9
   

THE US, THE UN AND IRAQ, ELEVENTH THREAD

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jul, 2007 04:09 pm
ican711nm wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Well, when Zardozz.com reports it, why, you know it must be true!

You crack me up, ICan.

Cycloptichorn

There is too much evidence of al-Qaeda support for Democrats for me to post it all here. Here is the link to many of the links besides Zardozz.com

http://www.altavista.com/web/results?itag=ody&q=al-Qaeda+support+for+Democrats&kgs=0&kls=0

I admit it. You cracked me up because your responses are so predictable. I anticipated your Zardozz comment so I set you up by giving only that piece of evidence. Now go look for yourself to see other confirmations of my allegation.


No. Either present the evidence yourself or retreat from your position. I'm not going to do your work for you.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jul, 2007 06:29 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
ican711nm wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Well, when Zardozz.com reports it, why, you know it must be true!

You crack me up, ICan.

Cycloptichorn

There is too much evidence of al-Qaeda support for Democrats for me to post it all here. Here is the link to many of the links besides Zardozz.com

http://www.altavista.com/web/results?itag=ody&q=al-Qaeda+support+for+Democrats&kgs=0&kls=0

I admit it. You cracked me up because your responses are so predictable. I anticipated your Zardozz comment so I set you up by giving only that piece of evidence. Now go look for yourself to see other confirmations of my allegation.


No. Either present the evidence yourself or retreat from your position. I'm not going to do your work for you.

Cycloptichorn

Laughing
Wow! You sure are predictable!

Seems like you don't want to make a personal effort to learn the truth. Crying or Very sad

Quote:


Quote:


Quote:

http://www.counterbias.com/481.html
Al Qaeda to Democrats: We Love You!
Those who are against extremely rational preemptive strikes had their way prior to 9/11, and now should just shut up regarding Iraq


December 6 2005
Counterbias.com
by Ted Baiamonte
R E P U B L I C A N V I E W


The most tragic fact of American political life is that we have Democrats. America is involved in a world war and yet Democrats still haven't figured out who the enemy is. A recent count of critical words used by major Democratic leaders shows that for every 100 words used to be critical of the American Commander in Chief, zero words were used to be critical of the enemy, who is, by the way, Al Qaeda. And, Al Qaeda is very thankful for the Democratic support as they prepare nuclear, chemical, biological, suicide bomber, sniper, and IED attacks against all of us.

Here is the relevant part of a recently intercepted 6,000-word letter from Ayman al-Zawahiri, Osama bin Laden's deputy in the Al Qaida organization, to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, Al Qaida's top man in Iraq: "However, despite all of this I say to you: that we are in a battle, and that more than half of the battle is taking place in the battle field if the media."

The thrilling fact for Al Qaeda is that American Democrats and their mainstream media allies are printing 100% coverage against Bush and nothing against them. The Democrats have succeeded politically to the point where Bush now has only a 36% approval rating, while intellectually, Democrats look as goofy and deadly as ever. Their political attack has succeeded by accusing Bush of being dishonest about WMDs as the reason for going to war. But here are the facts:

1) There was a natural tendency to believe that Saddam had WMDs or could have them again quickly because he had them and used them in the recent past.

2) When Bill Clinton left office, having had eight years to listen to the CIA and perhaps thirty other domestic and foreign intelligence agencies, he talked openly about whether Iraq would use WMDs in the run up to the war. He said, "I'll guarantee that he'll use the arsenal."

3) Hans Blix, the main UN weapons inspector, never found WMDs but assumed Iraq had them based on the incredible lengths to which Saddam Hussein went to impede the investigation.

4) The whole United Nations Oil For Food program that impoverished Saddam was put in place to pressure Iraq into disclosing its weapons, but Saddam would still not disclose that he had no weapons. It's hard dealing with a madman, and harder still to predict his next move.

5) Recorded conversations just before the war began show that Iraqi Generals thought they would be called on to use WMDs. If Iraqi Generals didn't know the truth, it is unlikely that Bush would have.

5) The American Military, which protects its own, has its own intelligence capability, and they went into battle fully equipped and prepared for WMD counter-attacks.

6) Immediately before the war, the CIA director was asked how certain he was about WMDs in Iraq. He said it was a "slam dunk" (according to Bob Woodward).

7) Joe Wilson was persuaded from his trip to Iraq that Iraq was not buying or trying to buy "yellow cake" from Niger but the CIA, for whom he worked at the time, was not convinced by Wilson, and neither was the bipartisan Senate Select Committee which also analyzed his findings.

