0
   

The UN, US and Iraq IV

 
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Sep, 2003 09:50 pm
We saw earlier in this thread that the "Werwulfen" myth has made it to those the administration counts on to buy their fictions.
0 Replies
 
Gelisgesti
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Sep, 2003 10:11 pm
0 Replies
 
Kara
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 10:12 am
Awful emotions, beautifully expressed. Thanks, Doug.

Is there any chance that Rumsfeld is on his way out, influence-wise, if Powell pulls this off at the UN?
0 Replies
 
BillW
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 10:29 am
Not in my opinion - Rumps is the darkarchangel of the Bush Regime and the architect of all that is foul. He can't possibly go........
0 Replies
 
BillW
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 10:36 am
Quote:
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 11:06 am
"Bush to seek $60 billion for Iraq." That in addition to the one billion per week being spent for the Iraqi's. When does the American People get some of the benefits for their taxes? Bush has the chutzpah to take away veteran benefits, while spending billions on the Iraqi people. I just don't get it.
0 Replies
 
BillW
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 11:47 am
c.i., they are - anyway some. There are quite a few Halliburton, Bechtel and Carlyle Group higher ups (I'm sure there are others) that are doing very well on the public dole - Thank You Exclamation

There is a lot of Bushites hitting the media market professing the great economic upswing in the second quarter - take away the new military spending and you have a very sluggish 2nd quarter. And these are the same ones that profess Bush is doing it without new Government spending -lie, all military spending is new government spending, most not even appropriated. I wish I could give credit, think it is Kerry, that said new military spending explodes in other countries, new domestic spending builds electrical infrastructures. Go figure!!!!!!!!1
0 Replies
 
wolf
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 03:16 pm
...and to whose accounts are national defense payments going? I always get a cynical grin on my face when I see separatist third world militia groups parading their brandnew out-of-the-box uniforms... made in the USA.

That industry is the deadly vicious circle Eisenhower warned us about. Make war for profit. Use profit for war. It's endless...
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 06:24 pm
A friend sent this to me today. I like it so much, I'm sharing with you.
______________________________
"It has become clear that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Wolfowitz are the physical manifestations of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. But this is only my opinion."
0 Replies
 
BillW
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 09:25 pm
That's really scary c.i., oh well, so is Revelations!
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 09:41 pm
But which one would be which? I prefer to think of them as the four other dwarves:
Smirky, Greedy, Bully, and Loony!
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Sep, 2003 09:50 pm
Take your pick; "Time, Famine, Pestilence, Death" correlates to all four of these bastards.
0 Replies
 
Gelisgesti
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 05:17 am
CI said ...........

A friend sent this to me today. I like it so much, I'm sharing with you.
______________________________
"It has become clear that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Wolfowitz are the physical manifestations of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. But this is only my opinion."



Shouldn't that be 'four horse's asses'?
0 Replies
 
Gelisgesti
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 06:06 am
I feel like an aphid, bouncing down a plant stem in the jaws of an ant, ready to be squeezed empty of the days accumulation of the sap that feeds both myself and my mindless courier ..... and I wonder .... is the trip up the stem, or down the stem, the reason for my existance?

Gelis



September 4, 2003
John McCain's Grim Vision
Waging a War that has Already been Lost

By ADAM FEDERMAN

why talk of beauty what could be more beaut-
iful than these heroic happy dead
who rushed like lions to the roaring slaughter
they did not stop to think they died instead
then shall the voice of liberty be mute?

e.e. cummings

The death tolls are rising on all sides. It's likely now that more American soldiers have died in post-victory Iraq than died during combat. The number of Iraqi civilians killed in the latest phase of what is a decades long war, according to iraqibodycount.net, is anywhere between six and eight thousand. But who's counting anyway.

Following the events of September 11 the New York Times carried a daily tabulation of the trade center body count. It also included pictures and brief, personal bios of those who tragically lost their lives. Iraqi civilians who, we are also told have died in the name of freedom and liberty, are unlikely even to receive a proper burial. At best, if their bodies are still intact, they?ll be left to rot in the desert sun.

That the United States is responsible for orchestrating such a massacre at the same time misleading millions of global citizens into believing that such a war is justified is a crime we have not yet begun to fathom.

John McCain writes in the Sunday Washington Post that, "a forced U.S. retreat from Iraq would be the most serious American defeat since Vietnam."

And he continues, "America's mission in Iraq is too important to fail. Given the stakes, we cannot launch this 'generational commitment' to changing the Middle East on the cheap. The administration should level with the American people about the cost and commitment required to transform Iraq."

