0
   

Pope launches scathing attack on Islam

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 02:22 pm
The above quoted as transcription:

Quote:
Outburst from Vatican fans flames of hatred
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 02:32 pm
Interesting excerpt:

Quote:
...The Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups that includes al Qaeda in Iraq, issued a statement on a Web forum vowing to continue its holy war against the West. The authenticity of the statement could not be independently verified.

The group said Muslims would be victorious and addressed the pope as "the worshipper of the cross" saying "you and the West are doomed as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere. ... We will break up the cross, spill the liquor and impose head tax, then the only thing acceptable is a conversion (to Islam) or (killed by) the sword."...


CNN
0 Replies
 
freedom4free
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 02:41 pm
Brandon9000 wrote:
Interesting excerpt:

Quote:
...The Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups that includes al Qaeda in Iraq, issued a statement on a Web forum vowing to continue its holy war against the West. The authenticity of the statement could not be independently verified.

The group said Muslims would be victorious and addressed the pope as "the worshipper of the cross" saying "you and the West are doomed as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere. ... We will break up the cross, spill the liquor and impose head tax, then the only thing acceptable is a conversion (to Islam) or (killed by) the sword."...


CNN


You couldn't have written it better yourself Brandon. Laughing

statement on a web forum hey? - When did you last post here? wana know how long you've been away for.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 02:52 pm
freedom4free wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
Interesting excerpt:

Quote:
...The Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups that includes al Qaeda in Iraq, issued a statement on a Web forum vowing to continue its holy war against the West. The authenticity of the statement could not be independently verified.

The group said Muslims would be victorious and addressed the pope as "the worshipper of the cross" saying "you and the West are doomed as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere. ... We will break up the cross, spill the liquor and impose head tax, then the only thing acceptable is a conversion (to Islam) or (killed by) the sword."...


CNN


You couldn't have written it better yourself Brandon. Laughing

statement on a web forum hey? - When did you last post here? wana know how long you've been away for.


Your post is no more than an evasion. Please respond to the obvious implication - that radical Muslim leaders often go much farther than the pope did, indeed state that they won't be satisfied until Christians are converted to Islam by force.
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 03:03 pm
Brandon9000 wrote:
freedom4free wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
Interesting excerpt:

Quote:
...The Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups that includes al Qaeda in Iraq, issued a statement on a Web forum vowing to continue its holy war against the West. The authenticity of the statement could not be independently verified.

The group said Muslims would be victorious and addressed the pope as "the worshipper of the cross" saying "you and the West are doomed as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere. ... We will break up the cross, spill the liquor and impose head tax, then the only thing acceptable is a conversion (to Islam) or (killed by) the sword."...


CNN


You couldn't have written it better yourself Brandon. Laughing

statement on a web forum hey? - When did you last post here? wana know how long you've been away for.


Your post is no more than an evasion. Please respond to the obvious implication - that radical Muslim leaders often go much farther than the pope did, indeed state that they won't be satisfied until Christians are converted to Islam by force.


Or Dead!!!

The Pope must die, says Muslim
18.09.06
Add your view

A notorious Muslim extremist told a demonstration in London yesterday that the Pope should face execution.

Anjem Choudary said those who insulted Islam would be "subject to capital punishment".


http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23367232-details/The+Pope+must+die%2C+says+Muslim/article.do
0 Replies
 
kickycan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 03:04 pm
I feel bad for the muslims who were so upset about this that they felt the need to go out and protest, and threaten violence, and burn effigies of the pope. In fact, in the spirit of good will, which all these islamic radicals have shown the rest of the world, I would like to add my apology to the two apologies that Pope Benedict offered already.

I'm sorry you are all such ignorant stupid goat-f*ckers, and I hope you all die very soon.
0 Replies
 
freedom4free
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 03:05 pm
Brandon9000 wrote:
freedom4free wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
Interesting excerpt:

Quote:
...The Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups that includes al Qaeda in Iraq, issued a statement on a Web forum vowing to continue its holy war against the West. The authenticity of the statement could not be independently verified.

