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I'm going To Switch My Support To John Edwards

 
 
nappyheadedhohoho
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jan, 2008 07:02 pm
old europe wrote:
And again, you've avoided to say what it is that you don't like about the American system. Possibly (and this is just a guess) because you don't really know that much about the American system. Possibly because you don't want to educate yourself about the American system.


Good guesses. Personally (and this is just a guess), I bet it has more to do with the Bureau of US Immigration and their great big old REJECT stamp LOL.

(Amazing when you realize we're not all that picky, either) Smile
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jan, 2008 07:16 pm
I am active in politics .
I am a member of Die Linke( a congenial confederation of communist ideas with Gandhi's values withouit corporate controlled compassionate conservative co-operation)
I am glad about my poolitics beside my personal life.
The Left is my heart and Gandhi is my MLK or xyz.

I follow your country's election with rapt attention.

I am unable to know why I waste my energy and time.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jan, 2008 08:34 pm
Ramafuchs wrote:
I am active in politics .
I am a member of Die Linke( a congenial confederation of communist ideas with Gandhi's values withouit corporate controlled compassionate conservative co-operation)
I am glad about my poolitics beside my personal life.
The Left is my heart and Gandhi is my MLK or xyz.

I follow your country's election with rapt attention.

I am unable to know why I waste my energy and time.


OK, fine, but it would still be nice to hear an answer from you to Old Europe's question:

old europe wrote:
What exactly is it that you have a problem with? In a few words? And please, don't tell us that "Americans are couch potatoes who are unwilling to cross the street." Tell us something specific. What do you not like about the way the American system works?

Something specific. Anything specific. Something concrete.

Not broad-sweeping sloganesque generalisations like "corporate controlled compassionate conservative co-operation". Less alliteration, more detail, bitte.

You are very insistent that the US system is messed up. I agree in general, and nevertheless I dont understand what you are trying to say four out of five times. It is not because your English isnt good enough - it's fine. It's because you dont ever get specific. Why don't you list a couple of concrete measures that you would take, as President or Congressman or the like, to improve US politics?
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jan, 2008 08:38 pm
A quality, critical evaluation of the Edwards campaign and why it failed - from the perspective of Edwards sympathisers themselves:

Quote:
Whither Edwards Supporters?

American Prospect

It's easy to imagine who the typical John Edwards voter is -- or was. A union member, perhaps working in a manufacturing industry where layoffs are a real threat. Or maybe a small farmer, frustrated by federal government policies that favor agribusiness.

After all, Edwards is a populist candidate who led the Democratic pack with progressive proposals on issues like health care and poverty. He spent four years wooing unions and lamenting corporate America's influence on politics. Edwards even controversially promised that as president, he'd take away Congress' health insurance if it didn't guarantee the American people the same level of coverage. And he spoke constantly about his Southern roots and commitment to rural communities.

But in actuality, it's been difficult throughout this primary to point to any particular demographic that has glommed on to Edwards' message. Indeed, his support has often come from unexpected places. In Iowa, the first and last state where Edwards made a real play to win, his supporters skewed upper-income and were more likely to call themselves "conservative" than were supporters of Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton. Although he consistently spoke about the importance of organized labor, Edwards came in third place among union members, despite the United Steelworkers and SEIU endorsing him in the state. (The American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees endorsed Clinton and advertised on her behalf in Iowa.) And he performed better in suburban areas than in rural ones.

In the five-day campaigning blitz between the Iowa caucus and the New Hampshire primary, many voters who liked Edwards seemed to conclude that he was no longer a viable candidate. Less than half of New Hampshire voters who had a "strongly favorable" opinion of Edwards actually cast their ballots for him, compared to 81 percent and 66 percent of those who felt the same way about Clinton and Obama. As he had in Iowa, Edwards did well among voters who were looking for the candidate who "cares about people," perhaps because of a stump speech that told the stories of regular folk affected by job layoffs and cost-cutting health insurers. But Edwards once again seemed to appeal very much to voters who stood to the right of all three front-running Democrats; white men who oppose the withdrawal of troops from Iraq identified with Edwards less because of his stance on issues than because of a cultural affinity for the Southern white male in the race.

When the contest rolled on to Nevada, a more diverse state, Edwards' support hit an astonishing low of 4 percent. And while he finished in a more respectable third place in South Carolina, with 18 percent of the vote, Edwards won only 2 percent of African American voters, who made up over half of the Democratic electorate in the state.

As the mainstream media continues to push Edwards to the sidelines of their coverage, the progressive blogosphere seems like the one place where true Edwards believers can still be found. "Edwards has always been a big favorite of the blogosphere, but they don't have a lot of votes," joked Ruy Teixeira, a fellow at the Century Foundation and the Center for American Progress and an expert on polling. "In the early states, his demographic profile hasn't been particularly sharp, except in the sense that he skews more to men than to women."

"The Edwards campaign never really caught fire," Teixeira continued.