It's a catch-22. America's mission in Iraq is too important to fail. It is by right (God-given) infallible. If it were to fail the fate of civilization itself would hang in the balance. Such a specter is unimaginable. So we continue to wage war, a war that has already been lost.

To retreat would be to acknowledge defeat. It would also mean recognizing the limits of unbridled military force as a centerpiece of U.S. foreign policy. What good is the worlds most powerful military machine when the cause of war, the reason for risking your life, is so convoluted and unclear that it becomes harder and harder to wake up in the morning and don your fatigues?

McCain makes a number of unruly assumptions in his column. He refers to the reordering of the Middle East as a ?generational commitment.? It's unclear which generation he's referring to (the greatest? Definitely not gen-x, given that we?re too distracted and unaware of what's going on to make an informed decision.) I don't know if the next generation, that is the one after gen-x has been named, but maybe that's the one McCain is referring to. If that's the case they?d probably thank us not now but in the future if we admitted defeat and opted for a different kind of relationship with the rest of the world.

But we can't have another Vietnam. So we must commit more troops, more dollars, and more resources in order to secure Iraq. We must fight harder, "we must win." This means being frank with the American people. Telling them the truth, acknowledging that things may be a little more difficult than previously imagined.

This means telling the families of active soldiers that their sons and fathers might not return. It means telling working families, students, and the retired that they'll have to cough up a bit more of their meager earnings in order to fund the liberation of Iraq.

It means calling up more reserves maybe even re-instituting the draft. Or as McCain puts it, "Americans must understand how important this mission is and be prepared to sacrifice to achieve it." In order to sacrifice however, what is at stake must be understood. Are Americans willing and ready to prostrate themselves before their commander in chief in order to achieve victory in Iraq? And what would victory bring?

There are farmers in India willing to ingest pesticides and take their own lives rather than succumb to the fate of agribusiness and what it might mean for a way of life that has been carried on for years and years. In Israel there are soldiers refusing to fight in the occupied territories because they understand the Israeli occupation as bankrupt and morally unacceptable, a policy that is not only morally wrong but one that threatens the very security of the state it claims to protect. In France the heroic Bove continues to defy the seemingly insurmountable corporate stranglehold.

And here in the United States?

No one has immolated themselves in front of the capital. No one has marched to the sea.

The so-called campaign season has already begun to overshadow the realities of war. One could say the meta-war has begun. The debate now is not about the actual war the one being waged every day in Iraq but rather about the merits of a war that is already over but that unfortunately has some unpleasant side effects.

As Americans debate the finer points of the latest round of medication and consider its discomforts (diarrhea, higher taxes, gulf war syndrome, more expensive gas, bloating ect.) the Iraqi people continue to wonder what liberation means.

Adam Federman can be reached at: [email protected]
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 06:26 am
A friend of mine in MI6 has handed me a transcript of a conversation that took place in the Oval office on Donald Rumsfeld's return from Iraq.

