50
   

What should be done about illegal immigration?

 
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 06:54 pm
@Brandon9000,
If you don't want millions of people in the country illegally, you will be happy with the Senate bill.

Its two main features; border security and a pathway to citizenship for people who have made lives here, both address the problem of people living here illegally.

It's the people who don't want millions of Hispanics living in the country who are the bigots. They are against this bill.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:29 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

If you don't want millions of people in the country illegally, you will be happy with the Senate bill.

Its two main features; border security and a pathway to citizenship for people who have made lives here, both address the problem of people living here illegally.

It's the people who don't want millions of Hispanics living in the country who are the bigots. They are against this bill.

I don't want a pathway to citizenship for people who have entered the country illegally and jumped ahead of everyone who chose to obey our rules. I don't want that at all. They've made lives here and so now they have the right to be here? What kind of logic is that? Is this likely to encourage or discourage people from trying to enter America illegally? They see millions granted what is close to amnesty, and they won't try to sneak in too because we have (if even true) increased border security?

Why would I want millions and millions of people from a single general foreign location in my country, who have such great numbers that they feel no pressure to be absorbed or speak my language, and who, instead, form little pockets of another country in my country? Why would I want my national culture to become just one of several in what had been my country?

If anyone gave a damn about what I want, it would be to deport everyone here illegally and continue to let in small numbers of people from everywhere else come in legally as before.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:30 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Simpleton is they name.

I'm not surprised that you are unable to muster an actual argument to support your position. Name calling is the lowest form of debate. Congratulations.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:31 pm
@Brandon9000,
Children who were brought to this country didn't have a choice.
Ignorance is bless.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:36 pm
@Brandon9000,
Quote:
let in small numbers of people from everywhere else come in legally as before.


As before what?
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:38 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Children who were brought to this country didn't have a choice.
Ignorance is bless.

Perhaps their parents should have thought of that before they chose to defy our laws and enter our country illegally. I am under no obligation to allow anyone here as the result of defying our laws.

But just out of curiosity, are you supporting a path to citizenship only for people brought here as children and deportation for those who actively chose to enter and stay here illegally?
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:41 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
let in small numbers of people from everywhere else come in legally as before.


As before what?


I am in favor of small numbers of people from other countries being granted entrance as occurred historically, not millions and millions who will come here knowing they are violating our immigration laws and who will essentially form pockets of their home country in my country, people who come here from one area in numbers so great that they feel no pressure to adopt our language and culture.

Be very sure to focus on just one sentence or phrase in my opinion and ignore the general thrust of what I'm saying.
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:42 pm
@Brandon9000,
Quote:
I am in favor of small numbers of people from other countries being granted entrance as occurred historically


In what period of our history do you think this happend?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:49 pm
@maxdancona,
Brandon doesn't know American history on immigration. If he did, he wouldn't make such ignorant statements such as
Quote:
granted entrance as occurred historically
.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:52 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
I am in favor of small numbers of people from other countries being granted entrance as occurred historically


In what period of our history do you think this happend?

As usual, you focus on one sentence and ignore the thrust of what I'm saying. Forget the reference to history. I am not in favor of allowing millions and millions of people in from any single location, and especially not if they knew they were entering illegally and did so anyway. I am in favor of allowing in small numbers from all over the globe, numbers small enough that if they choose to stay here, they feel some compulsion to adopt our language and national culture.
Brandon9000
 
  0  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 07:54 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

Brandon doesn't know American history on immigration. If he did, he wouldn't make such ignorant statements such as
Quote:
granted entrance as occurred historically
.

...and the rest of my argument? I notice you didn't answer my direct question about the status of people who are absolutely personally responsible for being here illegally. Your style is to ignore the argument and search for a way to impeach the source of the argument.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:02 pm
@Brandon9000,
I usually don't waste my time with people who lack historical perspective of anything they post. I call what you post mostly bull ****!
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:17 pm
@Brandon9000,
The history is important (which is why you made reference to it in the first place).

The current wave of immigrants is no different than past waves of immigrants. The charge that immigrants have no "compulsion" to learn the language was first made about German immigrants in the 18th century (famously by Benjamin Franklin). It was also said of Irish immigrants, Asian immigrants and Jewish immigrants.

If you knew the history, you would know the lies of the anti-immigrant know nothings were false.

Like always, by the second generation immigrants assimilate just fine.

History is a good defense against the rhetoric of bigotry.