As that analysis becomes more and more undeniable, many Edwards supporters, including those in his campaign's inner circle, are asking why their candidate, the Democratic party's vice-presidential nominee in 2004, hasn't done better. In part, they blame the media, which, ever since Obama's February 2007 entrance into the race, rushed to portray it as a two-person contest between the first woman and first African American to have a serious shot at the presidency.

But privately they admit that Edwards' candidacy was flawed: It relied on populist rhetoric at a time when a grassroots populist movement doesn't exist, and Edwards' personal life, including his large mansion and much-maligned expensive haircut, detracted from his ability to speak convincingly about the plight of lower- and middle-class Americans. But they still insist that their guy would have been the safest bet to face off against a Republican in front of an electorate accustomed to white, male politicians. As Edwards himself said at the South Carolina debate on Jan. 21, "it's amazing now that being the white male is different. … I grew up in the rural South, in small towns all across the rural South, and I think I can go everywhere and compete head-to-head with John McCain."

Realistically, the question for Edwards' Democratic competitors is no longer how they'll beat him but how, on Super Tuesday, they can peel votes away from the remaining 11 percent of the Democratic primary electorate that supports him, but may be looking to back a winner.

Intuitively, it makes sense that Edwards supporters would trend toward Obama. Both candidates ran as the anti-Clinton. Edwards even spoke about his own affinity toward Obama's "change" message at the last New Hampshire debate.

But some polling suggests otherwise. A Jan. 24 Los Angeles Times/Bloomberg News poll found that nationally, Edwards voters prefer Clinton to Obama by a slight margin. She could have an edge among those who are attracted to Edwards' focus on the economy. "Hillary talks about the economy more than Obama, and she's connected to the Clinton presidency, which people view as successful on the economic front," Teixeira said.

Edwards supporters bristle at the idea that Clinton could effectively assume Edwards' mantle as the economic populist in the race. They point to her husband's support for free trade and her own strong ties to corporate America. "John's views on trade and tax fairness are just different than what the Clinton administration's were, so there will be a credibility issue on these matters," said Leo Hindery, a former telecom executive and the senior economic policy adviser to the Edwards campaign. But most voters don't have a grasp of the finer policy differences between the Democratic candidates, and low-income voters -- those who would be most helped by Edwards' populist policies -- are especially loyal to Clinton. In recent weeks, she has doubled down on that appeal, speaking often about pocketbook issues such as the sub-prime mortgage crisis and health-care costs.

The economy has now eclipsed the Iraq War as voters' number one concern. It's a public-opinion shift Edwards partisans believe would have benefited their candidate had it occurred earlier in the primary cycle. They see Obama, too, as a poor general election nominee when it comes to addressing economic insecurities. Working-class voters are skeptical of a message attuned to the outlook of elite young adults, Edwards supporters say. "Barack Obama is talking about hope, but who is he talking to?" noted a senior union official with close ties to the Edwards campaign. "College kids and college-educated people already have hope. The politics of hope is tricky for 37- to 57-year-old working class men."

But populist politics proved to be tricky, too -- and therein lies the biggest disappointment for Edwards supporters deeply invested in the candidate's confrontation of corporate America. Organized labor failed to unite around the candidate who most clearly embraced its goals, but even if it had, with just 12.1 percent of American workers belonging to a union, the movement likely wouldn't have had the muscle to overcome the celebrity candidacies of both Clinton and Obama. Indeed, there is no widespread, popular movement afoot in America today calling for a rollback of corporate power. Even Edwards' advisers admit many Americans just aren't "ready" or "comfortable" with their candidate's aggressive rhetoric.

"It is still true in America that class politics has a lot of trouble breaking through, and I think that has to do with a failure of imagination," the union official said. "A fundamental challenge of corporate power is very, very hard for people to absorb."

With Edwards' presidential ambitions seemingly quashed, many campaign insiders are wondering what his next step will be. There's buzz about a possible Cabinet-level appointment, maybe even to attorney general. But others hope that released from the pressure of the presidential race, Edwards will become to anti-poverty work and populism what Al Gore is for the environment -- a powerful national advocate above the partisan fray.
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 07:40 am
Edwards will whore his delegates out to Obama for a cabinet position and to snub the Clintons.

No need overanalyzing it.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 07:48 am
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:
Edwards will whore his delegates out to Obama for a cabinet position and to snub the Clintons.

Which is completely irrelevant to about 90% of the article. Article's about a) what went wrong with Edwards' campaign, and b) what should the supporters of his causes do now. Little to do at all with what strategems might play out at the convention.
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 07:55 am
and I don't argue that point at all.

It is what's going to happen in the end though is all I'm saying.

Intersting article.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 08:46 am
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:
Edwards will whore his delegates out to Obama for a cabinet position and to snub the Clintons.

I don't think that Edwards will be able to control his delegates. After the first vote, they are free agents. Additionally, I think Edwards has a role in either adminstration. I hear trial lawyers are strongly hinting that he would make a great AG.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 08:54 am
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:
and I don't argue that point at all.

It is what's going to happen in the end though is all I'm saying.

Intersting article.