The group said Muslims would be victorious and addressed the pope as "the worshipper of the cross" saying "you and the West are doomed as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere. ... We will break up the cross, spill the liquor and impose head tax, then the only thing acceptable is a conversion (to Islam) or (killed by) the sword."...


CNN


You couldn't have written it better yourself Brandon. Laughing

statement on a web forum hey? - When did you last post here? wana know how long you've been away for.


Your post is no more than an evasion. Please respond to the obvious implication - that radical Muslim leaders often go much farther than the pope did, indeed state that they won't be satisfied until Christians are converted to Islam by force.


Ok, i'll agree with you. Now lets see how far our Christian radicals go :

We Should Nuke Iran

Yeah, lets kill em ALL, before they convert us.
0 Replies
 
kickycan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 03:08 pm
freedom4free wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
freedom4free wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
Interesting excerpt:

Quote:
...The Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups that includes al Qaeda in Iraq, issued a statement on a Web forum vowing to continue its holy war against the West. The authenticity of the statement could not be independently verified.

The group said Muslims would be victorious and addressed the pope as "the worshipper of the cross" saying "you and the West are doomed as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere. ... We will break up the cross, spill the liquor and impose head tax, then the only thing acceptable is a conversion (to Islam) or (killed by) the sword."...


CNN


You couldn't have written it better yourself Brandon. Laughing

statement on a web forum hey? - When did you last post here? wana know how long you've been away for.


Your post is no more than an evasion. Please respond to the obvious implication - that radical Muslim leaders often go much farther than the pope did, indeed state that they won't be satisfied until Christians are converted to Islam by force.


Ok, i'll agree with you. Now lets see how far our Christian radicals go :

We Should Nuke Iran

Yeah, lets kill em ALL, before they convert us.


You can't be serious.
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 03:10 pm
kickycan wrote:
freedom4free wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
freedom4free wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
Interesting excerpt:

Quote:
...The Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups that includes al Qaeda in Iraq, issued a statement on a Web forum vowing to continue its holy war against the West. The authenticity of the statement could not be independently verified.

The group said Muslims would be victorious and addressed the pope as "the worshipper of the cross" saying "you and the West are doomed as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere. ... We will break up the cross, spill the liquor and impose head tax, then the only thing acceptable is a conversion (to Islam) or (killed by) the sword."...


CNN


You couldn't have written it better yourself Brandon. Laughing

statement on a web forum hey? - When did you last post here? wana know how long you've been away for.


Your post is no more than an evasion. Please respond to the obvious implication - that radical Muslim leaders often go much farther than the pope did, indeed state that they won't be satisfied until Christians are converted to Islam by force.


Ok, i'll agree with you. Now lets see how far our Christian radicals go :

We Should Nuke Iran

Yeah, lets kill em ALL, before they convert us.


You can't be serious.


This a$$hole is serious. And a certifiable lunny!
0 Replies
 
freedom4free
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 03:19 pm
Oh, forgot to add this -->> [ Rolling Eyes ] to my previous post.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 07:00 pm
Kickycan:

Quote:
I'm sorry you are all such ignorant stupid goat-f*ckers, and I hope you all die very soon.


then later, scoldingly to someone else:

Quote:
You can't be serious.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 08:00 pm
Religion should never be used as a justification for violence. Guns and religion don't mix.

also...

The Muslims don't like the pope because he is the spokesman for a "faith" that promotes the idea that Jesus is God. The Muslims "reason" that the pope is acting on behalf of his church and is NOT biblically accurate on that point.

They see him and his church as blaspheming God with "three" Gods.

I love the pope and I love Christ Jesus I also love Mohammed but I do not believe in the trinity either.

I consider most of the roman catholic faith and protestant faint errant on that point.

I also feel that is is a rather blasphemous point. One may even term the trinity subtle idolatry of the worst kind.

To prop a man up in the face of God is a serious offence.

