80
   

When will Hillary Clinton give up her candidacy ?

 
 
blatham
 
  3  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 02:32 pm
Quote:
A longtime aide to New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) told CNN on Tuesday that she plans to vote for Hillary Clinton, telling the network that for Republicans coping with Donald Trump "silence isn't an option."

http://bit.ly/2aGFDnH
and h/t to Christie for finally criticizing Trump. It ain't enough but it's the right direction.
revelette2
 
  2  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 02:37 pm
@blatham,
Guess Trump not picking him for VP had consequences. They deserved each other though.
ossobucotemp
 
  2  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 02:38 pm
@blatham,
Excellent comment by him. Haven't listened to him for a bunch of years now. I had gotten fairly tired of him and then when I moved, I kind of turned off of radio, unusual for me, but radio is not (to me) the same interesting mode in Albuquerque as it was back in California. Is he in print in a particular place? NPR, I suppose.
blatham
 
  2  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 03:01 pm
@revelette2,
Definite similarities between the two men, yes.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  2  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 03:04 pm
@ossobucotemp,
I don't know of any running print contribution from Keillor presently But if you launch a google news alert for him, you'll get notice of any time he authors or is the subject of some written piece. I bump into him, infrequently, just in the course of my reading. He's now done his last Prairie Home Companion, by the way.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  3  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 03:08 pm
For those who don't mind reading, Theda Scokpol has a really good piece of research on the influence of the Koch operations. She's one of the best poli sci scholars. It's in pdf form and it is substantial. So if you wish to learn more about this subject and if you aren't thrown off by a work like this, bookmark and get to it when you can. If you don't like reading or if not interested in this subject, by all means tell someone close to you and suggest that you may need an intervention.
Quote:
This article highlights a heavyweight new player in conservative politics – the recently expanded “Koch network” – that coordinates big money funders and an integrated set of political organizations operating to the right of the Republican Party. As we will show, the rise of the Koch network may help to explain the increasingly extreme economic positions espoused by most GOP candidates and officeholders.


http://www.scholarsstrategynetwork.org/sites/default/files/mpsa_koch_network.pdf
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 04:36 pm
@Blickers,
Blickers wrote:
By now it has been established that Clinton did not comply with the letter of the law, though she thought her Email security setup did.

She might have believed that she was complying with federal law. But the way she avoided having the State Department vet her settup shows she had an idea that she was violating State Department internal policy.


Blickers wrote:
Regardless, the whole reason we have any type of national security setup at all is primarily to prevent Russia, the second largest military power in the world, from gaining an advantage on us which they will immediately turn into putting those Eastern European countries they held in subjugation until 1991 back into subjugation. That's over 100 Million people.

Other than their ICBMs Russia isn't that potent of a force. Their threat to their neighbors was because their neighbors had no defenses at all. Now that we are stationing NATO forces in the Baltics the threat is pretty much over.

China, on the other hand, is going to be a tricky problem. We will do well to avoid open war with them if possible. If possible.....


Blickers wrote:
With Trump talking about disbanding NATO and letting Eastern and Western Europe stand undefended against Russian forces moving back in, talking about whether the evidence is sufficient that Hillary's Email server was hacked by Russians doesn't make much sense. Trump wants to turn all of Eastern, and possibly Western, Europe over to the Russians-that's our national security threat right there, not stupid Emails.

While I strongly prefer Hillary's position over Trump's, his position isn't as unreasonable as the Democrats are pretending. He is suggesting that America can't afford to keep being the world's global policeman, and that we need curtail our military presence in the world and have our allies start helping out in keeping the world an orderly place.

It's not a position I like very much, but it's not an unreasonable position either. And I would suggest that a year ago many of the liberals on a2k would have agreed with that view.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 04:50 pm
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:
You are a living example of the episode in Seinfeld's "Bizzaro World." Where up is down and out is in.

It takes real bravery to stand up in the face of a demagogic mob and state truths that they don't want to hear.

Going along with the demagogy doesn't require any bravery at all.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -3  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 04:51 pm
@maporsche,
maporsche wrote:
It's completely logical to hold positions of a) hating the DNC, b) wanting Trump to lose, and c) voting for Clinton to bring about said Trump loss.
THAT is brave.

It may be logically possible. I don't see the bravery though. It wouldn't be like people who stand up and defend the truth in the face of a demagogic mob.
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  6  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 05:13 pm
@oralloy,
Quote oralloy:
Quote:
She might have believed that she was complying with federal law. But the way she avoided having the State Department vet her settup shows she had an idea that she was violating State Department internal policy.
That's all been gone over in Comey's report, there comes a time to let it drop in light of far greater national security threats.

Quote oralloy:
Quote:
Other than their ICBMs Russia isn't that potent of a force. Their threat to their neighbors was because their neighbors had no defenses at all. Now that we are stationing NATO forces in the Baltics the threat is pretty much over.

