8
   

Fitzgerald Investigation of Leak of Identity of CIA Agent

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 04:39 pm
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

Quote:
Obama was a US Senator which means he has some experience with the Federal government.


Lets be honest.
He was the JUNIOR Senator from Illinois, and he had very little actual power in the Senate.
He also started running for POTUS almost as soon as he was elected, so he missed quite a bit of time in the Senate.

I spent 24 years serving my country, so using your logic I have more experience with the federal govt then Obama does.


No, that's not his logic at all. See, you were part of the Armed forces, correct? That gives you experience in... the armed forces, not the Federal government.

Cycloptichorn
teenyboone
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 04:42 pm
@okie,
Thanks! For nothing!
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 04:48 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
But the armed forces are part of the federal govt.

0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 10:23 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:

Quote:
I am not going to vote for a corrupt Chicago street organizer that has no experience doing anything, except knowing how to read a teleprompter.

It's funny how you justify your nonsense okie by making the Democrats bad with made up "facts." Couldn't you try looking at the actual facts sometime?

Obama was a US Senator which means he has some experience with the Federal government. That quickly points out the falsity of your claim he has "no experience." You prefer to denigrate with falsehoods rather than stick to actual facts.

So I stretched it a bit, but not very much, as in reality he has little experience, none that is impressive at all. He is not the only guy in government with little or no experience, but he has to be a president with less experience than almost any of the other ones. He was elevated by the press to being a presidential contender because of one speech he gave, which I did not find particularly impressive but the press did. Thats all it amounted to. His record as a senator is not notable at all, he didn't do much of anything, and as mm said, he spent most of his time preparing to run or running for president.

Fact is, I would recommend every congressman actually work in the private sector for a few years prior to running for office, yes, I think that would be very beneficial. Then they might actually know something about the businesses and the economy that they are governing.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 10:28 pm
@teenyboone,
teenyboone wrote:

Thanks! For nothing!

Okay if thats the way you feel. Thanks for taking the time to discuss ideas at least.

Reminder, MLK was a Republican. Read this again. http://www.nbra.info/
genoves
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 4 Jun, 2009 11:07 pm
@okie,
Okie- I usually do not contradict you, but I find that I must.

Obama has a great deal of experience:

l. He has gone through the experience of having his drunken father from Kenya( who was a Muslim)desert his mother and family when he was young.

That was Some experience.

2. He has gone through the experience of having his mother remarry a Muslim from Indonesia.

3, He has gone through the experience of attending a Moslem School in Indonesia for at least one year.

4. He has had experience with cocaine and other drugs( he admitted it in his autobiography.

5. He has had the experience of having some fine mentors--The most prominent of which was a person who had been a card carrying Communist.

6. He has had the experience of going to an obscure college on the West Coast --Occidental( from which no one can obtain a clear story of his success( or failure) there

7. He has had the experience of going to Columbia after Occidental. IT IS TO BE CLEARLY NOTED THAT HIS GRADES AT COLUMBIA WERE NOT, I REPEAT, WERE NOT, HIGH ENOUGH TO GIVE HIM AN ENTRY INTO HARVARD LAW SCHOOL EVEN IF HE SCORED A PERFECT SCORE ON HIS LSAT.( He is, of course, a beneficiary of Affirmative Action--his vaunted promise about 'transparency" does not hold in this regard.

8. He worked for a time in a large Chicago Law Firm. He has had experience in a large law firm but he either thought he was set for higher things or he did not feel he would be able to meet the rigorous demands of a top law firm.

9. He had the experience of being trained for his job by acolytes of Saul Alinsky-the famous Socialist.

10. He had the experience of working in the Ghetto( I am sure that he has a great deal of empathy for the "brothers and sisters" in the Ghetto but I do not think he ever worked with any other ethnic group.

11. He had the experience of being appointed to several Boards by the esteemed former "Weatherman" bomber, William Ayres.

12. He had the experience, while on that Board, of voting to give thousands of dollars to GUESS WHO? ACORN!!!

13. He had the experience of wheeling and dealing his way through the Primary for Senator while his "brothers" in the Legislature saw to it that he had no real opposition.

