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What Really Happened on 9/11?

 
 
Amigo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 08:18 am
Making a point comparing Bigfoot to Americans wanting the truth about 9/11??? Never forget.

It will be a great day when were on the same side.

**************


Have you heard about Cynthia McKinney, former U.S. Congresswoman?

According to those quoted on National Public Radio, McKinney?s ?a loose cannon? (media expert) who ?the people of Atlanta are embarrassed and disgusted? (politician) by, and she is also ?loony? and ?dangerous? (senator from her own party).

Yow! And why is McKinney dangerous/loony/disgusting? According to NPR, ?McKinney implied that the [Bush] Administration knew in advance about September 11 and deliberately held back the information.?

The New York Times? Lynette Clemetson revealed her comments went even further over the edge: ?Ms. McKinney suggest[ed] that President Bush might have known about the September 11 attacks but did nothing so his supporters could make money in a war.?

That?s loony, all right. As an editor of the highly respected Atlanta Journal Constitution told NPR, McKinney?s ?practically accused the President of murder!?

Problem is, McKinney never said it.

That?s right. The ?quote? from McKinney is a complete fabrication. A whopper, a fabulous fib, a fake, a flim-flam. Just freakin? made up.

http://www.alternet.org/story/16172/

*******

Thursday, March 23, 2006
Extremely Sad News
The death of Michael Zebuhr:
Michael Zebuhr didn't intervene when two men stole his mother's purse, but one of the men shot him anyway. The 25-year-old Buckhannon resident and recent Davis & Elkins College died a day later.

According to reports, Zebuhr and his mother, Dr. Suzanne Strong of Virginia, were in Minneapolis visiting Zebuhr's sister, a student at the University of Minnesota, when the shooting took place at about 9:55 p.m. Saturday.

Inspector Kris Arneson of the Minneapolis Police Department's Fifth Precinct said the family trio and a friend were approached by two male subjects as they were returning to their vehicle following dinner at a restaurant in the Uptown area.

Reports indicate that the suspects demanded Strong's pursue which she was turned over without resistance. One of the suspects then shot Zebuhr in the head for no apparent reason, officials said.

http://covertoperations.blogspot.com/2006/03/extremely-sad-news.html


**********
Boy the coincidences abound.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 08:31 am
Amigo wrote:
Making a point comparing Bigfoot to Americans wanting the truth about 9/11??? Never forget.

It will be a great day when were on the same side.


That's right, never forget that Islamic terrorists planned for and attacked the US killing innocent Americans. It is a disservice to those people to try to lay the blame on the US government when the blame lies squarely on the shoulders of Osama Bin Laden and his zealots. Never forget how the events of 9/11 changed the course of history. Never forget those that have died avenging those who died on 9/11. Never forget why we are in Afghanistan and Iraq.

You seem to believe that mountains of theories, guesses, poor logic and guesswork will somehow change the facts the 2 airplanes, piloted by Islamic terrorists flew into the WTC and as a result, they collapsed.
0 Replies
 
Zippo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 11:21 am
Quote:
Easy. The collapse started at the point where the planes hit.


You are still trying to debunk a straw man, your 'theory' cannot be applied to the North Tower and WTC 7.

Try to use a theory which will support all the three towers, people can easily spot the straw man technique, their not stupid. Smile

1. The official story is that the collapse began when one floor broke, and the pieces fell to the floor below it. Those pieces shattered that floor, and so on, all the way down. However, when the pieces hit the floor below it, they would have slowed down slightly because some of their energy would be used to break the floor. Therefore, there should be a delay every time the pieces hit a floor. The towers had 110 floors, so if it took one second for each floor to be crushed, that would be 110 seconds.

However, the seismic data and video show that the North Tower collapsed in only 8.4 seconds. The collapse started at about the 94th floor. If you were to drop a rock from the 94th floor, it would hit the ground about 8.4 seconds later. This means that the pieces of the building were falling as fast as objects fall through the air. How can objects crash through steel and concrete floors as fast as they fall through the air?

There is only one explanation. Explosives were placed in these buildings before the attack. The collapse of the North Tower started when explosives at the 94th floor were detonated. The explosives were timed so that the floors were shattered before the rubble contacted it. The pieces of the building fell in only 8.4 seconds because none of the pieces crashed into a floor.

2. Why Has Fire Never Destroyed a Skyscraper Before?

A fire in a 32-story skyscraper in Madrid, Spain, became so intense that it spread from one floor to the next, causing the building to look like a torch. This fire was much larger than the fire at the World Trade Center. The next morning there were still a few fires in the lower floors. Everything inside the building had been burned. Some sections of the building broke. A few portions at the top of the building collapsed. However, the building remained standing, and it continued to support a large construction crane at the top. By comparison, the fire at the South Tower was so small that it never spread to the other side of the tower.

