean to ignore your earlier question. I almost brought back one of my many posts, describing why I believe we are in Iraq-- but, you've heard it before.

THIS, I thought, might be fodder for some interesting discussion. The new draft Resolution.

Here it is.

I am glad to see we're focused on pushing for elections. I'm surprised they've made this much progress so quickly.