14. He had the experience of doing almost nothing--introduced no major bills--when he was in the Senate.

15. He had the experience of being identified as the MOST LIBERAL Senator in the Senate.

16. He had the experience of running for President while calling for all out voting help from ACORN.

17. He had the experience of winning the Presidency despite the fact that the majority of white voters did not vote for him.

18. And, now, he has the experience of being president where he has put into motion initiatives which will ruin the country--massive deficits--irrational plans to Socialize Medical care-a very very expensive proposition which will cost Billions---unwise attempts to cut the so-called global warming even though China and India will not cooperate and the US will lose millions of jobs if Obama's plans were enacted--and, last but not least, free( meaning taxpayer subsidized) education for all --even minorities, many of whom cannot read or write when they leave high school.

SO, I AM SORRY, OKIE, YOU ARE MISTAKEN. OBAMA HAS PLENTY OF EXPERIENCE --THE WRONG KIND!
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Jun, 2009 10:05 am
@mysteryman,
Some of those with great experience were the worst presidents. Some with the least (e.g., Lincoln), were the best. Everything must be factored in.
0 Replies
 
teenyboone
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Jun, 2009 02:30 pm
@okie,
Okie at least you and I agree to disagree. Genoves on the other hand, should really be careful what he/she posts. There are laws against treason, you know. In another country Genoves would be arrested, so be thankful we're Americans. At least I know MysteryMan served his country! We are aware of each other from the now defunct Abuzz. I admit I'm a Democrat, Black, Female, Catholic, Southern and Liberal. Isn't that what a person that calls themselves Christians should be, outside of political party?

All I want is Peace. Here and abroad. Our Soldiers and sailors shouldn't have to leave home and go to war. War is Hell! Ask anyone who's strapped on a uniform, left home for a year or more, to serve Uncle Sam, at low wages, much discomfort and no job to return to upon arrival back, if they arrive home whole!

All this crap about what Obama IS, or is NOT, is too much energy misspent!
Take a look at Bush and Cheney and what they were! Bush called the wars a "crusade"! Oh, I'll bet Al-Quaida LOVED that! I thought we were a tolerant Nation. A melting pot. Well, what are we? Is it wrong that a child raised "differently" can't join us at the table?

McCain was raised differently, bragging about his Civil War ancestors. Sarah Palin was raised in Alaska. She certainly wasn't BORN there, but some of you question whether Obama is an American. I suggest you all read the Constitution and the Bill of Rights to see what determines who is and who isn't an American. McCain was born in Panama! Is HE an American? I'll bet he is, seeing he was born in the Canal Zone to a military father! Read up though on his military "hot-dogging", killing several sailors aboard the ship he was stationed on, then the Navy quietly transferring him to another ship, because of his father and his "white-ness"!

Think a Black man would get the same treatment? Ask my Navy husband! You KNOW what the answer is! All of the fear mongering, I've read on this and other threads convince me that racism is VERY alive and well in America, if you're Black.
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Jun, 2009 11:02 pm
@teenyboone,
teeny, I enjoyed your post.

In regard to genoves, he has alot of useful information, but I agree, he goes into the gutter with name calling, over the top in my opinion. If he or she could eliminate that, he could be a very good source of information.

Mysteryman, it is interesting how over time, one can almost feel or judge someone's character, and I agree, he seems like a very good guy.

McCain, I think you are right, he was a kind of hothead when young, maybe a fast living daredevil kind of guy. I had other choices over him in the primaries, but in his older age, I think you cannot take away what McCain has done for his country, he loves it, and although I don't always agree with him or even think he is that smart of a politician, I can respect him as a person. Actually, where is the perfect politician, there is none. And that is the reason I don't particularly put my faith in politics or politicians. I enjoy the debate, it is interesting, politics is interesting, and since I think I love this country, I care about how it is run and what happens to it. After all, I have children and grandchildren.

