192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
McGentrix
 
  4  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 06:25 am
@Setanta,
Well, if it gives you any satisfaction, I was watching some video's last night of what was going on and I must say that I have changed my mind a bit as I did not have the benefits of all the information available.

I did not see that during their torch lit walk they were shouting such rousing slogans as "Jews will not replace white people". I am fine with them walking quietly along, even at night with torches, to protest what they see as an attack on their culture. They have that right. But some of the stupid assed **** they were chanting just obliterates any symbolism they may have been trying to convey to their audience.

It seems we all agree that if you are going to be vocal of your opinions you need to own that **** and that you do risk being "exposed" to the world as a racist or an extremist of some sort. We all agree that there is no place for masked vigilantism and rock throwing/baton wielding.

So, let me wrap up by saying that there is no place in civilized society for the KKK, skin heads supporting neo-Nazi organizations or actaul Nazi's. However, as Trump said, there are people, that are good people, protesting the removal of statues from public parks that are not in the KKK, or skin heads or associated with Nazi's.
Setanta
 
  6  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 06:50 am
They are protesting the removal of statues of men who fought to preserve the institution of slavery and assured the unnecessary deaths of hundreds of thousands of Americans in the process. President Plump was attempting to draw an equivalence between Lee and Jackson on the one hand and Washington and Jefferson on the other. People aren't opposed to the statues because they were slave-owners, they are opposed to them because Lee and Jackson were traitors who caused more death and destruction than the United States has suffered in any other war. Almost more death and destruction than all of the others wars in which the United States has been involved combined. Glorifying murderous traitors is an unacceptable form of "culture." Cultural expression can be reasonably limited just as free expression can be reasonably limited. Oliver Wendell Holmes pointed out that freedom of speech does not protect the right to shout "Fire!" in a crowded theater. Those statues, and the Nazis who want to protect them are shouting fire in the national theater of ideas. One woman was killed and almost 20 people injured as a result of that little example of "free expression," of cultural expression. President Plump, however, who seems always to play to his base--probably on the advice of that idiot demagogue Bannon--has shown what matters to him.
snood
 
  9  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 06:58 am
@Setanta,
I just saw a clip from an upcoming 'Vice News' piece. It has a spokesperson from the White Nationalists effusing about how encouraged they were after Trump's spectacle of a press conference. He said he was glad"no one on our side was killed", that "no one was killed unjustly", that "he was proud of the restraint"his people showed, and that "many people will die before we're done".
Now Trump has given aid and comfort to the enemies of our country, both foreign AND domestic.

https://news.vice.com/story/vice-news-tonight-full-episode-charlottesville-race-and-terror

Setanta
 
  4  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 07:04 am
Kids on-line are always asking if there will be another civil war. I wouldn't be prepared to say that, but it will likely get very ugly before that fat clown leaves office. Knee-jerk conservatives rush to defend him, and he is indefensible.
revelette1
 
  8  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 07:25 am
I know blatham already alluded to the following, might have left the same link, I am not sure. (going through a lot of personal stuff right now, anyway..) I was struck by how by the statement of "he went rogue" so I read the following.

Quote:
To President Trump's aides, it was stunning. Multiple sources inside and close to the White House described the president's senior staff as confused and frustrated, caught off guard by Trump's decision to defend his initial response to the violence in Virginia.

He "went rogue," one senior White House official told NBC News.
The president's team had choreographed a plan: he would descend the golden elevators of Trump Tower and step to the lectern in the lobby, flanked by his Treasury Secretary, his Transportation Secretary and his top economic adviser. He would highlight the infrastructure executive order he had just signed, and then he'd leave — head back upstairs and deploy his aides to handle any inquiries.

That's the plan officials prepared reporters for as members of the media gathered in the giddy lobby as they had so often during the president-elect Trump's transition. The president had been unusually talkative the week prior during appearances at his golf club in Bedminster, New Jersey, and he was again ready to battle with reporters.


NBC NEWS

Surely a case can be made that the man is not capable of performing his duties as President and should be removed? I mean short of tying Trump down in a straight jacket how in the world is Kelly or anyone else going to control him? Should we have a person in oval office of the US who needs to be scripted and controlled and defies all attempts to keep him restrained?
snood
 
  9  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 07:40 am
If his staff is so shocked and dismayed let's see some standing on principle and resignations.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  5  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 07:54 am
@revelette1,
Quote:
Surely a case can be made that the man is not capable of performing his duties as President and should be removed? I mean short of tying Trump down in a straight jacket how in the world is Kelly or anyone else going to control him? Should we have a person in oval office of the US who needs to be scripted and controlled and defies all attempts to keep him restrained?


Here's one alternative...