But I am not God and I believe it is up to God to judge the souls and hearts of people.

Yet we do make our own judgments of others behaviors.

When we judge others of their inner spirit we step ourselves in the face of God and thus commit idolatry also.

The trinity has plagued Christianity and the world for hundreds of years. It may be time for the pope to re-open a real debate or dialogue about that.

Violence and the trinity both eclipse the radiant image of the true God.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 08:02 pm
I doubt that's why.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 08:17 pm
Some may not have read all of the pope's speech.
I read much of the first part a couple of days ago, but need to read it again, both to spend time considering what he said again - he doesn't speak all so simply, never has - and to see whether context matters to my view, whatever that turns out to be.

Slate has a copy of the english translation of the text of the speech on the Vatican website, with highlighted sections for which the article author, Timothy Noah, did footnotes, which you see by clicking on the highlighted sections.

What the Pope Said

Noah explains in the fourth footnote about some rewording.. which at this point I'm neither for or against, just mentioning it.
I plan to sit down with a glass of red wine and read this myself, perhaps tomorrow.
0 Replies
 
kickycan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 09:48 pm
snood wrote:
Kickycan:

Quote:
I'm sorry you are all such ignorant stupid goat-f*ckers, and I hope you all die very soon.


then later, scoldingly to someone else:

Quote:
You can't be serious.


And your point is...?
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 09:54 pm
kickycan wrote:
snood wrote:
Kickycan:

Quote:
I'm sorry you are all such ignorant stupid goat-f*ckers, and I hope you all die very soon.


then later, scoldingly to someone else:

Quote:
You can't be serious.


And your point is...?


...at least as clear as yours...
0 Replies
 
kickycan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2006 11:13 pm
Well, since you aren't clear on it, then let me explain it for you and any retarded people who might happen by...

On second thought, I don't feel like getting into it right now. I think my point was clear in both of those unrelated posts, whether you get it or not.

The long and short of it is that you came along and quoted them, as if that was supposed to mean something. The only conclusion I can come to is that you think you are pointing out some hypocrisy here. If that was your intent, you need to try again, because it isn't there.

I think you're just desperate to pick a fight with me. But don't worry, Snood, it's okay, I don't think any less of you for it.
0 Replies
 
freedom4free
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Sep, 2006 03:47 am
'A man with little sympathy for other faiths'

Pope Benedict is being portrayed as a naive, shy scholar who has accidentally antagonised two major world faiths in a matter of months. In fact he is a shrewd and ruthless operator, argues Madeleine Bunting - and he's dangerous

Tuesday September 19, 2006
The Guardian

Only 18 months into his papacy and already Pope Benedict XVI has stirred up unprecedented controversy. As the explanations and apologies pour out of the Vatican - and thousands of Catholic churches around the world - the questions about what exactly this man intended by quoting a 14th-century Byzantine emperor's insult of the Prophet Mohammed have only multiplied.

Some say this was a case of naivety, of a scholarly theologian stumbling into the glare of a global media storm, blinking with surprise at the outrage he had inadvertently triggered. The learned man's thoughtful reasoning, say some, has been misconstrued and distorted by troublemakers, and the context ignored.

But such explanations are unconvincing. This is a man who has been at the heart of one of the world's multinational institutions for a very long time. He has been privy to how pontifical messages get distorted and magnified by a global media. Shy he may be, but no one has ever before accused this pope of being a remote theologian sitting in an ivory tower. On the contrary, he is a determined, shrewd operator whose track record indicates a man who is not remotely afraid of controversy. He has long been famous for his bruising, ruthless condemnation of those he disagrees with. Senior Catholic theologians such as the German Hans Kung are well familiar with the sharpness of his judgments.

But in the 18 months since Benedict was elected, the wary critics who have always feared this man were lulled into believing that office might have softened his abrasive edges. His encyclical on love won widespread acclaim and the pronouncement on homosexuality being incompatible with the priesthood (and its inference that homosexuals were to blame for the child sex abuse problems in the church) were explained away as an inheritance from Pope John Paul II's reign.

