Political Correctness: Make a Judgment

OCCOM BILL wrote:

I don't think Snood ever said anything quite as extreme as Set saddled him with. I'll usually accept the interpretation of phrases from the person who made them, unless they are in obvious back-tracking mode and Snood has backtracked not one iota... beyond corrections he openly admitted to.

I didn't "saddle" Snood with anything. Snood said that being black gave him a better idea of how others "regard" him. That was the portion of his statement to which i took exception. Specifically, this is what he wrote:

Quote:

I had someone on this forum tell me that being an african american man gave me no better idea about how african american men are regarded in america. Still trips me out to this day...(emphasis added)

That's a direct quote, and in case anyone wishes to deny it, they need only read the thread again. I have highlighted his use of the verb "to regard." Being black doesn't give him a better idea of how he is regarded. He has very definitely "back-tracked," because he eventually came to see that his position was unsupportable, and changed the verb from "to regard" to "to treat." Despite the idiocy in which KW indulged, regard and treat are not even remotely synonymous.

So i didn't "saddle" him with any extreme statement, i took him to task for precisely what he wrote. If you have a problem with that, then it is your problem, and will, i suspect, chiefly reside in a problem with the meanings of words in the English language.

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I love Bill too. And it definitely don't involve squeezing anything.

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Obill wrote

Quote:

... and would have quoted it, had your subsequent posts relating to it not been even more clueless. It struck me terribly funny when Snood brought up his bride to be... and you still didn't get it.

Oh I got it, but I thought it nonproductive to refer to it since it had nothing to do with what I was saying. I do hope Snood's real life white friends, and/or his wife, don't have to walk on eggshells around him to keep from offending him or being misunderstood and/or mischaracterized as is the impression he sometimes gives here. People don't generally become a 'call me up at 2 am if you need me' kind of friend with those they have to be super careful around.

I am grateful to have my friend who does not need or expect me to 'be careful' around her and sure knows she doesn't have to 'be careful' around me.

As for that march, I'll just wish you well and hope you remembered to put your gel insoles in. Smile

_________________
--Foxfyre

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I?-
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

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Oh, they don't walk on any eggshells. They just don't get to call me ni**er, that's all. All in all, not a lot to ask from a relationship.

Laughing

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snood wrote:

Oh, they don't walk on any eggshells. They just don't get to call me ni**er, that's all. All in all, not a lot to ask from a relationship.

Boy, that's really putting them out... Laughing

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I hope someday you will have a friend you love enough that no word would have the power to hurt you. In fact, when we reach the point that words as ugly as the 'n' word and worse have no more power to hurt and/or offend, we can truly say that there is no more racism in America.

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It sounds like you're trying to say you have somehow better love or better friendships. I don't accept that.

And yeah, one day maybe all people can live in love and peace, with no racism or ugliness of any type. Good point. Shocked

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People are different. Snood's friends would know not to ever use that word with him--while other people think nothing of it with close friends.

I would like to know if snood has any black friends that refer to him as Nigger---

I can accept his barriers with friends-- I just resent that he refuses to accept my lack of those barriers with my friends.

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Words matter. For instance, you're calling it a "barrier" between me and my loved ones - that we don't call each other that name. I see it as a healthy boundary. That name needs retiring. More and more, people are coming awake to that - even those to whom its use had become so wretchedly commonplace - the hiphop industry.

It's more than a little strange for you to be wondering aloud if I have black friends I use that name with. If you and your black friends are so comfortable with it, why would that matter a whit?

I don't accept that its "cool" for you to be using it, or that its somehow negative for me not to like it when anyone uses it. But I guess I just have to live with you and Foxfyre's insistence that it's okay with your "call them at 2 AM" black friends, and you have to live with the fact that I think its sick.

Que sera.

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Snood writes

Quote:

If you and your black friends are so comfortable with it, why would that matter a whit?

It all goes back to your previous point that you know better than I or any other non-black person how people regard a black man. The more you attempt to characterize Lash or me as 'sick', the more you dig yourself into the obvious realization that you don't have a clue how anybody other than yourself or those who inform you how you are regarded or any black person is regarded or any person at all is regarded.

