What should be done about illegal immigration?

Perhaps to describe your own position on this issue?

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cjhsa wrote:

Where did I say half are criminals? They are ALL criminals and ALL on welfare. Every last one of them, as are their employers.

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cjhsa wrote:

Where did I say half are criminals? They are ALL criminals and ALL on welfare. Every last one of them, as are their employers.

How can employers get welfare? I mean, even some big companies employed illegals ...

(Agreeing with Bill's comment here!)

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OCCOM BILL wrote:

au1929 wrote:
OCCOM BILL
Dare I ask what has Friedman's column about foreigners graduating with PHD's to do with the 12 to 20 million unskilled and uneducated illegal aliens in this nation.
Regarding the lack of our young achieving. Did it ever occur to you that the middle class parent cannot afford the cost of higher education. Further students attending college are saddled with tremendous debt by the time they graduate and will enter the work force rather than incur the extra cost of post graduate school. If the government were interested in having our youth achieve they would find a way to financially help or at least minimize the burden
I solved the Illegal part of the problem, pages ago. It's now an immigration problem... because only one of you bit on the simplest, most effective way to end the "illegal" part of the problem. :wink: Further, a country that doesn't pursue PHD's in science is behaving extremely stupidly. It's a related problem.

What did he say? How does your answer address what I wrote. By the way if you solved the illegal problem. You should help out congress and tell them. They are in dire need of a solution.

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OCCOM BILL wrote:

cjhsa wrote:
Where did I say half are criminals? They are ALL criminals and ALL on welfare. Every last one of them, as are their employers.

Damn straight. I cannot figure you out Bill. On most issues you're on target, but on this one, you've really drunk the Kool Aid.

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au: What did he say? How does your answer address what I wrote. By the way if you solved the illegal problem. You should help out congress and tell them. They are in dire need of a solution.

If and when congress can get their act together and compromise enough on each side to agree on legislation, that's when I'll begin to show a little respect. Even then, it'll be based on enforcement of their "new" laws.

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

cjhsa wrote:
Where did I say half are criminals? They are ALL criminals and ALL on welfare. Every last one of them, as are their employers.

How can employers get welfare? I mean, even some big companies employed illegals ...

(Agreeing with Bill's comment here!)

Walter, I think it was worded funny, but when he writes "as are their employers", I think he means to refer to the employers as criminals, not as being on welfare.

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CI
Where there is no will there is no way. There will be as much inforcement of new laws as there was the old ones. Laws are only for American citizens. Not the criminals flowing across our border. Yes that means all illegal aliens.

Bill that should rate at least Bigots.

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I also have my doubts about congress' enforcing the laws.

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

I agree, au. I was just and only asking why someone gets a number of above 20 million for all USA due to his "personal experiences".

I never came up with any number. I simply offered my opinion that it is at least 20 million, which does not necessarily have to be more than 20 million. Read the posts, Walter, and at least do not mis-characterize what I said. I base it on travel experience, personal observation, talking with other people in other places, reading articles, and common sense. Yes, common sense.

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au1929 wrote:

By the way if you solved the illegal problem. You should help out congress and tell them. They are in dire need of a solution.

I have, both by email and by appearing in person for the latest March. :wink:

Okie: Repeat after me "Ok, ya got me... I said something silly, I hereby retract it."

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au1929 wrote:

CI
Where there is no will there is no way. There will be as much inforcement of new laws as there was the old ones. Laws are only for American citizens. Not the criminals flowing across our border. Yes that means all illegal aliens.

Bill that should rate at least Bigots.

Actually, no. Considering the petty trespassing criminal is pretty silly, but it's not the same as those who willfully exaggerate the quantity of real crimes these people commit when they get here. That's how they get rated bigots. In your case; I've known for years you don't give two sh!ts about any non-American or any color, so I'd be hard pressed to label you a bigot. (You are not necessarily immune to my other favorite names though :wink: ).

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No way it is silly. I think there are at least 20 million illegals in the country. I have heard some speculate more than that, 25 or 30. I don't know. Its an opinion. Get over it. I have a right to it. Calm down, you don't have to agree. And neither does Walter.

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CoastalRat wrote:

Walter Hinteler wrote:
cjhsa wrote:
Where did I say half are criminals? They are ALL criminals and ALL on welfare. Every last one of them, as are their employers.

How can employers get welfare? I mean, even some big companies employed illegals ...

(Agreeing with Bill's comment here!)

Walter, I think it was worded funny, but when he writes "as are their employers", I think he means to refer to the employers as criminals, not as being on welfare.

No, employing illegals is not only illegal, it is a form of corporate welfare being provided by a do-nothing government. It wasn't worded funny at all if you understand my position.

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No argument there. Many employers who are knowingly hiring illegals are accepting a lot of contract payments in cash, are not paying their share of social security or unemployment taxes, etc. etc., are not withholding income taxes, and can pretty well sidestep any responsibilities for the health or safety of their workers. A lot if not most of the self-employed illegals are operating this way.

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Hmm, and most of those "20 million" illegals pay ... but they will never collect Social Security benefits.

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So what? If they want social security, let them enter the country legally or collect it where they came from. Meanwhile a social security tax is the least they can contribute in return for the other costly benefits which they can access. I really question whether most are paying social security anyway. If their employers aren't, you can be darn sure the illegal workers aren't.

I am still wondering what happens if an illegal who has been using my social security number is granted amnesty so that he can start drawing social security. Is identify theft a deportable crime? If he starts drawing it before I do, what will that do to my benefits? Maybe this is not that much of a problem, but it is just one of many many questions that need to be addressed within a comprehensive immigration bill. As I've posted before, I've dealt with illegals here who were using four or more social security numbers as well as a half dozen aliases. This is not going to be a simple situation to sort out unless everybody just goes home and comes back legally with one ID.

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I wanted to ask this before already:

"an illegal using my social security number" - how can that be? Mine is clearly mine, and no-one else can use it (perhaps, if I had a twin, he could).

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

Hmm, and most of those "20 million" illegals pay ... but they will never collect Social Security benefits.

I haven't found "proof" of this, but I believe it to be true. Documents are cheap and required by any employer smart enough to not want to be fined for hiring illegals, which has to be most. No one ever applied for a job by me without a DL, SS, and or Green Card. Not once out of perhaps 200 Hispanic applicants. Everyone that was hire filled out all of the appropriate paperwork, and I in turn made copies of their ID and did the requisite new hire reporting in a timely fashion. Were some of them illegal? Don't know, don't care. They had the documents and the government agencies who received the information never said dick about it. I can only assume this is the norm, because I can't imagine an employer exposing himself unnecessarily regardless of what he does or doesn't know about his recruits.

Unless virtually ALL of the non criminal Illegal aliens are given an opportunity to become legal; I fully expect the new laws to be un-enforced exactly the same as the current laws. Failure to follow one of these two courses will result in a wicked crime spike, and anyone with half a brain in their head knows it. Anyone who truly wants to get rid of the illegal alien situation; had better get behind legalizing the entire process OR they can look forward to a change that won't be forthcoming.

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Walter, it is common knowledge that all over the country, the landscapers, yard people, commonly smaller service businesses, the list goes on, commonly fly under the radar screen and get away with not paying into the system. They may not even report the earnings if they get paid in cash. Actually this is a problem that occurs with citizens as well. One reason I favor the fair tax, the retail sales tax instead of the imcome tax.

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What should be done about illegal immigration?

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