Racism, sure there is some around, but it is subsided to the point that Obama was elected, so this issue was supposed to be put to rest, wasn't it? In fact, I am not sure Obama would have been elected if he was white, as I think alot of the romance and popularity of his candidacy was electing a black man. And actually he is half white, so I don't get it, I don't actually care what color he is, teeny, I don't like his politics, period.

I have a final question that really flummoxes me, you say you are Catholic. I thought Catholics believe staunchly that abortion is wrong, its killing an innocent. How can you support a man that has consistently voted for almost every form of abortion, including late term partial birth abortion, even consenting to killing a child if it lives after an unsuccessful abortion?

I have a friend, same thing, a Catholic and on issues like immigration, the economy, education, a bunch of things, he is conservative and agrees with my take on the issues, but he voted for Obama for crying out loud. The stated reason, it comes down to one thing, Iraq. I don't get it. He bought the Democrat garbage that Bush made up WMD all by himself, which is total and absolute baloney.

So teeny, how do you explain this, considering you are Catholic? Your explanation is pertinent to millions of Catholics that don't seem to vote their beliefs. And don't try to tell me you can't make the moral decision for other people. We do it all the time, thats why murder and robbery are against the law.
okie
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jun, 2009 09:48 pm
@okie,
One other point to teeny about Obama, he is even giving our tax money to other countries for them to do abortions. So his policy is now global. How do you feel about that, as a Catholic?
0 Replies
 
genoves
 
  0  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2009 10:27 pm
Teenyboone wrote:

Okie at least you and I agree to disagree. Genoves on the other hand, should really be careful what he/she posts. There are laws against treason, you know. In another country Genoves would be arrested, so be thankful we're Americans. At least I know MysteryMan served his country! We are aware of each other from the now defunct Abuzz. I admit I'm a Democrat, Black, Female, Catholic, Southern and Liberal. Isn't that what a person that calls themselves Christians should be, outside of political party?
******************************************************************

ARE YOU SERIOUS???? THERE ARE LAWS AGAINST TREASON?????

It is certain that you have never read Moveon.Org. The names they called George W. Bush were TEN times worse than anything I could ever make up, SO< teenyboone, until they do not come to arrest Moveon.org, I will post whatever I think is the truth.

Now, Teenyboone, perhaps you can tell me why I should not post the truth.

I am sure that you know that posting the truth is a perfect defense.

Maybe you can point out the "lies" Please do so but be prepared to give evidence as to why they are lies--Other wise . get lost!!!
genoves
 
  0  
Reply Sun 7 Jun, 2009 10:30 pm
OK-Teenyboone--Point out the lies GIVING EVIDENCE AS TO WHY THEY ARE LIES. I don't think you have read many of my posts. I never post unless I can show PROOF for everything I say.

Go ahead--If you can't --GET LOST!!!
0 Replies
 
teenyboone
 
  1  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2009 05:11 pm
@okie,
Considering I'm a Catholic, I myself, would never have an abortion, but I grew up in a time, when women had "back-alley" abortions, back in the 50's and 60's. That, kept my legs CLOSED! I would never hinder someone for doing what they choose to do, whether they be Catholic or Protestant. Poor women do not have access to opportunities that well to do women have. They have abortions too, but can fly off to Switzerland, while the poor woman has to have either a back-alley abortion, commit suicide, go to a home for unwed mothers or take dangerous drugs to end the pregnancy.

I believe in sex education, use of contraceptives, etc. While the Papacy orders women to cave in to a mans' desires, I am firmly against it. The Church is ordering women to submit to rape, in my opinion. As an educated woman, wife and mother, I submit to NO man. I only submit to God. God knows the pain that women have to endure just to give birth.

My pregnancies and deliveries were painful. I had 5 "live" births and 1 miscarriage. The miscarriage occurred in the emergency room. It was a fatal pregnancy from the onset. I knew I was going to miscarry. I just didn't know when. I was on medication from month one. It was worse than having a baby. I was in intensive care for 2 weeks.

Back then I was married to a Catholic. I should never have married this person. 4 years and 2 more kids, I got a divorce, so God stepped in and delivered me from the horror I was living. 3 years later, I remarried a Protestant. We have one child together, a girl. I'll be married 40 years in November. No, I believe a woman has the right to do with her body anything she sees fit.

