What should be done about illegal immigration?

And in NM ...



source: Albuquerque Journal, 16.05.07, page C1

I guess that will settle the staus of the 12 million now in the US and lay the ground work for the next 12 million ten years from now.

Point A to Point B to get a guaranteed entry to Point A = IDIOCY. Perhaps we should make them jump through "Hoops of Fire" while we're at it. Who does this serve?

The process of permanent entry should be as excruciating as possible to discourage more illegals from entering the country. An easy path to a green card would bring in untold more illegals flooding the country, which will certainly bring discord.

Advocate, I agree; the illegals should have to go through hoops to win citizenship, especially much tougher then the ones trying to get in legally. That to me is only fair and equitable.

It took 13 years for a friend of mine from Canada to get here. She's not at all bitter, but has the attitude of "it was worth the wait - and the hoops".

Her son and daughter-in-law are still waiting.

She's never said anything about the current situation (amnesty talk). Probably doesn't want to be labeled a "bigot".

Anyone wanna place a bet on how long it takes till someone forges a "Z" visa?

Last night I was listening to somebody--can't remember who--it was on a station I don't usually listen to--wanting to know that if the illegal using your social security number starts drawing social security before you are eligible, what happens to you when you apply? Does anybody know?

Is that anything like US currency forgeries? LOL

Immigration Burden or Boom for Tax Rolls?Immigration Burden or Boom for Tax Rolls?
By ERIC HORNG
May 17, 2007

Senators reached a landmark deal on immigration today that will give 12 million illegal immigrants in the United States the opportunity to obtain legal status. The compromise crafted by key senators also calls for increased border security to prevent new illegal immigrants from pouring into the country.

The proposed legislation would allow immigrants to obtain a probationary card right away and to ultimately obtain a "Z-visa" that would put them on track to permanent residency.


What does this new agreement mean for America? Overcrowded classrooms and emergency rooms. Overwhelmed police and fire departments. Bankrupt Social Security, Medicare and welfare programs. Skyrocketing taxes.

It's a gloomy scenario that some say could become a reality if millions of illegal immigrants are granted citizenship under a sweeping immigration reform bill currently working its way through the U.S. Senate. But is it fact or fear-mongering?

"This is the most expensive public policy choice that I've seen in Washington in a quarter-century," said Robert Rector of the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank. "You're essentially going to grant illegal immigrants eligibility to Social Security, to Medicare, to other welfare programs for the elderly like Medicaid … at the cost to the taxpayer of $17,000 more per illegal immigrant."

Rector bases his calculations not on the 12 million illegal immigrants currently in the United States who could be provided a pathway to citizenship over the next few years, as outlined in the bill, but on the millions more people Rector believes would seek citizenship in the next 20 years as a result of a change in policy.

Many of these new Americans, Rector argues, would be be poor, less-educated and pay thousands per year less in taxes than what they would cost the government in services.

"Each immigrant who does not have a high school degree over his lifetime costs the taxpayer about $1.2 million, and that's all the benefits his family would receive minus the taxes he pays in," said Rector.

But others say those figures overstate the impact, and one group even called the Heritage Foundation's assessment "dehumanizing."

"Human beings are made up of much more than a tally of their income taxes and the tally of the services they use," said Benjamin Johnson of the American Immigration Law Foundation, who cited the contributions of such accomplished high school dropouts as business titans Ray Kroc, Dave Thomas and Kirk Kerkorian.

"It's an indictment of people who are doing really valuable jobs in our economy and being very productive members of our economy," said Johnson, who highlighted the consumer purchasing power and job-creating influence of Hispanics in the United States, estimating their economic contribution at $798 billion in 2006.


Still, the strain on some services is already being felt.

The Texas Hospital Association reported a 30 percent increase in emergency room visits between 1997 and 2005, partly due to the flood of illegal immigrants, many of whom have no health insurance and are unable to pay for services.

"Because somebody becomes a citizen, it doesn't necessarily mean they're suddenly going to have insurance coverage," said THA spokeswoman Amanda Engler. "While granting citizenship status to undocumented immigrants will not guarantee health care coverage, it may create new strains on programs like Medicaid and the Children's Health Insurance Program."
But Juan Onesimo Sandoval, a professor of urban sociology at Northwestern University, said immigration reform could actually add money to government coffers.

"You're going to get people who are getting paid, but because they don't have documentation, it doesn't get reported," said Sandoval. "You're going to see some increase in taxes that they're paying, and once they become part of the formal market, they're going to be paying into Social Security, and so will their employers."

Sandoval also said the future economic contribution of the children and grandchildren of such immigrants could be vital.

"Their taxes are going to be far more important to our economy than their parents' taxes are," said Sandoval, who suggests a wave of new immigrant citizens could help support the aging population in the United States, as some believe it's done in Europe. "In terms of demographics, Latinos tend to be a younger population, so they're going to be part of a work force that will be supporting the Medicaid programs and all these senior programs. As a proportion, they'll be paying more and more of these taxes."

Foxfyre,

This bill seems to be what you were saying you wanted a while back. There is the touchback provision, a $5,000 fine, the need to learn English and go to the end of the line.

My side is going to have a bit of trouble with size of the fine ($5000 is a lot of money for poor people and the touchback is a punitive measure). I think we are going to get on board with this as a compromise.

The one thing my side is going to have trouble accepting (and I think you will see most of the pressure for amendments on this issue) is the temporary guest workers with no chance for citizenship.

Temporary guest workers, of course, are here legally to work. The fact that they are temporary (meaning they have less rights and no future) makes them exceptionally bad for American workers. Any worker would rather compete against citizens, or at least workers with full rights, then with people who have to keep quiet to keep their job for even the limited time they have it.

This doesn't have anything to do with illegal immigration, but it is something that people in my camp are going to try to fix.

Au,

You find the silliest articles! Good work.

ebrown, We hope you're in a position to fix those things that have been broken for too long. Congresss has meandered on this issue for too long, and it has only exacerbated the problems we now see and hear about. One step at a time is good enough for me just as long as solutions are forthcoming in the near future. Quit making laws if you ain't gonna enforce them; that's the least congress can do.

That part about the children of immigrants helping our country is a truism most people do not appreciate. That's the reason why Germany and Japan are in worse straights when it comes to their demographics and future economy.

Who will pay for the social services these people will be afforded. Since in the main they are low wage earners paying very little if any tax and be eligable for every government handout availabe.

au, I believe it's really unfair to generalize about how immigrant's "do not pay for social services." After all, we are all "immigrants" to some degree.

C.I.
I am not generalizing. The illegals from Mexico and points south are for the most part uneducated and are employed in jobs on the lowest rung of the ladder. They will pay little if any income tax and will demand the most in the way of social services. Who do you think will pay the freight .

au, I know it's only anecdotal, but our maid is from San Salvador, and she's been going to school to learn nursing. I also know that many of the restaurants in our area hire Mexicans to do everything from dishwashing to cooking. They provide a necessary work force in the industry here, and I'm pretty sure it's not an isolated case. The farms around Gilroy, Salinas, and Monterey all use Mexican laborers. Who eles would work those fields? They provide the necessary labor that would otherwise go unfulfilled. We must help their children get the education they need to advance themselves to better jobs that our country sorely needs for our economic future.

We do have similar problems in the EU ...

Source