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Should DeLay resign

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 08:53 am
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1054596,00.html

Quote:

Gifts in High Places
Did DeLay staffers violate ethics rules?
By KAREN TUMULTY


Man, it's like every day some new misconduct allegation comes out.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 09:16 am
I am sure there are more than a few congress people from both parties who are on the take. When all is said and done we do have the best congress that money can buy.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 10:01 am
au1929, are you saying we as ordinary citizens who elect these people in should shrug our shoulders when people violate rules because others violate rules? Why have rules to begin with?
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 10:07 am
revel
Not at all. We should be rooting out all these corrupt SOB's and transfer them from congress to jail.
What I was saying as it stands now congress is for sale to the highest bidder.
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 12:47 pm
au1929 wrote:
revel
...We should be rooting out all these corrupt SOB's and transfer them from congress to jail.
...


yup. one a them fancy new "super-max" jails. Laughing
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 05:41 pm
au1929 wrote:
revel
Not at all. We should be rooting out all these corrupt SOB's and transfer them from congress to jail.
What I was saying as it stands now congress is for sale to the highest bidder.


I agree with you. But it seems a pretty well hopeless battle to go up against so much money and power. It would take a real movement and organization and people realizing that it is not about the parties or issues.

And if some on the democrats side are on the take it we should go after them as much as the republicans who happen to be the majority right now.

However, sometimes you can only focus on one person or issue as they come up and right now it is about Delay. If he is guilty of wrong doing then he should pay the price.
0 Replies
 
quentedlin
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 06:19 pm
Delay is a "YES" man.
Quite sincerely, I'm becoming afraid of the right. And, I'm a Christian! I'm afraid of what's coming to us in the way of policy, and it is becoming more and more apparent that there is a definite smokescreen here. What to most evangelicals seems like "Christian ideology," I'm beginning to suspect more everyday that it is a wall of mirrors for a very aggressive foreign policy to hide behind. By stacking federal courts with your people and having the wherewithal in Congress to do it, you essentially aleviate yourself from having to be held accountable for your deeds (misdeeds) and in the case of the Bush/Cheney administration, very little has been done in the name of true Christian principles. But Karl Rove knows that. He knows that all you have to do is talk the talk with Christians, and that most of us are just sheep, who blindly follow whoever or whatever we're told.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 08:48 pm
0 Replies
 
pegasus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2005 09:01 pm
Yes, force him to resign. Not that it would hurt him financially, of course...
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Apr, 2005 05:50 am
Like au or someone said not long ago, he won't go on his own. This will have to be played out all the way. Now at least it can go before the ethics committee.

As for Hastert's comments, hehe.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 06:09 am
Kenneth Gross, an attorney who has represented Democrats and Republicans on ethics issues, said the financial ties on the committee could be a problem. "I would advise the committee not to use a member who had received contributions from DeLay's leadership PAC to head the investigation," he said.

The ethics committee has admonished DeLay five times since 1997, more than any current member of Congress. He has come under renewed scrutiny for taking foreign trips that may have been paid for by lobbyists or foreign agents, which is prohibited.

A DeLay investigation cannot be launched because the committee hasn't been able to solve a dispute over its rules. Rep. Alan Mollohan and other Democrats refuse to adopt the rules, saying they are designed to protect DeLay and would allow either party to protect members by refusing to act on complaints.

The panel is the only House committee with equal numbers of Republicans and Democrats: five each.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 06:16 am
USA Today is evolving into a brave paper...nice to see.
0 Replies
 
timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 11:59 am
Quote:
Congressional fellow travelers
Cal Thomas


It is no excuse to say "everybody does it" if what everybody is doing is unlawful. However, in the case of House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, who's been singled out by Democrats for criticism because of trips he's taken that were, in some cases, apparently paid for at least in part by lobbyists, the party that's pointing a finger at DeLay ought to look at all the fingers pointing back at Democrats.

A study by PoliticalMoneyLine ( www.politicalmoneyline.com ) has found that during the last five years, out of the $16 million in congressional travel paid for by private funds, more than half (almost $8.8 million) came from tax-exempt organizations which receive funds from others. One of the raps on DeLay is that some of his trips, including one to Russia in 1997, were reportedly underwritten by lobbyists, but through a non-profit organization. DeLay has said he had no knowledge of lobbyists funding such trips, which might have violated House ethics rules.

According to the study by PoliticalMoneyLine, many of the organizations paying for congressional travel are tax-exempt entities and are not required to disclose their donors to the public in the IRS Form 990 reports they must file.

The study found that during the five-year period surveyed, members of Congress took 5,410 trips (Democrats, 3,025 trips; Republicans, 2,375 trips; others, 10 trips.)

Altogether, 605 members of both houses took trips, with Rep. James Sensenbrenner (R-Wis.), Chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, receiving the most gifts of travel (19 trips valued at $167,960). By contrast, DeLay was 28th on the list with 14 trips valued at $94,568.

Rep. Harold Ford (D-Tenn.) can claim the prize for most trips (60), but Ford's less expensive domestic travel totaled just $61,000. Organizations spending the most for congressional travel, according to PoliticalMoneyLine, were the Aspen Institute ($2,897,602) and the Ripon Society ($694,042), both ideologically liberal organizations.

After Sensenbrenner, the next four members receiving the most gifts of travel were Democrats: Rep. Gene Green of Texas, (former) Sen. John Breaux of Louisiana, Rep. Robert Wexler of Florida and Rep. Maurice Hinchey of New York. No Democrat has raised questions about any of these because their target is DeLay, probably the most effective Majority Leader since the days when Democrats used to rule. DeLay resists and often thwarts the Democrats' agenda. Since he continues to win re-election, Democrats are trying to take him down using their scandal machine.