But while the Pope has tried to build a more appealing public image, what has become increasingly clear is that this is a man with little sympathy or imagination for other religious faiths. Famously, the then Cardinal Ratzinger once referred to Buddhism as a form of masturbation for the mind - a remark still repeated among deeply offended Buddhists more than a decade after he said it. Even his apology at the weekend managed to bring Jews into the row.

In fact, Pope Benedict XVI's short papacy has marked a significant departure from the previous pope's stance on interreligious dialogue. John Paul II made some dramatic gestures to rally world religious leaders, the most famous being a gathering in Assisi of every world faith, even African animists, to pray for world peace. He felt keenly the terrible history of Catholic-Jewish relations, and having fought with the Polish resistance to save Jews in the second world war, John Paul II made unprecedented efforts to begin to heal centuries of hostility and indifference on the part of the Catholic church to Europe's Jews. John Paul II also addressed himself to the ancient enmity between Muslims and Catholics; he apologised for the Crusades and was the first Pope to visit a mosque during a visit to Syria in 2001.

In contrast, Pope Benedict has managed to antagonise two major world faiths within a few months. The current anger of Muslims is comparable to the anger and disappointment felt by Jews after his visit to Auschwitz in May. He gave a long address at the site of the former concentration camp and failed to mention anti-semitism, and offered no apology - whether on behalf of his own country, Germany, or on behalf of the Catholic Church. He acknowledged he was a "son of the German people" ... "but not guilty on that account"; he then launched into a highly controversial claim that a "ring of criminals" were responsible for nazism and that the German people were as much their victims as anyone else. This is an argument that has long been discredited in Germany as utterly inadequate in explaining how millions supported the Nazis. Given his own involvement in the Hitler Youth movement as a boy, and his refusal to make a clean breast of the Vatican's acquiescence in the horrors of Nazism by opening its archives to historians, this was a shabby moment in Catholic history. Not for this pope those dramatic, epoch-defining gestures that made the last Pope such a significant global figure.

Even worse, in his Auschwitz address, he managed to argue in a long theological exposition that the real victims of the Holocaust were God and Christianity. As one commentator put it, he managed to claim that Jews were the "themselves bit players - bystanders at their own extermination. The true victim was a metaphysical one." This theological treatise bears the same characteristics as last week's Regensburg lecture; put at its most charitable, they are too clever by half. More plainly speaking, they indicate a deep arrogance rooted in a blinkered Catholic triumphalism which is utterly out of place in the 21st century.

But if his visit to Auschwitz disappointed many and failed to resolve outstanding resentments about the murky role of German Catholicism, this latest incident seems even worse. Quoting Byzantine emperor Manuel II Paleologos, he said: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." It was a gratuitous reawakening of the most entrenched and self-serving of western prejudices - that Muslims have a unique proclivity to violence, a claim that has no basis in history or in current world events (a fact that still eludes too many westerners). Even more bewildering is the fact that his choice of quotation from Manuel II Paleologos, the 14th-century Byzantine emperor, was so insulting of the Prophet. Even the most cursory knowledge of dialogue with Islam teaches - and as a Vatican Cardinal, Pope Benedict XVI would have learned this long ago - that reverence for the Prophet is a non-negotiable. What unites all Muslims is a passionate devotion and commitment to protecting the honour of Muhammad. Given the scale of the offence, the carefully worded apology, actually, gives little ground; he recognises that Muslims have been offended and that he was only quoting, but there is no regret at using such an inappropriate comment or the deep historic resonances it stirs up.

By an uncanny coincidence the legendary Italian journalist Oriana Fallaci died last week. No one connected the two events, but the Pope had already run into controversy in Italy by inviting the rabid Islamophobe to a private audience just months ago. This is the journalist who published a bestseller in 2001 which amounted to a diatribe of invective against Islam. This is the woman who was only too happy to fling out comments such as "Muslims breed like rats" and "the increasing presence of Muslims in Italy and Europe is directly proportional to our loss of freedom." At the time of her papal audience, Fallaci's ranting against Islam had landed her in court and there was outrage at the Pope's insensitive invitation. The Pope refused to backtrack and insisted the meeting was purely "pastoral".