We, however, can conclude that you regard negatively anybody who doesn't see the world as you see it. And that includes any black people who are different from you. (I'm still remembering how you referred to Clarence Thomas, Thomas Sowell, Condi Rice et al as 'hanky heads'.)

I fully accept that the 'n' word is ugly, insulting, and could be painful when used as a slur towards anybody. I fully accept that there are a lot of words that are ugly, insulting, and could be painful when used as a slur towards anybody. I for the life of me can't understand how anybody could object to two close friends teasing each other with playful insults using whatever words in private banter. And I am frankly sorry for anybody who is incapable of that kind of relationship.
_________________
--Foxfyre

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I?-
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

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Well, save your pity for those who consciously participate in the use of a word whose legacy is so caustic, for whatever reasons. Your "friendly banter" has to remain "private" because it would not stand up to the light of day.

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And by all means lets keep the legacy of caustic words intact and feed it incessantly to ensure that we can get the most possible mileage out of it to justify whatever hate, resentment, or victimhood one can mine out of it. Heaven forbid that we should get past racism and all other -isms so that people can actually see and treat people as people instead of black people or white people or whatever. Even further that people might finally see themselves as people instead of black or white or whatever and arrive at a point that such hateful words lose their power entirely.
_________________
--Foxfyre

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I?-
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

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''When we say 'nigger' now, it's very positive. Now all white kids who buy into hip-hop culture call each other 'nigger' because they have no history with the word other than something positive. . . . When black kids call each other 'a real nigger' or 'my nigger,' it means you walk a certain way . . . have your own culture that you invent so you don't have to buy into the US culture that you're not really a part of. It means we're special. We have our own language."

Russell Simmons

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HokieBird wrote:

''When we say 'nigger' now, it's very positive. Now all white kids who buy into hip-hop culture call each other 'nigger' because they have no history with the word other than something positive. . . . When black kids call each other 'a real nigger' or 'my nigger,' it means you walk a certain way . . . have your own culture that you invent so you don't have to buy into the US culture that you're not really a part of. It means we're special. We have our own language."

Russell Simmons

Derrick Z. Jackson in IHT (December 15, 2005):
The N-word and Richard Pryor

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Same with Tarbaby, snood.

It was OK with you when a friend said it --and a "point of deep insult" when a Republican said it.

That really tells us all we need to now about why you choose to take offense, and why you don't...

You never answered if your black friends use it...

This isn't about race--it's about usage and why people make the decisions about it that they do.

You want to beat people wiht words---when it suits you.

I reject that.

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snood wrote:

However, thousands of other Americans that plop their dollars down for racist furnishings, as well as the manufacturers of them, aren't interested in their historic value, or in making and using them to educate others on the danger of racial intolerance. They're interested in making a buck even if means demeaning blacks. That can't be blamed on a racist computer.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/earl-ofari-hutchinson/toms-coon-and-mammy-home_b_47322.html

According to Rolling Stone, rappers Diddy, 50 Cent, Eminem, Jay-Z, Kanye West and Dr. Dre made a total of $113M in 2006. Seems they're also interested in making a buck "even if it means demeaning blacks".

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I don't "want to whip people" with words or anything else.

I reject that.

My motives are far clearer than yours, Lash. After all these 80 pages, for instance, its hard to tell just how much you really do enjoy "pissing off the negros", as you so cleverly put it.

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I seem to sense an increase in the efforts of people to get away with politically incorrect usages--it almost seems to be a challenge to do so. Being rude, as as Snood calls it, "caustic" is being lowly of nature and action, if you ask me. And trying to "get away with it" smacks of a kind of social adolescence, a lack of adult poise and manner.

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yes. I've often thought (and occasionally said) those who whine loudest about the horrors of the "politically correct" are those who mourn the loss of the freedom to malign at will. If it weren't for those damn "PC police", we could have more nig*er jokes, more sambo memorabilia, more jemimah pancake boxes, ...more fun!

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Political Correctness: Make a Judgment

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