As far as Obama being Black, my vote had nothing to do with his color. I knew that a young President would come from his generation. Why? These kids were born in the early 60's. A time of enormous change. The public and Catholic schools were integrating, Blacks gained the right to vote in '64 and in '65, accomodations barriers fell. Affirmative Action gave otherwise not hired at all, Black men, women, Asians and Hispanics, based on qualifications and education. Title 9, I think, made participation in NCAA Sports more equitable. Women still aren't THERE, yet. So Obama becoming President was another bench mark in my life.

These kids have gone to school, where the kids were all colors and nationalities, the way this country is supposed to be. The melting pot reality instead of the "myth" put out by politicians, but never practiced. Civil Rights, made all of what we call the melting pot a reality.

Blacks are still "profiled", incarcerated on the word or suspician of one person, who "thinks" the perpetrator is the 1st Black they see. DNA has cleared hundreds of Blacks for crimes they never committed. The question begs, "How do you get your life back"?

As far as Obama he is a "moderate", not the far left that he has been portrayed. He is a lawyer and most of all, a politician! Bingo! In my humble opinion, ANYTHING would have been better than Bush! If the Republicans had run a strong candidate, which McCain wasn't, I as a Democrat, would have voted Republican.

McCain's campaign never took on a theme. His campaign was reactionary to everything Obama was doing. It was like the Republicans acting as "voyeurs", instead of ACTING on their own! They were like the Keystone Kops! I think he (McCain), thought that White voters would not vote for him in the numbers they did.

What if Obama turns the economy around? What if jobs start coming back with the Stimulus? After what Bush has taken this country through in 8 years, giving to the rich while bleeding the poor, Obama is a breath of fresh air! I'm not looking over my shoulder. I don't think my phone is tapped! I don't think my emails are being intercepted, but I still think there is a "shadow" government! I just lowered my shoulders a bit. I haven't let my guard down, yet! The Bush Administration was so crooked, with their "no bid" contracts to their friends and those BLACK OPS, Americans were NEVER aware of. Contractors making more money than our enlisted men. Blackwater enlisting former marines and air force veterans to kill innocent civilians in our names, the "secret" jails around the world and the room that AT&T allowed the government to listen in on ALL phone calls, not just suspected terrorists.

No, I'm not at ease, yet. Bush & Co. have changed me, forever! There IS no 1st Amendment! Cheney flushed that down a toilet!
teenyboone
 
  1  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2009 06:21 pm
@genoves,
TROLL!
okie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 8 Jun, 2009 10:24 pm
@teenyboone,
teenyboone wrote:

Considering I'm a Catholic, I myself, would never have an abortion, but I grew up in a time, when women had "back-alley" abortions, back in the 50's and 60's. That, kept my legs CLOSED! I would never hinder someone for doing what they choose to do, whether they be Catholic or Protestant. Poor women do not have access to opportunities that well to do women have. They have abortions too, but can fly off to Switzerland, while the poor woman has to have either a back-alley abortion, commit suicide, go to a home for unwed mothers or take dangerous drugs to end the pregnancy.

Or they could choose to take responsibility and raise that poor helpless child. Imagine that, taking responsibility, now that would be quite a thing. Or they could adopt the child out to the many couples that want to adopt children.

Quote:
I believe in sex education, use of contraceptives, etc. While the Papacy orders women to cave in to a mans' desires, I am firmly against it. The Church is ordering women to submit to rape, in my opinion. As an educated woman, wife and mother, I submit to NO man. I only submit to God. God knows the pain that women have to endure just to give birth.

I am not a Catholic, but thats the first I have ever heard of that, teeny, the Church is ordering women to submit to rape? If you actually believe that, I would not belong to a church like that.

