Progressives (Liberals)

@McGentrix,

I suppose Trump is mixed young man in his forties?

@revelette3,

revelette3 wrote:

I think too much credit is given to those two starting states.

It's impossible to win the nomination without coming in first or second in New Hampshire.

Unless of course the guy who was going to win the nomination withdraws after the New Hampshire primary, like LBJ did in 1968, but that's a pretty unlikely scenario.

I know that Bloomberg thinks that he can break this long-standing rule. We'll see, but I'm not holding my breath in anticipation. Certainly no one other than Bloomberg has any chance of breaking it.

Past New Hampshire primary results:

1956
Democriatic: Adlai Stevenson second place
Republican: I Like Ike first place

1960
Democriatic: John F. Kennedy first place
Republican: Richard Nixon first place

1964
Democriatic: Lyndon B. Johnson first place
Republican: Barry M. Goldwater second place

1968
Democriatic: Lyndon B. Johnson withdrew after winning
Republican: Richard Nixon first place

1972
Democriatic: George McGovern second place
Republican: Richard Nixon first place

1976
Democriatic: Jimmy Carter first place
Republican: Gerald R. Ford first place

1980
Democriatic: Jimmy Carter first place
Republican: Ronald Reagan first place

1984
Democriatic: Walter Mondale second place
Republican: Ronald Reagan first place

1988
Democriatic: Michael Dukakis first place
Republican: George H. W. Bush first place

1992
Democriatic: Bill Clinton second place
Republican: George H. W. Bush first place

1996
Democriatic: Bill Clinton first place
Republican: Bob Dole second place

2000
Democriatic: Al Gore first place
Republican: George W. Bush second place

2004
Democriatic: John Kerry first place
Republican: George W. Bush first place

2008
Democriatic: Barack Obama second place
Republican: John McCain first place

2012
Democriatic: Barack Obama first place
Republican: Mitt Romney first place

2016
Democriatic: Hillary Clinton second place
Republican: Donald Trump first place

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

2016
Democriatic: Hillary Clinton second place
Republican: Donald Trump first place

Considering in the democrat 2016 race you only basically had Hillary and Sanders, it would have been impossible for Hillary not to at least come in at second. She went on to win the democrat nomination after losing to Bernie in NH. Perhaps in this day age, those two states media coverage is coming to mean less as other issues get talked about in the media concerning the election even with those election in those early states going on. I mean, I am not even half paying attention I care so little.

1 Reply

@revelette3,

revelette3 wrote:

I suppose Trump is mixed young man in his forties?

Is Trump a candidate for the progressive Democrat party? It's normal for a GOP candidate to be an old white man.

1 Reply

@McGentrix,

Quote:

How progressive the Democrat party is. Down to two old white men.

It's a valid criticism of how the Dem slate has turned out. But it is a criticism which, when it comes from Republicans, is something of a joke given that the Dems are far more diverse than the GOP. There are, for example, more than 90 Dem women in the House compared to less than 20 Republicans. As to racial/ethnic diversity, I don't think you'll want to even check that out.

0 Replies

@revelette3,

revelette3 wrote:

Perhaps in this day age, those two states media coverage is coming to mean less as other issues get talked about in the media concerning the election even with those election in those early states going on.

It is very unlikely that the winner of the nomination will be anyone other than the two top winners in New Hampshire.

In fact, although I think that Sanders is the least-bad of all of the Democratic candidates, if Sanders ends up third in New Hampshire, when the Michigan primary rolls around I'll be voting for the least-bad of the top two in New Hampshire instead of voting for Sanders.

0 Replies

@McGentrix,

So because we are progressives (some would argue not all of us are) we can never elect an old white man? I voted for Obama because I felt he would be a good president. I voted Hillary because I thought she the most qualified. Their age and color had nothing to do with either.

0 Replies

Following from the McCarthy attempts to further division on the left, there's this from minutes ago

Quote:

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
7m
Bernie Sander’s volunteers are trashing Elizabeth “Pocahontus” Warren. Everybody knows her campaign is dead and want her potential voters. Mini Mike B is also trying, but getting tiny crowds which are all leaving fast. Elizabeth is very angry at Bernie. Do I see a feud brewing?

We're going to see more from the right on this because they understand it works to GOP advantage.

2 Replies

Quote:

David Atkins
@DavidOAtkins
I don't care which Democrat you want in the primary, or which one wins the nomination. Everyone on all sides better show up to humiliate this morally putrid, mentally decompensating clown.