The way he's talking do you think Trump would go along with consenting to NATO troops in the Baltics? His answer would be, "We can't afford this any longer, what the **** did Estonia ever do for us? Let Putin have 'em all if he wants them. They're his problem." If you are going to practice deterrence, you have to do things in response to the opponent. Having the President of the US play the part of the opponent's butt boy isn't going to get it done. It will be a clear signal to Putin that it was time, if not to move in directly, to foment civil wars in these Baltic countries with Russia taking one side, which would appear to the outside world as Russia simply backing a different side than we do-not Russia taking over. But that's what it will be.

Quote oralloy:
Quote:
He is suggesting that America can't afford to keep being the world's global policeman, and that we need curtail our military presence in the world and have our allies start helping out in keeping the world an orderly place.
The poorer, former Iron Curtain countries are still just getting on their feet economically, though they are far ahead of Russia in per capita GDP already. They can't afford much. The US makes much money off weapons sales, so we're not as generous with the defense as we might seem. And a real President will first think: "What needs to be done to guarantee the security of Europe from Russia", not "They didn't pay up, so screw 'em. Welcome Warsaw Pact Part Deux".

Trump's position is not just unreasonable, a few years ago it would have been considered treason by many. At any rate, a guy who talks like Trump does on this issue can't be let anywhere near the Oval Office.

cicerone imposter
 
  5  
Tue 2 Aug, 2016 05:33 pm
@Blickers,
And add this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-nato-alliance-trump-doesnt-see/2016/04/03/da19479e-f765-11e5-8b23-538270a1ca31_story.html
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 04:46 am
@Blickers,
Blickers wrote:
The way he's talking do you think Trump would go along with consenting to NATO troops in the Baltics? His answer would be, "We can't afford this any longer, what the **** did Estonia ever do for us? Let Putin have 'em all if he wants them. They're his problem."

The NATO troops in the Baltics aren't American though. This is what Trump actually wants to see: other NATO partners stepping up to shoulder more of the burden.


Blickers wrote:
Trump's position is not just unreasonable, a few years ago it would have been considered treason by many. At any rate, a guy who talks like Trump does on this issue can't be let anywhere near the Oval Office.

It's not what I prefer, but a reduced American role in the world isn't unreasonable. Lot's of people like the idea.
blatham
 
  3  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 05:29 am
A fine conservative mother:

Quote:
During a rally for Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump in Ashburn, Virginia on Tuesday, a school-aged boy shouted “take the bitch down” in an apparent reference to Democratic presidential rival Hillary Clinton.

Responding to a group of reporters sitting nearby, the child’s mother, who identified herself as Pam Kohler, defended her child’s “right to speak what he wants to,” noting that “he’s a minor so he can’t be interviewed.” When asked about his behavior, Kohler blamed “Democratic schools” for her child’s lewd language, the Los Angeles Times reported."
http://bit.ly/2aI6rnM
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  6  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 09:39 am
@oralloy,
Quote oralloy:
Quote:
The NATO troops in the Baltics aren't American though. This is what Trump actually wants to see: other NATO partners stepping up to shoulder more of the burden.
No, Trump wants to see other NATO nations pay up or he will not take part in NATO, which will destroy the situation which won the Cold War. Even by broadcasting this, Trump is destroying the extraordinary solidarity between NATO allies that has been responsible for Russia respecting NATO's borders for over 50 years. Trump has already been destructive to NATO and he hasn't even gotten to the White House yet. God help us if he gets elected and runs things for four years.

Quote oralloy:
Quote:
It's not what I prefer, but a reduced American role in the world isn't unreasonable. Lot's of people like the idea.
A reduced role in parts of the world is one thing, pulling out of NATO and letting Russia reclaim her former Eastern European Empire is quite another. The only people who like that idea are located in Moscow, or their fanboys.

cicerone imposter
 
  4  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 10:57 am
@Blickers,
Thanks for your offense against such idiocy. Trump is ignorant about most things which he proves every time he opens his loud mouth. People still don't get it; he lies 91% of the time.
Just type "trump lies," and you'll get a whole slew of links.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -1  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 06:18 pm
So, now.

http://time.com/4402823/glaude-hillary-clinton/

Why Donnie Darko may nuke us all to hell as Prez.
Cause Hillary and Dems have pissed off too many people for too long.
bobsal u1553115
 
  3  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 06:28 pm
@Lash,
In the end the choice is between Donald Trump and Hilary Clinton. I will have no problems whatsoever voting for Hilary Clinton. I highly recommend Hilary Clinton to anyone who has any doubts. Let alone the fact that suppressing the vote is a bad idea when we can start changing the House and the Senate. The White House means too little with another crap Congress.
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  2  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 06:29 pm
@Lash,
I suppose with the few holdouts, we can make it up from the republicans who have come out and said they will vote for Hillary.

Meanwhile:

Clinton retakes lead over Trump
Lash
 
  0  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 06:34 pm
@revelette2,
I can definitely understand why republicans would be excited about Hillary. She's the only republican in the race.
revelette2
 
  2  
Wed 3 Aug, 2016 06:35 pm
@Lash,
She is the only sane one in the race.
 

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