If Jesus died to forgive us, then why is there a Hell?

God did this, God did that, God said Bla ,bla. .
Rubbish. the bible was writen by man and it was written based upon the morality and belief at the time of it's writing.

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Trudat

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booman2 wrote:

Trudat

Au

That may be true but remember we have people here who still believe the earth was created in seven 24 hour days.

And don't forget all of humanity is decended from a SIX HUNDRED year old man with a big boat; a very big boat.

http://www.thedubyareport.com/spinpolls.html

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.....Not only very BIG, but very smelly...eeeeeewwww Exclamation

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xingu wrote:

Excuse my 300 year mistake. 600 or 900, it's all fiction. I can understand ignorant people 2500 years ago believing that; but today?

If it's all fiction, then it didn't happen. So, there is no one to blame, right?

Well, there is an explanation. I'm sure I've said this many times before as it is one of the central themes of the bible: If Adam and Eve had never sinned, they would still be alive and we would not have war and crime and sickness and death.

Why have people died the ways in which they have died since then? Each incident has an explanation in its context.

I'm sure will you have plenty to jump on right now; so I'll save my breath and let you speak.

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I believe there is a lot of essential truth and wisdom in the bible, as in all other religions, and philosophies. But it has been transelated and passed through so many humans, It's ludricrous to try to defend it as literal history.

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If there is an omnipotent and loving God, would He allow us to be completely ignorant of his will and purpose?

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booman2 wrote:

I believe there is a lot of essential truth and wisdom in the bible, as in all other religions, and philosophies. But it has been transelated and passed through so many humans, It's ludricrous to try to defend it as literal history.

It also works quite well as a coaster for your drink. (If you get one of the ones with the plastic binding)

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....LiontamerX.....I'm scare'd 'a you. Smile

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LionTamerX wrote:

booman2 wrote:
I believe there is a lot of essential truth and wisdom in the bible, as in all other religions, and philosophies. But it has been transelated and passed through so many humans, It's ludricrous to try to defend it as literal history.

It also works quite well as a coaster for your drink. (If you get one of the ones with the plastic binding)

That's the 'coffee table bible'. It's very common among those who wish to impress without having to read.

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neologist wrote:

LionTamerX wrote:
booman2 wrote:
I believe there is a lot of essential truth and wisdom in the bible, as in all other religions, and philosophies. But it has been transelated and passed through so many humans, It's ludricrous to try to defend it as literal history.

It also works quite well as a coaster for your drink. (If you get one of the ones with the plastic binding)
That's the 'coffee table bible'. It's very common among those who wish to impress without having to read.

The illustrated version ?

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neologist wrote:

LionTamerX wrote:
booman2 wrote:
I believe there is a lot of essential truth and wisdom in the bible, as in all other religions, and philosophies. But it has been transelated and passed through so many humans, It's ludricrous to try to defend it as literal history.

It also works quite well as a coaster for your drink. (If you get one of the ones with the plastic binding)
That's the 'coffee table bible'. It's very common among those who wish to impress without having to read.

Very nice- Have you ever read the book of enoch? I highly suggest The book of Thomas as well as it explains the "Miniskos" . And also gives good advice to females who want to ascend. There is more truth in the Gospel than we will ever get to know here on earth but some people need a map to get to their destination, some people have an amazing sense of direction and arrive without the map .and others choose to regress. And just miss the chance of eternity, having to be re-purified until cleansed.

One thing I could not understand is the connection between the "blood" many religions and cults over time have used blood as a symbol and during thir rituals, ( Christians still receive) the Blood (wine) & Body (bread) very old rituals involved the drinking of blood to capture your enemys' energy. kind of weird huh.

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Should the apocryphal books be considered inspired?

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Quote:

So, there is no one to blame, right?

There's no one to blame if you realize this story is mythology. But to those literalists, having God kill all these people is making a God that is cruel and barbaric. That's what I object to.

Adam and Eve is mythology, a story created to try to explain unknowns. All cultures do that. Jewish mythology is not any more accurate than anyone else's.

Quote:

Why have people died the ways in which they have died since then?

Are you trying to tell me that you have proof that before Adam and Eve humans lived for eternity? Show me the fossil records. Explain to me in medical terms how humans can do what no other animals has been able to do since the creation of this world, live for eternity.

I agree the human soul can live for eternity, but not the body.

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If there is an omnipotent and loving God, would He allow us to be completely ignorant of his will and purpose?

No, God wouldn't. That's why there is NDE.

"Many near-death accounts reveal that the religions of this world are merely an external path whose ideal is to lead people inward toward true spirituality. People often confuse religion with spirituality. Religion is the outward form of worship and spirituality is the inward form of worship. People who have a near-death experience often return less religious and more spiritual."