OK!
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 09:49 am
BBB
There is a huge difference between American labor unions and European labor unions. American unions were established along trade lines while European unions developed generally along social class lines. That's why American unions have failed to maintain their power. Another reason is that American unions had a long history of discrimination against racial minorities and women until the Civil Rights Movement forced them to reform. When I worked for the Retail Clerks Union during the 1970s, I examined some of their old Butchers contracts. There were three rates of pay. One for white men, a lower one for Black men, and the lowest one for women, if they were allowed to enter the trade.

I participated in a national two-day seminar and panel of union leaders, mostly men, at American University in Washington D.C. in the 1970s. I publicly challenged the heads of the major unions to change their ways. I warned them that if they did not begin organizing women and hiring women organizers, their unions would shrink in size and influence. The big union honchos got royally pissed at me. They were embarrassed because the Media loved what I had to say and it got a lot of Press and TV coverage. My warning was largely ignored for several years and, sadly, my prediction came true. By the end of the 1980s, the unions woke up and changed their organizing methods and their target organizing populations. We even got some women appointed to the Board of the AFL-CIO. After that, I concentrated on organizing women and minorities in California.

In the 1970s and 1980s, I was one of a small group of women who created two new national organizations of union women. One was the Union Women Alliance to Gain Equality (Union WAGE), a name I coined. The other was the Coalition of Labor Union Women (CLUW). I served on the Boards of Directors. We increased the women leadership numbers in the national and local unions and ultimately changed the organizing agenda of the unions. It helped Unions to survive.

BBB
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 10:04 am
Good for you, BBB! Respect for the long years of work you have done for the cause.
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 10:25 am
nimh
nimh wrote:
Good for you, BBB! Respect for the long years of work you have done for the cause.


Thanks, but there were many men who worked hard to change the natures of labor unions, among them Eugene Debs and Asa William Randolph.

Dyslexia's grandfather was a member of the Wobblies. They attempted to form unions based on the European class model:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_Workers_of_the_World

Randolph led the Porters Union: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A._Philip_Randolph

Debs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_V._Debs

BBB
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 10:31 am
"God gave me my money."

John D. Rockefeller--the world's first billionaire--spoke these words in 1905. This is how the founder of the Standard Oil Trust--now known as Exxon, Mobil, Chevron, Amoco, etc.--explained the secret of his wealth.

Nine years after that interview, the bodies of two women and 11 children were dragged out from a cellar in Ludlow, Colo. They had choked to death when the Colorado state militia set the tent above them on fire.

Ludlow coal miners were on strike against the Colorado Fuel and Iron Co. Nine thousand miners had walked out of the company-owned camps on Sept. 23, 1913.

They struck against $1.68-a-day wages. They revolted against the CF&I; company stores, CF&I-controlled; schools, CF&I-censored;libraries and CF&I-bought-and-paid-for; ministers.
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 10:45 am
sounds like a Tennesee Ernie Ford song in the making...
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nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Jan, 2008 10:57 am
Re: nimh
BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:
Thanks, but there were many men who worked hard to change the natures of labor unions, among them Eugene Debs and Asa William Randolph.

Dyslexia's grandfather was a member of the Wobblies. They attempted to form unions based on the European class model:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_Workers_of_the_World

Randolph led the Porters Union: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A._Philip_Randolph

Debs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_V._Debs

Yes, I know about the Wobblies and about Debs...

Just to momentarily return to my obsession about elections and geography, the funny (or important, or sad, or some combination of these) fact about Debs is that his strongest support was in heartland "red states" like Oklahoma, Montana and Idaho.

Peasants in Oklahama, I'm guessing, and miners in the West... one of his very highest scores was in Nye County, Nevada - which was all desert with scattered mining towns.
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jan, 2008 09:20 am
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jan, 2008 01:22 pm
John Edwards, sadly, is out. With him went what seemed like the only chance to end our occupation of Iraq before 2012, when a presumably Democratic president will presumably be reelected.

If Edwards had been able to end the occupation next year — Bush’s warhogs are right about this — the results would have been the shameful abandonment of our allies there, a bloody civil war killing thousands or hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, and a destabilized Middle East descending into God knows what new horrors.

If Clinton or Obama is elected, exactly the same things will happen, only four years later. By that time we will have lost another trillion dollars or so and thousands more American lives. In addition the Iraqis would have lost — Oh, well, who cares?

Obama or Clinton will happily pay such a price for reelection, just as Nixon did before them. The awful irony is that this time it might not even work. Bush has left his successor a far worse mess to clean up than Kennedy/Johnson did. We could wind up with a Republican president in 2012, or even a Scientologist. On the evidence so far this century, we’re dumb enough to elect anything.
http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/12507
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jan, 2008 02:47 pm
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/01/30/us/30edwards7-600.jpg
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jan, 2008 02:50 pm
http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_stump/JRE1.jpg
0 Replies
 
nappyheadedhohoho
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Jan, 2008 02:56 pm
In memoriam..................................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE847UXu3Q
0 Replies
 
 

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