8) Other investigations by the Senate Select Intelligence Committee and the Robb-Silverman group concluded there was no cherry picking of intelligence or pressure to manufacture it as needed by the Administration.

9) The Democrats, by law, saw all or most of the intelligence prior to the war. They always had the option to reject it, ask for more of it, or to refuse to fund the war. Now, like little children they want a "do over," and they want to pretend they were not integrally involved in the run up to war.

The facts are surely ironic here in light of how well the Democrats have avoided them in their successful political attack against Bush, but what is more ironic is that WMDs were never the main reason for going to war, just the most public one. WMDs were used to capture the attention of a public that mostly doesn't pay attention, and when it does, gets confused enough to vote for Democrats and Republicans in the same election, and then proudly proclaims it is an act of electoral independence.

The real reason for the war was that after 9/11 Bush didn't want it to happen again, and thankfully it didn't. On 9/11 we were already at war with Iraq over the "no fly zones" and through the UN Oil for Food program, which was slowly strangling that country. Since Iraq was seemingly a thousand times more inclined to, and capable of, attacking us than Afghanistan, it made perfect sense to strike preemptively. Those who are against extremely rational preemptive strikes had their way prior to 9/11, and now should just shut up regarding Iraq.

An even greater irony in the scummy, but politically successful, Democratic attack is that in truth it no longer matters much why we went into this war or the Vietnam War or any other of our wars that necessarily started under a cloud of partisan democratic confusion. What matters two thousand times more is that if we lose in Iraq, Al Qaeda gets the oil, and civilization collapses.

The Democrats have tons to say about history because doing so happens to be working for them at the moment, no matter how irrelevant. But when asked what they would do if actually elected to office to make history, they do what their current standard bearer, Hillary Clinton, does: they hide under their desks in absolute fear that being forthright and honest would cost them too much politically.

Recently, the Chairman of the Democratic Party was on Meet the Press where he was gently and politely asked, by the liberal host Tim Russert, about how it is that the Democrats have no positions at a critical and pivotal time in human history. The Chairman acknowledged that it was quite true about not having any positions yet, but he added that they were working on it and when they came up with something it would be based on honesty. When gently pressed about whether they would let us know their honest positions this year, the Chairman replied, "in 2006." The liberal host (Tim Russert) quietly, quickly, and politely moved on to the next question.

It almost makes you cry, doesn't it? The Democrats are half of the political culture in America; yet they launched a scummy, intellectually meaningless, but successful political attack about Bush's honesty while not being honest enough themselves to present their positions on the future of their own country or Western Civilization. They are, by default, sending a huge and encouraging valentine to Al Qaida which has written that the Democrats will soon do for them what they did for the communists in Vietnam and Pol Pot in Cambodia.

The greatest irony of all is that our CIA was incompetent and mistaken mostly because Democrats had always hated it, and stripped it bare of any real capabilities. Why? The CIA had been a very effective Republican anti-Communist organization while the Democrats always had a pronounced sympathy for Communists. In fact, Oleg Kalugin, the head of the KGB in Washington during the cold war period, has written that of course he looked among the liberals when the wanted to recruit spies in Washington. After Republicans defeated Communism, Democrats insanely continued to resist American freedom and the promotion of it around the world, and do so to this day. A neutered CIA has always been the Democratic policy, but that doesn't stop them from audaciously exploiting the deadly results of their own failed policy.

So why can't there be a Constitutional Amendment against the existence of the Democratic Party whereupon the Republican Party would split into two thinking Parties with legitimate disagreements?

And, all this is to say nothing of the traitorous affect the Democrats have on our troops in the field who heroically fight, bleed, and die out of a believe in their mission: a mission which Democrats are seeking to undermine.


Quote:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1757448/posts
Al Qaeda Sends a Message to Democrats
ABC News ^


Posted on 12/22/2006 11:55:34 AM PST by bnelson44


Brian Ross and Hoda Osman Report:

Al Qaeda has sent a message to leaders of the Democratic party that credit for the defeat of congressional Republicans belongs to the terrorists.

In a portion of the tape from al Qaeda No. 2 man, Ayman al Zawahri, made available only today, Zawahri says he has two messages for American Democrats.

"The first is that you aren't the ones who won the midterm elections, nor are the Republicans the ones who lost. Rather, the Mujahideen -- the Muslim Ummah's vanguard in Afghanistan and Iraq -- are the ones who won, and the American forces and their Crusader allies are the ones who lost," Zawahri said, according to a full transcript obtained by ABC News.

Zawahri calls on the Democrats to negotiate with him and Osama bin Laden, not others in the Islamic world who Zawahri says cannot help.

