80
   

When will Hillary Clinton give up her candidacy ?

 
 
maporsche
 
  5  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 03:27 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
At the same time we are hearing accusations from Dems that Trump is a sociopath...


There are estimates that 5% of the country is sociopathic and that certain professions (CEO's being one of them) have a much higher rate of sociopaths.

https://www.amazon.com/Sociopath-Next-Door-Martha-Stout/dp/0767915828
Baldimo
 
  -1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 03:36 pm
@maporsche,
Yet one comment by a single person in the GOP applies to everyone in the GOP?
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  -1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 03:46 pm
@blatham,
blatham wrote:

First, the context where I brought it up (along with another proven example of the RNC running covert ops) was to demonstrate that the RNC does run covert ops using false pretenses. Thus, there's no rational reason to presume they aren't doing so again in order to sew discord among Dems this election. And in that initial post, I even provided some of the historical data later repeated, including a list of the names of the operatives (citing location of source). Your reply suggested that I was merely dealing in conspiracy theories to imagine such a thing. That's fundamentally dishonest.
And you imagine that omitting the recent DNC conspiracy with the Clinton campaign to malign Sanders is somehow different??!!! That is something well beyond the pseudo-intellectual rhetorical dishonesty of which you accuse me.

blatham wrote:

Second, the examples I provided and the examples you put forward are not of the same category. The Brooks Brothers Riot was not a citizen-populated or citizen-organized protest. It wasn't grassroots as it pretended, it was astro-turf run by the RNC.
Do you actually believe that the demonstrations and riots in Wisconsin organized by the State Democrat Party and the Public Employees Unions were any different??? I'll acknowledge that such things are sufficiently commonplace enough that we may have become dulled to them and inattentive to their significance. However they were direct agitation in the best Rules for Radicals tradition of many self-styled progressives.


[/quote]
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  3  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 03:47 pm
@Baldimo,
Quote Baldimo:
Quote:
I guess you have forgotten that Hillary supporters started that rumor [about Obama's supposedly false birth certificate] back during the 2008 campaign. It wasn't the GOP who started it, it was Hillary and her people. Not surprising as we now know that the DNC was going to use Sanders religion or lack of religion against him in the south.

I don't know if Hillary supporters started the rumor, but supporters are one thing and the candidate coming out and strongly hinting it are two different things. There's always the possibility that the candidate did not know about it. For instance, in 2000 when McCain was running against Bush 43, some Bush supporters were saying before the South Carolina primary that McCain had an illegitimate black daughter. Did Bush himself know about the rumor? We don't know, and he never said anything that indicated he believed it.

Do you think Bush believed it?
Baldimo
 
  -1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 03:54 pm
@Blickers,
Except this little gem in her own words:

Quote:
In a March 2008 interview with "60 Minutes," Clinton said she took then-Sen. Obama's word that he was not a Muslim, but when pressed if she believed he was, she replied, "No. No, there is nothing to base that on -- as far as I know."


http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/06/politics/fact-check-donald-trump-claims-that-hillary-clinton-started-birther-movement/
Blickers
 
  4  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 04:02 pm
@Baldimo,
There's no evidence as far as I know that Baldimo severs the heads of unwitting passersby and adds them to tomatoes, basil, oregano and a special proprietary blend of herbs and spices to make a tasty spaghetti sauce.

Okay, go ahead, sue me.
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 04:04 pm
@Blickers,
On Obama's birth certificate. Many still don't believe the facts. The conspiracy theory lives even though all the facts proves Obama's birth in Hawaii. It was a long conspiracy with all the government agencies in cahoot.
Anybody who believes that might be interested in a bridge I have for sale. BTW, it's in Montana.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/jun/27/obamas-birth-certificate-part-ii/
Builder
 
  -1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 04:05 pm
This woman nails it.

https://www.facebook.com/claudia.stauber/videos/10208776020210828/
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  0  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 04:06 pm
@cicerone imposter,
It doesn't change the fact that someone else other than the GOP started the rumor. You can thank Hillary's people for this.
blatham
 
  3  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 04:46 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
I am not dishonest and don't take such suggestions lightly.

I know, and I was hesitant to say it but I was referring to the intellectual aspect, not characterological. And it applies. If not that, then a species of laziness. Take this...
Quote:
That the RNC may have been involved in such an event once doesn't mean it is a part of their normal activity

I just gave you two. Not one. Neither are in dispute. The RNC did register the domain ClintonsForMcCain and facilitated (at least) the creation of a covert and significant astro-turf operation with operatives in the field designed to cause dissention among Dem voters.

And would we be accurate in saying there is only two? Not close. Just start at Haldeman and Erlichman (surely to god I don't have to detail that stuff for you) and move on up. It's a rich harvest. It's a pattern.


In the modern period, we have to look past the RNC/GOP. Now, the Koch boys are (and have been for decades) playing the same game. You ought to read this reporting by Jane Mayer, "Covert Operations" http://bit.ly/2aovZWM Sadly, my certainty is high that you won't.

Quote:
Should I regard the recently revealed collusion between the DNC and Hillary's campaign staff to discredit Bernie Sanders as proof that this is part of a normal campaign for left wing and progressive organizations?

What evidence for collusion can you cite? If you can verify that, I'll address it. It surely is normal or not out of the ordinary for the existing power structures in the Dem party to have and support a favorite candidate. It's the norm for campaigns to have oppo research on rivals and to use it.

Wisconsin = Brooks Brothers. Are you kidding me? First, find me evidence that the DNC directed these protests. Find me evidence that they bused in party operatives. And then there is the not small point that one event here had consequences for who held the White House. The other involved protests against a particular state bill.