Put last week's lecture in Bavaria and the Fallaci audience alongside his vocal opposition to Turkish membership of the EU, and the picture isn't pretty. On one of the biggest and most volatile issues of our day - the perceived clash between the west and the Muslim world - the Pope seems to have abdicated his papal role of arbitrator, and taken up the arms in a rerun of a medieval fantasy.

An elderly Catholic nun has already been killed in Somalia, perhaps in retaliation for the Pope's remarks; churches have been attacked in the West Bank. How is this papal stupidity going to play out in countries such as Nigeria, where the tensions between Catholics and Muslims frequently flare into riots and death? Or other countries such as Pakistan, where tiny Catholic communities are already beleaguered? Or the Muslim minorities in Catholic countries such as the Philippines - how comfortable do they feel this week?

Two lines of thought emerge from this mess. The first is that the Pope's personal authority has been irrevocably damaged; how now could he ever present himself as a figure of global moral authority and a peacemaker after this? At the weekend, a message was read out from Cardinal Murphy O'Connor at all masses in Catholic churches in England; he spoke of the regret at any offence caused and urged good relations between Catholics and Muslims. For a church that prides itself on taking centuries to respond, this was unprecedented crisis management. It cannot but damage the pope's authority with the faithful that such emergency measures were necessary, and it compromises not just this pope but the papal office itself. (This is a job, after all, that is supposed to be divinely guided and at all times beyond reproach: a claim that looks a bit threadbare after the past few days.)

The second is a more disturbing possibility: namely, that the Catholic church could be failing - yet again - to deal with the challenge of modernity. In the 19th and 20th centuries, it struggled to adapt to an increasingly educated and questioning faithful; now, in the 21st century, it is in danger of failing the great challenge of how we forge new ways of accommodating difference in a crowded, mobile world. The Catholic church has to make a dramatic break with its triumphalist, bigoted past if it is to contribute in any constructive way to chart this new course. John Paul II made some dramatic steps in this direction; but the fear now is that Pope Benedict XVI has no intention of following suit, and that he has another direction altogether in mind.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/pope/story/0,,1875791,00.html
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Sep, 2006 04:41 am
kickycan wrote:
Well, since you aren't clear on it, then let me explain it for you and any retarded people who might happen by...

On second thought, I don't feel like getting into it right now. I think my point was clear in both of those unrelated posts, whether you get it or not.

The long and short of it is that you came along and quoted them, as if that was supposed to mean something. The only conclusion I can come to is that you think you are pointing out some hypocrisy here. If that was your intent, you need to try again, because it isn't there.

I think you're just desperate to pick a fight with me. But don't worry, Snood, it's okay, I don't think any less of you for it.


Oh thank you Mr Kickycan, for deigning to stoop to explain your goofy nonsense. And since you did, let me try to point out the obvious hypocrisy that you will never "get", for the smart and sensitive posters who happen by. You think you can blithely refer to a population of over a billion people as "ignorant stupid goat-fuckers" on the one hand, and then turn around and expect to be taken seriously when you feign incredulity at someone else's words. Your words paint you very clearly as the lowest kind of stupid racist ****, and I don't think any less of you for that, simply because it's not possible for me to think any less of you.

