When Does Life Begin?

real life wrote:

USAFHokie80 wrote:

It's not that they ignore the old testament... they just ignore the parts they don't like. Like in leviticus it says that eating shellfish is an abomination (along with 20 other things people do every day). They ignore that part... but they really seem to like the part that condemns homos.

The bible... is complete bullshit. Personally, I think it should be considered a weapon of mass destruction.

Abortion is a weapon of mass destruction.

It literally is the cause of death for millions each year.

The same is not true of the Bible.

Umm... let's see... the crusades? the inquisition? 9/11? the current war in iraq?

Religion causes death wherever it is let free.

RL... you are taking what I say completely out of context. I'm sure you know that. This is the last time I'm going to repeat myself. There is a difference between having asthima or a learning disability and having a several malformation caused by trisomy-13, -18, -21 or any of the other chromosomal disorders.

You are right, a perfectly healthy child cannot care for himself for several years. But after those few years, he CAN. The children I mention have an extraordinarily small chance to even live to see their teen years. If they do manage that, it is only because of the mass of technology and constant care they get. What happens when their parents are gone? Are you going to take care of them? Do you have ANY idea what the cost is for these people to maintain all of this care?

I've said it twice so far: Before you draw more of these stupid, completely different, comparisons... GO READ.

real (in black):
The USA has provided more freedom for religion that any society on earth.
Is that why the conservatives are trying to push their religious agenda on all Americans?

Show how that has caused massive numbers of deaths as you claim.
You must study who instituted the "crusades" and the "inquisition." I'm surprised you are still unawares.



Are you saying that America's freedom of religion is responsible for 9/11, (the example you used) ?
Do you know what a "strawman" is?

TheUS Army had sent smallpox laced blankets to Indian tribes in order to exterminate them.

Most all of our dealings with The brown skinned Indians could hardly be called "Christian" in he way you like to believe in it.

cicerone imposter wrote:

real (in black):
The USA has provided more freedom for religion that any society on earth.
Is that why the conservatives are trying to push their religious agenda on all Americans?

Show how that has caused massive numbers of deaths as you claim.
You must study who instituted the "crusades" and the "inquisition." I'm surprised you are still unawares.



Are you saying that America's freedom of religion is responsible for 9/11, (the example you used) ?
Do you know what a "strawman" is?

CI,

Are you claiming that the inquisition and the crusades were caused by a country that had freedom of religion?

Hokie used 9/11 as one of his examples. Did you miss that?

If you had your way, would religion be legal or would you ban organized religion if it were up to you and you alone?

If you wouldn't ban religion altogether, what legal restrictions on religion would you favor ?

I am well aware that you are speaking of 'severe disabilities'.

I am also aware that this is a relative term. It means different things to different people. And what was at one time in history a 'severe disability' or even a fatal disease, may later be curable.

So is your solution to disability simply to kill the ill, and forget about cures?

Abortion is a weapon of mass destruction.

Actually, your christian god is a purveyor of mass destruction; the world flood. Anybody want to top that one?

real life wrote:

cicerone imposter wrote:

real (in black):
The USA has provided more freedom for religion that any society on earth.
Is that why the conservatives are trying to push their religious agenda on all Americans?

Show how that has caused massive numbers of deaths as you claim.
You must study who instituted the "crusades" and the "inquisition." I'm surprised you are still unawares.



Are you saying that America's freedom of religion is responsible for 9/11, (the example you used) ?
Do you know what a "strawman" is?

CI,

Are you claiming that the inquisition and the crusades were caused by a country that had freedom of religion?

Hokie used 9/11 as one of his examples. Did you miss that?

If you had your way, would religion be legal or would you ban organized religion if it were up to you and you alone?

If you wouldn't ban religion altogether, what legal restrictions on religion would you favor ?

Yes, I used 9/11. But I didn't say america was to blame for it. I said religion was.

You are desperatley trying to put words into my mouth - and failing.

I would ban the influence of religion on our politics; it's called "freedom from religion."

cicerone imposter wrote:

I would ban the influence of religion on our politics; it's called "freedom from religion."

So would you prohibit Christians from voting?

Or would you simply limit their choices only to those who do not hold views that they agree with?

real life wrote:

I am well aware that you are speaking of 'severe disabilities'.

I am also aware that this is a relative term. It means different things to different people. And what was at one time in history a 'severe disability' or even a fatal disease, may later be curable.

So is your solution to disability simply to kill the ill, and forget about cures?

There is no way to "cure" a cleft plate or pallet. There is no way to "cure" a child who has both of his eyes on ONE side of his head. There is only massive surgery that is extraordinarily dangerous. Even then, these children usually also have undeveloped lungs and nervous systems. There is no cure or magic pill to take that will force their lungs to finish development.

So you want all of these kids to be born with these massive defects on the hope that one day before they die at the age of 6, there will be a "cure" for their genetic disorder?

And how exactly do you propose we cure a genetic defect? It would require a retrovirus to reimplant a correct DNA sequence. It's not nearly as trivial as you are trying to make it.

real life wrote:

cicerone imposter wrote:

I would ban the influence of religion on our politics; it's called "freedom from religion."

So would you prohibit Christians from voting?

Or would you simply limit their choices only to those who do not hold views that they agree with?

Do you do this on purpose? It's quite obvious what he means by this... and yet it seems that you cannot help but to spin it completely out of context.

Aren't you the one who loves to talk about red herring? It's funny that you have no problem when it is you throwing up a distraction.

For the record, I agree with him. I do no think religion has ANY place in politics. (and just so you can understand:) Governmental policy should never be made where is it based on religion.

So if you gave someone a choice between a surgery that was 'extraordinarily dangerous', (i.e. they might die as a result) and being chopped limb from limb by a scalpel in an abortion ---

--- which do you think they'd prefer?

Umm... let's see... the crusades? the inquisition? 9/11? the current war in iraq?

Religion causes death wherever it is let free.

Christianity is a form of religion, but it is not the be-all and end-all of religion.