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What's happening with those poor devils at Camp Xray ???

 
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Nov, 2003 02:33 pm
scrat, so why did the US release these guys?
0 Replies
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Nov, 2003 02:43 pm
dyslexia wrote:
scrat, so why did the US release these guys?

You did read the article, right?

My guess is that these guys pose little or no threat to the US at this time and have little or no intelligence value. It is also possible that they were detained in error.
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Nov, 2003 02:46 pm
yeah, I can read,(although I am not so secure in cursive) is that your question?
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Nov, 2003 02:49 pm
Quote:
It is also possible that they were detained in error.

Nah, never! Aren't they guilty of being "other than American?" Rolling Eyes
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Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Nov, 2003 02:50 pm
dyslexia wrote:
yeah, I can read,(although I am not so secure in cursive) is that your question?

Sorry, I guess that really wasn't called for. My point is that you have the same information as I do. Why do you think they were released?
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Nov, 2003 02:57 pm
scrat. my best guess is that the US picked up everyone in the arena and then slowly have made amends.
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Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Nov, 2003 09:42 am
dyslexia wrote:
scrat. my best guess is that the US picked up everyone in the arena and then slowly have made amends.

I think "everyone" is a stretch, but yes, I suspect they cast a pretty wide net and figured it would be better to have to apologize for detaining the wrong people than to have to apologize for not detaining the right ones.

And I know that it is a hardship for any who were held (are being held) who are innocent of any wrongdoing. I hope that they are a very small minority of the group and my heart goes out to them and their families.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Nov, 2003 03:18 pm
The Australian Government says it has reached a deal with the United States for the trial of two Australians held at Guantanamo Bay.

Guantanamo deal for Australia duo
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 02:07 pm
One of Britain's most senior judges has condemned the US over the detention of terror suspects at Guantanamo Bay.

Lord Steyn said conditions at Camp Delta were of "utter lawlessness", in a speech seen by Channel 4 News.

The Law Lord said the US was guilty of a "monstrous failure of justice" and challenged UK ministers to condemn the decision to hold any prisoners there.

He said detainees were "beyond the rule of law, beyond the protection of any courts and at the mercy of victors".
Top UK judge slams Camp Delta
0 Replies
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 02:31 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
One of Britain's most senior judges has condemned the US over the detention of terror suspects at Guantanamo Bay.

F#$% him.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 02:56 pm
Why?
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Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 02:59 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Why?

Because who gives a rat's ass what he thinks? It's amazing to me how eagerly you cite anyone and everyone who comes out on your side of an issue. Then you think that everyone ought to value this nobody's opinion because it agrees with your own.
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hobitbob
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:07 pm
Scrat: Poster child for American Exclusivism. Rolling Eyes
The US does not exist in a vacuum. Might does not make right, and right now "patriotic Americans" with a f#ck the world attitude are doing their best to prove that the real "rogue state" is the USA. !
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:08 pm
Scrat wrote:
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Why?

Because who gives a rat's ass what he thinks?

Anyone who is interested in hearing competent legal opinions about the subject. While there is no practical relevance to the fact that a British judge came out on Walter's side of the issue, this judge is nevertheless an expert of law, in a legal system not too different from America's. Judging by the history of this thread, it is you, Scrat -- not Walter -- who stubbornly refuses to take seriously anyone who disagrees with him.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:08 pm
Perhaps you didn't notice
a) that wolf, and not you created this thread,
b) the title of this thread,
c) that I quoted one of the many media reports about this, here from the BBC.


Another question: why do you think, the Rt. Hon. Lord Steyn of Swafield to be a nobody?
Did you have lectures by him? Reviewed his books?
Or have you been on one of his trials? (It's a Law Lord, so that should have been a very serious case.)
0 Replies
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:23 pm
Thomas wrote:
Scrat wrote:
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Why?

Because who gives a rat's ass what he thinks?

Anyone who is interested in hearing competent legal opinions about the subject. While there is no practical relevance to the fact that a British judge came out on Walter's side of the issue, this judge is nevertheless an expert of law, in a legal system not too different from America's. Judging by the history of this thread, it is you, Scrat -- not Walter -- who stubbornly refuses to take seriously anyone who disagrees with him.

Last things first, the only thing I refuse stubbornly is to agree with others who happen to be failing to agree with me, so if I am to be called "stubborn" they are equally so.

Next, would you assert that every person who becomes a judge must be considered an "expert of law"?

Lastly, the judge in question commented thusly:
Quote:
He said detainees were "beyond the rule of law, beyond the protection of any courts and at the mercy of victors".

I happen to believe that the detainees belong "at the mercy of victors", and think them lucky that we were the victors, for they'd likely be dead at the hands of any other power, instead of getting 3 hots and a cot, better medical care than most have ever known, freedom to practice their religion, etc..

Once again this judge (as are so many who are whining about this) asserts that these people should be being treated as criminals before a criminal court, when that is simply not what they are.

Don't get me wrong, I can certainly see arguments that at some point the US needs to at least suggest what the endgame is for the detainees, but I am far less concerned with the possibility that they have been denied a few rights (which they likely forfeited through their own behavior) than I would be allowing them freedom to cause other innocents to forfeit their lives.

But sure, my "F@#$ him" was a bit over the top. My point was that I could not care less what this limey judge thinks. Of course, you and Walter have every right to care what he thinks if you wish.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:30 pm
Scrat wrote:
Next, would you assert that every person who becomes a judge must be considered an "expert of law"?


Although you didn't address the question to me,

yes - when it is in Britain or any other countries, where judges have to study law before the are appointed to this job.

Besides, Lord Steyn is a quite wellknown expert. Even in the USA.
0 Replies
 
Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:32 pm
"I hope we shall... crush in its birth the aristocracy of our
moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our
government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of
our country." --Thomas Jefferson to George Logan, 1816
0 Replies
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:36 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Scrat wrote:
Next, would you assert that every person who becomes a judge must be considered an "expert of law"?


Although you didn't address the question to me,

yes - when it is in Britain or any other countries, where judges have to study law before the are appointed to this job.

Besides, Lord Steyn is a quite wellknown expert. Even in the USA.

Then you would not disagree with any opinion reached by any judge?
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Nov, 2003 03:38 pm
Scrat wrote:
Next, would you assert that every person who becomes a judge must be considered an "expert of law"?

Unless there is evidence to the contrary, yes. There are incompetent judges just like there are incompetent pilots. But we consider every pilot to be an expert in flying unless he gratuitiously crashes a plane. Likewise, we should consider every judge an expert of law unless he does the legal equivalent of a pilot crashing a plane. Reaching different conclusions than His Scratness doesn't fall in that category. And if you have anything else to hold against this particular judge, you haven't told us what it is yet.
0 Replies
 
 

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