Progressives (Liberals)

@InfraBlue,

InfraBlue wrote:

oralloy wrote:
The common DNA cluster that the Jews share with the Palestinians means that they share Bronze Age ancestry.

You're finally getting it somewhat right.

My position is unchanged. I've been saying from the start that DNA shows that the Palestinians and the Jews share a common Bronze Age ancestry.

I'm actually 100% right.

InfraBlue wrote:

Netanahu, being the leader of Israel which is a part of the world, and Israel being one of the two sides of the Israel/Palestine conflict, counts as a part of the world that doesn't ask Israel for a two state solution.

"The views of the leader of Israel" do not count as "the world asking Israel for something".

"Not asking for a two-state solution" is a far cry from "asking Israel for something other than a two-state solution".

InfraBlue wrote:

oralloy wrote:
Have these diverse opinions resulted in anyone asking Israel to do anything more than pursue land-for-peace?

Yes.

What, other than land for peace, is the world asking of Israel?

1 Reply

@RABEL222,

After a couple of "friendly" remarks from him, I gave him a mild rebuke.

0 Replies

@Sturgis,

Sturgis wrote:

I took a staggering step to the side after the rather immature antics last night from Elizabeth Warren. I already had issues with her, she just added to the stack.

She does not seem to be on the team of getting the Dems to win, only herself.

What was the egregious offense she committed that makes you think she isn’t for “our team”?

0 Replies

I have always considered myself a Roosevelt liberal. It's hard to change that label to 'progressive.' But the progressives I run into consider 'liberal' a centrist's label. To avoid confusion, I have slowly been transitioning to progressive, but I don't like it. Liberal gave us The New Deal, social security and medicare, the 1964 Civil Rights Act, infrastructure, welfare and other neat stuff. Roosevelt had plans to push for universal health coverage, but he died too soon. My great argument with centrist Democrats is that they did not defend these things. The few people who gave us hope were assassinated. Now they preach 'increments' to give back a tiny sliver at a time what already had been ours. Elizabeth Warren was a long time Republican. As a Democratic senator, she had opportunities to push some of these plans she keeps borrowing from Bernie Sanders, but she was against much of it, until she ran for president. Sounding like Bernie does not make her Bernie. She stood to applaud Trump saying we will never be a socialist nation. Now she's pushing socialist plans. How can you trust someone like that?

1 Reply

@oralloy,

oralloy wrote:

InfraBlue wrote:
oralloy wrote:
The common DNA cluster that the Jews share with the Palestinians means that they share Bronze Age ancestry.

You're finally getting it somewhat right.

My position is unchanged. I've been saying from the start that DNA shows that the Palestinians and the Jews share a common Bronze Age ancestry.

You've been conflating this with other flights of imaginative interpretation.

oralloy wrote:

I'm actually 100% right.

Not by a long shot.

oralloy wrote:

InfraBlue wrote:
Netanahu, being the leader of Israel which is a part of the world, and Israel being one of the two sides of the Israel/Palestine conflict, counts as a part of the world that doesn't ask Israel for a two state solution.

"The views of the leader of Israel" do not count as "the world asking Israel for something".

Israel, as a part of the world, doesn't ask itself for a two state solution, hence, the world as a singularity doesn't. There is no world unanimity to support your assertion.

oralloy wrote:

"Not asking for a two-state solution" is a far cry from "asking Israel for something other than a two-state solution".

It's an example of another portion of the world not asking Israel for a two-state solution, which contradicts your assertion of the world asking Israel for a two-state solution.

oralloy wrote:

InfraBlue wrote:
oralloy wrote:
Have these diverse opinions resulted in anyone asking Israel to do anything more than pursue land-for-peace?

Yes.

What, other than land for peace, is the world asking of Israel?

For one, a single state.

1 Reply

Watching Night 2 of the Democrat Debates. (grin). I’m guessing Biden et al are all trained with gotchas, one-liners, and deep cuts. Who will gain? Who will lose their slot?

I hope Castro continues his strong performance, although I do think he’s too liberal —even for me. I would love to see Tulsi cut butt. I’d also love to see Biden AND Harris taken down a notch. Harris’ nutty bait and switch #NotMedicareNotForAll is a marker of incompetence and dishonesty in her campaign. I believe pharma chiefs wrote this last ridiculous iteration of what she has the nerve to call #MedicareForAll.

0 Replies

Everyone is eating Kamala for dinner. As it should be.

0 Replies

@edgarblythe,

Quote:

Why many gravitate to Warren I can't totally figure. I am sure some of them do it through residual resentment of Sanders from 2016 and don't want to reward him, even though they are persuaded his policy ideas are correct.