0 Replies

@blatham,

Quote:

We're going to see more from the right on this because they understand it works to GOP advantage.

We're going to see a lot more this from every quarter, I'm afraid. The childish name-calling, long seen as unbecoming of a world leader, is politically toxic and will continue to infect our politics long after Trump leaves office.

You'd think he'd at least learn how to spell "Pocahontas".

By the way, I thought the ignored one's quick upvoting of Lash's self-righteous post was a perfect example of the "let's sow divisiveness in the enemy ranks" phenomenon. I notice some of the other right-wingers are quick to give Lash encouragement as well.

2 Replies

@blatham,

From what I've been hearing and reading, Sanders is not denying it, but he is distancing himself from it. So, it may well be truth that some volunteers trashed Warren, but maybe not a direct memo from Sanders.

Quote:

"Look I just read about it. We have over 500 people on our campaign. People do certain things. I'm sure that in Elizabeth's campaign, people do certain things as well. But you have heard me for months," Sanders told reporters. "I have never said a negative word about Elizabeth Warren who is a friend of mine. We have differences of issues, that's what the campaign is about, but no one is going to be attacking Elizabeth."

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/12/politics/elizabeth-warren-bernie-sanders-negative-talking-points/index.html

2 Replies

@McGentrix,

Quote:

Down to two old white men.

That's racist, and sexist, and ageist — McG scores a trifecta!

1 Reply

@hightor,

Quote:

We're going to see a lot more this from every quarter, I'm afraid. The childish name-calling, long seen as unbecoming of a world leader, is politically toxic and will continue to infect our politics long after Trump leaves office.

Yes. One more depressing consequences of having a sociopath take a political party where it clearly has no problem going.

Quote:

By the way, I thought the ignored one's quick upvoting of Lash's self-righteous post was a perfect example of the "let's sow divisiveness in the enemy ranks" phenomenon. I notice some of the other right-wingers are quick to give Lash encouragement as well.

That's happened quite often before. There's a bond.

1 Reply

@revelette3,

No, I haven't heard anyone suggesting it originated with Sanders himself. You've seen how some of his supporters conduct themselves on this site — I can easily see people like those coming up with this sort of tactic.

0 Replies

@blatham,

Quote:

That's the problem. Many Ron Paul supporters or Nader supporters or Perot supporters had faith their candidates could revolutionize the country because of the romanticism of the endeavor and their faith in the exceptionalism of their candidates.

I can't deny having the exact same view of Obama when he ran, I don't think I was alone. The trouble was after the election, we saw how hard it was to turn those "yes we can" hopes into reality given the political partisan environment at the time, which really was ramped up with Mitch McConnell's stated goal of making Obama a one time President by voting every single policy down. If anything the political environment has only gotten worse, on all sides, Trump has made this country hate each other, deeply. Sanders would have his work cut out for him getting any of his policies passed because all of them are so totally against what the other side could ever agree on even in a more sane environment, much less what we have now. He would have to compromise just like Obama did or just ending up campaigning and getting nothing accomplished into law. Or a miracle will happen and we will get a friendly congress and then Sanders could pass his policy. Then we would see if they would actually help and turn out like he says. If it does, we all win.

1 Reply

@revelette3,

Quote:

So, it may well be truth that some volunteers trashed Warren, but maybe not a direct memo from Sanders.

Quite possible.

0 Replies

@hightor,

hightor wrote:

The childish name-calling, long seen as unbecoming of a world leader, is politically toxic and will continue to infect our politics long after Trump leaves office.

It isn't Mr. Trump's fault that progressives engage in childish name-calling. Progressive toxicity comes from progressives themselves.

hightor wrote:

the ignored one

See what I mean about progressives being childish?

hightor wrote:

quick upvoting of Lash's self-righteous post was a perfect example of the "let's sow divisiveness in the enemy ranks" phenomenon. I notice some of the other right-wingers are quick to give Lash encouragement as well.

Lash was upvoted because she provided fair and appropriate criticism of progressive misbehavior.

0 Replies

@blatham,

It's all very simple: when you go to a concert, whom do you listen to the most, the audience, or the musicians? And do you hold the musicians responsible for how the audience is behaving? I don't, and nor would I hold a politician responsible for what each and everyone of his followers is doing.

2 Replies

@revelette3,

Good points.

0 Replies

@Olivier5,

Quote:

It's all very simple

Again, thanks.

1 Reply

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