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The Worst President in History?

 
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 01:29 am
Mr FartR, your apology to Setanta is due.
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 01:44 am
Hingehead wrote:

I never mentioned GDP (go back and look loser boy). I only mentioned Defence spending. Screw reading your links - you don't even read short posts like this one.

end of quote.

To mention Defence spending of a country and suggest that it is too much is like saying that Bill Gates gave TEN BILLION TO CHARITY without knowing how much money he has!!!

Is Ten Billion a lot? It isn't to Bill Gates. Why? He is said to be worth 50 Billion Dollars. Ten Billion is only 20% of his total worth.


Therefore, Hingehead, when you complain that the US spent 5 Billion on Defense in one year, that means NOTHING unless you know how much the USA PRODUCED IN THAT YEAR!

Find someone who knows Economics. If you pay close attention, you may begin to understand.

I will try to restate if for you in a simple, almost elementary way--

The government's( ANY GOVERNMENT) ability to handle its debt is tied to the size and strength of its economy or Gross Domestic Product>
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 02:23 am
Returning to the subject of the thread and away from the troll's musings.......

As Jon Stewart puts it:


"There comes a point in every president's career when he has to reassure the people that he isn't the thing that everybody thinks they are. Richard Nixon famously said, 'I am not a crook.' Bill Clinton assured us, 'I did not have sex with that woman.' What point does this president have to clear up?"

Joe(Who wants to answer this one?)Nation
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 02:33 am
The point that this president has to clear up? Why it is that the lefties like Joe Notion do not know that the Islamo-Fascists want to kill us!

Joe Notion does not know that the Islamo-Fascists nearly attacked Germany with suitcase bombs on Germantrains.

Joe Notion does not know that the Nations of the world are learning that the ISlamo-Fascists hate everyone who is not a Muslim.

Joe Notion does not know that Spain learned it, the British learned it, the Malaysians learned it, and, now, the Germans almost have learned it.

Poor Joe Notion!!
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 02:50 am
Sorry, that's not a response to the question. Anyone else?

Joe(I was never at Ft. Bragg)Nation
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 02:52 am
Well, the reason you don't think it is a response to the question is that you can't read- Joe Notion!
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 02:55 am
dyslexia wrote:
Mr FartR, your apology to Setanta is due.
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 03:02 am
No, Cyrano does not apologize to Valvert who called him a "putz" because Setanta has no wit..not an atom and of letters, he needs but three to set him down-ASS-An Ass!
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 03:12 am
Bi-Polar Bear wrote:
BernardR wrote:
No, you weren't in the bars I went to--We didn't cater to "legs" in those days. We merely roughed them up and left them in the trash outside.

Did that ever happen to you? It would explain a great deal!!!


Bernard name the bars in Fayetteville on the strip from those days and the two main streets they were on..... please now and not hours from now after you've googled the info from your wheelchair.....

....
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 05:48 am
Joe Nation wrote:
As Jon Stewart puts it:


"There comes a point in every president's career when he has to reassure the people that he isn't the thing that everybody thinks they are. Richard Nixon famously said, 'I am not a crook.' Bill Clinton assured us, 'I did not have sex with that woman.' What point does this president have to clear up?"

Joe(Who wants to answer this one?)Nation


I somehow doubt it will be 'I am not an idiot.'
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Aug, 2006 11:44 pm
Hingehead wrote; Regarding President Bush--


I somehow doubt it will be 'I am not an idiot.'

Hingehead, as usual, gives no evidence.

I will give evidence, statistical evidence that Hingehead may not be familiar with that will show that Hingehead is the idiot, not President Bush.

If Hingehead can read, he is directed to the evidence below> Of course, if he has statistics that an disprove any of the material he is welcome to give them.





The Worst President in History?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, Hingehead , here is some more evidence you can chew on.

If you disagree with the evidence, please be so good as to say EXACTLY WHY!!!

Source- http://www.Vdare.com/sailer/kerry_iq_lower.htm


I just think Americans need to know the truth.

In the long run, however, we do need to think about the quality of the candidates our current primary system is producing. Are these two the best our nation of nearly 300,000,000 can put forward?