Quote:
My pregnancies and deliveries were painful. I had 5 "live" births and 1 miscarriage. The miscarriage occurred in the emergency room. It was a fatal pregnancy from the onset. I knew I was going to miscarry. I just didn't know when. I was on medication from month one. It was worse than having a baby. I was in intensive care for 2 weeks.
Thats the way we are made as humans, teeny, I cannot fix that. And we all die after 3 score and ten, or whatever. I cannot fix that. Submit your complaint to the Lord.

Quote:
Back then I was married to a Catholic. I should never have married this person. 4 years and 2 more kids, I got a divorce, so God stepped in and delivered me from the horror I was living. 3 years later, I remarried a Protestant. We have one child together, a girl. I'll be married 40 years in November. No, I believe a woman has the right to do with her body anything she sees fit.
Congratulations on the 40 years. I am not too far behind you. But no, I heartily disagree about a woman and her body, there are numerous laws about what we can do with our bodies, both men and women. And remember, it still takes a man to make a baby, last I checked, so it isn't just the woman involved, not just her body anymore after sexual unions are completed.

Quote:
As far as Obama being Black, my vote had nothing to do with his color. I knew that a young President would come from his generation. Why? These kids were born in the early 60's. A time of enormous change. The public and Catholic schools were integrating, Blacks gained the right to vote in '64 and in '65, accomodations barriers fell. Affirmative Action gave otherwise not hired at all, Black men, women, Asians and Hispanics, based on qualifications and education. Title 9, I think, made participation in NCAA Sports more equitable. Women still aren't THERE, yet. So Obama becoming President was another bench mark in my life.

These kids have gone to school, where the kids were all colors and nationalities, the way this country is supposed to be. The melting pot reality instead of the "myth" put out by politicians, but never practiced. Civil Rights, made all of what we call the melting pot a reality.

Blacks are still "profiled", incarcerated on the word or suspician of one person, who "thinks" the perpetrator is the 1st Black they see. DNA has cleared hundreds of Blacks for crimes they never committed. The question begs, "How do you get your life back"?

As far as Obama he is a "moderate", not the far left that he has been portrayed. He is a lawyer and most of all, a politician! Bingo! In my humble opinion, ANYTHING would have been better than Bush! If the Republicans had run a strong candidate, which McCain wasn't, I as a Democrat, would have voted Republican.

And what Republican would be a strong candidate, teeny. Criminy, I thought McCain was a reach across the aisle guy, a moderate, a guy that got along with Democrats, etc. Fact is, some have speculated in the past that he would change parties. Maybe he still will for all I know. And he still lost. One reason is the press loved him as long as he criticized his own party, but when he ran for president, they stabbed him in the back. Face it, if any Republican runs, you are going to have to see through the media bias in order to vote Republican. If you want to be trendy, you will vote Democrat every time, just like you did Obama.

Quote:
McCain's campaign never took on a theme. His campaign was reactionary to everything Obama was doing. It was like the Republicans acting as "voyeurs", instead of ACTING on their own! They were like the Keystone Kops! I think he (McCain), thought that White voters would not vote for him in the numbers they did.

I did not think McCain ran a good campaign, I agree, but the mainstream press is worth 15 points in an election, its tough to overcome, and they all tanked for Obama.

Quote:
What if Obama turns the economy around? What if jobs start coming back with the Stimulus? After what Bush has taken this country through in 8 years, giving to the rich while bleeding the poor, Obama is a breath of fresh air! I'm not looking over my shoulder. I don't think my phone is tapped! I don't think my emails are being intercepted, but I still think there is a "shadow" government! I just lowered my shoulders a bit. I haven't let my guard down, yet! The Bush Administration was so crooked, with their "no bid" contracts to their friends and those BLACK OPS, Americans were NEVER aware of. Contractors making more money than our enlisted men. Blackwater enlisting former marines and air force veterans to kill innocent civilians in our names, the "secret" jails around the world and the room that AT&T allowed the government to listen in on ALL phone calls, not just suspected terrorists.

No, I'm not at ease, yet. Bush & Co. have changed me, forever! There IS no 1st Amendment! Cheney flushed that down a toilet!

