If Jesus died to forgive us, then why is there a Hell?

I wonder why everyone always relates the Christian faith to the Catholic church? I am not Catholic. I don't agree with some of their beliefs either. I don't exactally take offence to being associated with them, but I don't care for it in particular.

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Probably because all Catholics are Christians, but not all Christians are Catholics.

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I only find it funny how those of you who do not believe what we do, automatically consider us to be arrogant and say that we consider you to be ignorant.
AU, you especially throw these terms around. I am sure you are a very "educated" person, but I don't think you fully understand what they are until you look at both sides from a non-opinionated point of view.

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Thunder, why should the Catholic church represent all Christians then? I feel they shouldn't.

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headofthefield wrote:

Thunder, why should the Catholic church represent all Christians then? I feel they shouldn't.

I don't know, they operate very differently, even between the branches of Catholicism.

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Ok then, that is what I am asking. I didn't ask it to a fellow Christian, just to those who don't "believe."

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There are Christians and there are nominal christians. The latter are by far more numerous.

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As far as opinion in interpretation goes, I'm sorry, one cannot put their own predjucises and opinions into a book of morality.

Book of morality?
You mean when God of the Bible slaughters men, women and children, that's moral?
When God becomes so angry he wants to rip fetuses out of women's bellies, that's moral?
When God says he's going to slaughter all the people in the world who will not believe in him we should consider this moral?
When Gods solution to all problems is to kill people then this is a morality we should follow?

There must be books of morality out there that are far better than the Bible and its intolerant God.

When you get right down to it God of the Bible is anti-American. He can't measure up to what America stands for.

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xingu wrote:

Quote:
As far as opinion in interpretation goes, I'm sorry, one cannot put their own predjucises and opinions into a book of morality.

Book of morality?
You mean when God of the Bible slaughters men, women and children, that's moral?
When God becomes so angry he wants to rip fetuses out of women's bellies, that's moral?
When God says he's going to slaughter all the people in the world who will not believe in him we should consider this moral?
When Gods solution to all problems is to kill people then this is a morality we should follow?

There must be books of morality out there that are far better than the Bible and its intolerant God.

When you get right down to it God of the Bible is anti-American. He can't measure up to what America stands for.

Would it be so difficult for you to identify the source of your quotes? It would make things much more easy to follow.

A careful reading of the third chapter of Genesis will reveal the cause of death to be not God, but Satan. Don't blame God if the religious leaders of the world haven't had the integrity to teach the truth (though some responsiblity has to be laid at the feet of those who would ignore the truth).

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Headofthefield
IMO it is the arrogance of the religious that makes them believe that they are obligated to teach us wayward souls about religion. And of course their religion.

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Quote:

I wonder why everyone always relates the Christian faith to the Catholic church?

Because it was the Church that created Christianity as it is today. They created the Bible, the Trinity, and said hell and damnation awaited all non-Catholics (EENS). Protestants are late-comers. That's not to say they didn't exist. If there were any they were hiding under the leaves like tiny mammals during the Age of Dinosaurs. They were afraid to come out in the open least they get burned; literally. The Catholics had a very large impact on the shaping of the Christian religion and beliefs.

Today there are some conservative Protastants who don't consider Catholics as Christians because of this Virgin Mary think they have.

http://www.trosch.org/

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0071/0071_01.asp

The Catholics were very brutal, intolerant and bloodthirsty. The Protastants, when they came along, weren't much better.

But then they both believed in a God that set the example.

I mean, what's the difference between God having his cronies slaughter everyone in Jericho and the Catholics slaughtering some 10,000 in the city of Beziers in 1209? It was here that the papal representive Abbot Arnaud-Amaury screamed;

"Slay them all! God will know his own."

I guess some of you know what that has come down to today; that good Christian verbal ejaculation;

"Kill 'em all and let God sort them out."

I guess that's what God did in Jericho; he spared a prostitute and killed all the children.

Fine moral example that can be found in the Bible.

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Thunder wrote

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Oh, I forgot, au1929 needs no help, he is never misguided and he always possesses the ultimate understanding of everything

I understand that the bible is directly out of the fertile mind of man and I do not appreciate people who feel they are obligated to proselytize

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au1929 wrote:

Headofthefield
IMO it is the arrogance of the religious that makes them believe that they are obligated to teach us wayward souls about religion. And of course their religion.

I would only suppose to teach those who are willing to listen. Even then I would refrain from teaching my own interpretations. If the topic of religion does not appeal to you, I would be happy to talk sports or movies (Have you seen STORE WARS yet?) or beer.

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neologist
I need no one to explain the bible to me. I had more than enough religious learning when I was a youngster.
I should note that we do not proselytize and I do not take kindly to those that do.

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Quote:

Would it be so difficult for you to identify the source of your quotes? It would make things much more easy to follow.

I believe I gave you a ton of examples in a previous statement.

"Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up."
Hosea 13;16 or 14;1 depending on your Bible

Now what would we think of a human talking about killing infants ripping up pregnant women. We would condemn him as evil and cruel; someone ruled by the Devil.

What do Christians think of a God that says the same thing. He is glorious; perfect in every way. We should praise and worship him.

Is there a double standard here; hypocrisy?

Headofthefield said;

Quote:

Who are we to judge what God says? Wouldn't that make us better than God?

Looking at his behavior I would say we are no worse. On the contrary in many respects we are better.

We Americans, for the most part, believe in religious tolerance.

Your God doesn't.

There are many, but sad to say not a majority, Americans who believe rights should be for all Americans, regardless of their sexual orientation.

Your God doesn't.

American don't believe that people should have punishment inflicted upon them because of their religious preference or non-religious beliefs.

Your God doesn't.

Americans believe it is wrong to kill children of other countries who practice a different kind of religion.

Your God doesn't.

So are we better then the God of the Bible? In many respects, YES.

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xingu
The God of the bible is fiction. The Bible gives God if he/she/it does exist a bad rap. It is how superstitious ancients perceived a supreme being. The bible itself reelects the brutal time of it's writing.

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au1929 wrote:

neologist
I need no one to explain the bible to me. I had more than enough religious learning when I was a youngster.
I should note that we do not proselytize and I do not take kindly to those that do.

So then, its either sports or STORE WARS or beer. Or something else. But I must say you do spend a lot of time pontificating in the religion threads.

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neologist
Yes, because I am amazed by the gullibility of the believers. In any event from time to time I need a break from reality and am in need of some comic relief.

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There is much to laugh at here; it's true. There is also much to frighten.

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neologist
Yes. There is much to frighten and that is what religion thrives on Fear.

Believe or it's eternal damnation Twisted Evil

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If Jesus died to forgive us, then why is there a Hell?

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