Bush. So how was it Rummy?
Rumsfeld. Well sir to put it bluntly the place is a **** hole.
B But an all American **** hole now eh?
R Not quite sir. Actually we are too thin on the ground. Saddam is still around somewhere, there are foreign insurgents and terrorists killing our boys, and its too hot.
B But you were the one who said we could do it at minimal cost.
R Its just the temperature sir, patrolling in full body armor is really taking its toll on our troops.
B Where are our meteorollical, I mean climate type people experts. Why weren't we told about hot weather in Iraq? We'll have to give them a break. Get more troops out there.
R You mean pay for more Americans?
B No we'll get the Brits to send some more. Get me Tony Blair.
B. Hi Tony, how ya doin?
Blair. Not too bad. Slight problem over the suicide of our chief weapons inspector, my defence secretary will probably have to resign, we have a massive budget shortfall, the Party is in open revolt...otherwise ok.
B. Good. Now can you send 10,000 fresh troops to Baghdad to give our boys a break? It's real hot there right now. I'd really appreciate that Tony.
Blair. Golly, thats a difficult one George. You know I'd love to help, but I'll have to get back to you on that one 'bye for now. God bless America.
Bush. Anyone else we can try?
Colin Powell. There's always er...(cough) Old Europe.
Bush Where the hell's that?
Powell. You know sir that bunch of ungrateful Europeans who wouldn't help out last time, you know like the French and Germans and Russians.
Bush. But didn't Condi Rice say I had to sort those countries out?
Powell. Thats right sir, punish the French, ignore the Germans, forgive the Russians.
Bush. ok well get me Putin
Bush Hi Volody baby how's things?...look do you think you could...
Putin Niet
Bush (to aid) What's he sayin? What sort of a word is n'yes?
Aid. Its Russian sir, Russian for No.
Bush. Look I know you Russkiis can't afford much these days, and I'm sorry about that pipeline contract, but you know how it is, a lot of our people still don't trust you guys, but hey your boys could go where is warm and sunny for a change and we would lend you uniforms and stuff. Hell you could even get to keep a Jeep or two.
Aid. Putin is replying in Russian sir
Bush So what's he saying?
Aid Couldn't make it all out, he was speaking so fast but he certainly said Niet a few times.
Bush ok Volody, dozy dahnya'll as we say in Texas
Putin Goodbye Mr President.
Bush Get me Gehardt Schroder
Aid. But Sir you are supposed to ignore the Germans
B. ok well that cheese eating surrender monkey in chief then.
Bush. Now listen up Jacques, the US takes a pretty dim view of your obstructifying what we are doin in I-raq. I've a good mind to start drinking again - and it won't be French wine - lets be clear about that.
Chirac. If you want to start another trade war with the EU I can arrange it.
Bush But we only want 20,000 troops!
Chirac. Non. It ees beneath the dignity of La France for thees conversation to continue.
Bush. But you'll think about it?
Chirac Non.
Bush Well that sure told him, he won't be doing that again in a hurry - get me that German fella.
Bush Hi Gehardt, long time eh?
Schroder. Who is that please?
Bush. Its me George. 43rd President of the USA.
S. Oh yah! I was knowing your father, also George if I remember. Those were the days ya? When we ver on ze same side so to speak?
Bush. Yes well I know its been a long time but I'm really after a favour here.
S. Ah yes, I know about this. You want me to send German troops to participate in your military adventure in Iraq no?
Bush so you'll help right?
Schroder. Right. Nein. Guten Nacht.
Aid. Its Tony Blair for you sir.
Bush Now what the hell does he want?
Aid. He doesn't want anything sir. He just asked me to tell you No, and that its 43 deg in Basra right now.
Bush. ****. Hey wait a minute, 43 is quite cold isn't it?
Aid. 43 Celsius is hot sir.
Bush. ****. Rummy, you and Dick got me into this mess. Now I'm depending on you to get me out.
Rumsfeld and Cheney. ****.
0 Replies
 
PDiddie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 08:28 am
If only it were funny.

Remember when Iraq had WMDs that threatened us? And then they had WMD programs which would kill us all in 45 minutes, via pilotless drone? Now, it appears that the real danger wasn't that Iraq had WMDs or that they had WMD programs it's that they sought to have WMD programs.

Quote:
"The issue I think has been the capability that Iraq sought to have ... WMD programs," Bolton said at the U.S. Embassy in Paris.


Saddam's Scientists Justified War

Even you republicans would agree that this nation, and its people, deserve more truth from its leaders than this.

A daily, near-constant revision of the rationalizations for this war.

Completely despicable.
0 Replies
 
hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 08:35 am
Careful, PD. you are being unamerican, and that great paragon of democracy , John Ascroft, will knock on your door. Rolling Eyes
Did you see Wolfy's comments in CNN this morning?More angst in Iraq
Quote:
Wolfowitz acknowledged that "any plan has got to adjust to the reality as you find it on the ground," but he also disputed any notion that the Bush administration has resisted international help.

"We're unified as an administration on this," Wolfowitz told reporters on Capitol Hill. "We're unified within the Defense Department. We all understand the enormous value of expanding this coalition."

Seeking a new U.N. resolution, he said, "didn't sort of emerge out of nowhere a few days ago."

"It's been on our agenda ever since the fall of Baghdad," Wolfowitz said.

He described last month's deadly bombing of the U.N. headquarters in Baghdad as a "breakthrough, a sad one" -- in bringing the international community aboard.

"The bombing of the U.N. headquarters, I think, changed the atmosphere in New York and it looks like we can move forward in that area," he said.

"Things change. You exploit opportunities, you deal with surprises."


Yup...a bombing isn't a sad event, its an opportunity. What a group of vultures!
0 Replies
 
Tartarin
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 08:37 am
What we finally need, PDiddie, is for the administration's supporters to recognize this and laugh along with the rest of us. Laugh and then do something about it. It's the absence of recognition on the part of admin supporters that has made me (for one) lose respect for them, no matter how well-made their arguments may seem.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 11:27 am
These sick bastards are rewriting human history that'll live in infamy.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Sep, 2003 11:53 am
I must confess the sight of a chastened and penitent Bush going cap in hand to the French and the Germans asking for forgiveness and troops, is one of the more startling images of the late summer.
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.12 seconds on 12/25/2024 at 12:44:28