Religion is not as important as some people think

Doctrine and creed and race mean nothing. No matter what we believe we were all children joined under one God. The only rule is God's true law: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. (May Eulitt)

God does not care which religion is best. God does not care what religion people practice. They are all a blooming facet of the whole. All religions refer to the same God. (Mellen-Thomas Benedict)

One man who had a near-death experience realized that the "God" of his religious background wasn't anything like the reality. He learned that it doesn't matter if people call him God, Allah, Great Spirit or whatever, he is one and the same. (Dr. Liz Dale)

Everyone, religious or not, believing in God or not, transitions to the spirit world as part of the natural process of life. Just as one does not need to be religious to live in the physical world, one does not need to profess a particular faith to live in the spirit world. (Nora Spurgin)

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/research06.html

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Puglia

The Gospel of Thomas is an interesting book. It's a forgery but that means nothing. There were a lot of forgeries in those days.

You can find them in the Bible.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_bibl.htm

Thomas is a book of 114 sayings of Christ, with the exception of the introductory verse by the author. It's like Q, if Q existed. No mention is made of Christ's life. No information about Christ is found in Thomas. To the Gnostics, who used the Gospel of Thomas, Christ was a messenger, not a God. Who he was is not important. His message is what counted.

Most sayings start with "Jesus said." In some places there is a dialog between Jesus and one of the disciples. The disciple will ask and Jesus responds. 79 of the 114 saying in Thomas can be found in the Bible (Matthew, Mark and Luke). In some cases they are not exact but similar.

For example;
"Jesus said, 'Blessed are the poor, for yours is the kingdom of heaven.' (Saying 54; Luke 6:20)

According to the Gospel human spirits came from another world.

Jesus said, "If they say to you, 'Where did you come from?' say to them, 'We came from the light, the place where the light came into being of its own accord.' If they say to you, 'Is it you?' say, 'We are its children, and we are the elect of the living father.'" (Saying 50)

"Jesus said, 'Blessed are the solitary and elect, for you will find the kingdom. For you are from it, and to it you will return.'" (Saying 49)

We are from another world, the world of the Light, And to there we will return.

Information from the book 'Lost Christianities' by Bart Ehrman.

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xingu wrote:

Quote:
Why have people died the ways in which they have died since then?

Are you trying to tell me that you have proof that before Adam and Eve humans lived for eternity?

You believe you understand what you think I wrote. What you read is not what I meant. But I have to ask: What on earth have you written?

xingu wrote:

Show me the fossil records.

Fossil records of what? Fossil records of people still alive?

xingu wrote:

Explain to me in medical terms how humans can do what no other animals has been able to do since the creation of this world, live for eternity.

I agree the human soul can live for eternity, but not the body.

Why is that less preposterous than God's promise of everlasting life on earth?

xingu wrote:

Quote:
If there is an omnipotent and loving God, would He allow us to be completely ignorant of his will and purpose?

No, God wouldn't. That's why there is NDE.

Quote:

God does not care which religion is best. God does not care what religion people practice. They are all a blooming facet of the whole. All religions refer to the same God. (Mellen-Thomas Benedict)

One man who had a near-death experience realized that the "God" of his religious background wasn't anything like the reality. He learned that it doesn't matter if people call him God, Allah, Great Spirit or whatever, he is one and the same. (Dr. Liz Dale)

Is this the diabolical God you revile in your posts?

xingu wrote:

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/research06.html

Forgive me for not going to your source. Your quotes convince me.

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Quote:

If Adam and Eve had never sinned, they would still be alive and we would not have war and crime and sickness and death.

Why have people died the ways in which they have died since then?

The typical Christian argument is if Adam and Eve had not sinned then humans would live on this earth for eternity. There would be no death, wars, illnesses, etc. I'm assuming from the quote above that is what you believe.

My position is that's bunk! The Adam and Eve story is mythology; fiction.

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xingu wrote:

Quote:
If Adam and Eve had never sinned, they would still be alive and we would not have war and crime and sickness and death.

Why have people died the ways in which they have died since then?

The typical Christian argument is if Adam and Eve had not sinned then humans would live on this earth for eternity. There would be no death, wars, illnesses, etc. I'm assuming from the quote above that is what you believe.

My position is that's bunk! The Adam and Eve story is mythology; fiction.

Not the typical Christian argument which is that somehow God wanted us to live here for a while and then go to heaven. Say, isn't that what NDE is all about? We live here for some stupid unknown reason; then we go to someplace better, right?

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Quote:

Not the typical Christian argument which is that somehow God wanted us to live here for a while and then go to heaven.

The typical conservative Christian argument I have heard is if Adam and Eve had not sinned humans would live forever on earth. Others say it is the spirit that will die. God will kill those souls that do not submit to him. It seems the more ignorant one is the more they succumb to fear.

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We live here for some stupid unknown reason; then we go to someplace better, right?

Right, but take into account those who say we will go to Hell. Read what the Book of Revelation say about what God will do to the vast majority of humans living on earth.

I have met many a human that was more tolerant, humane, kind and understanding then the God found in the Bible.

If Jesus died to forgive us, then why is there a Hell?

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