dyslexia..
I did not say you were wrong at all.
I probably just picked up a dose of mad cow disease on my last sojourn.
I was in the UK last month. Didn't worry a bit. c.i.
O.K. we'll get back to topic. The story has gone from an Iraq loaded to the hilt with centres manufacturing weapons and a massive number of rockets to deliver them to concrete evidence of zero. So they managed to dismantle and hide them since February, a concept that flies in the face of logic because they JUST FOUGHT A WAR. In a war you use weapons, if there really had been dispersed amongst Iraqi armed forces they would have been either used or captured.
So now the story is that there are mobile laboratories capable of producing the agents (but not able to deliver them). Or they were snuck out to Syria. Or they were destroyed. Christ, the Marines can manage to find $4 million dollars in greenbacks and a $1B in gold, but the can't find the equivalent of a factory (and a munitions factory at that).
Next step, the Workstations of Mass Destruction. We can't locate the actual items or the facilities, but there has to be records of such activity. So, looted computers have all the information, we need to find these before this information is used to create WMDs!
Mr Still, We must use logic in defense and opposition on the question of WMD's in Iraq. As you say, the time line just doesn't fit the tons of WMD's that supposedly existed. As for those portable chemical labs, that's not the whole shoot'n match. They probably had both fixed and portable labs. Yes? The many problems proferred by Saddam are many. The first one was the 12,000 page declaration that only repeated what was available back in 1991-1998. The second problem was the unproven destruction of all their WMD's. The third problem was their claim that they had no WMD's. The fourth problem was the inability of the chemists, scientists, and engineers to speak freely. If it's true that many of their WMD's were destroyed several days before the war started, all Saddam needed to do was to broadcast that action to the world, and to let the UN inspectors to verify it. He didn't do that. Saddam also understood that the US and UK were preparing for military action very soon. Everybody in the world knew that the US and UK were preparing for military action very soon. The Iraqi army had gas masks at many locations throughout Iraq. Why? If they had no intention of using chemical or biological weapons, why did they have gas masks? Although I was against the preemptive attack on Iraq on the premise that Saddam's WMD's were under control by the UN inspectors, I still believe WMD's will be eventually found in Iraq. I think it's only a matter of time as more Iraqi's come forward to provide information on their WMD programs and hiding places. Finally, I still think it's best to wait before we come to any conclusions about Iraq's WMD program. c.i.
Why did the US soldiers had gasmasks? What what that plan to use riot control agents to attack Bagdad.
This war was never about WMD. Have you heard what Blix said this week? THe US deliberatly sabotaged and undermined the work of the inspectors. There is a saying in Dutch
"If you want to beat up a dog, its easy to find a stick."
Tell me, how can u destroy tons and tons, thousands and thousands of gallons? All products used in WMD. Without leaving a trace? Without 300.000 soldiers knocking on your back- and frontdoor. With satelites spying on you. With several thousands of special forces operating in the area? With CIA officers infiltrated,....
How is it possible to destroy that enormous stockpile of WMD, without leaving one single trace?
And one last question. IF they had WMD. Why didn't they use it to slaughter the Kurds? Why didn't they use it when the US soldiers passed the so-called red line?
Real classy signature line there, Frolic.
snood wrote:Real classy signature line there, Frolic.
Thanks :wink:
I guess people get the respect they deserve, dont they?
(that boy's been drinking too much! nobody has that much pee available!)
An interesting article from The Times.
Reports of weapons 'greatly exaggerated' By Bronwen MaddoxWhat they said about weapons of mass destruction:
Quote:George Bush, October 7, 2002
Quote:"We are dealing with a very real threat today, that of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction"
Geoff Hoon, March 10, 2003
Quote:"His (Saddam Hussein's) regime has large, unaccounted-for stockpiles of chemical and biological weaponsand he has an active programme to acquire and develop nuclear weapons"
Donald Rumsfeld, January 20, 2003
Quote:"Every statement I make today is backed up by sources, solid sources. These are not assertions. What we're giving you are facts and conclusions based on solid intelligence.