Despite Howell Raines's diktat on the natural superiority of the liberal candidate, quoted in my epigraph, there was always room for doubt that Kerry was objectively sharper than Bush. While Bush mangles the English language, Kerry inundates it in dependent clauses. Chris Suellentrop recently reported in Slate how Kerry somehow bloviated the 2,500 crisply-written words his speechwriters handed to him into 5,300 soggily-spoken words.

Bush's 1206 SAT score on the college entrance exam and his C average at Yale have been public knowledge since the last election. (Bush's Graduate Management Aptitude Test score and grades at Harvard Business School, however, are not known.)

Kerry's grades and academic test scores remain wholly unavailable. But we do know that he did not graduate from Yale with honors. His biography by three Boston Globe reporters recounts:

"During his senior year he 'majored in flying,' as Kerry put it, learning aerobatics and performing loop-de-loops instead of focusing on his studies."

After fighting and losing the most expensive Congressional race in the country in 1972, Kerry wound up the next year at a surprisingly non-glittering law school, Boston College. The Boston Globe biography reports:

"A nationally known figure, Kerry was not your typical law student. 'I remember looking up at my first-year class, and sitting there, big as life, was this guy I had seen on television, testifying before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and running for Congress,' recalls Thomas J. Carey Jr., one of Kerry's professors. 'He stood out from the beginning.'"

Then three weeks ago, a minister in Florida named Sam Sewell, a Navy veteran and Mensa member who works with gifted children with learning disabilities, pointed out to me that, although no one in the press had noticed it, the Kerry campaign had posted on the Web the Senator's score on the IQ-like test he took when he applied to join the Navy as an officer on February 18, 1966.

After interviewing military psychometricians and reading Defense Department reports from the 1960s on the development of the tests, I can now compare Kerry's score on the Navy's Officer Qualification Test to Bush's score on the Air Force Officer Qualifying Test.

Kerry's PDF file on JohnKerry.com is blurry, but it appears to read:

TEST
FORM
RAW
SCORE
STAND. [?]

SCORE

OFFICER QUALIFI-CATION TEST
7
58
50


To help me make sense out of this, a retired Navy psychometrician advised me to buy from the National Technical Information Service a 1961 technical bulletin called "Development of the Officer Qualification Test, Forms 7 and 8" by Smith, Guttman, Proctor, and Sharp of the Bureau of Naval Personnel.

According to this documentation, the Form 7 of the Navy's OQT that Kerry took in 1966 was a 90-minute pencil and paper test consisting of 35 verbal analogy questions, 30 mechanical comprehension questions, and 50 arithmetic reasoning questions.

Kerry got 58 out of 115 questions right, or 50.4 percent.

The bulletin explained that,

"The Verbal Analogies section emphasizes understanding of conceptual relations rather than knowledge of vocabulary. The Mechanical Comprehension section calls for ability to understand mechanical principles and ability to apply them to visually presented problems. The Arithmetic Reasoning section measures skill in arithmetic reasoning and problem solving, and requires an understanding of basic arithmetic processes."

In the validation process, the test was found to have a satisfactory correlation of about 0.6 with various measures of success in Officer Candidate School.

To standardize this new version of the test when it was developed in the early 1960, it was given to "approximately 1600 applicants to OCS [Officer Candidate School]."

The mean raw score (i.e., number of questions answered correctly) of the preliminary norming group on Form 7 was 57.11?-almost identical to Kerry's 58?-with a standard deviation of 16.14. In other words, Kerry finished almost exactly at the 50th percentile.

(Technically, the "50" on his record appears to refer to his "Navy Standard Score." This is a bell curve-based scoring system where the midpoint is 50 and each standard deviation is 10, so that a score of, say, 60 would fall at the 84th percentile and a score of 70 would fall just below the 98th percentile. In Kerry's case, though, the differences between percentile and Navy Standard Score don't matter, because the midpoint for both scales is 50?-his score on both.)

It's possible that the test slightly underestimated Kerry's overall cognitive ability?-if he is a stronger verbal thinker than mathematical or visual thinker. And this seems likely. He was political science major at Yale and then went to law school, a typical verbalist's career path.

The Navy test was tilted in the opposite direction. When the Navy's OQT was revised in 1961, the number of arithmetic reasoning questions was boosted from 20 to 50 because of "a study by Wollnack and Guttman (1960), which found that quantitative reasoning items were the most valid predictors of OCS performance."

