192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 04:35 pm
@blatham,
Well, of course you're right. It's all the fault of Fox News.

Without Roger Aisles, Bill O'Reilly and Sean Hannity, America would be such a nicer place. Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 04:40 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Yup. You got it.


Yes she does.

She has the same intellectually dishonest notion you do:

CIA is the defender of American democracy and would never lie unless forced to by some autocrat like Dick Cheney.

This one argument alone renders everything else you argue unreliable as it proves you are more than willing to not only twist facts to suit your opinions, but that you couldn't care less whether your current arguments are at all consistent with those you've made in the past.

0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 04:44 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Trump visits Pope Francis.

I'm curious as to how many right wing posters here deem Trump a better, wiser sort of human than Francis.


I've no interest in comparing the two.

Neither are paragons of virtue and it's is meaningless to consider or argue that one is somehow more blessed than the other.

Once again you are all to ready and happy to discard past positions you have held if they will serve your current anti-Trump obsession.

Suddenly blatham has become a Catholic.

The Lord truly works in mysterious ways.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 04:47 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:



But Trump and Duterte don't like liberals. So, that's the important thing.




Actually that is the important thing.

If one believes that the leftist ideology is harmful, if not destructive, that is far more important than the metaphysical nonsense posited by someone who doesn't believe in any of it.
ossobucotemp
 
  2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:05 pm
@blatham,
I'm a person who long asked for stuff about my father, and received back papers almost completely blacked out pages.

A lot of that was from the Hoover years, and so on.
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:07 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Why did Russia become such a big issue only after November? In part because of who won.
Trump wasn’t supposed to win....That’s the key reason that the meddling question is more important now than it was then.


For once, Wapo actually gets a couple of things right, eh? But they're wrong to suggest that the "meddling quesion is important." It aint. Never was.

That's the reason why the cheese-eaters are doing their damnedest to mislead people into "thinking" it's important is what he should have said.

As I, and many others, have noted, if it was such an "important issue," then the KNOWN fact that the Clinton campaign paid HUGE sums of money to collude with russian intelligence agents in the production of a false and scurrilous "dossier" designed to smear Trump and "influence the campaign" would be front burner on the "collusion" stove, eh?

This same piece of crap was reportedly used by Obama's people to violate the 4th amendment when securing a FISA warrant, which makes it even more important.

At least the FISA court refused to grant their illegal attempt to wiretap Trump a couple of times, but, still....
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:16 pm
Quote:
You like blatham are trying to make one of the most intellectually inconsistent and dishonest arguments I've seen here.

Despite the long history of liberal Democrats ranting about the excesses of the CIA, now when an ex-CIA director alleges something you want to believe, the agency is a paragon of honesty.

Arguments made by "liberal Democrats" is a fallacious generalization when speaking of rev or myself as you'd need to cite such statements either of us have made to support the suggestion of inconsistency.

Aside from that, there's obviously no logical problem if I or rev hold that the CIA, by the nature of it's tasks and its necessarily secretive operations and a history of misbehavior (Casey, for just one instance) deserves scepticism while at the same time validating the organization in other ways and instances. Intel agencies are tightly regulated and overseen because of the potential for abuse. That's always been understood. But it obviously doesn't follow that you or I or anyone has to hold that such agencies or either good or bad. They've been both.

As to the present situation, you are apparently going to go with the "deep state" notion. Not because you have evidence to support this but because it helps "explain" Trump's troubles.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  3  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:28 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
If one believes that the leftist ideology is harmful, if not destructive

This is a rather weird notion. Let me just point out that the most successful and free nations in the world are all liberal democracies. There really aren't any exceptions here, certainly none I can think of. Can you think of any? All have social safety nets of some sort (most more generous than the US), all redistribute wealth and all, at the same time, allow for initiative and productivity to be rewarded. And the people who live in these nations are generally happy to be where they are.
giujohn
 
  -1  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:38 pm
Hey layman...have you noticed how not even one cheese head including the head cheese head BLATHER , do not seem to have the courage of their convictions to back up their propaganda???

They are so sure Trump will be impeached next year but won't bet on it. (Except for Lash)

What an inglorious flock of
🐔s...
CLUCK CLUCK
layman
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:44 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

Quote:
If one believes that the leftist ideology is harmful, if not destructive

This is a rather weird notion. Let me just point out that the most successful and free nations in the world are all liberal democracies.


Leave it to Blabby to equate "leftist ideology" with "liberal democracy," eh? Sadly, it is an ancient tactic of sophists to treat words with different meanings as being identical in attempt to "prove" a fallacious argument.

Cheese-eater.
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:52 pm
@giujohn,
Yeah, John, talk is cheap, eh?

And by that measure, Blabby may be the cheapest s.o.b. on the planet.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:54 pm
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

Brennen was "concerned" and "Worried" and he "felt" and "he did not see proof of collusion" despite his feelings and concerns. Feelings and concerns are not enough to prosecute an impeachment.




But they are just the sort of stock in trade of a professional weasel.

"I can't prove anything I hope you will believe, but then the CIA doesn't do evidence, we do disinformation. It's what we do and we're good at it."

Now I think the vast majority of CIA employees are dedicated to the protection and advancement of US interests, but Brennan is the sort of political creature who has throughout recent history led the CIA to excess.

He, above all lesser mortals, knows what is in the best interest of this country and, surprisingly enough, it always seems to be aligned with what is the best interests of Mr. Brennan.

