Ticomaya wrote:
Let's set aside for the moment your assertion about what "terrorism started" at the beginning of a sentence implies....
Now why should I want to do that? LoneStarMadam wrote the garbled version of what Murtha actually said for the express purpose of trying to make it seem that Murtha was saying that terrorism was unknown to the world before the US took over the Abu Ghraib prson. That's the whole point of garbling the quote in the first place.
If she posted the
actual quote, it would become apparent, even in that short except you posted, that Murtha meant the Iraqi attacks on Americans began with the invasion-not before. Which is certainly not stupid.
Ticomaya wrote:Quote #1: "Terrorism started with Abu Graib" .
Quote #2: "Well, I say that the fight against Americans began with Abu Ghraib. It began with the invasion of Iraq. That's when terrorism started. ..."
The plain language used by Murtha shows a clear meaning to express the belief that terrorism started with Abu Ghraib and the invasion of Iraq.
"The fight against the Americans" IS the terrorism Murtha was clearly referring to. Murtha made it clear by that sentence. The invasion and the putting of people in Abu Ghraib happened in the same time frame. We invaded, we stuck people in Abu Ghraib shortly after, and then the Iraqis fought back by use of terrorism. Later, foreign terrorists joined them.
Ticomaya wrote:Thus, we can revise Quote #2 by taking out extraneous matter and be left with the following:
Revised Quote #2: "The fight against Americans began with Abu Ghraib [and] with the invasion of Iraq [and] that's when terrorism started."
If you don't agree with that revision, please explain why.
Revised Quote #2 can be further revised as follows:
Further Revised Quote #2: "Terrorism started with Abu Ghraib and with the invasion of Iraq."
What's wrong with Revised Quote #2 is that it ignores that the terrorism Murtha was referring to was the terrorism that Iraqis and the foreign sympathizers who came to join them was against the Americans who invaded Iraq. Your Revised Quote #2, as well as LoneStarMadam's, makes it seem that Murtha was trying to claim that terrorism was unknown before the Americans took over Abu Ghraib. That is a big difference.
Ticomaya wrote:I don't know what Murtha meant...
Why? Murtha made it plain as day that the terrorism he referred to was the fight against the Americans. That is the very reason he said "the fight against the Americans" in the previous sentence!
Ticomaya wrote:....and I'm not willing to concede that you have a grasp on his true meaning.
I'm not willing to concede that you haven't realized that Murtha was referring to the terrorism the Iraqi insurgents are using against the American troops there. Do you think he interrupted a whole interview about Iraq to suddenly wax historical about worldwide terrorism and it's origins? Please.
Ticomaya wrote: But what I do know is IF that was his [Murtha's] meaning as you claim, it was very stupid for him to say, "[T]hat's when terrorism started," because those words carry an entirely different meaning, and the context does not rescue him.
Considering that he made it plain that the terrorism he was talking about was the Iraqi insurgents' fight against the American soldiers there, there was nothing stupid about it at all. Especially in the context where Adminstration supporters were still trying to draw links between Iraq and 911.
<---- Added in case anyone couldn't gather from the context that I was being sarcastic.