During the 3.5 month-long Officer Candidate School, Kerry outperformed his test score, finishing 80th out of his class of 563.

I found two other class ranks for Kerry. In a ten-week class on damage-control, Kerry ranked 17th out of 33 (p. 2 of this 5 megabyte PDF). In a three-week Command and Control course, he ranked 7th of 22 (p. 4).

So, if Kerry is about as smart as the average applicant to the Navy's Officer Candidate School, how smart is he?

It's certainly nothing to be ashamed of. To take the test, applicants were supposed to be college graduates, or on track toward a four-year degree, or be high scorers on the IQ test for enlisted men, the AFQT. The average IQ of a college graduate is typically close to one standard deviation above the national mean, over the 80th percentile. Charles Murray, co-author of The Bell Curve, told me that, in the huge National Longitudinal Study of Youth that was featured in his book, the average college graduate's IQ, as measured by the AFQT, was 114.

(A quick summary of IQ scoring: Scores are assumed to fall according to a "normal distribution," or bell curve, with the average score at 100. Each standard deviation is 15 points. So, a 115 IQ falls at the 84th percentile and a 130 IQ at the 97.7th percentile.)

Perhaps a better way to estimate Kerry's IQ is to look at the average SAT scores of military officers.

A second Navy psychometrician told me about a major study he had conducted:

"I looked at the SAT scores of new officers from 1975 through 1985, by separate fiscal year. For each of the eleven years examined, new officers in the Navy had the highest SAT mean scores (on SAT-Verbal and SAT-Math) among all four services. Overall, including all officers commissioned from 1975 through 1985 combined, SAT scores were as follows:"

1975-1985
SAT-Math
SAT-Verbal
Total
Recentered * (post 1994 scores)

Navy
584
519
1103
1188

Air Force
557
494
1051
1132

Marines
531
487
1018
1113

Army
522
479
1001
1098

Male high school seniors
495
437
932
1032


[* The "recentered" column converts these average scores into the easier scoring system that the College Board adopted in the mid-1990s.]

So, the average SAT score for Navy officers was 1103 (old style).

Of course, the SAT isn't taken by high school dropouts, nor by students who don't intend to go to college. So the true national average would have been much lower, probably around 800 under the old (uninflated) style scoring system.

Can we convert the average Navy officer's SAT score of 1103 into a rough IQ? There's a reasonable correlation between SAT and IQ.

The standard deviation of the SAT was around 230 back then, so if the typical Navy officer scored 1100, or 300 points above the estimated national average of 800, then his IQ was about 1.3 standard deviations above the national average IQ of 100 -- roughly 120, or maybe a little higher, which is in the low 90s on a percentile scale.

Of course, Kerry's OQT score was average for applicants for Officer Candidate School, not for officers, who presumably score better than those who flunk the test. This suggests he might have scored under 1100 on his SAT.

Another complication: it's not clear whether the applicant pool was stronger or weaker when Kerry's version of the test was normed in 1961 than in this 1975-1985 period for which we have data.

The draft was in effect in 1961, so many young men chose to volunteer to be an officer rather than to be drafted into the enlisted ranks. The late 1970s in contrast, were the early years of the all-volunteer military. Recruiting was notoriously difficult and the quality of the military drooped. But then, in the Reagan 1980s, pay increases and revived patriotism brought in better recruits.

An SAT score of 1100 for Kerry seems low, however, because that might have been low enough to keep him out of Yale, which he entered in 1962. I don't know the average SAT score at Yale at that time, but The Bell Curve reports that in 1960, the Harvard freshman class averaged 1373.

Yale turned down Former Senator Bill Bradley, who challenged Al Gore for the Democratic nomination in 2000, despite being an outstanding basketball player, because his SAT-Verbal score was only 485. Bradley was accepted by Princeton and became a Rhodes Scholar. But, although he built a good reputation in the Senate, his dull style during his dismal 2000 Presidential campaign certainly did not disprove his SAT score's validity.

Two years after Kerry's admission to Yale, Bush slid into Yale too. According to a 1999 article in The New Yorker, he had a 566 Verbal - 640 Math, for a 1206 total (which would be about 1280 today). Combined with Bush's mediocre grades in prep school, this meant he was left sweating over whether he'd get in. During spring break in 1964, Bush downplayed expectations by telling friends how much he looked forward to attending the University of Texas, which was his "safety school."