And just for the record, if you left this forum forever, I wouldn't miss you, your stupid, adolescent, misogynistic and racist "humor", or any opportunity to "pick a fight" with the likes of you. I simply stand up to your ignorance when you spew it.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Sep, 2006 05:34 am
No matter how you couch the language, the Pope made a serious error. You cannot publicly say the words quoted in the article without knowing they will be seized upon for violent reaction.


freedom4free wrote:
'A man with little sympathy for other faiths'

Pope Benedict is being portrayed as a naive, shy scholar who has accidentally antagonised two major world faiths in a matter of months. In fact he is a shrewd and ruthless operator, argues Madeleine Bunting - and he's dangerous

Tuesday September 19, 2006
The Guardian

Only 18 months into his papacy and already Pope Benedict XVI has stirred up unprecedented controversy. As the explanations and apologies pour out of the Vatican - and thousands of Catholic churches around the world - the questions about what exactly this man intended by quoting a 14th-century Byzantine emperor's insult of the Prophet Mohammed have only multiplied.

Some say this was a case of naivety, of a scholarly theologian stumbling into the glare of a global media storm, blinking with surprise at the outrage he had inadvertently triggered. The learned man's thoughtful reasoning, say some, has been misconstrued and distorted by troublemakers, and the context ignored.

But such explanations are unconvincing. This is a man who has been at the heart of one of the world's multinational institutions for a very long time. He has been privy to how pontifical messages get distorted and magnified by a global media. Shy he may be, but no one has ever before accused this pope of being a remote theologian sitting in an ivory tower. On the contrary, he is a determined, shrewd operator whose track record indicates a man who is not remotely afraid of controversy. He has long been famous for his bruising, ruthless condemnation of those he disagrees with. Senior Catholic theologians such as the German Hans Kung are well familiar with the sharpness of his judgments.

But in the 18 months since Benedict was elected, the wary critics who have always feared this man were lulled into believing that office might have softened his abrasive edges. His encyclical on love won widespread acclaim and the pronouncement on homosexuality being incompatible with the priesthood (and its inference that homosexuals were to blame for the child sex abuse problems in the church) were explained away as an inheritance from Pope John Paul II's reign.

But while the Pope has tried to build a more appealing public image, what has become increasingly clear is that this is a man with little sympathy or imagination for other religious faiths. Famously, the then Cardinal Ratzinger once referred to Buddhism as a form of masturbation for the mind - a remark still repeated among deeply offended Buddhists more than a decade after he said it. Even his apology at the weekend managed to bring Jews into the row.

In fact, Pope Benedict XVI's short papacy has marked a significant departure from the previous pope's stance on interreligious dialogue. John Paul II made some dramatic gestures to rally world religious leaders, the most famous being a gathering in Assisi of every world faith, even African animists, to pray for world peace. He felt keenly the terrible history of Catholic-Jewish relations, and having fought with the Polish resistance to save Jews in the second world war, John Paul II made unprecedented efforts to begin to heal centuries of hostility and indifference on the part of the Catholic church to Europe's Jews. John Paul II also addressed himself to the ancient enmity between Muslims and Catholics; he apologised for the Crusades and was the first Pope to visit a mosque during a visit to Syria in 2001.

In contrast, Pope Benedict has managed to antagonise two major world faiths within a few months. The current anger of Muslims is comparable to the anger and disappointment felt by Jews after his visit to Auschwitz in May. He gave a long address at the site of the former concentration camp and failed to mention anti-semitism, and offered no apology - whether on behalf of his own country, Germany, or on behalf of the Catholic Church. He acknowledged he was a "son of the German people" ... "but not guilty on that account"; he then launched into a highly controversial claim that a "ring of criminals" were responsible for nazism and that the German people were as much their victims as anyone else. This is an argument that has long been discredited in Germany as utterly inadequate in explaining how millions supported the Nazis. Given his own involvement in the Hitler Youth movement as a boy, and his refusal to make a clean breast of the Vatican's acquiescence in the horrors of Nazism by opening its archives to historians, this was a shabby moment in Catholic history. Not for this pope those dramatic, epoch-defining gestures that made the last Pope such a significant global figure.

Even worse, in his Auschwitz address, he managed to argue in a long theological exposition that the real victims of the Holocaust were God and Christianity. As one commentator put it, he managed to claim that Jews were the "themselves bit players - bystanders at their own extermination. The true victim was a metaphysical one." This theological treatise bears the same characteristics as last week's Regensburg lecture; put at its most charitable, they are too clever by half. More plainly speaking, they indicate a deep arrogance rooted in a blinkered Catholic triumphalism which is utterly out of place in the 21st century.