The 25th Amendment Solution for Removing Trump
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/16/opinion/25th-amendment-trump.html?_r=0

And this is in today's news...
Rep. Speier Says President Trump Puts 'Country in Grave Danger. Time to Invoke the 25th Amendment'
http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Rep-Speier-Says-President-Trump-Puts-Country-in-Grave-Danger-Time-to-Invoke-the-25th-Amendment-440673173.html
0 Replies
 
wmwcjr
 
  5  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 08:35 am
In Charlottesville, the Local Jewish Community Presses On

By Alan Zimmerman , 8/14/2017



http://reformjudaism.org/sites/default/files/styles/blessing_image/public/candle-335965_960_720.jpg?itok=lPDnVmgB

At Congregation Beth Israel in Charlottesville, VA, we are deeply grateful for the support and prayers of the broader Reform Jewish community. Our thoughts and prayers are with the families of Heather Heyer and the two Virginia State Police officers, H. Jay Cullen and Berke Bates, who lost their lives on Saturday, and with the many people injured in the attack who are still recovering.

The loss of life far outweighs any fear or concern felt by me or the Jewish community during the past several weeks as we braced for this Nazi rally – but the effects of both will each linger.

On Saturday morning, I stood outside our synagogue with the armed security guard we hired after the police department refused to provide us with an officer during morning services. (Even the police department’s limited promise of an observer near our building was not kept — and note, we did not ask for protection of our property, only our people as they worshipped).

Forty congregants were inside. Here’s what I witnessed during that time.

For half an hour, three men dressed in fatigues and armed with semi-automatic rifles stood across the street from the temple. Had they tried to enter, I don’t know what I could have done to stop them, but I couldn’t take my eyes off them, either. Perhaps the presence of our armed guard deterred them. Perhaps their presence was just a coincidence, and I’m paranoid. I don’t know.

Several times, parades of Nazis passed our building, shouting, “There's the synagogue!” followed by chants of “Seig Heil” and other anti-Semitic language. Some carried flags with swastikas and other Nazi symbols.

A guy in a white polo shirt walked by the synagogue a few times, arousing suspicion. Was he casing the building, or trying to build up courage to commit a crime? We didn’t know. Later, I noticed that the man accused in the automobile terror attack wore the same polo shirt as the man who kept walking by our synagogue; apparently it’s the uniform of a white supremacist group. Even now, that gives me a chill.

When services ended, my heart broke as I advised congregants that it would be safer to leave the temple through the back entrance rather than through the front, and to please go in groups.

This is 2017 in the United States of America.

Later that day, I arrived on the scene shortly after the car plowed into peaceful protesters. It was a horrific and bloody scene.

Soon, we learned that Nazi websites had posted a call to burn our synagogue. I sat with one of our rabbis and wondered whether we should go back to the temple to protect the building. What could I do if I were there? Fortunately, it was just talk – but we had already deemed such an attack within the realm of possibilities, taking the precautionary step of removing our Torahs, including a Holocaust scroll, from the premises.

Again: This is in America in 2017.

At the end of the day, we felt we had no choice but to cancel a Havdalah service at a congregant’s home. It had been announced on a public Facebook page, and we were fearful that Nazi elements might be aware of the event. Again, we sought police protection – not a battalion of police, just a single officer – but we were told simply to cancel the event.

Local police faced an unprecedented problem that day, but make no mistake, Jews are a specific target of these groups, and despite nods of understanding from officials about our concerns – and despite the fact that the mayor himself is Jewish – we were left to our own devices. The fact that a calamity did not befall the Jewish community of Charlottesville on Saturday was not thanks to our politicians, our police, or even our own efforts, but to the grace of God.

And yet, in the midst of all that, other moments stand out for me, as well.

John Aguilar, a 30-year Navy veteran, took it upon himself to stand watch over the synagogue through services Friday evening and Saturday, along with our armed guard. He just felt he should.

We experienced wonderful turnout for services both Friday night and Saturday morning to observe Shabbat, including several non-Jews who said they came to show solidarity (though a number of congregants, particularly elderly ones, told me they were afraid to come to synagogue).

A frail, elderly woman approached me Saturday morning as I stood on the steps in front of our sanctuary, crying, to tell me that while she was Roman Catholic, she wanted to stay and watch over the synagogue with us. At one point, she asked, “Why do they hate you?” I had no answer to the question we’ve been asking ourselves for thousands of years.

At least a dozen complete strangers stopped by as we stood in front the synagogue Saturday to ask if we wanted them to stand with us.

And our wonderful rabbis stood on the front lines with other Charlottesville clergy, opposing hate.