"And if you don't refrain from the foolish American policy of backing Israel, occupying the lands of Islam and stealing the treasures of the Muslims, then await the same fate," he said.
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jul, 2007 08:13 pm
Quote:
Zawahri calls on the Democrats to negotiate with him and Osama bin Laden, not others in the Islamic world who Zawahri says cannot help.


And I suppose in your own sick little mind you believe the Democrats would sit down and negotiate with Osama bin Laden. Why I bet you think they were all lining up seeing who could be first to negotiate with him.

Something you and Osama bin Laden have in common; you make your own reality and live in your own world, separate and distinct from the real one. Laughing
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jul, 2007 09:36 pm
Quote:

Al Qaeda has sent a message to leaders of the Democratic party that credit for the defeat of congressional Republicans belongs to the terrorists.


How can you think this constitutes 'support?'

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 04:12 am
link
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 04:27 am
ican wrote:
If he had succeeded, he would have replaced Bush with someone (i.e., John Kerry) who is not only more incompetent than Bush, but also is a blatant fraud and more manipulatable by George Soros than is Bush.


How do you know Kerry would be more incompetent than Bush? Kerry has never held the office so you don't know what he would do or how he would react. Bush held it for four years and proved his incompetence. He proved he was owned by the religious right and the neocons.

So your telling us you supported a proved incompetent over an unknown. Kerry is unknown to you as you have already proven to us that you have no psychic ability to predict the future or understand what's happening in the present.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 07:41 am
General Odom's prescription for supporting the troops: withdraw; cut off funds; and impeach

Quote:
If the Democrats truly want to succeed in forcing to begin withdrawing from Iraq, the first step is to redefine "supporting the troops" as withdrawing them, citing the mass of accumulating evidence of the psychological as well as the physical damage that the president is forcing them to endure because he did not raise adequate forces. Both Democrats and Republicans in Congress could confirm this evidence and lay the blame for "not supporting the troops" where it really belongs â€" on the president. And they could rightly claim to the public that they are supporting the troops by cutting off the funds that he uses to keep U.S. forces in Iraq.

The public is ahead of the both branches of government in grasping this reality, but political leaders and opinion makers in the media must give them greater voice....

The president is strongly motivated to string out the war until he leaves office, in order to avoid taking responsibility for the defeat he has caused and persisted in making greater each year for more than three years.

To force him to begin a withdrawal before then, the first step should be to rally the public by providing an honest and candid definition of what "supporting the troops" really means and pointing out who is and who is not supporting our troops at war. The next step should be a flat refusal to appropriate money for to be used in Iraq for anything but withdrawal operations with a clear deadline for completion.

The final step should be to put that president on notice that if ignores this legislative action and tries to extort Congress into providing funds by keeping U.S. forces in peril, impeachment proceeding will proceed in the House of Representatives. Such presidential behavior surely would constitute the "high crime" of squandering the lives of soldiers and Marines for his own personal interest.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 07:43 am
Sacrifice Is for Suckers

Quote:
The Bushies, it seems, like starting fights, but they don't believe in paying any of the cost of those fights or bearing any of the risks. Above all, they don't believe that they or their friends should face any personal or professional penalties for trivial sins like distorting intelligence to get America into an unnecessary war, or totally botching that war's execution.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 09:28 am
revel, Both of your posts speaks for the true heart of Americans; only Bush and those die-hard 30 percenters who refuse to acknowledge the great failures of Bush et al on Iraq are the biggest un-Americans in our country. How many more dead and maimed are they willing to sacrifice for their undefined goals while situations only gets worse?
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 09:45 am
Quote:
The president is strongly motivated to string out the war until he leaves office, in order to avoid taking responsibility for the defeat he has caused and persisted in making greater each year for more than three years.


If this is true one has to wonder just how crass and insensitive our president is to let Americans die till the end of his term so he can say it was someone else who led America into defeat.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 09:49 am
That's what we get when we elect a president with no brains or heart. We must stay away from electing another president with a history of alcohol and drugs; their brains have been destroyed - but in the case of Bush, he started out without brains.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 12:53 pm
Arrow
xingu wrote:
Quote:
Zawahri calls on the Democrats to negotiate with him and Osama bin Laden, not others in the Islamic world who Zawahri says cannot help.


[size=8]And I suppose [/size]in your own sick little mind [size=8]you believe the Democrats would sit down and negotiate with Osama bin Laden. Why I bet you think they were all lining up seeing who could be first to negotiate with him.