3. Why Does the Government Use the Same Engineer?

The government selected an engineer named Gene Corley to investigate the collapse of the World Trade Center towers and Building 7. Corley had also been selected to investigate the bombing of the Murrah Building in Oklahoma City in 1995, as well as the fire at the Branch Davidian complex in Waco, Texas, in 1993.

In all three cases, Corley supported the government's theory. However, for those of us who have seen the evidence that the government was involved in those three crimes, we have to conclude that Corley was selected to investigate these crimes because he is one of the few people with engineering credentials who is willing to lie for the government.

A lot of people are willing to secretly commit or cover up a crime, but not many people want to publicly defend a crime. This seems especially true for people who have struggled for years to build up a reputation as a competent scientist or engineer. Therefore, when the government finds an engineer or scientist willing to lie for them, they have to turn to that person again and again.

A few university professors supported the government's theory about the collapse of the towers, but they ignored the collapse of Building 7, and they have not yet responded to critics of their theory. It appears as if they published these theories only because they were pressured to do so, and then they quickly went into hiding.

4. What Happened to Building 7?

The collapse of Building 7 is the most obvious sign that the government was involved in the attack. This was a 47-story building with a steel frame. It was not hit by an airplane, and it was across the street from the towers. At 5:25 PM, this building collapsed into a tiny pile of rubble. Video and photos show that Building 7 collapsed exactly like old buildings that are brought down by explosives.

The U.S. Government investigated the collapse of this building, but after seven months of investigating, their conclusion was that they have no idea why the building collapsed. A few months later, the landlord of Building 7, Larry Silverstein, announced on television that the fire department demolished Building 7.

If the government was interested in understanding what happened on September 11, they would have asked Silverstein and the fire department to explain what happened to Building 7, but our government officials, university professors, and news reporters are ignoring Building 7. For the government to ignore such a major crime is simply more evidence that they were involved in this attack.

Building 7

This photo shows the largest fires observed in Building 7 on September 11, 2001. Other photographs taken from this vantage point also show fires in the same location, but not elsewhere.


http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/3073.jpg


http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/IMAGES/wtc1_core.jpg

http://oceanmirage.homestead.com/files/madr_collapse.jpg

PLEASE TELL ME WHY YOU CANNOT SEE AN EXPLOSION ?

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/dusttrail.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/sor8.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/sor11.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/nuke1.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/w.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/w1.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/w2.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/w3.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/w4.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/w5.jpg

http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/w6.jpg

Still can't see an explosion ? Smile
0 Replies
 
Zippo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 11:29 am
McGentrix
Quote:
That's right, never forget that Islamic terrorists planned for and attacked the US killing innocent Americans


You are right Smile

Quote:
U.S. had agents inside al-Qaeda

By John Diamond, USA TODAY

WASHINGTON — U.S. intelligence overheard al-Qaeda operatives discussing a major pending terrorist attack in the weeks prior to Sept. 11 and had agents inside the terror group, but the intercepts and field reports didn't specify where or when a strike might occur, according to U.S. officials. The disclosures add to a growing body of evidence to be examined in congressional hearings that open today into how the CIA, FBI and other agencies failed to seize on intelligence pointing to the deadliest terror attack in U.S. history.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/sept11/2002/06/03/cia-attacks.htm


Some more good news for you McGentrix, which you will blindly ignore. Smile

Quote:
Armed pilots banned
2 months before 9-11
FAA rescinded rule allowing guns in cockpits just before terror attacks


A 40-year-old Federal Aviation Administration rule that allowed commercial airline pilots to be armed was inexplicably rescinded two months before the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, leading aviation security experts to lay at least some of the blame for the tragedy at the feet of airlines, none of which took advantage of the privilege while it was in effect.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=27647
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:02 pm
Blindly ignore? Nah, laugh at and ridicule, but not ignore...

I thought this was interesting...

Quote:
There is only one explanation. Explosives were placed in these buildings before the attack. The collapse of the North Tower started when explosives at the 94th floor were detonated. The explosives were timed so that the floors were shattered before the rubble contacted it.


How convenient that the airline flew into that floor to mask these explosives...

I wish you understood how incredibly stupid I find this whole 9/11 conspiracy. The government can't wipe it's own ass without some one leaking it to the press, yet people think they could keep a secret like this? Please.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:13 pm
About as stupid as your 'Iraqi WMD smuggled into Syria' theory, I would think, McG. The fact that you believe this, and ridicule anyone else, is truly laughable Laughing

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Zippo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:21 pm
McGentrix,

Yes, we are stupid, but you believe in Miracle's Laughing

Quote:
Another 911
'Passport Miracle' !