Trusting a spymaster to tell the truth when, if he is any good at his job, the truth is entirely malleable, only happens when his "truth" comports with someone's partisan wishes.

Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:56 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Now, that really is a very convincing post!
Certainly your thoughtful arguments will change my mind and that of others.
Thanks for these well articulated words!


Well, his thoughtful arguments have exactly the same chance of changing minds in this forum as yours do (or, for that matter, mine).

But I suppose you're welcome to think that you are somehow more persuasive.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 05:59 pm
@glitterbag,
Yes, and it is far less often an attempt to join the gang in targeting someone than is the case with some other A2K members we all know and love.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 06:03 pm
@InfraBlue,
Neither you nor the NYT reporter has actually seen this purported Comey memo. At present, no one knows for certain that it even exists, let alone what it's content might be. You know this and yet your insist on pressing forward with the BS assertion that it is proven fact.

Quote:
two current and two former officials, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss private communications with the president


More absolute proof! Smile
layman
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 06:04 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Obviously a weasel. Just look at the way he stammers and hedges when he is challenged about denying that he unmasked a name for an American Ambassador.



After stating that he "definitely" knows he was not at the CIA offices on Jan. 20, it apparently occurred to him that this could be disproven. So, later, he makes a "correction."
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 06:06 pm
@giujohn,
I've been here for a whole lot of minutes and I didn't know anything about a bet you had with bobsal.

Is that why he's gone?

What was the bet?
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 06:08 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Wow! Those photos prove that every living Belgian came out on the streets to tell Trump what for. What solidarity!
0 Replies
 
layman
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 06:26 pm
Even the commie-ass Guardian is so disgusted with the lying Brennan that they demanded he be fired, eh?

Quote:
CIA director John Brennan lied to you and to the Senate. Fire him

It was hard to conclude anything but the obvious: John Brennan blatantly lied to the American public. Again.

An internal investigation by the Central Intelligence Agency’s inspector general found that the CIA “improperly” spied on US Senate staffers, which he had denied.

Lest we forget, Brennan’s most recent false statement is not his first James Clapper-esque experiment in misinformation. The nation’s top spy is, in fact, a proficient and skilled liar. During a speech in 2011, the keeper of the kill list said there had not been “a single collateral death” from US drone strikes because of their “exceptional proficiency [and] precision”.

Brennan also fed the public wildly inaccurate details about the Osama bin Laden raid in 2011, and despite condemning leaks of classified information from others, he has often leaks classified information himself to suit his own needs.

The National Security Agency and the Central Intelligence Agency have been allowed to lie brazenly to Congress, the courts and the public for far too long. It’s far past time for the Obama administration to bring a little accountability to the intelligence community. It’s time for Barack Obama to fire John Brennan.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/31/cia-director-john-brennan-lied-senate

Nice try. Obama would never fire such a useful idiot.

0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Wed 24 May, 2017 06:33 pm
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:


Your opinion is duly noted. However, these directives are further indications of gross impropriety by President Trump, and may be seen as efforts to influence or impede an investigation.


Well, obviously they may be seen as efforts to influence or impede an investigation since you clearly see them that way. Crop circles may also be seen as evidence that earth has been visited by aliens from outer space. The leap from asking officials to state there is no evidence of collusion to an effort to impede an investigation is based on wishful thinking. If one or both of them complied with the request, how would that have influenced or impeded any outstanding investigation? Clearly you believe there was collusion so you are making the assumption that his request involved a lie. On what do you base that assumption?


Quote:
Sure, assumptions can be made from these allegations. One thing that is not an assumption about this report is that Trump directly instructed these officials to make statements to the public that they felt were inappropriate. These instuctions raise the obvious question as to why he would instruct these officials to make these public announcements. This leads to the assumption that you've brought up.


Sure assumptions can be made that George Bush ordered the destruction of the Twin Towers on 9/11.

Your logic is terribly twisted.

Requests to state there is no evidence of collusion (You've chosen to convert request to instruct) are not difficult to fathom. He knows he didn't collude and he's not aware of collusion by his campaign staff and he wants the American people to know that there is no evidence to support such charges. Is that really that difficult for you to comprehend? It doesn't at all lead to the assumption that he is lying (unless you've abandoned reason in favor of pronouncing him guilty).

No matter how much you would like to believe otherwise, the report is an allegation not a recitation of fact. When the two officials issue a public statement or testify before congress that Trump asked them to state there was no evidence, then you will have some real meat upon which to chew.

Quote:
Ok. Conversely, however, if you were were under a highly publicized investigation that impacted your daily life and were a guilty weasle, you'd probably love for authorities to announce that there was no evidence of your guilt, and you would have no hesitation to ask them to make such an announcement, surely.


Sure, but why do you think it is more likely that he is a guilty weasel? If you can imagine why someone in his position would request such statements (whether guilty or not) that should be the end of it, and yet you want to stretch it to evidence of obstruction of justice.


Quote:
Ok. It it could be seen as an attempt to interfere with or impede the investigation, however.
We've covered this already. A lot can be seen and much of it is nonsense. That something can be seen is not proof of anything.


Quote:
Oh, there's a lot to sink my cuspids into already, seeing as how Trump is like an infant who's been given a razor blade to play with inflicting upon himself a thousand cuts.


Really? And precisely what is there other than unproven allegations and innuendo? Trump's habit of shooting himself in the foot with stupid comments is hardly evidence of his being guilty of anything other than a lack of impulse control. Try finding a prosecutor who is willing to charge him for that.
 

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