Kerry, being a Forbes, had family pull too?-but certainly no more than Bush, whose father and grandfather were Yalies. And the latter, Prescott Bush, had been U.S. Senator from Yale's state of Connecticut until the year before.

During the 1960s, Yale tightened up entrance requirements for sons of graduates considerably, especially in the year after Bush was admitted. The late historian Jim Chapin, who taught at Yale during those years, told me that the intellectual quality of his students leapt upwards the next year.

This sudden arrival of so many brainy, bookish, leftwing nobodies may be a major reason Bush became so alienated from Yale during his later years there.

Still, it's important to keep in mind that Kerry was admitted two years before Bush?-when admission was even less meritocratic.

(By the way, there is a web page out there that claims that Kerry's SAT score was 1190. That's not implausible, but, unfortunately, the site provides no supporting evidence whatsoever, and I wasn't able to find any confirmation on Google.)

What kind of IQ does Bush's 1206 SAT imply?

Linda Gottfredson, co-director of the University of Delaware-Johns Hopkins Project for the Study of Intelligence and Society, told me:

"I recently converted Bush's SAT score to an IQ using the high school norms available for his age cohort. Educational Testing Service happened to have done a study of representative high school students within a year or so of when he took the test. I derived an IQ of 125, which is the 95th percentile."

In other words, only one out of 20 people would score higher.

Charles Murray came up with a similar result:

"I think you're safe in saying that Dubya's IQ, based on his SAT score, is in excess of 120, which puts him in the top 10 percent of the distribution, but I wouldn't try to be more precise than that."

This suggests that applicants to the Air Force Academy averaged about 122.5 (halfway between one and two standard deviations above the average), putting Bush in the 125-130 range -- a little better than his SAT score would suggest.

By way of comparison, Bush's 2000 opponent Al Gore scored 134 and 133 the two times he took an IQ test in high school, putting him just under the top 1 percent of the public.

Not surprisingly, the former vice president's' SAT scores were also strong but not stratospheric: Verbal 625, Math 730, for a total of 1355, which would equate to the upper 130s in IQ.

We can compare Kerry's 50th percentile performance to Bush's performance on the different but reasonably comparable Air Force Officer Qualifying Test.

On January 17, 1968, Bush took the AFOQT. (Just to keep our military acronyms from getting tangled up in a SNAFU, the AFOQT is different from the AFQT or Armed Forces Qualifying Test, which is the IQ portion of the ASVAB or Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery that all applicants for the enlisted ranks take.)

This AFOQT then consisted of 13 subtests that were aggregated into five composites.

Here are Bush's percentile scores (p. 25 of a huge PDF on the USA Today website):

Test Composite
Percentile

Pilot Aptitude
25

Navigator Aptitude
50

Officer Quality
95

Verbal Aptitude
85

Quantitative
65


Bush took the 1966 version of the test. I couldn't find the technical report on that revision, so I bought from NTIS the report on the 1964 revision, "Development and Standardization of the Air Force Officer Qualifying Test-64," by Dr. Robert E. Miller and Dr. Lonnie D. Valentine, two prominent psychometricians at the Lackland Air Force Base.

The percentiles are based on the scores of Air Force Academy candidates during 1955-1960. (To be technical, the 1964 version of AFOQT was renormed using the huge 1960 Project Talent study of high school seniors, but the percentile scores continued to reflect the scores of applicants to the Academy at Colorado Springs.)

This baseline group would appear to be fairly comparable to the Naval OCS applicants against whom Kerry scored at the 50th percentile. The Air Force norm group was typically younger, being high school seniors, than the Navy OCS candidate group, but applicants to the Academies tend to be a little more elite than OCS applicants. For example, the average SAT score of today's Air Force Academy students is 1292 (using the easier post-1994 scoring system), compared to the recentered 1132 of the average Air Force officer during the 1975-1985 period.

