192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
blatham
 
  3  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 03:12 pm
@nimh,
I think we have to accept that randomness will be a feature in something as large and varied as a national election.

But on the other hand, what can appear initially as randomness appears so because causal factors are hidden from view (that's the magic of astro-turf operations, for example) or because causal factors are very complex and difficult/impossible to ascertain.

Any election is an attempt to build a consensus for X and to degrade a consensus for Y. As Waldman argues in the piece I just linked, the modern GOP specialty is degradation of consensus Y (Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, Benghazi). And they are very good at this. Truth, accuracy are not merely of no interest, they will often be impediments to power realized. Thus they behave as we see them behave. It is an amoral undertaking.

Grover Norquist once said that he is uninterested in what moves an individual human mind. He is, he said, interested in what moves groups of human minds. Bannon certainly would voice a similar interest. This is exactly the realm of propaganda.
revelette1
 
  3  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 03:14 pm
@blatham,
It is going to have to be someone strong with absolutely nothing in his/her background. I just hope all the populist stuff is gotten out of most people's system by then and concentrate solely on taking Trump down.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 03:14 pm
@blatham,
Another load of disingenuous crap from Waldman via blatham.

To the extent that the GOP use personal attacks, so do the Democrats.

It amazes me that you swallow this one-sided bs
blatham
 
  5  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 03:33 pm
@revelette1,
Quote:
It is going to have to be someone strong with absolutely nothing in his/her background.

That person will be accused of paling around with terrorists. His/her birth cert will be said to be fake. He/she will be called a bolshevik who isn't releasing his grades at college because they must have been really bad. He/she will be accused of secretly harboring ties and affinities with Muslims. He/she will be portrayed as hating America and western culture. He/she will have shot himself/herself in the battlefield in order to look a hero when actually trying to avoid combat and placing comrades in mortal danger in the process.

Just think how long I could go on here.

The right is trying to divide the left because voter enthusiasm and turnout is the thing.
blatham
 
  4  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 03:43 pm
As Digby says, "Russian trolls are very weird"

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-CKwvFQVLWAE/WcvkIWgJMGI/AAAAAAAAzFM/bkrewxa9l6sDQa4O2tYJYX808WtrWu6mwCLcBGAs/s640/Screenshot%2B2017-09-27%2Bat%2B10.46.20%2BAM.png
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  4  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 03:50 pm
Jon Chait, Ed Kilgore and Eric Levitz of NYMag
Quote:
Politics Group-Chat: What to Make of Roy Moore Winning the Alabama’s GOP Senate Race?

...Jon: As Ed has suggested in his coverage, the fact that Strange had to get to Moore’s right was a surrender of the major principle before a shot was fired. If you can’t attack a lunatic for being a lunatic, and you have to paint him as a liberal, your party is too far gone.
Discussion Here
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 03:55 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
My God! I have to take a screenshot! 4 thumbs up!
blatham
 
  4  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 04:07 pm
@blatham,
Let me add that this piece by Rebecca Traister tells us exactly what to expect (as if we didn't know already)
Quote:
The elite, ambitious candidate, saying one thing on the stump but another to wealthy donors, willing to cede big dreams for incremental, pragmatic fixes … You recognize her, right? Of course you do. She’s Massachusetts Senator and progressive firebrand Elizabeth Warren, who in the past few weeks has co-sponsored Bernie Sanders’s new Medicare for All bill, introduced a bill to preempt state right-to-work laws, prepared to take on leaders of Wells Fargo and Equifax on the Senate floor … and been hit with a blast of right-wing messaging and mainstream news coverage that feels positively uncanny.

