Confused about religion

Yep Frank,I know what a non-sequitur is.They are hard to avoid sometimes.
I am aware that you don't know what I'm talking about.When I started on algebra I didn't know what they were talking about,
The "it" is where we are now and the "they" are those who were somewhere else before Christendom took control.The dark ages if you like.
And boy were they dark. The "they" also included non-Christians.Perhaps something else would have done better but I rather doubt it.I fear that you think the task is a great deal simpler than it actually is.
One might see the virgin birth as metaphor.Isn't James Bond a metaphor?Shakespeare's tragedies are entire metaphor.
You're mystified are you.Right then.
You're sat in Rome as Pope in,say,1400.You have reports of hordes of armed horesmen laying waste your outlying lands by force of numbers.You look at your numbers.Your walls are tumbling down and your head is on a lance if you do nothing.The same position Augustus was in and Mr Bush now.But then numbers mattered most.The hordes reached Vienna.How do you get numbers up Frank?And then train and equip them.(This isn't mystifying I hope.I didn't ought to be.It is simple and it did happen and if it hadn't you wouldn't be living the luxurious life I presume you to be leading.)Now it's no good asking me exactly how it was made to happen.I do know roughly and I've met people who know a lot more than I do about the matter but it was made to happen and that's for sure.And the job isn't done with yet.The process is not one you need to know about.In fact I don't think you would wish to know.Suffice to say here that numbers may not be as important now as they used to be.Nukes and smart bombs being available now.One thing is obvious though.Since the advent of those technologies porn has been legalised and other sexual relief systems which don't cause babies have appeared.Fifty years ago such things were either crimes or subjected to social forces.One of those social forces is the influence on peasants of metaphor.I know you're not a peasant Frank and I'm happy for you in that regard but you seem to have difficulty seeing that that is what the Pope had to work with and the structures of cohesion worked out under his aegis have actually produced where we are now and any suggestions of a heretical nature are pure guesswork and with hindsight added.
Hang on Frank-Jesus overturned the money tables.Your bank is a money table.Jesus turned the other cheek.Your Gov't hasn't done that thank goodness.If Jesus had seen credit cards he'd have freaked out.
I never said anything about Jesus commenting on the church being rich.Jesus was no church.The editor of The Spectator,which is quite famous,once wrote in an editorial that he would have been shouting "crucify him" as loud as anybody else in that mob.(That's assuming it actually happened and it isn't just an extended metaphor.)Charles Moore is his name and he went on to edit The Telegraph under the ownership of Conrad Black.All I said was that THE CHURCH needs to be rich in order to have reach.Under certain circumstances which we don't have now it needs to be ruthless too.But I don't know what point I'm supposed to be having some difficulty in conceding.I don't really bother with points.I stick to facts if I can.The Church became an institution under Constantine in the fourth century AD.Before that it was persecuted.It was to do with the sociological facts that Constantine had on his hands not the dogma.
Peace and security were what mattered just like now.You must have failed to wrestle with Gibbon.It only takes a few months.
Can you not imagine saying to Jesus-"Look mate-they'll have you if you carry on like this and when this lot have you you're going to know about it goodstyle.Why don't you just go fishing like the rest of us."I can easy imagine saying that.I've said similar things to people.

Is that any clearer>

spendius.

live to be:-

You ain't free mate.You are having yourself on.

Frank:-

I bent my finger to try to make it clear.I think it is pretty clear.Maybe you are remaining obtuse as a way of justifying not reading Gibbon and a whole range of other stuff such as the Malleus Malificarum.

The Pope was sat in Rome with that lot on his plate.That's a fact.OK What's the "that lot"?The mongol hordes.The anarchy.The bandits.The good timers.The food supply.Oh man-I could make a list as long as you want.Can't you put yourself in his position just as a thought experiment.?What would you have done?Let it all go to smash I suppose.It was an option.

Try reading a bit more slowly.That whole post of mine was as easy to follow as abc.You just don't like what it says-that's all.It shrinks you down to what you actually are just like it does me.That bothers you and it doesn't bother me.That seems to be the difference.There's not an assertion in sight and no difficult logic.The tone is tolerant and easy going.It's as clear as clear gets.

spendius.

It probably just seems that way to you because you're constantly trying to talk down to someone.

the guy who "doesn't do 'believing'"

"If the will of every man were free,that is,if every man could act as he chose,the whole of history would be a tissue of disconnected accidents."

live to be:-

Your whimsicalities ain't wisdom.Dirt-bike all you want.We gave you permission,but don't go thinking you have created such things.You are living on the fat of the land.

When people talk about being free they belittle all that as if the world just happened when they were born and will be over when they are dead.Its inhuman. Monkeys are like that.

One example of serious crap is talking about being free when we are obviously not free.What we have are certain privileges and we have had to fight for them with blood and guts.And the people who did the fighting have my heartfelt gratitude.When people talk about being free they belittle all that as if the world just happened when they were born and will be over when they are dead.Its inhuman.
Monkeys are like that.