How did Bush do? In estimating his IQ, we can probably throw out his high score (the 95th percentile on Officer Quality) and his low score (25th percentile on Pilot Aptitude) because those tests don't measure IQ very directly. Instead, we should concentrate on his Verbal Aptitude (85th percentile), Quantitative (65th), and Navigator Aptitude (50th). In fact, those three are fairly similar in subject matter to the three parts of the Naval OQT that Kerry took: Verbal Analogies, Arithmetic Reasoning, and Mechanical Comprehension, respectively.

The Officer Quality score was derived by combining Bush's score on the 60 item Quantitative Aptitude subtest, the 60 item Verbal Aptitude subtest, with the 100 item Officer Biographical Inventory. The latter was a personality test that asked about "past experiences, preferences, and certain personality characteristics related to measures of officer effectiveness." It inquired into enthusiasm for sports and hunting, and was only vaguely correlated with IQ.

(A retired Air Force test psychologist told me that this section was later dropped because women did very poorly on it, and urban and suburban youths didn't do as well as country boys. "It was politically incorrect, but"?-he recalled wistfully?-"It was a predictor of success as an officer.")

Judging from his scoring at the highest percentile possible on Officer Quality, Bush must have absolutely nailed the Officer Biographical Inventory test, as you might expect coming from his ultra-competitive family.

In contrast, his not having any flying experience dragged down Bush's 25th percentile score in "Pilot Aptitude." He would have scored poorly on the Pilot Biographical Inventory and on Aviation Information, two of the seven subtests for this composite. Many of the other subtests focused on three dimensional imagination capacities, such as the "Visualization of Maneuvers" component. These are valuable mental skills, no doubt, but not ones called upon much in the Oval Office.

So, if you take the average of Bush's percentile scores on the three composites most similar to the test Kerry took, Bush scored at the 67th percentile, a little better than Kerry's 50th percentile.

This isn't an apples to apples comparison, so you can't say that Bush would have done better than Kerry on the same test. But this doesn't provide any evidence in support of the common assumption that Kerry has a much higher IQ.

The standardization report by Miller and Valentine says that the "officer population" that provided the percentile scores was about one standard deviation better than the average 12th grade male on the Verbal subtest and about two standard deviations better on the Quantitative test.

This suggests that the 50th percentile among the norm group of Air Force Academy applicants had an IQ of about 123, thus putting Bush in the 125-130 range?-a little better than his SAT score would imply.
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 03:10 am
Acting as if one were an idiot is the same as being an idiot, but Bush is not an idiot.

He suffers from the same mindset disfunctions that conservatives do. They are not sick, Bush isn't either, they do, however, live out their existence living in fear of the unknown and trying to pass that fear on to others. It makes for bad decision making. It makes for bad politics.

If he were just a Radio Shack manager, the things he does and says would be bad for business, but the rest of us would remain unscathed. As it is, with him actually in charge of our national security, some more of us are going to die for his delusions, to say nothing about the rest of humanity, because he hasn't got a clue who those people are.

As evidence, I offer his most recent news conference, a complete mish-mosh of grasping at straws and exposing a serious lack of understanding regarding the definition of the word "strategy".

Joe(In reply, massagotto will call me and several others ignorant)Nation

Golly, Ned.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 05:48 am
Can you give an example of a specific unrealistic fear on Bush's part, since you say that this is one of his salient characteristics?
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 05:50 am
Speaking of "idiots," has anyone else read the book, "Useful Idiots: How Liberals Got It Wrong in the Cold War and Still Blame America First," by Mona Charen?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 06:38 am
We could let Fred Kaplan at Slate answer Brandon's question...

Quote:
What a Moronic Presidential Press Conference!
It's clear Bush doesn't understand Iraq, or Lebanon, or Gaza, or …
By Fred Kaplan
Posted Tuesday, Aug. 22, 2006, at 5:48 PM ET
George W. Bush at a press conference
Among the many flabbergasting answers that President Bush gave at his press conference on Monday, this one?-about Democrats who propose pulling out of Iraq?-triggered the steepest jaw drop: "I would never question the patriotism of somebody who disagrees with me. This has nothing to do with patriotism. It has everything to do with understanding the world in which we live."

George W. Bush criticizing someone for not understanding the world is like … well, it's like George W. Bush criticizing someone for not understanding the world. It's sui generis: No parallel quite captures the absurdity so succinctly.

