192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
George
 
  3  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:06 am
Donald Trump is the Anti-Christ.

Hillary Clinton is the Red Whore of Babylon.

Text 666 to make your reservations for the Apocalypse.
blatham
 
  3  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:06 am
Welcome to our new Trumpian world, folks
Quote:
Donald Trump’s long-time but informal adviser Roger Stone says the Secretary of State job was dangled in front of Mitt Romney in order to “torture” him for previously opposing the president-elect.
During a Sunday appearance on InfoWars with Alex Jones, a conspiratorial media outlet that has become a mouthpiece of the next president, Stone called Romney a “choker” and said that Trump was simply toying with him.
“Donald Trump was interviewing Mitt Romney for Secretary of State in order to torture him,” Stone claimed on the program. “To toy with him. And given the history, that’s completely understandable. Mitt Romney crossed a line. He didn’t just oppose Trump, which is his democratic right, he called him a phony and a fraud. And a con man. And that’s not the kind of man you want as Secretary of State.”
It's how Lincoln would have behaved
Frugal1
 
  -2  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:10 am
Those recounts are helping Trump, are the Russians also to blame for this?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  2  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:13 am
Re my post(s) above on the nature of the team Trump is putting in place and the common aspect of appointees who have prior records of wanting to diminish, neuter or destroy the government institutions they are being put in charge of...
Quote:
Paul Rosenberg ‏@PaulHRosenberg 35m35 minutes ago
Paul Rosenberg Retweeted Seth Cotlar
"Hostile takeover" in this thread is good template for Trump's actions. But "coup" or "regime change" more accurate to scale & scope.

Yes.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  0  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:15 am
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Here's a pattern that continues
Quote:
Trump taps former Texas Gov. Rick Perry to head Energy Department he once vowed to abolish

That is, extremist ideologues usually tied into very big corporate money setting to the task of dismantling the institutions of government that Americans, as voters supporting such institutions, have built up over the last century. And they are setting to this under cover of deceits to bait and then switch. How many seniors who voted for Trump grasp what is intended for Medicare? Or Medicaid? How many, newly insured or protected under the ACA conceive properly of their new futures? How many get what could, and likely will, happens as a consequence of deregulation of environmental laws? And that's to list just a few such areas of concern.

The really serious problem in all of this is how difficult it will be to rebuild these institutions once they've been dismantled or made powerless.

The US is setting out now on a path which has no precedents in the free world.


Oh I believe the free world has a very wide field of precedents and that its limits are not at all stretched. More than a little exaggeration here.

I believe that calling the Department of Energy "an institution" is excessively charitable. It is instead an amalgum of formely distinct entities (Atomic Energy Commission; Energy Research & Deveolopment Administation: Nuclear Regulatory Commission Federal Energy Regulatory Commission; etc.) It is an utterly prosaic government bureaucracy, full of process and venality, badly needing reform. The environmental component of DOE started mainly with the cleanup of former Manhatten Project sites in the easrly 1990s, though the Reneweable Energy Lab in Denver had been operating for a few years (I'm not aware of any useful research that has ever come out of that institution). That appears to be your main concern, but in fact it is a very small part of the operation. I have a lot of direct experience in some DOE operationa and I am well acquainted with several former Secretaries & Ass't Secretaries of that Department. I believe Gov. Perry is at least as well qualified as most past Secretaries and far better than some. I would be happy to trade specifics with you if you have any.

My impression is that the concerns expressed in the Washington Post article you cited are merely those of the departing establishment - stuff that has been said many times before with as much (or little ) significance.

In short, I believe you are magnifying the significance of utterly ordinary processes and and seeing disaster where there is only routine change. However if you have any concrete, factual information suggesting the contrary I will be glad to review it.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  2  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:28 am
Adam Gopnik from May 20, this year
Quote:
The Dangerous Acceptance of Donald Trump
...If Trump came to power, there is a decent chance that the American experiment would be over. This is not a hyperbolic prediction; it is not a hysterical prediction; it is simply a candid reading of what history tells us happens in countries with leaders like Trump. Countries don’t really recover from being taken over by unstable authoritarian nationalists of any political bent, left or right—not by Peróns or Castros or Putins or Francos or Lenins or fill in the blanks. The nation may survive, but the wound to hope and order will never fully heal.
http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/the-dangerous-acceptance-of-donald-trump
h/t to Jay Rosen for the reminder
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  0  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:29 am
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Quote:
the Stock Market agrees

Current and temporary stock market tendencies aren't a great place to hang your hat, McG. As some folks are likely to remind you when the wind changes, which it always does.


Undeniably true, Short term stock market trends are indeed reliable indicators of shifts in public & market expectations, but it is the underlying long-term economic metrics that dominate over time.

