13
   

This is Biden's America

 
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sun 5 Sep, 2021 10:02 pm
@neptuneblue,
neptuneblue wrote:
And you would know that from personal experience.

I do have a lot of experience dealing with traitors like you, unfortunately.
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Sun 5 Sep, 2021 10:05 pm
@oralloy,
Lying comes easy for you.

Fortunately, not for me.

0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sun 5 Sep, 2021 10:25 pm
@neptuneblue,
neptuneblue wrote:
I am well aware Oralloy cannot be reasoned with.

I am not to blame for your inability to reason.


neptuneblue wrote:
But telling lies cannot be how a discussion is left unchallenged.

You and vikorr are the only people here who are lying.

Rest assured that none of your lies will ever go unchanged.


neptuneblue wrote:
Maybe if Oralloy were a veteran and stood shoulder to shoulder with others who served, he'd understand how wrong he is.

I am not wrong in any way whatsoever. That is why you have never been able to point out anything untrue in my posts.

I have never disclosed one way or another whether I am a veteran. You are lying when you presume to speak for me.


neptuneblue wrote:
just a loud mouth

I can back up everything I say.

You can't back up anything you say.


neptuneblue wrote:
loyalty or honor that it takes to be part of the we few, we happy few, Band of Brothers.

I have more loyalty and honor in my little toe than you have in your entire family tree, traitor.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sun 5 Sep, 2021 10:28 pm
@vikorr,
vikorr wrote:
Oralloy I've come to the conclusion after years of talking to him, chooses not to.

You are just blaming me for your inability to make intelligent arguments.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sun 5 Sep, 2021 10:32 pm
@neptuneblue,
neptuneblue wrote:
I'm not putting liars on Ignore.
Not in the past, not now, not ever.

Is it even possible for you to put yourself on ignore?

You are the one who has been lying after all.
0 Replies
 
neptuneblue
 
  0  
Reply Sun 5 Sep, 2021 10:54 pm
@oralloy,
You are to blame for untruths, insincerity, dishonor and generally being stupid. However you want to frame yourself, you are seen as a joke, fraud and humorous to the point most won't take you or your words seriously.

My hope is for you to become someone different.

Today is not that day.

vikorr
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2021 12:00 am
@neptuneblue,
Umm. Forum = no affect on the outside world. Running for President (and getting it) = great affect. The two aren't comparable in outcomes at all. They are very different things to choose to ignore. In the end you choose what you think is worthwhile...but edgar is right about how many people ignore him, and how not doing so interferes with a thread (even as I'm currently contributing to that issue)
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2021 02:04 am
@Mame,
E
Mame wrote:

If everyone put him on Ignore, the problem would go away.


Exactly.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2021 02:05 am
@neptuneblue,
And you will be as successful and productive as Monterey Jack.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2021 02:55 am
@neptuneblue,
neptuneblue wrote:
You are to blame for untruths,

Wrong. You are the one who is spewing untruths, and I am not in any way responsible for your dishonesty.


neptuneblue wrote:
insincerity,

Wrong again. You are the one who lacks integrity. I am not in any way responsible for your lack of integrity.


neptuneblue wrote:
dishonor

Wrong again. You are the one who lacks all honor. I am not in any way responsible for your lack of honor.


neptuneblue wrote:
and generally being stupid.

Wrong again. You are the one who is stupid. I am not in any way responsible for your stupidity.


neptuneblue wrote:
However you want to frame yourself, you are seen as a joke, fraud and humorous to the point most won't take you or your words seriously.

You do not speak for anyone who is intelligent.

And frankly, the views of the stupid people who you do speak for, are not of any interest to me.


neptuneblue wrote:
My hope is for you to become someone different.

Having your lies and your treason challenged all the time frustrates you.


neptuneblue wrote:
Today is not that day.

Indeed.

I am going to continue to challenge your lies and your treason.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 6 Sep, 2021 03:03 am
@vikorr,
vikorr wrote:
...but edgar is right about how many people ignore him,

No he isn’t.

Edgar speaks only for traitors and people who have low IQs.

This progressive tendency to claim to speak for everyone in really rather silly.


vikorr wrote:
and how not doing so interferes with a thread (even as I'm currently contributing to that issue)

You are a bit more than a mere contributor. You are one of the primary instigators.

And since Edgar joined in with the personal attacks himself, it is hard to take his handwringing over derailed threads very seriously.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2021 03:44 am
@izzythepush,
Back on topic please, people.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 14 Sep, 2021 09:43 pm
“Send It Back” — Squad Tells Senate to Reject Rahm Emanuel’s Ambassadorship
https://truthout.org/articles/send-it-back-squad-tells-senate-to-reject-rahm-emanuels-ambassadorship/?fbclid=IwAR0WCtDUPg-ZvGSMeWGU-cRmz4AlGhaSaB7iXlLIFDhac6c7aTbz5qvcw9k
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2021 06:17 pm
Any time kids in cages comes up somebody gets in a huff and defends the practice, saying there is no other choice. Many of these same people complained long and loud when Trump was president.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Wed 15 Sep, 2021 07:30 pm
@edgarblythe,
I don't think we were supposed to notice the changing attitude.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 16 Sep, 2021 08:25 am
@roger,
Progressive hypocrisy is legendary. It was Barack Obama who started putting kids in cages.

https://i.imgflip.com/2cvofi.jpg
https://cdn.creators.com/1054/258919/258919_image.jpg
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Sep, 2021 09:26 am
@oralloy,
Using oversimplification to create political propaganda is legendary:

Quote:
The phrase “kids in cages” has become a catchall for the Trump administration’s approach to immigration enforcement in recent years, to the president’s evident frustration. As he pointed out during Thursday night’s presidential debate, he didn’t build the “cages” — the Obama administration did.