There's plenty more in the PoliticalMoneyLine report that bears investigation if Democrats are serious about "exposing" ethically questionable travel. More than 127 travel reports filed by members listed no destinations. Twenty reports listed no trip sponsor. One hundred and six reports listed no cost figures, Fifty-one reports showed no purpose for the travel. Four reports failed to show any travel dates. No wonder some members, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, have rushed to file amended reports. An aide to Pelosi acknowledged not reporting a 2004 trip to South Korea, but only after a Washington Post reporter inquired about it. The aide, said the Post, filed a full disclosure form "a few hours after the newspapers' inquiry" and sent a note to the ethics committee which said, "I did not know I was supposed to file these forms and I apologize for its lateness."

The Washington Post reported Wednesday (4/27) that House Republicans have decided to rescind a rules change they pushed through in January that led to the shutdown of the ethics committee, possibly clearing the way for consideration of charges against DeLay and others. The House Ethics Committee has not been operating because Democrats would not allow it to meet following the rules change that required an ethics complaint be dismissed if the evenly-divided panel deadlocked. We'll now see if Democrats are as enthusiastic about maintaining an ethical standard when some of their own are questioned along with Tom DeLay.


timber fearlessly steps out on a limb here: The DeLay fray will work out to much less inconvenience for DeLay and the Republicans, and much greater inconvenience for The Democrats, than The Democrats wish.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 12:08 pm
I suspect, Timber, that this is why, when the Republicans agreed to revert to the original rules for the Ethics Committee, Nancy Peolosi took to the House Floor (or it may have been a news conference right after the House adjourned) to object to returning to the original rules rather than adopt new rules. She wanted the focus to be on Delay alone and for rules to forbid dragging any others into it. The 'original rules' allow the committee to look at Delay's sins in comparison to all other charges of impropriety being leveled and the Democrats have hugely dirty hands on many of those issues.
0 Replies
 
Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 03:00 pm
Hard to believe Delay has many defenders, but I guess I should've known better.

Plenty of Dems have gotten in trouble for ethical lapses: Jim Wright and Dan Rostenkowski come to mind. Why not grin and bear it instead of trying to defend the indefensible?
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 03:04 pm
If it means catching a lot of rotten fish to get to the smellist rotten fish, so be it.

The repubs back down because they knew it made them look bad period.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Apr, 2005 03:50 pm
DeLay is, of course, on the carpet for more than the trips. And he is unique in having been censured three times previously by a bipartisan committee. And the rules change the Republicans pushed through was inexcuseable. As was the replacement of personnel simply because they acted in accord with their consciences rather than in accord with party wishes.

The Republicans have had to back down on this matter and backing down isn't something this crowd is comfortable doing. Apparently, they believe that such makes one appear a loser, and once one appears a loser, then the injuries will grow. That's happening with Social Security too. And it is increasingly probable that they won't get Bolton through. Party division is increasing likely due to lame duck phenomenon but also to the increasing power push by the extremists, thus voices like Danforth in opposition.

And DeLay is an extremist...
"I blame Congress over the last fity to a hundred years for not standing up and taking its responsibilities given to it by the Constitution. The reason the judiciary has been able to impose a separation of church and state that's nowehere in the Constitution is that Congress didn't stop them. The reason we had judicial review is because Congress didn't stop them. The reason we had a right to privacy is because Congress didn't stop them." Washington Times interview
0 Replies
 
pegasus
 
  1  
Reply Tue 3 May, 2005 10:26 pm
Is is true that he said "fity," as in "fity cent," or is that a typo? Laughing
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 May, 2005 06:31 am
2 on Ethics Panel Withdraw From Any DeLay Inquiry

Quote:
By CARL HULSE
Published: May 5, 2005
WASHINGTON, May 4 - Two Republican members of the House ethics committee who contributed to the legal defense fund of Representative Tom DeLay, the majority leader, recused themselves Wednesday from any potential investigation of him as the panel took the first steps that could lead to such an inquiry.

After a two-hour meeting, Representative Doc Hastings, the chairman, announced that the two representatives, Lamar Smith of Texas and Tom Cole of Oklahoma, would not take part in any action relating to Mr. DeLay. The two lawmakers each provided $5,000 last year to a fund being used to underwrite Mr. DeLay's legal expenses as he fought accusations of misconduct in Texas and Washington.

"All three of us agree that it's best to remove any doubt about this at the very start of the process," Mr. Hastings, a Washington Republican, said in a statement.

The decision represented an effort by Republicans to avert calls for an outside counsel to lead the House investigation into the powerful party leader and to restore credibility to its internal ethics process. That process has been rocked by accusations that Republicans had sought to weaken it through new rules and membership changes. Mr. Cole and Mr. Smith were added to the committee this year after the panel admonished Mr. DeLay three times last year.

link
0 Replies
 
kelticwizard
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 May, 2005 07:43 am
revel wrote:
The repubs back down because they knew it made them look bad period.


blatham wrote:
The Republicans have had to back down on this matter and backing down isn't something this crowd is comfortable doing. Apparently, they believe that such makes one appear a loser, and once one appears a loser, then the injuries will grow.


If one reads various message boards and listens to Republican leaders, the Republicans have largely given up justifying anything on the merits and taken to just reciting their electoral gains of the past few years as giving themselves the right to do anything.

On another message board, a normally reasonable fellow who is Republican even started using electoral gains to justify the deficits in the budget!

They have had electoral gains, yes, but their presidential candidate lost the popular vote in 2000 and squaked by with a scant 2% plurality in 2004. Yet Republicans talk as if they have this huge popular mandate to do anything at all, that the field is now clear of any opposition to them on any issue.
0 Replies
 
 

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