When Does Life Begin?

If anyone is interested in debating with me instead of making threats on my personal safety, here's a jump off point.

45 million abortions done in a given year. 20 million of which happen in countries were it's illegal, 25 million in countries were it's legal.

If making abortion illegal is the answer, what's the question?

The question certainly isn't: "How do we convince people to not have abortions?"

So what's the legitimate case to make abortion illegal?

T
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Now your imagining threats of violence?

Report me to the board administrators and point out the threat. If a threat is apparent,(other than in your head) i'm sure they will have no problem banning my ip and my membership.

You don't have to take threats of violence from anybody!
You can point it out?...surely you can do that now?

I just don't think in a face to face situation with a stranger you would make demands for answers or tell them to answer promptly and the like.

You are only bold enough to do so here over the net. (coward)

A real (not imagined) threat would probably even cause my ISP to drop my service! Back up your assertion and make a report!

If you can......?

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I was wondering if you were for real Bartikus but I guess you are.

I bet you spend a lot of your time in "face to face situations" calling people "cowards." Rolling Eyes

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Bart you can either answer the question I posted, or post your own question. You're wasting my time.

T
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We sometimes forget our manners when we converse over the internet.

It doesn't mean we are bad people, does it?

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parados wrote:

I was wondering if you were for real Bartikus but I guess you are.

I bet you spend a lot of your time in "face to face situations" calling people "cowards."

No.... I try not to call people names. In the event I do slip up...I usually will apologize or have some sign of remorse.

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neologist wrote:

We sometimes forget our manners when we converse over the internet.

It doesn't mean we are bad people, does it?

It could just mean sometimes..... people do bad things. I've forgotten my manners as well.

The name calling and insults do tend to get old..I think that would be true for anyone on the receiving end.

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Diest TKO wrote:

Bart you can either answer the question I posted, or post your own question. You're wasting my time.

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Can I ask where your statistics came from?

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neologist wrote:

We sometimes forget our manners when we converse over the internet.

It doesn't mean we are bad people, does it?

"You are a coward of the first order sir, and you deserve no respect. You answer is heard loud and clear. You had the option to retain respect but CHOSE to not take it. You are a failure of the species.

Sentient, and audible, yet no voice or thoughts of your own. You sir are an empty vessel, a puppet, and you make no contribution to this or any other conversation.

No brain No eyes a coward....accused of threatening physical violence etc."

Would this be an example of goodness? Would it be good if on the receiving end Neo? Read it again.....this time as if addressed to you.

Could I say this about him and it be received as ....a good thing.... you think?

*all because i chose not to answer a survey (20 pages back) he insisted(not asked) i answer(and quickly)...and no one else...not even him*

the insults never stopped.

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Neo has never been shy about saying "I don't know" or "I'll think about it and get back to you." There's a large difference.

Bartikus wrote:

Diest TKO wrote:
Bart you can either answer the question I posted, or post your own question. You're wasting my time.

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Can I ask where your statistics came from?

Do you hold my 40/25/20 to be unreliable?

They were originally posted by a pro-lifer in this thread some 100 pages ago. You want the source, you'll have to take it to the horse's mouth.

Baddog was that you who posted these numbers? It's been a long time...

I'm sure if you took some time to research you'd find it validated. If my memory serves me correct, I searched and validated the numbers. I believe it was a part of a survey the CDC did in partnership with other interantional organizations.

T
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Bartikus wrote:

neologist wrote:
We sometimes forget our manners when we converse over the internet.

It doesn't mean we are bad people, does it?

"You are a coward of the first order sir, and you deserve no respect. You answer is heard loud and clear. You had the option to retain respect but CHOSE to not take it. You are a failure of the species.

Sentient, and audible, yet no voice or thoughts of your own. You sir are an empty vessel, a puppet, and you make no contribution to this or any other conversation.

No brain No eyes a coward....accused of threatening physical violence etc."

Would this be an example of goodness? Would it be good if on the receiving end Neo? Read it again.....this time as if addressed to you.

Could I say this about him and it be received as ....a good thing.... you think?

*all because i chose not to answer a survey (20 pages back) he insisted(not asked) i answer(and quickly)...and no one else...not even him*

the insults never stopped.

Remember Frank Apisa?

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What do you think the stats suggest if abortion was made illegal?

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neologist wrote:

Bartikus wrote:
neologist wrote:
We sometimes forget our manners when we converse over the internet.

It doesn't mean we are bad people, does it?

"You are a coward of the first order sir, and you deserve no respect. You answer is heard loud and clear. You had the option to retain respect but CHOSE to not take it. You are a failure of the species.

Sentient, and audible, yet no voice or thoughts of your own. You sir are an empty vessel, a puppet, and you make no contribution to this or any other conversation.

No brain No eyes a coward....accused of threatening physical violence etc."

Would this be an example of goodness? Would it be good if on the receiving end Neo? Read it again.....this time as if addressed to you.