The playbook that the right is running against Warren — seeding early criticism designed to weaken her from the left — is pretty ballsy, given that Warren has been a standard-bearer, the crusading, righteous politician who by many measures activated the American left in the years before Bernie Sanders mounted his presidential campaign. Warren is the candidate who many cited in 2016 as the anti-Clinton: the outspoken, uncompromisingly progressive woman they would have supported unreservedly had she only run. Yet now, as many hope and speculate that she might run in 2020, the right is investing in a story line about Warren that is practically indistinguishable from the one they peddled for years about Clinton. And even in these early days, some of that narrative is finding its way into mainstream coverage of Warren, and in lefty reactions to it.
Link Here
Apologies if already linked but it is right on the money in this discussion.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 04:24 pm
Joe from Chicago did the research here once't . . . probably more than a decade ago. Liberal used as a description of political alignment first appears in English in 1832, at the time of the first Parliamentary Reform Bill. Conservative used as a description of political alignment first appeared shortly thereafter.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  6  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 04:29 pm
As to Sanders voters voting Trump, I'm not surprised. A lot of them have the political awareness of a fresh water clam. Sanders is, and always has been an independent. But he wanted to be president so badly he could taste it. So, sartor resartus, he becomes a Democrat. But was he ever really a Democrat? Not in my never humble opinion. Did he go on the stump for the party's standard bearer? Certainly not--and while that it is understandable in a crotchety old man, did he go on the stump for Senate candidates? No, he didn't. Did he go on the stump for House candidates? No, he did not. He did not deploy any of his considerable political capital to aid the Democratic Party.

And that's because he was not, and still is not a Democrat. He's just another typical opportunistic politician.
wmwcjr
 
  0  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 04:36 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Someone thumbed you down; so, I gave you a thumbs up to bring it back up to 4. Mr. Green
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 04:54 pm
@wmwcjr,
wmwcjr wrote:

Someone thumbed you down; so, I gave you a thumbs up to bring it back up to 4. Mr. Green


Thanks. It won't last for long.
blatham
 
  2  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 05:02 pm
@Setanta,
Damned close to my take, set.
0 Replies
 
wmwcjr
 
  0  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 05:20 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
(minutes later)

You're right. It's down to 3 again.

(This is what makes A2K so entertaining. Smile )
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  3  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 05:39 pm
What a buncha whiners . . . there, I voted it back up. I hope you're happpy now.
wmwcjr
 
  0  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 05:53 pm
@Setanta,
We weren't whining. We were joking about it. Smile

But that was very magnanimous of you. Smile
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -2  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 05:54 pm
4 again
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  3  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 05:54 pm
I wish one could down-vote passages in the bible.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  3  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 05:58 pm
For those who like to read and think (this won't be all of us) there is a really brilliant long piece up on the First Amendment. I'm just part way into it now. Here's a taste
Quote:
Consider three main assumptions that the law grew up with. The first is an underlying premise of informational scarcity. For years, it was taken for granted that few people would be willing to invest in speaking publicly. Relatedly, it was assumed that with respect to any given issue — say, the war — only a limited number of important speakers could compete in the “marketplace of ideas.”27 The second notable assumption arises from the first: listeners are assumed not to be overwhelmed with information, but rather to have abundant time and interest to be influenced by publicly presented views. Finally, the government is assumed to be the main threat to the “marketplace of ideas” through its use of criminal law or other coercive instruments to target speakers (as opposed to listeners) with punishment or bans on publication.28 Without government intervention, this assumption goes, the marketplace of ideas operates well by itself.

Each of these assumptions has, one way or another, become obsolete in the twenty-first century, due to the rise in importance of attention markets and changes in communications technologies. It is to those phenomena that we now turn.
link here
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  3  
Wed 27 Sep, 2017 06:18 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

As to Sanders voters voting Trump, I'm not surprised. A lot of them have the political awareness of a fresh water clam. Sanders is, and always has been an independent. But he wanted to be president so badly he could taste it. So, sartor resartus, he becomes a Democrat. But was he ever really a Democrat? Not in my never humble opinion. Did he go on the stump for the party's standard bearer? Certainly not--and while that it is understandable in a crotchety old man, did he go on the stump for Senate candidates? No, he didn't. Did he go on the stump for House candidates? No, he did not. He did not deploy any of his considerable political capital to aid the Democratic Party.

And that's because he was not, and still is not a Democrat. He's just another typical opportunistic politician.

So, you know, aside from the fact that Bernie did in fact stump for Clinton's presidential campaign and for Democratic congressional candidates, your whole rant about how 12% of Bernie primary voters opting for Trump in the general proves how much of a fake, opportunistic non-Democrat he is kind of falls flat once you see that twice as many Hillary primary voters in '08 opted for McCain in the general.

But hey, Blatham agrees with you despite all that, so there's that.
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.43 seconds on 05/22/2024 at 12:30:04