maporsche
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 05:49 pm
The more I learn, the more I discover how ignorant I truly am.

Those who “know it all” are the most ignorant.
Setanta
 
  4  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 06:21 pm
@blatham,
I cannot agree with you. Pelosi is a politician, and this is practical politics. I think she's lying about the motivation, I believe she has an eye to the 2020 election rather than any "divisive issue." It simply does not make sense to impeach the fat clown with no prospect of a conviction. Impeach just means to indict, and only requires a simple majority. A conviction requires a two-thirds vote of a quorum of the Senate. It ain'ta gonna happen. That being the case, it would be idiocy, in terms of practical politics, to make the attempt. It could also be electoral suicide. I am convinced that those who agitate for impeachment do so because of an irrational grudge against the fat boy in the White House. Impeachment can only hurt the Democratic Party. Wait until he's out of office, and then take the son-of-a-bitch to court in New York. If he tries to hide out in Florida, indict him and extradite him. Then he can have his day in court, or go into exile in Russia--if Putin will have him.

Impeachment would be political stupidity, an all just to gratify a petty desire for revenge. Democrats need to look to the future.
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 06:52 pm
@hightor,
Yes, a thousand times, at least.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 06:53 pm
@blatham,
I`m glad that Pelosi keeps that message out there and is so clear about it.
georgeob1
 
  0  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 06:57 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Quote:
Quote:
Everything isn't binary.

Well, everything is - if you happen to have a need to constantly set yourself up as being smarter, more savvy, or more in tune with reality than ‘others’.
This is an interesting phenomenon. A long time ago, I bumped into this idea - "The primary barrier to learning is believing you already know it all"

Sarah Palin stands as an exemplar of this mindset. It is a mindset that contains a justification for not studying, for not reading, for uncareful analyses (if any at all), for slipshot argumentation, etc. And, of course, it functions as a psychological defense where one feels some species of intellectual inferiority which is somehow, and for some persons, too painful to admit. One aspect of this I continue to observe is the profligate use of cliches.


I fully agree on your general point. Those who don't know and recognize the boundary between what they know and understand and don't, are doomed to fail if they get outside their zones of proficiency. Indeed the hallmark of a wise leader is the ability to get the best out of others more expert than him or herself. Have you considered AOC, Omar, Spartacus and Pocahontas or Bernie Sanders for membership in this elite group?

Another path to this infirmity is confusing the opinions of self proclaimed experts with real knowledge and understanding of the underlying material. Many more fall victim to this illusion.
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 06:59 pm
@maporsche,
Quote:
The more I learn, the more I discover how ignorant I truly am.

Those who “know it all” are the most ignorant.

It does seem to work that way. I might be surprised or even embarrassed when it turns out I've been wrong about something but that impinges on me far less than the excitement from discovering there is more to learn.

Coincidentally, in a Philosophy of Religion course I did at university working from a text that covered the work of some America evangelical philosophers, one of these chaps argued that science cannot be said to contribute to learning because most new discoveries reveal how much we don't know. Honest. That was his argument.
blatham
 
  3  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 07:09 pm
@Setanta,
Actually we are on precisely the same page. Sorry, not sure how I wrote that in a way which wasn't clear. It is practical politics, for sure, and she is good at that. And that's where I think she's absolutely correct in strategy.

I learned a tough lesson during the Obama period. He did sincerely try to decrease the divisiveness of US politics ("we're not red states and blue states...") or when he described Paul Ryan as a smart and careful guy. Four years later, he understood that good intentions (and rationalism) don't carry the day when the opposition demonstrates little of either.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 07:10 pm
@ehBeth,
Yes, indeed.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  0  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 07:20 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Quote:
The more I learn, the more I discover how ignorant I truly am.

Coincidentally, in a Philosophy of Religion course I did at university working from a text that covered the work of some America evangelical philosophers, one of these chaps argued that science cannot be said to contribute to learning because most new discoveries reveal how much we don't know. Honest. That was his argument.
I suspect you may have omitted some elements of his argument. In any event there are numerous counter examples, including, for example, a Catholic priest, Georges Lemaitre, an eminent modern physicist.
blatham
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 07:49 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
I fully agree on your general point. Those who don't know and recognize the boundary between what they know and understand and don't, are doomed to fail if they get outside their zones of proficiency.
There's one way in which I think this is wrong. There is an obvious value to specialization in knowledge but there's also value in the generalist's overview of special knowledge areas. A President, for example, better be knowledgeable in a huge range of matters if only to best estimate what specialists he ought to heed.

Quote:
Indeed the hallmark of a wise leader is the ability to get the best out of others more expert than him or herself.
No argument from me on that.