Like the Unscathed Hijacker Passport Found Near Ground Zero, Now Comes Flight 77 Passenger's Perfectly Intact ID Card Found at Pentagon Meltdown

Never before revealed passport of Pentagon victim called by critics 'another piece of bogus evidence' planted by the FBI like the passport, hijacker luggage and other suspicious evidence quickly linking the 19 Arab hijackers to 9/11.

One day after 9/11 the perfectly unscathed passport of Satam Al Suqami, one of the alleged 19 hijackers, was found several blocks from Ground Zero, even though its next to impossible such a flimsy item escaped the towering inferno unblemished.


It just flew right out of his pocket or bag several blocks away, undamaged.
And Elvis Presley is still alive.

Very Happy
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:28 pm
McGentrix wrote:
Blindly ignore? Nah, laugh at and ridicule, but not ignore...

I thought this was interesting...

Quote:
There is only one explanation. Explosives were placed in these buildings before the attack. The collapse of the North Tower started when explosives at the 94th floor were detonated. The explosives were timed so that the floors were shattered before the rubble contacted it.


How convenient that the airline flew into that floor to mask these explosives...

I wish you understood how incredibly stupid I find this whole 9/11 conspiracy. The government can't wipe it's own ass without some one leaking it to the press, yet people think they could keep a secret like this? Please.


It's obvious that you misunderestimate the power of the evil PNAC, McG.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:30 pm
Zippo wrote:
McGentrix,

Yes, we are stupid, but you believe in Miracle's Laughing

Quote:
Another 911
'Passport Miracle' !

Like the Unscathed Hijacker Passport Found Near Ground Zero, Now Comes Flight 77 Passenger's Perfectly Intact ID Card Found at Pentagon Meltdown

Never before revealed passport of Pentagon victim called by critics 'another piece of bogus evidence' planted by the FBI like the passport, hijacker luggage and other suspicious evidence quickly linking the 19 Arab hijackers to 9/11.

One day after 9/11 the perfectly unscathed passport of Satam Al Suqami, one of the alleged 19 hijackers, was found several blocks from Ground Zero, even though its next to impossible such a flimsy item escaped the towering inferno unblemished.


It just flew right out of his pocket or bag several blocks away, undamaged.
And Elvis Presley is still alive.

Very Happy


I apparently haven't been following this aspect of the conspiracy theory very closely. Am I to understand that you believe the FBI planted that passport, along with other pieces of evidence, because there weren't really islamic terrorists on board the 4 planes that crashed on 9/11, as the government has asserted? If that's the case, who did fly the planes?
0 Replies
 
Zippo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:33 pm
McGentrix

Quote:
The government can't wipe it's own ass


This makes me wonder why it doesn't stop you people from licking it ? Smile
0 Replies
 
Zippo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:52 pm
Ticomaya

Quote:
I apparently haven't been following this aspect of the conspiracy theory very closely. Am I to understand that you believe the FBI planted that passport, along with other pieces of evidence, because there weren't really islamic terrorists on board the 4 planes that crashed on 9/11, as the government has asserted? If that's the case, who did fly the planes?


Very good question Tico Smile , the answer lies in a truly independent investigation of 9/11. Thats all we want.

However, if you watch Loose Change, that will provide some very good clues.

I understand that you dont want to believe ANY of the arguments, put forth by so called conspiracy theorists, but if you looked into the facts, you too would have a hard time dismissing the notion that something is awfully wrong with the way, the US government runs the country.

I do hope that there will be light shed upon the case of 9/11 in the future, and that does not have to include a full blown governernmental scadal to satisfy anyone. A simple, independant and believable explanation as to what happened with no cover ups, would suffice. Until that the US administration is digging an information hole for themselves. It is the new age of the Internet, and information travels much much faster than it has in the past.

They cannot bury the 9/11 conflicting information, and in the end, they will not win by keeping quite. More and more people believe that the US administration is behind 9/11, and whether true or not, the genreral public are who decides what is written in history books.
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 12:54 pm
Zippo wrote:
You are still trying to debunk a straw man, your 'theory' cannot be applied to the North Tower and WTC 7.


Dave Heller, the author you posted, did the math for the South Tower. So did I. What's your problem with that?


Zippo wrote:
1. The official story is that the collapse began when one floor broke, and the pieces fell to the floor below it. <snip> The towers had 110 floors, so if it took one second for each floor to be crushed, that would be 110 seconds.


You're making the same mistake again and again. You are assuming that the collapse started on floor 110.