Something you and Osama bin Laden have in common; [/size]you make your own reality and live in your own world, separate and distinct from the real one Laughing
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:03 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Quote:

Al Qaeda has sent a message to leaders of the Democratic party that credit for the defeat of congressional Republicans belongs to the terrorists.


How can you think this constitutes 'support?'

Cycloptichorn

Quote:

www.m-w.com
Main Entry: 1 sup·port
Pronunciation: s&-'port
Function: transitive verb
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French supporter, from Late Latin supportare, from Latin, to transport, from sub- + portare to carry -- more at FARE
1 : to endure bravely or quietly : BEAR
2 a (1) : to promote the interests or cause of (2) : to uphold or defend as valid or right : ADVOCATE <supports> (3) : to argue or vote for <supported> b (1) : ASSIST, HELP <bombers> (2) : to act with (a star actor) (3) : to bid in bridge so as to show support for c : to provide with substantiation : CORROBORATE <support>
3 a : to pay the costs of : MAINTAIN <support> b : to provide a basis for the existence or subsistence of <the> <support>
4 a : to hold up or serve as a foundation or prop for b : to maintain (a price) at a desired level by purchases or loans; also : to maintain the price of by purchases or loans
5 : to keep from fainting, yielding, or losing courage : COMFORT
6 : to keep (something) going
- sup·port·abil·i·ty /s&-"por-t&-'bi-l&-tE/ noun
- sup·port·able /-'por-t&-b&l/ adjective
- sup·port·ive /-'por-tiv/ adjective
- sup·port·ive·ness /-n&s/ noun
synonyms SUPPORT, UPHOLD, ADVOCATE, BACK, CHAMPION mean to favor actively one that meets opposition. SUPPORT is least explicit about the nature of the assistance given <supports>. UPHOLD implies extended support given to something attacked <upheld>. ADVOCATE stresses urging or pleading <advocated>. BACK suggests supporting by lending assistance to one failing or falling <refusing>. CHAMPION suggests publicly defending one unjustly attacked or too weak to advocate his or her own cause <championed>.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:05 pm
ican711nm wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Quote:

Al Qaeda has sent a message to leaders of the Democratic party that credit for the defeat of congressional Republicans belongs to the terrorists.


How can you think this constitutes 'support?'

Cycloptichorn

Quote:

www.m-w.com
Main Entry: 1 sup·port
Pronunciation: s&-'port
Function: transitive verb
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French supporter, from Late Latin supportare, from Latin, to transport, from sub- + portare to carry -- more at FARE
1 : to endure bravely or quietly : BEAR
2 a (1) : to promote the interests or cause of (2) : to uphold or defend as valid or right : ADVOCATE <supports> (3) : to argue or vote for <supported> b (1) : ASSIST, HELP <bombers> (2) : to act with (a star actor) (3) : to bid in bridge so as to show support for c : to provide with substantiation : CORROBORATE <support>
3 a : to pay the costs of : MAINTAIN <support> b : to provide a basis for the existence or subsistence of <the> <support>
4 a : to hold up or serve as a foundation or prop for b : to maintain (a price) at a desired level by purchases or loans; also : to maintain the price of by purchases or loans
5 : to keep from fainting, yielding, or losing courage : COMFORT
6 : to keep (something) going
- sup·port·abil·i·ty /s&-"por-t&-'bi-l&-tE/ noun
- sup·port·able /-'por-t&-b&l/ adjective
- sup·port·ive /-'por-tiv/ adjective
- sup·port·ive·ness /-n&s/ noun
synonyms SUPPORT, UPHOLD, ADVOCATE, BACK, CHAMPION mean to favor actively one that meets opposition. SUPPORT is least explicit about the nature of the assistance given <supports>. UPHOLD implies extended support given to something attacked <upheld>. ADVOCATE stresses urging or pleading <advocated>. BACK suggests supporting by lending assistance to one failing or falling <refusing>. CHAMPION suggests publicly defending one unjustly attacked or too weak to advocate his or her own cause <championed>.


For the AQ to say to the Dems,

'You didn't win, you only got into office b/c the current group couldn't beat us.'

Is nowhere close to supporting the positions of the Dems. It is actually trying to minimize any thoughts that Americans supported their positions.

You really should quit this idiocy, equating dems with terrorists. You have little enough credit on this board as it is, don't waste what's left with further ranting about stuff like this.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:08 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
That's what we get when we elect a president with no brains or heart. We must stay away from electing another president with a history of alcohol and drugs; their brains have been destroyed - but in the case of Bush, he started out without brains.

Bush's low grades at Yale were higher than both Kerry's and Gore's.