I think the meaningful point here is that most liberal and media prognosticators were very confidently predicting a market collapse in the event of a Trump win, and indeed the market did indeed drop immediately after election day. However, it very quickly rebounded with a very positive climb in the DJA, perhaps much to their surprise. Overall the market is up, though with the forthcoming end of the quantatiative easing that has been propping up our weakened economy (and protecting our heavily indebted government) the Bond market is falling.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  2  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:36 am
Quote:
“The defining feature of the plutocratic insurgency is its goal: to defund or de-provision public goods in order to defang a state that its adherents see as a threat to their prerogatives. (Note that, conceptually, plutocratic insurgencies differ from kleptocracies; the latter use the institutions of state to loot the population, whereas the former wish to neutralize those institutions in order to facilitate private-sector looting. In practice, these may overlap or co-mingle.) Practically speaking, plutocratic insurgency takes the form of efforts to lower taxes, which necessitates cutting spending on public goods; reducing regulations that restrict corporate action or protect workers; and defunding or privatizing public institutions such as schools, health care, infrastructure, and social space.”
http://www.the-american-interest.com/2014/06/15/the-twin-insurgency/
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  0  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:42 am
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Welcome to our new Trumpian world, folks
Quote:
Donald Trump’s long-time but informal adviser Roger Stone says the Secretary of State job was dangled in front of Mitt Romney in order to “torture” him for previously opposing the president-elect.
During a Sunday appearance on InfoWars with Alex Jones, a conspiratorial media outlet that has become a mouthpiece of the next president, Stone called Romney a “choker” and said that Trump was simply toying with him.
“Donald Trump was interviewing Mitt Romney for Secretary of State in order to torture him,” Stone claimed on the program. “To toy with him. And given the history, that’s completely understandable. Mitt Romney crossed a line. He didn’t just oppose Trump, which is his democratic right, he called him a phony and a fraud. And a con man. And that’s not the kind of man you want as Secretary of State.”



There's very little that is new in the world of human behavior Blatham, and you should know that.

I see no evidence that you know the truth or credibility of the statements attributed to Stone. It may be true, partly true, or entirely false, and I suggest here that you don't really know. This wouldn't be the first time that someone was misquoted, or when someone on the periphery of big events claimed knowledge and insight he didn't really have to enhance his own stature.

In a perhaps similar way, this is merely yet another tidbit of "news" that fits your narrative and prejudices, which you have posted here to persuade others and , as it increasingly appears, to further the impression that you are some kind of knowledgable insider. I'm not that and neither are you.
blatham
 
  2  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:43 am
Bait and switch. Or X (Trump) tells lie and Y (McConnell) tells truth.

Quote:
McConnell also voiced skepticism that a multi-trillion dollar infrastructure bill was a good idea or use of the GOP’s time and resources, which could be a departure from Trump who has said infrastructure is a top priority.
blatham
 
  4  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 10:49 am
@georgeob1,
Definitely avoid checking to see if that is a misquote or an accurate quote.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  -1  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:03 am
@maporsche,
maporsche wrote:

You don't think there is a substantive difference in posting articles that challenge your POV or beliefs versus say, simply calling individual posters "cheese-eaters" (among many worse invective)?

Do you think that both equally are worthy of debate?


I have no complaint with the posting of articles that challenge my perspective. I do weary of the prodigious outpouring of them ( a very large % of the total space on this and other threads) from one member. all accompanied by vague claims of an evil underlying conspiracy and dirisive, mocking characterications of all who disagree with him.

When that is folowed by pleas from him to others to ignore those who challenge him directly on this, accompanied, as they are, with overtones of iumagined authority, I am sadly bemused and disappointed.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:06 am
@georgeob1,
I'm sure most people accept these "news" with a grain of salt. It's not a big deal whether it's true or not. In the scheme of things, it's not that important.
georgeob1
 
  -1  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:15 am
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Bait and switch. Or X (Trump) tells lie and Y (McConnell) tells truth.

Quote:
McConnell also voiced skepticism that a multi-trillion dollar infrastructure bill was a good idea or use of the GOP’s time and resources, which could be a departure from Trump who has said infrastructure is a top priority.



Well perhaps both are lying, or - prepare yourself - perhaps they disagree on relative priorities. We are dealing with different, and independent, branches of government. We elected a president, not a king.

In short there is nothing either significant or remarkable in the apparent disagreement, and you are making an issue out of nothing ..... again.
georgeob1
 
  0  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:18 am
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

I'm sure most people accept these "news" with a grain of salt. It's not a big deal whether it's true or not. In the scheme of things, it's not that important.


I agree with you.

Chicken Little was wrong: the sky did not fall in. However, he persists.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  4  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:18 am
@georgeob1,
I believe the governments investments into our infrastructure is very important. We learn that in Econ 101.
georgeob1
 
  -1  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:46 am
@old europe,
old europe wrote:

I appreciate your analysis that the Select Committee on Benghazi did not so much investigate what precisely happened in September 2012 in Libya, and was rather focused on destroying Secretary Clinton as a viable candidate for the 2016 election.

I suppose from that point of view, you have to argue that it was time and money well spent.


Paragraph #1 No.
Paragraph #2 Yes

The Congress did investigate Secretary Clinton't performance while in authority - as it is their duty to do. They did indeed find fault with her performance on the job, and with her character in dealing honestly and responsibly with the outcomes that occurred on her watch while in office. It was the public perception of those failings that defeated her.

Surely you have at least roughly equivalent ways of holding ministers accountable for their performance in office in the UK.
Frugal1
 
  -3  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:58 am
@cicerone imposter,
Then you are going to absolutely love Trump, his plans are actually shovel ready.
0 Replies
 
Frugal1
 
  -1  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 11:59 am
@cicerone imposter,
Yeah, even libs are growing tired of all of the fake news their side is putting out, but that won't deter 0bama & friends - they will continue to lie.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  -2  
Tue 13 Dec, 2016 12:10 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

I have no complaint with the posting of articles that challenge my perspective. I do weary of the prodigious outpouring of them ( a very large % of the total space on this and other threads) from one member. all accompanied by vague claims of an evil underlying conspiracy and derisive, mocking characterizations of all who disagree with him.

When that is followed by pleas from him to others to ignore those who challenge him directly on this, accompanied, as they are, with overtones of imagined authority, I am sadly bemused and disappointed.


This. I enjoy the debate, but being swamped by repeated postings from people that can't defend their writing is boring.
0 Replies
 
 

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