You have refused to explicitly answer this very simple question before, so I'm going to repeat it here, for your convenience:

Zippo, do you believe that the collapse of the Towers started on floor 110?
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:00 pm
While you're thinking about how to answer that question, let me post a picture for you, so you have something to look at in the meantime:

http://schmidtweb.tripod.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/wtc-collapse.jpg
0 Replies
 
Amigo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:09 pm
McGentrix wrote:
Amigo wrote:
Making a point comparing Bigfoot to Americans wanting the truth about 9/11??? Never forget.

It will be a great day when were on the same side.


That's right, never forget that Islamic terrorists planned for and attacked the US killing innocent Americans. It is a disservice to those people to try to lay the blame on the US government when the blame lies squarely on the shoulders of Osama Bin Laden and his zealots. Never forget how the events of 9/11 changed the course of history. Never forget those that have died avenging those who died on 9/11. Never forget why we are in Afghanistan and Iraq.

You seem to believe that mountains of theories, guesses, poor logic and guesswork will somehow change the facts the 2 airplanes, piloted by Islamic terrorists flew into the WTC and as a result, they collapsed.
Definitions of rhetoric:

using language effectively to please or persuade
grandiosity: high-flown style; excessive use of verbal ornamentation; "the grandiosity of his prose"; "an excessive ornateness of language"
palaver: loud and confused and empty talk; "mere rhetoric"
study of the technique and rules for using language effectively (especially in public speaking)
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:18 pm
And while we're at it, let me ask you the same question:

Amigo, do you believe that the collapse of the Towers started on floor 110?

That might have some more merits than discussing the definitions of "rhetoric"...
0 Replies
 
Amigo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:33 pm
Does calling people wacko conspiracy nuts have more merit then putting the definition of "rhetoric" in the face of those exploiting "rhetoric"? Nevermind.

I read your exchange with Zippo as it was happening and have been reading on it. No comment.
0 Replies
 
Zippo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:35 pm
old europe

Quote:
Zippo, do you believe that the collapse of the Towers started on floor 110?


Look up the word free fall

1. The fall of a body within the atmosphere without a drag.
2. The ideal falling motion of a body that is subject only to the earth's gravitational field.
3. Rapid uncontrolled decline

We're talking about the 'body' i.e Towers , what your saying is the tower collapsed from 79th floor, and the top remained in mid-air. Smile

How are you going to apply your theory to North Tower and WTC 7 ? Smile

South Tower the explosives were detonating right across the east face at the 75th floor, so probably started from there :

http://www.plaguepuppy.net/public_html/newsouth/snapshot(54).jpg

http://www.plaguepuppy.net/public_html/newsouth/snapshot(60).jpg

http://www.serendipity.li/wot/lines-of-explosives_1.gif

North Tower :

Review of videotape recordings of the collapse taken from various angles indicates that the transmission tower on top of the structure began to move downward and laterally slightly before movement was evident at the exterior wall. This suggests that collapse began with one or more failures in the central core area of the building. (FEMA, 2002, chapter 2; emphasis added.)

We can see for ourselves that the antenna drops first from videos of the North Tower collapse, so the collapse started from the top.

http://www.physics911.net/9-11%20Picture3.jpg



Now can you tell me where it started for WTC 7 ? :wink:

Also go back and answer my other questions.

Waiting......[for the straw man] Laughing
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:40 pm
So, is that a yes or no to OE's question?
0 Replies
 
Amigo
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:44 pm
McGentrix wrote:
So, is that a yes or no to OE's question?
That is something to give you guys a little charge, Keep your blood pumping.

**********

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_domestic_conspiracy_theory

Official account challenged

CNN broadcast of September 11 destruction when the second plane struck the south tower of the WTC.As the sun began to set on the evening of September 11, alternate theories of the 9/11 attacks were emerging to explain what had occurred. A history of events began to be developed from the mainstream media accounts, further known in this article as the common account or official story.

While those who accept the 9/11 Commission Report often dismiss alternative hypotheses as 'conspiracy theories,' there are individuals, groups and organizations who have researched the attacks and similarly dismiss the official version of events as a conspiracy theory. Professor of philosophy of religion and theology David Ray Griffin has written, "we can say that we accept all those conspiracy theories that we believe to be true, while we reject all those that we believe to be false."
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Thu 30 Mar, 2006 01:49 pm
Amigo wrote:
Does calling people wacko conspiracy nuts have more merit then putting the definition of "rhetoric" in the face of those exploiting "rhetoric"? Nevermind.

I read your exchange with Zippo as it was happening and have been reading on it. No comment.


I don't know, but want to emphasize that I never used the term "wacko conspiracy nuts". However, Zippo was talking about things "we had to do", "we were trying to get" etc... I was asking him what group he was speaking for, and he said the group's called "conspiracy nuts".

I'm not sure if I have mistakenly included you in this group. If you feel the term doesn't describe you and I have callled you a "conspiracy nut", I apologize.
0 Replies
 
 

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