When moderator Kristen Welker asked about the president’s “zero tolerance” policy in 2018 and the separation of thousands of migrant parents from their children, President Trump immediately tried to skirt responsibility by blaming former president Barack Obama.

“They built cages,” he said, referring to the Obama administration. “You know, they used to say I built the cages. And then they had a picture in a certain newspaper and it was a picture of these horrible cages and they said, look at these cages, President Trump built them. And then it was determined they were built in 2014. That was him. They built cages.”

Biden responded by stating, correctly, that the Obama administration did not systematically separate parents from their children at the border, a practice that generated such backlash that the first lady and Trump’s daughter Ivanka joined the groundswell of people who pressured him to end it.

“Let’s talk about what we’re talking about,” Biden said. “What happened? Parents were ripped — their kids were ripped from their arms and separated and now they cannot find over 500 sets of those parents and those kids are alone. Nowhere to go. Nowhere to go. It’s criminal. It’s criminal.”

The two claims at the core of the exchange — that Obama built the cages and Trump did something unprecedented with them — were not wrong. But the wider context and history were missing.

In spring 2014, Central American families, teenagers and children began crossing the border into the Rio Grande Valley of South Texas, turning themselves over to U.S. agents in unprecedented numbers.

Fleeing poverty, chronic violence and joblessness, the families also were spurred by smugglers telling them that children who cross the border could generally avoid lengthy detention and certain deportation. Those claims were accurate.

By May 2014, thousands of Central Americans were streaming into Texas, overwhelming U.S. agents and leaving Border Patrol detention cells jampacked. More than 4,000 adults and children were arriving a day at the peak of the crisis.

Border Patrol stations were so overcrowded that agents began using the “sally port” areas outside the stations — little more than outdoor garages — as holding pens. Mothers with babies and young children were left for hours in 90-plus-degree heat, sprawled out on concrete floors with little more than bologna sandwiches and Kool-Aid.

The Washington Post obtained a video of the conditions at the McAllen station not long after the Breitbart website published photos showing the dire situation inside the facility.

The Obama administration responded to the outrage by rushing to expand its capacity to handle the new migration wave at the border, to adapt an infrastructure built to handle single adult men, not families and children.

The government acquired an empty warehouse a few blocks from the McAllen station and converted it into a sprawling new facility that opened in July 2014, a place that had capacity for 1,500 detainees. The new “Central Processing Center,” or CPC, was clean, spacious, air-conditioned and a major improvement over the cramped detention cells and sweltering garages.

To keep different demographic groups safely apart — a standard practice in detention settings — the U.S. Border Patrol used chain-link fencing to create partitions in the cavernous warehouse. One area was designated for teenage boys, another for mothers with small children, another for entire family groups, and so on.

The chain-link fencing was cheap, allowed for good ventilation and carried the benefit of allowing agents to supervise the entire facility, by affording them full visibility into the enclosures.


Its grim, industrial appearance, however, was redolent of a livestock operation rather than a humane facility. Migrants and some agents soon derided it as “la perrera” — the dog kennel.

The facility was controversial at the time, but it wasn’t until Trump’s zero-tolerance episode in spring 2018 that the facility came to symbolize the kind of administrative cruelty associated with the intentional separation of children from their parents by the government.

As criticism of the separation practices grew, the government allowed television crews inside the CPC, intending to show that families were being treated humanely. It backfired. Instead, viewers were shocked and appalled at the sight of children staring back through the chain-links of a human warehouse.

Trump ended the zero-tolerance efforts in June 2018, after six weeks. The controversy and attention the episode generated — and Trump’s declaration that children would no longer be separated — was something smugglers quickly seized on. They began telling would-be clients that children were a passport into the United States.

A new migration wave built, and by May 2019 more than 144,000 migrants were taken into U.S. custody amid a record surge of Central American families and children. The CPC filled to nearly twice its capacity, and while the Trump administration occasionally allowed lawmakers and reporters inside, it imposed strict controls on filming and photography.

The facility is mostly empty now, [this story is from Oct. '20] the result of emergency coronavirus enforcement measures that allow the Border Patrol to quickly “expel” most migrants to Mexico. But despite calls to replace the chain-links with plexiglass or another material, the warehouse and the chain-links — built by Obama, used in an unprecedented way by Trump — remain unchanged.

wp

"Kids in cages" is a good example of creating simple, easy to remember slogans which people can scream at each other without actually doing any research. There are good reasons to separate large numbers of people when temporarily confined – whether the practice is inhumane or not depends on other factors which don't conveniently translate into cartoons and catch phrases.

0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Sep, 2021 09:45 am
Kids in cages is perfect because it creates pressure on the government to resolve the situation.
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Sep, 2021 10:06 am
@edgarblythe,
It's not a situation which is easily resolved, however, and lowering the level of debate by substituting emotional catch phrases for careful analysis doesn't help anyone but grandstanding politicians and their political activist critics. Meanwhile, people are still entering the country illegally and they're still being temporarily detained. Four years of screaming about "kids in cages" hasn't changed anything. Do you see an effective, achievable solution? I haven't seen one offered yet.
InfraBlue
 
  2  
Reply Thu 16 Sep, 2021 10:11 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

Progressive hypocrisy is legendary. It was Barack Obama who started putting kids in cages.

And still the Republicans weren't satisfied by Obama's right-wing, hard-line approach to immigration, and ignored it.
0 Replies
 
 

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