This, after all, is the president who invaded Iraq without the slightest understanding of the country's ethnic composition or of the volcanic tensions that toppling its dictator might unleash. Complexity has no place in his schemes. Choices are never cloudy. The world is divided into the forces of terror and the forces of freedom: The one's defeat means the other's victory.

Defeating terror by promoting freedom?-it's "the fundamental challenge of the 21st century," he has said several times, especially when it comes to the Middle East. But here, from the transcript of the press conference, is how he sees the region's recent events:

What's very interesting about the violence in Lebanon and the violence in Iraq and the violence in Gaza is this: These are all groups of terrorists who are trying to stop the advance of democracy.

What is he talking about? Hamas, which has been responsible for much of the violence in Gaza, won the Palestinian territory's parliamentary elections. Hezbollah, which started its recent war with Israel, holds a substantial minority of seats in Lebanon's parliament and would probably win many more seats if a new election were held tomorrow. Many of the militants waging sectarian battle in Iraq have representation in Baghdad's popularly elected parliament.

The key reality that Bush fails to grasp is that terrorism and democracy are not opposites. They can, and sometimes do, coexist. One is not a cure for the other.

Here, as a further example of this failing, is his summation of Iraq:

I hear a lot about "civil war"… [But] the Iraqis want a unified country. … Twelve million Iraqis voted. … It's an indication about the desire for people to live in a free society.

What he misses is that those 12 million Iraqis had sharply divided views of what a free society meant. Shiites voted for a unified country led by Shiites, Sunnis voted for a unified country led by Sunnis, and Kurds voted for their own separate country. Almost nobody voted for a free society in any Western sense of the term. (The secular parties did very poorly.)

The total number of voters, in such a context, means nothing. Look at American history. In the 1860 election, held right before our own Civil War, 81.2 percent of eligible citizens voted?-the second-largest turnout ever.

Another comment from the president: "It's in our interests that we help reformers across the Middle East achieve their objectives." But who are these reformers? What are their objectives? And how can we most effectively help them?

This is where Bush's performance proved most discouraging. He said, as he's said before, "Resentment and the lack of hope create the breeding grounds for terrorists." This may or may not be true. (Many terrorist leaders are well-off, and, according to some studies, their resentment is often aimed at foreign occupiers.) In any case, what is Bush doing to reduce their resentment?

He said he wants to help Lebanon's democratic government survive, but what is he doing about that? Bush called the press conference to announce a $230 million aid package. That's a step above the pathetic $50 million that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice had offered the week before, but it's still way below the $1 billion or more than Iran is shoveling to Hezbollah, which is using the money to rebuild Lebanon's bombed-out neighborhoods?-and to take credit for the assistance.

As for Iraq, it's no news that Bush has no strategy. What did come as news?-and, really, a bit of a shocker?-is that he doesn't seem to know what "strategy" means.

Asked if it might be time for a new strategy in Iraq, given the unceasing rise in casualties and chaos, Bush replied, "The strategy is to help the Iraqi people achieve their objectives and dreams, which is a democratic society. That's the strategy. … Either you say, 'It's important we stay there and get it done,' or we leave. We're not leaving, so long as I'm the president."

The reporter followed up, "Sir, that's not really the question. The strategy?-"

Bush interrupted, "Sounded like the question to me."

First, it's not clear that the Iraqi people want a "democratic society" in the Western sense. Second, and more to the point, "helping Iraqis achieve a democratic society" may be a strategic objective, but it's not a strategy?-any more than "ending poverty" or "going to the moon" is a strategy.

Strategy involves how to achieve one's objectives?-or, as the great British strategist B.H. Liddell Hart put it, "the art of distributing and applying military means to fulfill the ends of policy." These are the issues that Bush refuses to address publicly?-what means and resources are to be applied, in what way, at what risk, and to what end, in pursuing his policy. Instead, he reduces everything to two options: "Cut and run" or, "Stay the course." It's as if there's nothing in between, no alternative way of applying military means. Could it be that he doesn't grasp the distinction between an "objective" and a "strategy," and so doesn't see that there might be alternatives? Might our situation be that grim?
http://www.slate.com/id/2148197/
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 06:47 am
hingehead wrote:

I somehow doubt it will be 'I am not an idiot.'