Not equivalent.

Trashing of the capital
Quote:
"On Thursday, March 3, Wisconsin Administration Secretary Mike Huebsch claimed that the weeks of demonstrations resulted in $6.5 million in damages and other costs to the Capital.[85] The next day he admitted that he had no basis for the higher figure and that the actual cleanup costs could be as low as $347,500.[236] State architect Jeffrey Plale, a former Democratic state senator who was appointed to his post by Walker,[237] stated that he had not observed any damages from demonstrations.[238]
wikipedia

You again claim I'm guilty of "far-fetched conspiracies". How can you use that description when I present the evidence for what I'm saying? It must seem that way to you simply because you don't know this stuff and that's because of what you read and don't read.

You'll have to pardon if I continue as I have been (and I will). Where I don't provide evidence or where I make a claim that is insufficiently tempered, go ahead and criticize or point it out. That's appropriate.

Finally, let me ask you a question. Have you, in the last day or two, done any research/reading on the Brooks Brothers Riot? Have you sought to get yourself more knowledgeable on this event?



cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 05:19 pm
@blatham,
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2008/11/20/a-gop-dirty-trickster-has-second-thoughts.html
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 05:25 pm
@maporsche,
Other than providing us with an interesting factoid, your point is?

I suspect that 99% of that 5% are professional politicians.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 05:29 pm
@Blickers,
You are being disingenuous.

Clinton's words were of a particularly nasty species of weasel.

If a Republican said the same thing, you would be apoplectic.

She's Mistress of Weasel Words.
reasoning logic
 
  -2  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 05:37 pm
@maporsche,
Quote:
There are estimates that 5% of the country is sociopathic and that certain professions (CEO's being one of them) have a much higher rate of sociopaths.


From my research and understanding CEO's are at the top #1 of Robert Hairs check list for sociopathy and attorneys come in #2. Hillary and Debby are both attorneys if my memory is correct.

It is very hard at times for me to distinguish prosocial psychopaths from antisocial psychopaths.

I wonder if Hillary may actually be a prosocial psychopath, I have been very naïve most of my life so I may get Hillary wrong thinking she is a wolf in sheep's clothing.

We realize that there are very evil behaving people out there and like all of them they are not going to tell you they are that way.

I wonder if such evil behaving people could have threatened the lives of Bernie and Elizabeth Warner's families if they did not show love for Hillary.

I am not saying that this is the case but it is true that people have behaved just as evil as this before and will continue to.

I wonder why Bernie and Elizabeth Warner turned to be so supportive of Hillary is all I am wondering.
reasoning logic
 
  -1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 05:52 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
I suspect that 99% of that 5% are professional politicians.


You very well may be close in your estimate. Imagine that! the 99% against the 99% It reminds me of a paradox.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  0  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 05:55 pm
@blatham,
I'm not as interested in thus stuff as evidently are you, but I do understand the history of political shenanigans going back to Cook county in the 1960 Presidential election and the various city and state political machines (mostly democrat) that ruled cities and some states for too long. I stongly suspect your rersearch in this area is very one sided ( your posts so far strongly suggest this) , and my experience in life tells me that this stuff is episodic in both parties depending on the stakes and personalities involved. I trust you will trot out the old familiar equivalence argument: I'll consider it done and save you the trouble.

You repeatedly allege the existence of the "vast right wing conspiracy" your esteemed candidate spoke about decades ago. You also imply that these things are absent from your side of the political spectrum. I find that laughable, but I have neither the time nor the interest in getting as obsessive about it as evidently are you.

The political activities of the Koch brothers are dwarfed by those of organized labor unions, both in terms of money spent and particularly in organized thuggery (this is something I have observed and experienced directly).
revelette2
 
  2  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 06:10 pm
I found the following very interesting; don't know if anyone else will, but since there is not currently a pro-Hillary thread...

What the White House might look like with Bill Clinton in the East Wing

Wish we could fast forward to November. I am tired of this election, seems like it has been years and years.
0 Replies
 
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 06:11 pm
Tangent: I'm relieved to find the Andrew Sullivan DNC day 2 blog showed up (in the New York Magazine News and Politics section.) I've liked him for quite a while now, though we differ on much. I got hooked on reading The Dish, which was his last blog, a few years ago, then he took a hiatus, and then recently he started a New York Mag blog.

I found him interesting re day 1; now I'm off to day 2..
0 Replies
 
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 06:15 pm
Tangent: I'm relieved to find the Andrew Sullivan DNC day 2 blog showed up (in the New York Magazine News and Politics section.) I've liked him for quite a while now, though we differ on much, he being conservative at heart. I got hooked on reading The Dish, which was his last blog, a few years ago, then he took a hiatus, and then recently he started a New York Mag blog.

I found him interesting re day 1; now I'm off to day 2..

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/07/andrew-sullivan-liveblogs-the-dnc-night-2.html#jumpLink

The blog starts at the bottom, where it says 8 o'clock EST
blatham
 
  3  
Tue 26 Jul, 2016 06:18 pm
@georgeob1,
Quote:
The political activities of the Koch brothers are dwarfed by those of organized labor unions,

How could you know that to be true? Can you forward evidence to back up the assertion? Can you give me a figure for union financial support this election cycle (the Kochs stated they would invest just shy of 1 billion, widely covered in the media, even though they have a history of deceit in this matter)? And of course, the Koch operation is something aside from the Chamber of Commerce funding, which is normally considered the counter-weight to union donations.
0 Replies
 
 

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