"In fact, they (Iraqi regime) can produce enough dry biological agent in a single month to kill thousands upon thousands of people. "Saddam Hussein has never accounted for vast amounts of chemical weaponry: 550 artillery shells with mustard, 30,000 empty munitions, and enough precursors to increase his stockpile to as much as 500 tons of chemical agents. If we consider just one category of missing weaponry, 6,500 bombs from the Iran-Iraq war. . . Our conservative estimate is that Iraq today has a stockpile of between 100 and 500 tonnes of chemical-weapons agent. Even the low end of 100 tonnes of agent would enable Saddam Hussein to cause mass casualties across more than 100 square miles of territory, an area nearly five times the size of Manhattan"
Colin Powell, address to the UN Security Council, February 5, 2003
Quote:"It is right (going to war) because weapons of mass destruction, chemical, biological and nuclear weapons, are a real threat to the security of the world and this country"
Tony Blair, House of Commons, January 15, 2003
Quote:"What I believe the assessed intelligence has established beyond doubt is that Saddam has continued to produce chemical and biological weapons, and that he has been able to extend the range of his ballistic missile programme.
His (Saddam Hussein's) military planning allows for some of the WMD to be ready within 45 minutes of an order to use them."
Tony Blair, Foreword to Iraq "dossier"
Well, it's been nearly a month since the last post to this thread, and I just thought everyone would like to know that our troops have been
verrrry busy looking for the WMDs (but not very lucky finding them):
Quote:he found a cache of vacuum cleaners.
So it goes for Site Survey Team 3, which today begins its ninth week in the hunt for illegal weapons. One of four such units assembled before the war, it has screened intelligence leads from Basra to Baghdad with discouraging, even darkly comic, results. Team 3's odyssey through Iraq is a tale of frustration and disillusionment.
Allison's 25 men and women have dug up a playground, raided a distillery, seized a research paper from a failing graduate student and laid bare a swimming pool where an underground chemical weapons stash was supposed to be.
An Odyssey of Frustration in Iraq
Maybe, the ought to have some more pratcise .... and look for a car, something like John Kelso suggests in the Austin American Statesman
Call the feds! I can't find my Honda!
Thanks for the update, btw, PDiddie!
There is an interesting link provided By James Morrison on another thread. A very non-standard version of answer to a question that appears in the title of the current thread:
http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=211779&highlight=#211779
And now according to a NYTimes/CBS News Poll conducted between May 9 and 12 2003, it doesn't matter to the majority of Americans POLLED(don't know how many and what methods and can't bring up online).
"Victory in Iraq, Even Without Saddam and Weapons:
If Saddam Hussein is not captured or killed, then do you think the US will have won the war in Iraq, or not?
Will have won the war...56%
Will not have won.........37%
No Answer.....................7%
If the United States and its allies never find any weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, then do you think the war against Iraq will have been worth the loss of American life and other costs of attacking Iraq, or not?
Worth it........................56%
Not worth it...................38%
No Answer......................6%"
This all from page two of The Week in Review of the New York Times today.
I think if this poll is correct, and I think it is suspect, the American people that fall for this nonsense are dunderheads. The slope is getting very slippery indeed towards fascism.
Vietnamnurse wrote:
I think if this poll is correct, and I think it is suspect, the American people that fall for this nonsense are dunderheads. The slope is getting very slippery indeed towards fascism.
Which was somehow to expect, wasn't it?
Fascism? Heavens forbid! If the USA really was a fascist (or a Communist) country, then Vietnamnurse would not be able not only to express her opinion online, but even to get online at all. Or, the number of accessible sites would be restricted by some law enforcing agency.
Yes, indeed, Walter. I have been noting the progression of this for some time since Bush was appointed president. Nothing that has happened has changed my views or fears for my country. I learned a long time ago to question authority and to clarify, clarify, clarify. This most secretive administration lies to us daily and people do not question?
For now, Steissd...this is the beginning. If Patriot Act II were to be brought about, who knows what would happen to us who question? Professor Niemoller of Germany did not question until they carted him away, remember? Always question the government.
I personally don't think so , but I can understand people, who compare the momentary situation in the US to that in Germany in the 30's.
Walter, we had the main media in this country cheering on the war in Iraq...people who do not go online or to the BBC for news were getting fed news from CNN, Fox, MSNBC, and the main networks ALL corporate owned that this war was just wonderful. They didn't want to show the Iraqi dead and wounded, God forbid we should see what our weaponry does!
I was listening to the radio the other morning...we have at least one liberal radio station YET left! Amy Goodman of Democracy Now had a great line..."If Hitler had had TV and the major media, just think of what he could have accomplished!"
Most people in this country do not have the time we have to read and digest the news. I am saying we are ripe for something and if it ain't fascism, it ain't good!