Could I say this about him and it be received as ....a good thing.... you think?

*all because i chose not to answer a survey (20 pages back) he insisted(not asked) i answer(and quickly)...and no one else...not even him*

the insults never stopped.
Remember Frank Apisa?

Yes I do and wish we did'nt communicate here but rather in person. I think our disagreements would have remained but the conversation would have been more pleasant for the both of us.

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Bartikus wrote:

What do you think the stats suggest if abortion was made illegal?

Abortion is a decision people make and act upon in about the same frequency whether legal or not.

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Bartikus wrote:

neologist wrote:
Bartikus wrote:
neologist wrote:
We sometimes forget our manners when we converse over the internet.

It doesn't mean we are bad people, does it?

"You are a coward of the first order sir, and you deserve no respect. You answer is heard loud and clear. You had the option to retain respect but CHOSE to not take it. You are a failure of the species.

Sentient, and audible, yet no voice or thoughts of your own. You sir are an empty vessel, a puppet, and you make no contribution to this or any other conversation.

No brain No eyes a coward....accused of threatening physical violence etc."

Would this be an example of goodness? Would it be good if on the receiving end Neo? Read it again.....this time as if addressed to you.

Could I say this about him and it be received as ....a good thing.... you think?

*all because i chose not to answer a survey (20 pages back) he insisted(not asked) i answer(and quickly)...and no one else...not even him*

the insults never stopped.
Remember Frank Apisa?

Yes I do and wish we did'nt communicate here but rather in person. I think our disagreements would have remained but the conversation would have been more pleasant for the both of us.

Then again.....maybe I would just like to think that and I fool myself.

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parados wrote:

Bartikus wrote:
What do you think the stats suggest if abortion was made illegal?

Abortion is a decision people make and act upon in about the same frequency whether legal or not.

You're probably correct parados. Amazing what a 'me-first' mindset will do to other lives isn't it?

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parados wrote:

Bartikus wrote:
What do you think the stats suggest if abortion was made illegal?

Abortion is a decision people make and act upon in about the same frequency whether legal or not.

The 'statistics' regarding illegal abortions are highly suspect.

In those locations where abortion is illegal, obviously nobody actually is able to count how many are done.

The 'statistics' are furnished by organizations which sell abortions and/or support abortion, so they obviously have a vested interest in the impression created by the 'figures' they provide.

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real life wrote:

The 'statistics' regarding illegal abortions are highly suspect.

In those locations where abortion is illegal, obviously nobody actually is able to count how many are done.

The 'statistics' are furnished by organizations which sell abortions and/or support abortion, so they obviously have a vested interest in the impression created by the 'figures' they provide.

LOL. The statistic come from a pro-life website! One edit though. I was incorrect. The stats should have been 46/26/20 (abortions/legal/illegal).

Source: http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/fastfacts.html

The site also has other statistics which support my theory that the people who have the most abortions are the same people whom the goverment cares the least about. 70% of abortions come from developing countries. What to look at a country with the highest quality of life? Look at Denmark.

From 1981 their abortion rates have gone down!
Source: http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/abortion/denmark/ab-denmarkc2.html

The legislative action taken wasn't to make abortion illegal either.

A pretty strong case for domestic policy reform.

Start researching universal healthcare. I'm going to make an arguement for it very soon.

T
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Bartikus wrote:

What do you think the stats suggest if abortion was made illegal?

That legislative action only criminalizes, it does not actually help the situation. 49% of all pregnacies in the US are unplanned.

T
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Diest TKO wrote:

real life wrote:
The 'statistics' regarding illegal abortions are highly suspect.

In those locations where abortion is illegal, obviously nobody actually is able to count how many are done.

The 'statistics' are furnished by organizations which sell abortions and/or support abortion, so they obviously have a vested interest in the impression created by the 'figures' they provide.

LOL. The statistic come from a pro-life website!

Check the footnotes. The Guttmacher Institute is the public relations arm of Planned Parenthood. While run 'independently' , their history is very much entwined.

from http://www.guttmacher.org/about/history.html

Quote:

The Guttmacher Institute was founded in 1968 as the Center for Family Planning Program Development. .............The Center was originally constituted as a semiautonomous division of Planned Parenthood Federation of America (PPFA). Its early development was nurtured by Alan F. Guttmacher, an eminent obstetrician-gynecologist, teacher and writer who was PPFA's president for more than a decade until his death in 1974. The Center was renamed in Dr. Guttmacher's memory, and the Guttmacher Institute became an independent, not-for-profit corporation in 1977.

Diest TKO wrote:

The site also has other statistics which support my theory that the people who have the most abortions are the same people whom the goverment cares the least about. 70% of abortions come from developing countries.

I have often pointed out that Planned Parenthood heavily targets dark skinned folks, in accordance with the views of Margaret Sanger and other founders. But I am usually trashed for daring to mention it.

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When Does Life Begin?

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