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:19 pm
@maxdancona,
Thank you, maxdancona. I especially liked,
Quote:
History is a good defense against the rhetoric of bigotry.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  0  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:20 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

I usually don't waste my time with people who lack historical perspective of anything they post. I call what you post mostly bull ****!

Let me recapitulate. You're afraid to actually argue your beliefs, and your chosen mode of debating ideas is the personal insult. I'm not surprised. Next.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:23 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

The history is important (which is why you made reference to it in the first place).

The current wave of immigrants is no different than past waves of immigrants. The charge that immigrants have no "compulsion" to learn the language was first made about German immigrants in the 18th century (famously by Benjamin Franklin). It was also said of Irish immigrants, Asian immigrants and Jewish immigrants.

If you knew the history, you the lies of the anti-immigrant know nothings were false.

Like always, by the second generation immigrants assimilate just fine.

History is a good defense against the rhetoric of bigotry.

I repeat, people who have entered the country illegally and jumped ahead of others who tried to obey our laws have no right to be here. We have the right to regulate immigration, as most civilized countries claim. We have the right to preserve our national culture and not let people from any area come here by the millions and millions and establish pockets of their country in our country. Argue that.
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:25 pm
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
who will essentially form pockets of their home country in my country, people who come here from one area in numbers so great that they feel no pressure to adopt our language and culture.


no Irish
no Germans
no Italians
no Polish
no Europeans of any sort

nobody

how do you think any group of immigrants behaves when it first arrives?
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:50 pm
@Brandon9000,
No. You were provided the answer by another member, but you just ignored what he said. You were dumped on, and now you feel hurt. But no more than the immigrants who come to this country to advance themselves and their children. This "is" the land of opportunity, and most people on this planet understand this simple fact.

If you lived in another country, especially a third world country, you would also want to come here - to bring your children, because there's nowhere else on earth that provides people who work and study hard a chance at living a pretty good life on this planet.

My grandfather brought his new wife to this country in 1896, because the people in Japan were starving without any work to earn income.

Fast forward to today; our family is made up of Brits, Germans, Italians, Dutch, Russian, Chinese, black, and Polynesian. Japanese-Americans were the second largest Asian immigrants in the US before WWII; we are now the smallest Asian group in the US.

That's because the Japanese economy grew to become the second largest economy in the world after WWII, and their citizens didn't need to migrate to other countries to earn a living.

capish?
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:53 pm
@ehBeth,
ehBeth wrote:

Brandon9000 wrote:
who will essentially form pockets of their home country in my country, people who come here from one area in numbers so great that they feel no pressure to adopt our language and culture.


no Irish
no Germans
no Italians
no Polish
no Europeans of any sort

nobody

how do you think any group of immigrants behaves when it first arrives?

The same way, but when many millions come from just one place, they feel little motivation to adopt the new country's language or culture, and instead of simply forming communities of an ethnicity, form pockets of a foreign country.

And then, there's the fact that they defied our laws to enter. They have no right to be here and should be deported. Most countries claim the right to regulate immigration, and we have that right too.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  0  
Reply Fri 28 Jun, 2013 08:56 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

No. You were provided the answer by another member, but you just ignored what he said. You were dumped on, and now you feel hurt. But no more than the immigrants who come to this country to advance themselves and their children. This "is" the land of opportunity, and most people on this planet understand this simple fact.

If you lived in another country, especially a third world country, you would also want to come here - to bring your children, because there's nowhere else on earth that provides people who work and study hard a chance at living a pretty good life on this planet.

My grandfather brought his new wife to this country in 1896, because the people in Japan were starving without any work to earn income.

Fast forward to today; our family is made up of Brits, Germans, Italians, Dutch, Russian, Chinese, black, and Polynesian. Japanese-Americans were the second largest Asian immigrants in the US before WWII; we are now the smallest Asian group in the US.

That's because the Japanese economy grew to become the second largest economy in the world after WWII, and their citizens didn't need to migrate to other countries to earn a living.

capish?

Yes, and I also understand the distinction between legal and illegal immigration. Furthermore, we are not talking about a variety of people from a variety of lands, we are talking about so many people from a single culture and language that they are able to form an outpost of their country within ours rather than coming to become American. Also, after telling me how innocent children were brought here at a young age and bear no blame, you have steadfastly refused to answer my repeated question whether you advocate deportation for immigrants who absolutely knowingly and deliberately came here illegally.
 

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