Quote:
Have you considered AOC, Omar, Spartacus and Pocahontas or Bernie Sanders for membership in this elite group?
Sorry, your question is unclear to me? And who the **** is Spartacus?
blatham
 
  3  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 07:58 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
I suspect you may have omitted some elements of his argument.
Nope. I don't recall how he worked his way to this conclusion but that's where he got to.
Quote:
In any event there are numerous counter examples, including, for example, a Catholic priest, Georges Lemaitre, an eminent modern physicist.
One clear fact I learned in that course and other studies was that both Catholicism (particularly) and Anglicanism have sophisticated philosophical traditions. I wouldn't stand a chance in a debate with a lot of these guys. But the American Protestant tradition is philosophically bankrupt.
glitterbag
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 07:58 pm
@blatham,
Wasn't Spartacus a character played by Kirk Douglas?
blatham
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 08:00 pm
@glitterbag,
Oh that's right! Either Douglas or Mel Brooks. One of the two.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 08:48 pm
Quote:
Ocasio-Cortez: America As It Currently Stands is ‘Garbage’

How many agree with that?
https://thepoliticalinsider.com/ocasio-cortez-america-as-it-currently-stands-is-garbage/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=wdupree
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 09:19 pm
@Setanta,

Setanta wrote:

I cannot agree with you. Pelosi is a politician, and this is practical politics. I think she's lying about the motivation, I believe she has an eye to the 2020 election rather than any "divisive issue." It simply does not make sense to impeach the fat clown with no prospect of a conviction. Impeach just means to indict, and only requires a simple majority. A conviction requires a two-thirds vote of a quorum of the Senate. It ain'ta gonna happen. That being the case, it would be idiocy, in terms of practical politics, to make the attempt. It could also be electoral suicide. I am convinced that those who agitate for impeachment do so because of an irrational grudge against the fat boy in the White House. Impeachment can only hurt the Democratic Party. Wait until he's out of office, and then take the son-of-a-bitch to court in New York. If he tries to hide out in Florida, indict him and extradite him. Then he can have his day in court, or go into exile in Russia--if Putin will have him.

Impeachment would be political stupidity, an all just to gratify a petty desire for revenge. Democrats need to look to the future.


Yes! A small part of me would like to experience the possible brief moment of embarrassment an impeachment might bring, but I totally agree that to pursue impeachment would be very damaging - to the Dems. I just hope Mueller and the others sifting through the dirty man’s finances find a way to get him.
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 11 Mar, 2019 09:46 pm
@snood,
Quote:
I just hope Mueller and the others sifting through the dirty man’s finances find a way to get him.

Because he won an election. Stalin would be proud. Your comment shows you have no respect for the rights of any citizen that stands in the way of a gangsterized government with no intention of losing power.

You people are not Americans.
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Tue 12 Mar, 2019 02:30 am
@ehBeth,
Quote:
I`m glad that Pelosi keeps that message out there and is so clear about it.

Same here.

If the time comes to start impeachment proceedings it will have to be supported by members on both sides of the aisle (a few, anyway) and a large swathe of the USAmerican people.
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  2  
Reply Tue 12 Mar, 2019 02:34 am
@blatham,
Quote:
But the American Protestant tradition is philosophically bankrupt.

That's evident from the behavior of recent Republican presidents — when they want an intellectual conservative on the Supreme Court they choose a Catholic.
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Mar, 2019 08:10 am
@hightor,
You have to be philosophically bankrupt to nominate a Catholic?
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Mar, 2019 08:18 am
Poor Tucker Carlson
Quote:
On the Monday episode of his 8 p.m. program on Fox News, “Tucker Carlson Tonight,” the host cast himself as a target of a liberal “mob” and suggested that the political left wanted to shut down his network.

“Fox News is behind us as they have been from the very first day,” Mr. Carlson told viewers. He added: “We will never bow to the mob. Ever. No matter what.”

As Mr. Carlson was speaking, Media Matters released a second batch of excerpts from his appearances on the “Bubba” radio program, including a clip from 2008 in which Mr. Carlson described Iraq as “a crappy place filled with a bunch of, you know, semiliterate primitive monkeys — that’s why it wasn’t worth invading.” Calling into the show in 2006, Mr. Carlson said of Barack Obama, then an Illinois senator, “How is he black, for one thing? He has one white parent, one black parent.”

NYT
Hard to see any reason the white power crowd might find Carlson an agreeable advocate.

And more delicious celebration of the superiority of the white skinned heroes from the WP
Quote:
The new audio highlights about a dozen instances of Carlson using racist language on the “shock jock” show, which he apparently called into for about an hour per week. In 2008, Carlson lamented that “everyone’s embarrassed to be a white man,” before stating that white men deserve credit for “creating civilization and stuff.”

0 Replies
 
 

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