So it all goes back to hate Bush, thats it. And all the what ifs, what if Obama is a complete bust, teeny, what if jobs don't come back? Or if they do, it will be a very mild recovery, and by then we will be in debt trillions more. And face it, every president has no-bid contracts, wake up, thats a total made up crock. Secret jails, AT&T, how many lives were saved, teeny, all of that is nothing more than liberal spin on Bush. You have to apply critical thinking to this instead of swallowing the hate Bush propaganda. News today, the liberal Panetta says do not make texts of interrogations public, it will be a national security mistake. Obama is drifting toward using Bush policies in these regards, the reason being it was prudent.

You will someday wish we had Bush back, after you realize some of the policies were totally reasonable in regard to national security. What do you want, another FDR to round up all the nationalities that he didn't trust? Educate yourself with some history and apply some context to the liberal propaganda. Get a grip, teeny.

To summarize, I like your debate style, you are honest, forthright, and you explain your opinions. Even if we disagree, I respect your opinion. An important observation here, you are definitely not a typical liberal poster, you have a mind of your own, and that is good, you are a step above many here.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  2  
Reply Tue 9 Jun, 2009 07:44 am
Okie, you never hesitate to distort the facts to make your point. As for McCain being a man who could work both sides of the aisle, the public learned during the campaign that McCain voted in lockstep (about 90 % of the time) with Bush. Thus, McCain was fully responsible for the failed Bush policies.
okie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 9 Jun, 2009 10:24 am
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:

Okie, you never hesitate to distort the facts to make your point. As for McCain being a man who could work both sides of the aisle, the public learned during the campaign that McCain voted in lockstep (about 90 % of the time) with Bush. Thus, McCain was fully responsible for the failed Bush policies.

Your problem is that if you want to look at failed policies, Bush's don't hold a candle to the failed policies of some other presidents, including the one we have now. In fact, Bush was successful on many of his policies, and slowly the populace will look back and realize this, I hope, if they are smart enough to see it.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  0  
Reply Tue 9 Jun, 2009 06:45 pm
@Advocate,
I believe you need to learn some basic math.

90% of something is not all of it.
So, if he voted with Bush 90% of the time, that means that he opposed Bush 10% of the time.
Therefore, he cannot be "fully responsible" for the Bush policies.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 10 Jun, 2009 11:12 am
@mysteryman,
And you need to learn a wee bit about both language and logic, MM.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Wed 10 Jun, 2009 11:21 am
@Advocate,
Yup! Conservatives forget so easily of the recent past; it was common knowledge that McCain voted with Bush 90% of the time even though he tried to separate himself from Bush during the campaign. McCain played all the "tricks" of campaigning including choosing (unqualified) Palin as his running mate because he thought it would win him the presidency.

McCain changed his mind on so many issues to win votes, nobody knew where he stood on anything.

We must also not forget his trip to DC to help with Obama's stimulus plan.

Quote:

Jed Lewison
[email protected] | HuffPost Reporting From DC

McCain Drops 'Main Street' Stimulus, Follows Obama's Lead On Taxpayer Protections

September 23, 2008 05:02 PM

This afternoon, John McCain gave his first press conference in nearly six weeks, answering only a few questions and totally punting on the most important issue facing the country: the need to help average American families hit hard by the economy.

On the bailout package, McCain said that he thinks a bailout must be must be enacted soon, warning of dire consequences if Congress fails to act.

On the question of whether taxpayers must be protected and whether there must be oversight, McCain adopted the key points of Barack Obama's plan.

Unlike Obama, however, McCain offered no plan to put in place new regulations that would prevent a crisis like this from ever happening again.

The Obama campaign took McCain to task for his baseless attacks on Obama's response to the financial crisis.

"Contrary to the lies told by the McCain campaign, it was John McCain who followed Senator Obama's lead in laying out principles that call for strict oversight and accountability, protecting taxpayers, and cracking down on CEO pay. We only wish he had adopted those same principles over the last 26 years rather than cheerleading for the deregulation agenda that helped produce today's crisis and repeatedly opposing limitations on the obscene compensation given to failed CEOs," said Obama-Biden spokesman Hari Sevugan.
 

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