Most attention now is, and for the foreseeable future will be, focused on the deaths and injuries that occurred, and that is as it should be. But for most people, before the week is out, Saturday’s events will degenerate into the all-to-familiar bickering that is part of the larger, ongoing political narrative. The media will move on — and all it will take is some new outrageous Trump tweet to change the subject.

We will get back to normal, also. We have two b’nai mitzvah coming up, and soon, Rosh HaShanah and Yom Kippur will be upon us, too.

After the nation moves on, we will be left to pick up the pieces. Fortunately, this is a very strong and capable Jewish community, blessed to be led by incredible rabbis. We have committed lay leadership, and a congregation committed to Jewish values and our synagogue. In some ways, we will come out of it stronger – just as tempering metals make them tougher and harder.

Join the Reform Jewish community's response to the hate and bigotry in Charlottesville. This week, #BeTheLightForJustice: Take a photo of yourself holding a candle of unity, then post it to Instagram or Twitter using the hashtag. Next, learn about action steps to take for direct responses to terror from the Union for Reform Judaism.

Alan Zimmerman is the president of Congregation Beth Israel in Charlottesville, VA.

Published: 8/14/2017
blatham
 
  5  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 09:15 am
@wmwcjr,
Thank you very much for that, wmwcjr!
farmerman
 
  5  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 09:28 am
@Setanta,
Vegas is already running a line on this regime. (Odds are on WHEN Pence is inaugurated not IF.)
Cycloptichorn
 
  8  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 10:08 am
@McGentrix,
Thanks for writing this, most people are jerks who can't write that they've changed their mind even if they have, not you though man, kudos to you.

This part in particular -

Quote:
I did not see that during their torch lit walk they were shouting such rousing slogans as "Jews will not replace white people". I am fine with them walking quietly along, even at night with torches, to protest what they see as an attack on their culture. They have that right. But some of the stupid assed **** they were chanting just obliterates any symbolism they may have been trying to convey to their audience.


This is what gets me about Trump saying that there were some 'good people' at that Friday-night torch march. Like, what 'very fine' person would voluntarily march along with nazi and white supremacist slogans? Isn't that the point where a 'good person' would nope out of the situation, because he didn't want to be associated with this?

That's why the press conference from Trump yesterday was SO terrible: he just doesn't get why people are upset about the whole thing at all. He also doesn't understand that his choosing to make an equivalence argument acts as validation to the nazis and tells them that he agrees with them, and that's not my opinion - they were literally cheering on Twitter yesterday.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
wmwcjr
 
  0  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 10:21 am
@blatham,
You're welcome.
0 Replies
 
Below viewing threshold (view)
Debra Law
 
  7  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 10:28 am
@snood,
snood wrote:

I just saw a clip from an upcoming 'Vice News' piece. It has a spokesperson from the White Nationalists effusing about how encouraged they were after Trump's spectacle of a press conference. He said he was glad"no one on our side was killed", that "no one was killed unjustly", that "he was proud of the restraint"his people showed, and that "many people will die before we're done".
Now Trump has given aid and comfort to the enemies of our country, both foreign AND domestic.

https://news.vice.com/story/vice-news-tonight-full-episode-charlottesville-race-and-terror




I watched the video at the link you provided. It is horrifying. The divisions (among groups, families, friends, et al.) in the USA are growing.



0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  4  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 10:31 am
@layman,
What's with your white polo shirt and khakis uniform cum cosplay shield accoutrement? Decided to update your look, victim?
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  4  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 10:37 am

But it was Seth Rich...
In Ukraine, a Malware Expert Who Could Blow the Whistle on Russian Hacking
NYT
There they go, wasting taxpayer money on this silly witch hunt — we know it was Seth Rich.

Seth Rich, you fools. And Hillary. And don't forget Benghazi.
snood
 
  5  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 10:40 am
@farmerman,
I heard a good joke on XM radio this morning. "The way Trump picked out the good people in the Nazi crowd was they were the ones carrying the tiki torches in their left hands".
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  6  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 10:52 am
@snood,
snood wrote:

Yup, ole Jefferson Beauregard Sessions is a busy bee.

Named after his pappy, who in turn was named after Jefferson Davis, the president of the Confederate States of America, and P. G. T. Beauregard, the Confederate general who bombarded Fort Sumter, commencing the American Civil War.
0 Replies
 
glitterbag
 
  6  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 11:09 am
@wmwcjr,
Thank you for that article. I wept while reading it, the hatred and violence is so close to the surface I'm aghast. I can barely recognize my own country.
Brand X
 
  4  
Wed 16 Aug, 2017 11:18 am
Trump's Strategic & Policy Forum made up of various corporate CEO's is disbanding. 2-3 more CEO's resigned from it today.

He's claiming he was disbanding it....but the group had already decided to disband it themselves and have been vacating over the past few days.
 

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