To achieve your goal, at least one candidate should not be incompetent and/or a fraud.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:14 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
ican711nm wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Quote:

Al Qaeda has sent a message to leaders of the Democratic party that credit for the defeat of congressional Republicans belongs to the terrorists.


How can you think this constitutes 'support?'

Cycloptichorn

Quote:

www.m-w.com
Main Entry: 1 sup·port
Pronunciation: s&-'port
Function: transitive verb
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French supporter, from Late Latin supportare, from Latin, to transport, from sub- + portare to carry -- more at FARE
1 : to endure bravely or quietly : BEAR
2 a (1) : to promote the interests or cause of (2) : to uphold or defend as valid or right : ADVOCATE <supports> (3) : to argue or vote for <supported> b (1) : ASSIST, HELP <bombers> (2) : to act with (a star actor) (3) : to bid in bridge so as to show support for c : to provide with substantiation : CORROBORATE <support>
3 a : to pay the costs of : MAINTAIN <support> b : to provide a basis for the existence or subsistence of <the> <support>
4 a : to hold up or serve as a foundation or prop for b : to maintain (a price) at a desired level by purchases or loans; also : to maintain the price of by purchases or loans
5 : to keep from fainting, yielding, or losing courage : COMFORT
6 : to keep (something) going
- sup·port·abil·i·ty /s&-"por-t&-'bi-l&-tE/ noun
- sup·port·able /-'por-t&-b&l/ adjective
- sup·port·ive /-'por-tiv/ adjective
- sup·port·ive·ness /-n&s/ noun
synonyms SUPPORT, UPHOLD, ADVOCATE, BACK, CHAMPION mean to favor actively one that meets opposition. SUPPORT is least explicit about the nature of the assistance given <supports>. UPHOLD implies extended support given to something attacked <upheld>. ADVOCATE stresses urging or pleading <advocated>. BACK suggests supporting by lending assistance to one failing or falling <refusing>. CHAMPION suggests publicly defending one unjustly attacked or too weak to advocate his or her own cause <championed>.


For the AQ to say to the Dems,

'You didn't win, you only got into office b/c the current group couldn't beat us.'

Is nowhere close to supporting the positions of the Dems. It is actually trying to minimize any thoughts that Americans supported their positions.

You really should quit this idiocy, equating dems with terrorists. You have little enough credit on this board as it is, don't waste what's left with further ranting about stuff like this.

Cycloptichorn

To obtain my evidence, I searched the internet with this search argument: al-Qaeda support of Democrats.

I think you should argue your point with:

http://www.altavista.com
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:17 pm
I really don't care less what you found on an internet search. As you were the one who was making the proposition, you shouldn't repeat such dreck.

Attempting to blame it on what others have written is laughably pathetic

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:23 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
I really don't care less what you found on an internet search. As you were the one who was making the proposition, you shouldn't repeat such dreck.

Attempting to blame it on what others have written is laughably pathetic

Cycloptichorn

If you truly don't care, why do you discuss it?
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:25 pm
ican711nm wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
I really don't care less what you found on an internet search. As you were the one who was making the proposition, you shouldn't repeat such dreck.

Attempting to blame it on what others have written is laughably pathetic

Cycloptichorn

If you truly don't care, why do you discuss it?


I care to discuss the fact that you are putting forth an idiotic and highly insulting position. I don't care that you got your information from a web search at all. It doesn't add any validity to it, and makes you look bad for attempting to shift the blame elsewhere.

Let's get back on topic. When are you going to admit that we are screwed in Iraq? We aren't staying for 'years' longer. You're no fool, you can see what is happening politically.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 6 Jul, 2007 01:35 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
ican711nm wrote:
Cycloptichorn wrote:
I really don't care less what you found on an internet search. As you were the one who was making the proposition, you shouldn't repeat such dreck.

Attempting to blame it on what others have written is laughably pathetic

Cycloptichorn

If you truly don't care, why do you discuss it?


I care to discuss the fact that you are putting forth an idiotic and highly insulting position. I don't care that you got your information from a web search at all. It doesn't add any validity to it, and makes you look bad for attempting to shift the blame elsewhere.

Ahaa! Now I understand you better. It is your position that when I justify my position with references, I'm blaming my references; when you justify your position with references, you are acknowledging them.

Let's get back on topic. When are you going to admit that we are screwed in Iraq? We aren't staying for 'years' longer. You're no fool, you can see what is happening politically.

Cycloptichorn

"We are screwed in Iraq" until we choose tactics that work.

If we leave before we succeed in Iraq, we will be screwed in the USA as well as in Iraq.
0 Replies
 
 

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