But if his visit to Auschwitz disappointed many and failed to resolve outstanding resentments about the murky role of German Catholicism, this latest incident seems even worse. Quoting Byzantine emperor Manuel II Paleologos, he said: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." It was a gratuitous reawakening of the most entrenched and self-serving of western prejudices - that Muslims have a unique proclivity to violence, a claim that has no basis in history or in current world events (a fact that still eludes too many westerners). Even more bewildering is the fact that his choice of quotation from Manuel II Paleologos, the 14th-century Byzantine emperor, was so insulting of the Prophet. Even the most cursory knowledge of dialogue with Islam teaches - and as a Vatican Cardinal, Pope Benedict XVI would have learned this long ago - that reverence for the Prophet is a non-negotiable. What unites all Muslims is a passionate devotion and commitment to protecting the honour of Muhammad. Given the scale of the offence, the carefully worded apology, actually, gives little ground; he recognises that Muslims have been offended and that he was only quoting, but there is no regret at using such an inappropriate comment or the deep historic resonances it stirs up.

By an uncanny coincidence the legendary Italian journalist Oriana Fallaci died last week. No one connected the two events, but the Pope had already run into controversy in Italy by inviting the rabid Islamophobe to a private audience just months ago. This is the journalist who published a bestseller in 2001 which amounted to a diatribe of invective against Islam. This is the woman who was only too happy to fling out comments such as "Muslims breed like rats" and "the increasing presence of Muslims in Italy and Europe is directly proportional to our loss of freedom." At the time of her papal audience, Fallaci's ranting against Islam had landed her in court and there was outrage at the Pope's insensitive invitation. The Pope refused to backtrack and insisted the meeting was purely "pastoral".

Put last week's lecture in Bavaria and the Fallaci audience alongside his vocal opposition to Turkish membership of the EU, and the picture isn't pretty. On one of the biggest and most volatile issues of our day - the perceived clash between the west and the Muslim world - the Pope seems to have abdicated his papal role of arbitrator, and taken up the arms in a rerun of a medieval fantasy.

An elderly Catholic nun has already been killed in Somalia, perhaps in retaliation for the Pope's remarks; churches have been attacked in the West Bank. How is this papal stupidity going to play out in countries such as Nigeria, where the tensions between Catholics and Muslims frequently flare into riots and death? Or other countries such as Pakistan, where tiny Catholic communities are already beleaguered? Or the Muslim minorities in Catholic countries such as the Philippines - how comfortable do they feel this week?

Two lines of thought emerge from this mess. The first is that the Pope's personal authority has been irrevocably damaged; how now could he ever present himself as a figure of global moral authority and a peacemaker after this? At the weekend, a message was read out from Cardinal Murphy O'Connor at all masses in Catholic churches in England; he spoke of the regret at any offence caused and urged good relations between Catholics and Muslims. For a church that prides itself on taking centuries to respond, this was unprecedented crisis management. It cannot but damage the pope's authority with the faithful that such emergency measures were necessary, and it compromises not just this pope but the papal office itself. (This is a job, after all, that is supposed to be divinely guided and at all times beyond reproach: a claim that looks a bit threadbare after the past few days.)

The second is a more disturbing possibility: namely, that the Catholic church could be failing - yet again - to deal with the challenge of modernity. In the 19th and 20th centuries, it struggled to adapt to an increasingly educated and questioning faithful; now, in the 21st century, it is in danger of failing the great challenge of how we forge new ways of accommodating difference in a crowded, mobile world. The Catholic church has to make a dramatic break with its triumphalist, bigoted past if it is to contribute in any constructive way to chart this new course. John Paul II made some dramatic steps in this direction; but the fear now is that Pope Benedict XVI has no intention of following suit, and that he has another direction altogether in mind.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/pope/story/0,,1875791,00.html
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