"I COULD care less" or "I COULDN'T care less" Which is it?

dlowan wrote:

Eg: How many people actually have any idea what "In one fell swoop" actually refers to? They know what the phrase means in current English, but not why it means that.

There are many phrases like that, and I suspect "I could care less" is on its way to becoming an oddish example of one.

BUT IT'S LOOPY NONETHELESS!!

In one fell swoop........

From Shakespeare's Macbeth.

MACDUFF: [on hearing that his family and servants have all been killed]
He has no children. All my pretty ones?
Did you say all? O hell-kite! All?
What, all my pretty chickens and their dam
At one fell swoop?

The kite referred to is a hunting bird, like the Red Kite, which was common in England in Tudor times. The 'fell swoop' is the rapid descent made by the bird when capturing prey.

Fell can have two meanings.

1. Fell. Name given to a large open space of countryside, similar to "down" or "moor". This type of open space was popular for hunting with hawks. So...."fell swoop" is the type of descent witnessed during this type of hunt.

2. Fell is possibly an old english way of saying "falling", or rapid descent, as mentioned above ....therefore "In one falling swoop"

Interesting? ...or could/couldn't care less?

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chichan wrote:

I'm always surprized at just how firmly some are wedded to these bubbe maise.

I was surprised to see that the word "surprized" garnered 339,000 hits upon a google search.

I'm genuinely curious: Is that considered proper spelling in some parts or settings?

And if it can be answered without derailing the thread too much, which is more proper: "apprized" or "apprised"?

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"which is more proper: "apprized" or "apprised""

dont quite know how to say this tico but apprized and apprised mean two different things

and more proper is tautology

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1 entry found for apprised.

ap·prise

To give notice to; inform: apprised us of our rights.

1 entry found for apprized.

ap·prize

To appreciate; value.

from dictionary.com

which is more better than yours Smile

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Steve (as 41oo) wrote:

which is more better than yours

I think if you will look at the root words "apprise" and "apprize" on dictionary.com, you will find that each refers to the other as a synonym. Look at the second entry for "apprize."

And while I agree that "more better" is redundant, I still don't think "more proper" is. :wink:

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Oxford Shorter gives-

Apprise- from French apprendre,to teach.
(1694).Causitive of the sense 'learn'.To impart information.To acqaint.To be aware.To notify.To advise (rare).

Apprize.To put up for sale at a set price.Appraise.To value,appreciate.

More proper might be okay used as greater magnitude or importance.e.g.It could be more proper to bow correctly to the Queen at an investiture than to have your fork on the right side of your plate at breakfast simply because of the greater importance of the occasion for those who think the former is more important.
More can be used to signify greater quantity,amount or degree so maybe "more better" is alright too.A lady could use it coquettishly under certain circumstances and that would be fine I'm sure.She might use it to denote,at the same time,that she isn't pedantic.(That's probably rare as well.)

I'm not sure though.

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It might be a question of style.

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Spendius, I'll have whatever you're on Smile

more proper is like more correct or more best. It doesnt work.

you wouldnt say proper-er or correct-er or best-er

I think, and I know English is a flexible friend, and God knows you Americans bend it all over the place

but I think instead of "more proper" in the way you used it, "better grammar"....

or if you meant proper = formal

then yes there are degrees of formality

so you could say more formal

there aint the degrees of properness, something is either proper or its not.

so long as you werent being sarcastic which would change the meaning from I could to I couldnt in modern American wouldnt it?

How the hell should I know anyway?

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Steve-

The entry under "More" is 5 inches of close packed fine print and the light in here is a bit dim.But it did say "importance" is a factor.I take that to mean that the proper thing to do is more proper when the occasion is more important as in the example I offered.One might say that the fuel gauge on a lunar lander had to be more correct that the one in your scooter.(I'm using scooter to mean anything you scoot in or on.).Could one say that pie is more correct at 3.142 that at 3.14.

I don't know either.I don't think I would ever use "more better" but I might use "more proper" and I could easily use "more correct" and "more formal".

I may well be confused.When you're on what I'm on you easily get confused.

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Steve (as 41oo) wrote:

you wouldnt say proper-er ...

heh. Right, that's why you say, "more proper." Duh!

Quote:

or if you meant proper = formal

then yes there are degrees of formality

so you could say more formal

there aint the degrees of properness, something is either proper or its not.

I meant "proper" in the sense of "appropriate." And I disagree yet again ... there are degrees of properness and appropriateness.

Quote:

so long as you werent being sarcastic which would change the meaning from I could to I couldnt in modern American wouldnt it?

I'm not sure I speak "modern American." Any translators?

Quote:

How the hell should I know anyway?

Because you're English ... duh!

Actually, so is Spendius ... perhaps you blokes can arm wrestle or something to see who's more correct .....

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Lord Ellpus wrote:

dlowan wrote:

Eg: How many people actually have any idea what "In one fell swoop" actually refers to? They know what the phrase means in current English, but not why it means that.

There are many phrases like that, and I suspect "I could care less" is on its way to becoming an oddish example of one.

BUT IT'S LOOPY NONETHELESS!!

In one fell swoop........

From Shakespeare's Macbeth.

MACDUFF: [on hearing that his family and servants have all been killed]
He has no children. All my pretty ones?
Did you say all? O hell-kite! All?
What, all my pretty chickens and their dam
At one fell swoop?

The kite referred to is a hunting bird, like the Red Kite, which was common in England in Tudor times. The 'fell swoop' is the rapid descent made by the bird when capturing prey.

Fell can have two meanings.

1. Fell. Name given to a large open space of countryside, similar to "down" or "moor". This type of open space was popular for hunting with hawks. So...."fell swoop" is the type of descent witnessed during this type of hunt.

2. Fell is possibly an old english way of saying "falling", or rapid descent, as mentioned above ....therefore "In one falling swoop"

Interesting? ...or could/couldn't care less?

I KNEW WHAT IT MEANT!!!!

I even know what imping and all the hawking metaphors mean in Taming of the Shrew.

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Steve (as 41oo) wrote:

So the dog, Rosie the rivetter (I think) are on my side, the rabbit's neutral. In the opposing camp is a frighteningly intelligent German physicist (who must stop throwing paper about) and a person possibly of chichanese extraction.

Chichan you said yourself, "how can sarcasm make something true or false" ? I asked that question earlier.

but you went on to say

"... "I could care less" has the same meaning as "I couldn't care less".... "

Which space-time continuum did you say you came from?

Where, in our Universe, does a statement, and the direct negation of that statement, have the same meaning?

Well, in Shakespeare's time, as one example, it was common to use a double negative to give emphasis.

More xxxxx was a common construction, also to give emphasis.

Both are uncommon now, although more something is less uncommon, as in "more proper", and is related to number of syllables in a word.

Shakespeare would also happily write things like "more happier" more fairer"

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yeah well what does shakespeare know about English?

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he's dead isnt he?

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Define "dead".

He certainly no longer has a meat based existence.

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clinical or metaphorical?

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you added that!

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I thought "fell" meant "lucky."

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"... perhaps you blokes can arm wrestle or something to see who's more correct ....."

actually tico, beneath your abrasive, sorry abrazive, exterior I detect something akin to a sense of humour (humor).

Quite rare in our American cousins, well done and keep it up old bean.

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"I COULD care less" or "I COULDN'T care less" Which is it?

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