So Bernard you disagree with me? You think he will say 'I am not an idiot'? I still can't imagine it but I won't argue with you. I'm happy to bet a beer on it.
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 07:28 am
Brandon9000 wrote:
Can you give an example of a specific unrealistic fear on Bush's part, since you say that this is one of his salient characteristics?


From watching and listening to him over these past painful years, it's apparent that George is afraid of almost anything he doesn't understand, and that's a lot of things, from stem cell research to Islam to what roles other nations in the world play in making peace and war.

His greatest fears, however, are 1) uncertainty, the feeling of being out of control of events, (a glimpse at one of his speaking engagements which are hermetically sealed against anyone who might harbor an opposing view of the world is revealing of his need to be in control.) and 2) that he will make a mistake and that someone will notice and point it out. I've known others who think like that, mostly they have been children who have been browbeaten by one parent or another into trying to be perfect on the soccer field or at chess. They freeze like George does when he is confronted by a question, they make the same grim face as he does, they make the same claim denying that they have made any mistake or mistakes whatsoever. When you meet such children you always hope that they will have time to outgrow their condition, George is beyond such hope.

For him, and other conservatives, a heightened need to manage uncertainty and threat is the driving force in their lives as well as the need to dominate others. I think it is a life strategy that works well for people like George who obliviously has had some years of complete chaos in his life, but it doesn't seem to me to be a very healthy way to run either a Republic or a Democracy or any combination of the two.


Joe( Scaring the bejeezus out of the electorate does seem to work though it might be that we'll become what we fear.)Nation
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 07:40 am
Joe Nation wrote:
Brandon9000 wrote:
Can you give an example of a specific unrealistic fear on Bush's part, since you say that this is one of his salient characteristics?


From watching and listening to him over these past painful years, it's apparent that George is afraid of almost anything he doesn't understand, and that's a lot of things, from stem cell research to Islam to what roles other nations in the world play in making peace and war.

His greatest fears, however, are 1) uncertainty, the feeling of being out of control of events, (a glimpse at one of his speaking engagements which are hermetically sealed against anyone who might harbor an opposing view of the world is revealing of his need to be in control.) and 2) that he will make a mistake and that someone will notice and point it out. I've known others who think like that, mostly they have been children who have been browbeaten by one parent or another into trying to be perfect on the soccer field or at chess. They freeze like George does when he is confronted by a question, they make the same grim face as he does, they make the same claim denying that they have made any mistake or mistakes whatsoever. When you meet such children you always hope that they will have time to outgrow their condition, George is beyond such hope.

For him, and other conservatives, a heightened need to manage uncertainty and threat is the driving force in their lives as well as the need to dominate others. I think it is a life strategy that works well for people like George who obliviously has had some years of complete chaos in his life, but it doesn't seem to me to be a very healthy way to run either a Republic or a Democracy or any combination of the two.


Joe( Scaring the bejeezus out of the electorate does seem to work though it might be that we'll become what we fear.)Nation


Excellent post.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 07:45 am
joe said
Quote:
For him, and other conservatives, a heightened need to manage uncertainty and threat is the driving force in their lives as well as the need to dominate others. I think it is a life strategy that works well for people like George who obliviously has had some years of complete chaos in his life, but it doesn't seem to me to be a very healthy way to run either a Republic or a Democracy or any combination of the two.


I think so. It's very difficult not to see the similarities between the fundamentalisms of this administration and its supporters with the fundamentalisms arising elsewhere in the world. Modernity, or change which threatens old ways almost always gains such a reactionary response in some percentage of a community.
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Aug, 2006 07:57 am
blatham wrote:
joe said
Quote:
For him, and other conservatives, a heightened need to manage uncertainty and threat is the driving force in their lives as well as the need to dominate others. I think it is a life strategy that works well for people like George who obliviously has had some years of complete chaos in his life, but it doesn't seem to me to be a very healthy way to run either a Republic or a Democracy or any combination of the two.


I think so. It's very difficult not to see the similarities between the fundamentalisms of this administration and its supporters with the fundamentalisms arising elsewhere in the world. Modernity, or change which threatens old ways almost always gains such a reactionary response in some percentage of a community.


Conservatives (Bush and supporters) vs. conservatives (Muslim terrorist).

Damn conservatives. Without them we may have some peace.
0 Replies
 
 

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