Warren has been an inspirational figure for many going back before the last Dem primaries. Nothing to do with "residual resentment".

0 Replies

FFS, it's the Kamala show. She's boring as ****.

0 Replies

Michael Tracey
‏
Verified account

@mtracey
49s49 seconds ago
More
Kamala disputed that Kathleen Sebelius wrote her plan, but did not dispute Tulsi’s allegation that Sebelius stands to benefit financially from her plan, because it’s true.

0 Replies

Tulsi points out #MedicareAdvantage CEO ‘endorsed’ Harris’ ‘plan’. Harris was visibly irritated but rather than make her case to Tulsi, she tried to pivot against Biden and called his plan something like inexcusable. It was such a transparent dodge of her own shitty plan and she is constantly turning everything against Biden.

De Blasio kicked ass for progressivism against that Howdy Doody Bennett.

0 Replies

Castro should be on Bernie’s short list for Veep, but I feel that he’s hellbent on a WOC. I feel a level of comfort with him.

0 Replies

Castro is very sharp.

Biden can say Obama.

0 Replies

https://static01.nyt.com/images/2019/07/31/opinion/31collins/31collins-superJumbo.jpg?quality=90&auto=webp

2 Replies

Kyle Griffin
‏
Verified account

@kylegriffin1
9m9 minutes ago
More
Andrew Yang: "If you go to a factory here in Michigan, you will not find wall-to-wall immigrants, you will find wall-to-wall robots and machines. Immigrants are being scapegoated for issues they have nothing to do with in our economy."

0 Replies

Tulsi Gabbard may just have mortally wounded Kamala the Cop. She mentioned two or three items from Harris’ record as a prosecutor.

1 Reply

Michael Tracey
‏
Verified account

@mtracey
4m4 minutes ago
More
Biden is too cognitively decrepit to effectively expose Kamala so the task has fallen to Tulsi

0 Replies

@Lash,

I’m seeing a flood of tweets bailing on Kamala. Looking forward to seeing the fallout in the coming week.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

Quote:

I have always considered myself a Roosevelt liberal. It's hard to change that label to 'progressive.'

In America (true but much less so in Canada) the term "liberal" has always provoked right wing ire and demonization. But in the early 90s this became a sustained messaging strategy from the right. Anyone who has a clear recollection of the '92 Republican primaries will recall Pat Buchanan's use of the term where he might have substituted "evil" or "godless" or "communists" with little if any loss in negative connotation. Such purposeful redefinition of "liberal" became almost boilerplate from that point on.

A relevant contemporary factor at that time was the collapse of the USSR. Russia/communism had always provided the right and the GOP with a simple, black and white, easy to comprehend ideological anchor - "This is America's great enemy!" The disappearance of this ideological anchor was a problem for the right. Somebody or something had to take its place and with America (apparently) ascendant as a world power, the new enemy was conveniently discovered within the US itself. Liberals.

It was only following this change (along with the constant bombardment of anti-left propaganda) that many liberals became uncomfortable using the term they'd always used and many shifted to the "progressive" self-identifier.

One can (and should) review dictionary definitions of "progressive". The following is typical:

Quote:

pro·gres·sive
/prəˈɡresiv/
adjective
1.
happening or developing gradually or in stages; proceeding step by step.
"a progressive decline in popularity"
synonyms: continuing, continuous, increasing, growing, developing, ongoing, intensifying, accelerating, escalating; More
2.
(of a group, person, or idea) favoring or implementing social reform or new, liberal ideas.
"a relatively progressive governor"
noun
1.
a person advocating or implementing social reform or new, liberal ideas.
synonyms: innovator, reformer, reformist, liberal, libertarian, progressivist, progressionist, leftist, left-winger; formalneoteric
"people present themselves as progressives or traditionalists"
2.
GRAMMAR
a progressive tense or aspect.
"the present progressive"

0 Replies

@edgarblythe,

Quote:

I didn't bother to watch the debates. As far as I am concerned, barring a surprise, Bernie is the only progressive in the race, although Tulsi has some good ideas also. The rest, that are rated very high, are centrists, regardless of campaign rhetoric and they will not have my vote. I said last time I will never again vote the lesser of two evils.

To describe Sanders as "the only progressive" is to reject accepted definitions of the term. And it is eerily similar to those on the far right who think themselves as the only true representatives of proper conservatism.

If you were to carry through with your voting strategy, edgar, you will be doing exactly what Russian trolls and right wing rabble rousers hope you will do. Their strategy is to divide voices and voters on the left, to pit followers of X against fans of Y, to reduce left wing voter turnout. You are free, of course, to do so but you're playing their game designed to help their ends, not yours.

0 Replies

Progressives (Liberals)

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know